Age of Ultron The Steve Rogers/Captain America Thread

[BigThor]

Are people forgetting that Cap got the most screen time in the Avengers and was pretty much the number 1 or 2 character? AND he also got some of the best moments, featuring some very "Captain America" lines. Where are all these complaints coming from that Joss doesn't get Cap? He was my favorite character in the first Avengers film.

Thor fans have more cause for worry in my opinion, he was by far more short changed than Cap in TA. Not to mention TWS did Cap far more justice than Thor:TDW did Thor.

But for some reason Thor fans don't seem to be worried when in actuality they have more reason to be.

 

[Quasimod0]

Yeah we major Cap fans have got it made. TWS was crazy awesome, and TFA was great as well. Thor has had two pretty good films, but I feel like he hasn't really gotten to shine like Cap and Iron Man have. Hopefully Thor 3 will be his best movie yet, and he certainly looks to have some great scenes in Age of Ultron.

 

[marcvader]

Are people forgetting that Cap got the most screen time in the Avengers and was pretty much the number 1 or 2 character? AND he also got some of the best moments, featuring some very "Captain America" lines. Where are all these complaints coming from that Joss doesn't get Cap? He was my favorite character in the first Avengers film.

The complaints are about getting Cap's fighting prowess wrong.

 

[BigThor]

The complaints are about getting Cap's fighting prowess wrong.

And about him being short changed in the trailers and possibly playing second fiddle to The Twins.

 

[marcvader]

Are people forgetting that Cap got the most screen time in the Avengers and was pretty much the number 1 or 2 character? AND he also got some of the best moments, featuring some very "Captain America" lines. Where are all these complaints coming from that Joss doesn't get Cap? He was my favorite character in the first Avengers film.

And about him being short changed in the trailers and possibly playing second fiddle to The Twins.

I was addressing the bolded. The complaints are that we haven't seen anything different in the two trailers "so far" when it comes to representing Cap right. What we have seen so far is more of the same from the Avengers.

 

[Ghostcrow13]

What have we seen so far that looks like Avengers 1 Cap?

 

[marcvader]

He's getting beat down by a/the villain, him leaping to avoid danger, and that's it, in both trailers. He hasn't spoken yet or been shown to do anything different from what we have seen in the other Wheadon film. The fans main gripe in the last Wheadon film was that he didn't really do anything dynamic or appear to be one of the greatest fighters of the MCU the way it was aptly displayed in TWS. Fans are hoping for a correction and as of yet it hasn't happened. That's all.

 

[Stringer]

Yep yep.

 

[Ghostcrow13]

He's getting beat down by a/the villain, him leaping to avoid danger, and that's it, in both trailers. He hasn't spoken yet or been shown to do anything different from what we have seen in the other Wheadon film. The fans main gripe in the last Wheadon film was that he didn't really do anything dynamic or appear to be on of the greatest fighters of the MCU the way it was aptly displayed in TWS. Fans are hoping for a correction and as of yet it hasn't happened. That's all.

Leaping like 15 ft into the air to avoid danger. And he is getting beat down, yeah but are you expecting him to lose that battle are you? Pretty sure these clips are in there to show the danger they are in. It would be counter intuitive to have a dark trailer and then go hey here's Cap beating down a drone easy.

Then guess what people would be saying, oh those drones look like cannon fodder. In fact what most people have said about that Cap vs drone fight is that it looks like the drones will be at least good in a fight.

 

[Stringer]

Leaping like 15 ft into the air to avoid danger. And he is getting beat down, yeah but are you expecting him to lose that battle are you? Pretty sure these clips are in there to show the danger they are in. It would be counter intuitive to have a dark trailer and then go hey here's Cap beating down a drone easy.

Then guess what people would be saying, oh those drones look like cannon fodder. In fact what most people have said about that Cap vs drone fight is that it looks like the drones will be at least good in a fight.

Yeah, you're still missing the point.

 

[warhorse78]

Cap and Superman in one pic t:

with Dana Scully

So, I wonder who she is more fascinated by. The man who took the serum and became almost superhuman, or the alien that is from another planet? Hmmmm? Either way, I bet she'd like to dissect both.

 

[BoredGuy]

^^^Oh, I so won the race to that joke a few pages back... sorry!







and note that she's standing with the posture of a preteen boy with an erection in class
she's excited

 

[Ghostcrow13]

Yeah, you're still missing the point.

The point that Caps fighting style is going to be reverted back to A1, because of a 1 second clip where a drone gets the upper hand over him?

Or because he has yet to say any lines in the trailers therefore that points to him not having the same characterization as in TWS, despite the fact there is a whole clip of him speaking and taking Stark down a peg.

 

[Suzanne78]

Leaping like 15 ft into the air to avoid danger. And he is getting beat down, yeah but are you expecting him to lose that battle are you? Pretty sure these clips are in there to show the danger they are in. It would be counter intuitive to have a dark trailer and then go hey here's Cap beating down a drone easy.

Then guess what people would be saying, oh those drones look like cannon fodder. In fact what most people have said about that Cap vs drone fight is that it looks like the drones will be at least good in a fight.

Yeah, I think you're missing the major point a lot of us are trying to make.

We're just worried that Whedon's going to let Cap's skills and abilities stagnate from how they were developed and displayed during TWS. Thus far, in any of the officially released footage, there hasn't been a display of Cap's powers/strength/fighting abilities/emotional moments like there is with Hulk/Tony/Widow/Thor… Even Scarlet Witch has a couple of split-second moments in the first trailers where she looks like she's in agony or other emotional conflict.

Cap's only been shown leaping around cars, kicking down a door, and in the middle of a beatdown with Ulty/drone (w/ Quicksilver racing around). Hardly anything that could be close to being considered a "money shot" for him.

The Russos did an incredible job with his development from TFA to TA, not just emotionally, but in showing what an incredible, skillful fighter and leader Cap is and can be. Our hope is that Whedon hasn't forgotten that. It just hasn't been revealed yet in the trailers that have been released. The closest thing is that leaked Steve/Tony scene at the cabin and Cap getting so angry he splits a log with his bare hands, but that's not officially released by Marvel yet. And I certainly hope that's not the only BAMF moment we get with Cap in this movie. I'm crossing my fingers, but the lack of Cap goodness in these trailers is leaving me a bit bereft.

There are ways to show some sort of epic shot involving Cap without making it look like he's going to win easily.

But it is okay to have differing opinions about this. I think whether you feel Cap's being shown enough for this movie thus far is entirely subjective.

 

[BoredGuy]

time to wade into this fight:

but now you're missing the point Suzanne, that there is pretty much no evidence to point in either direction

any assumption that Whedon will fail to show off Cap is just that, an assumption, and one that actually contradicts some information we have, like statements from Evans and the fact that the fight Choreographer from TWS is involved here.

it's the deifinition of jumping the gun to assume off these two brief trailers that Cap's all of a sudden gunna suck or something

 

[Suzanne78]

Ehhhh… I try not to let myself get too ahead of the game. Like, I definitely want to wait to see the final product of AoU.

It's just that… I'm not impressed with what's been released so far in regards to Cap. Which has made me realize I'm pretty much invested solely in Cap and just Cap, LOL!

Evans has talked a great deal about Cap's role, yes. But Whedon's said very little, and Whedon's the one with ultimate control over the movie. But, like I said, it's a very subjective matter with good points to be made on both sides. I just didn't want what I'm feeling to be misunderstood, LOL!

See… this is where I get confused. Is there a difference between stunt coordinator/choreographer and fight choreographer/coordinators? I know that one from TWS is involved in this movie, but to what degree are they involved? How does it work when you have multiple characters requiring different fighting skills and abilities?

*runs to Google*

 

[Ghostcrow13]

Well I'll change my tone, perhaps this just isn't Caps story. Perhaps he is there for the ride, he will be a leader, he will clash with Stark over Ultron, setting up Civil War and he will have his moments in the action scenes. (Personally I think cap leaping 15-20ft into the air to avoid a car is awesome)

But maybe he won't have a huge money shot, or big emotional arc. And you know what personally as a huge Cap fan, I won't mind it. I loved TFA, I liked his role in A1 yeah his fighting could have been better but there is a clear in universe reason as to why it wasn't and TWS was amazing and made Cap a badass in the GAs eyes. He will be the lead in Civil War next year and will play his role in IW. I think he has earned his place just being a member of the Avengers in this story.

As an Avengers fan and Marvel fan I want people to love Hawkeye and Thor the same way they now love Cap and Widow. (Hawkeye and Thor by the way I fear getting shafted way more than Cap) So if that means Cap has less of a story and has less badass moments well then so be it, they only have a certain amount of time to tell a story and a certain amount of money to spend on effects.

 

[warhorse78]

Just to quickly point out, your entire second paragraph is an opinion statement, subject to interpretation. Obviously, others here have a different interpretation of what "showcase" means. I think for many of us, showing even the briefest of clips of Cap's fighting style instead of increasing the amount of IM and Hulk's showdown, might go a ways to assuage our fears about how Whedon will handle Cap in this movie.

Normally, I'm not one to get prematurely worked up about something before the release, but it is a concern I have, and it would be alleviated if Whedon talked a little more in depth about what is going on with Cap in AoU.

Also, if they just give us a wee little taste of Cap's fighting style in the movie.

Maybe Cap has all the major money shots this time, and they are saving the best scenes for the movie (like Hulk's smash on Loki in Avengers 1). Can't be coincidence that they show him actually moving Mjolnir, so perhaps in the movie, he does actually use it. I too am a bit concerned, but, I am more worried about Robert Downy Jr hijacking Civil War from Captain America than I am about Steve's role in Avengers 2. I have a sad feeling that even though Civil War is supposed to be Captain America 3, Robert Downey Jr/Ironman is going to be the primary credit/character.

 

[BigThor]

I was addressing the bolded. The complaints are that we haven't seen anything different in the two trailers "so far" when it comes to representing Cap right. What we have seen so far is more of the same from the Avengers.

As I've said before Cap fans shouldnt be nearly as concerned as Thor fans. Cap has for all intent and purposes been taken a lot more seriously in the MCU.

He's had a solid film followed by an amazing film and he had more screentime than anyone in TA. I think Cap fans should be grateful, but gratefulness isn't really a part of human nature is it.

 

[warhorse78]

Are people forgetting that Cap got the most screen time in the Avengers and was pretty much the number 1 or 2 character? AND he also got some of the best moments, featuring some very "Captain America" lines. Where are all these complaints coming from that Joss doesn't get Cap? He was my favorite character in the first Avengers film.

But he didn't save the day. Ironman, Hulk and Black Widow were the saviors, not Cap. Hulk defeated Loki (it really should have been Thor to be honest) Ironman flew the bomb up to the aliens and Black Widow closed the portal. Personally, I would have swapped out Widow for Cap, but we all know Whedon likes his ass kicking females.

 

[warhorse78]

Thor fans have more cause for worry in my opinion, he was by far more short changed than Cap in TA. Not to mention TWS did Cap far more justice than Thor:TDW did Thor.

But for some reason Thor fans don't seem to be worried when in actuality they have more reason to be.

Sadly, I agree. He seriously got upstaged, in both his movies and The Avengers, by Loki. Hemsworth is great, but his charisma stales in comparison to Hiddleston.

 

[Ghostcrow13]

But he didn't save the day. Ironman, Hulk and Black Widow were the saviors, not Cap. Hulk defeated Loki (it really should have been Thor to be honest) Ironman flew the bomb up to the aliens and Black Widow closed the portal. Personally, I would have swapped out Widow for Cap, but we all know Whedon likes his ass kicking females.

To be honest unless we write the stories we are not going to get exactly what we want. You want Cap instead of Widow and if it was like that then there would have been people who wanted Widow instead of Cap.

If it was up to BigThor I feel like he would have all the other Avengers killed then Thor go on a rampage through all the drones then defeat Ultron.

 

[sabrecmc]

If the rumors of some big action set piece in the third act that has yet to be revealed are true, then maybe that is where Cap's big money shots are and they are holding off on those on purpose? I'm an optimist.

Agree that Thor needs the most help. TDW did him no favors. He still seems like a super-powered frat boy to me. Eh.

 

[warhorse78]

Well I'll change my tone, perhaps this just isn't Caps story. Perhaps he is there for the ride, he will be a leader, he will clash with Stark over Ultron, setting up Civil War and he will have his moments in the action scenes. (Personally I think cap leaping 15-20ft into the air to avoid a car is awesome)

But maybe he won't have a huge money shot, or big emotional arc. And you know what personally as a huge Cap fan, I won't mind it. I loved TFA, I liked his role in A1 yeah his fighting could have been better but there is a clear in universe reason as to why it wasn't and TWS was amazing and made Cap a badass in the GAs eyes. He will be the lead in Civil War next year and will play his role in IW. I think he has earned his place just being a member of the Avengers in this story.

As an Avengers fan and Marvel fan I want people to love Hawkeye and Thor the same way they now love Cap and Widow. (Hawkeye and Thor by the way I fear getting shafted way more than Cap) So if that means Cap has less of a story and has less badass moments well then so be it, they only have a certain amount of time to tell a story and a certain amount of money to spend on effects.

He didn't have that either in Avengers 1. Like I said, Hulk, Ironman and Blackwidow got all the money shots. Cap was severely held back so the other three could shine, for whatever reason. I also don't like how Thor got shafted too.

 

[Ghostcrow13]

Sadly, I agree. He seriously got upstaged, in both his movies and The Avengers, by Loki. Hemsworth is great, but his charisma stales in comparison to Hiddleston.

See that is the disappointing thing for me, offscreen I don't think that's the case, I think they are both charismatic, in interviews I wouldn't say Hiddleston greatly out shines Hemsworth. It's on screen Loki has just had more to work with and more fun lines.