The "we're sorry, Brett" thread...

[KenK]

I don't agree here. The theme was stamped all over the movie. And the movie does have a theme, unlike the first two X-movies.

I can understand the disappointments; I share them too but I dealt with them as soon as I knew about the changes in creative team. It's less than intelligent to be surprised by the content of the movie, given the fact that online fans on here knew the details more than anyone else did.

The number of characters is not really an issue in a movie about a final showdown. Cameo roles were bound to happen. What hurt the movie was editing/runtime.

But the theme was transparently obvious. Xavier and Magneto talk of 'power corrupts', Xavier tells Wolveirne of his terrible choice regarding Jean, Storm argues with Wolverine over making a choice. Beast argues with the president over the cure weaponisation choice. You'd have to be pretty dense not to have noticed a theme that was mentioned throughout the movie.

I'm not saying that I didn't notice there being a theme. The issue is that the film as a whole was not well-made!! There was an under-developed feeling to everything that was done in the film to the point that whatever themes are being presented are irrelevant. I'm not going to excuse bad filmmaking just because a movie has a clear theme. Bearing that in mind, I can't totally blame Ratner, or the screenwriters, because the "choice" was always in Fox's hands. The choice was theirs to either secure Singer & Co. as soon as X2 made 85 million its first weekend, and immediately start development on the third film, will all the time in the world to do everything they would need long before May of last year, or let me do it after Superman Returns, as he always said he'd gladly come back. The only thing that would have kept X3 from coming out in 2005 would have been Fantastic Four, another Fox production of a Marvel comic, in which case that's just even more time for Singer to make the best movie possible, instead of a film where the script was allegedly written in a week, pre-production went along without a director, and when they finally do get a director, it's two months before shooting starts, then he quits, and Ratner comes on with little more than a month to prepare! And it shows. Scenes just jump from one to the next with no real transition, some effects weren't conceptualized very well (especially Colossus), and far too many characters are there just to be there. Aside from Callisto and Psylocke being little to nothing like their characters, they're not even referred to by name anyway! Not to mention other characters who don't even speak!! Which would be forgiveable if they had been involved in any halfway decent action/fight sequences! Deathstrike may not have had any lines in X2, but her fight with Wolverine was fantastic. We don't get any of that with X3.

I'm not saying the film didn't have its moments, but most of those moments don't particularly relate back to the story, or add to the story. It's basically a lot of various comic nuances like Beast reading while hanging upside down, Bobby turning himself into ice, etc. It's cool to see stuff like that, but I'd much prefer to see more character/story-driven moments that are well-executed.

A scene was very much looking forward to from the trailers and commercials was X-Men suiting up to go to Alcatraz, and Bobby, Kitty, and Peter volunteered to join them, with Wolverine initially rejecting them, because he knows how dangerous it'll be. Instead we get Wolverin monologuing and persuading them to join. Even from a casual filmgoer's standpoint, that's not something the film Wolverine would do. The films always established Logan as someone who'd try to keep the kids out of harm's way. Even in the context of this one film, it began with them in a training session and him making it abundantly clear that they're not ready to handle a combat situation. But by the end of the film, he's persuading them to go into battle with mutants that could, and have, easily whooped his ass?!? To say nothing of the fact that between the beginning of the film, and the climax, he has ZERO interaction with the students, except for Rogue, and no scenes are presented to develop on the idea of the students training to be X-Men.

Any focus on the students during the course of the film aims for frivolous high school melodrama, and it even fails on that level. Rogue's jealousy of Bobby and Kitty's friendship is completely unfounded, and Peter, he's given three words of dialogue in a gag scene. At least X2 had a minor acknowledgment of the fact that in the comics, Peter likes to draw. And it worked far better at evoking humor than in X3 with him walking down the hall with a giant TV in his arms (and doesn't his superhuman strength only apply when he's in metal form, anyway?).

And on a more shallow note. . . . .Anna Paquin looked too damn good in that X-uniform to only wear it once throughout the whole film!! Instead with get Storm without the high heels, and Kitty who's built like a twelve-year-old boy!

 

[LastSunrise1981]

I'm not saying that I didn't notice there being a theme. The issue is that the film as a whole was not well-made!! There was an under-developed feeling to everything that was done in the film to the point that whatever themes are being presented are irrelevant. I'm not going to excuse bad filmmaking just because a movie has a clear theme. Bearing that in mind, I can't totally blame Ratner, or the screenwriters, because the "choice" was always in Fox's hands. The choice was theirs to either secure Singer & Co. as soon as X2 made 85 million its first weekend, and immediately start development on the third film, will all the time in the world to do everything they would need long before May of last year, or let me do it after Superman Returns, as he always said he'd gladly come back. The only thing that would have kept X3 from coming out in 2005 would have been Fantastic Four, another Fox production of a Marvel comic, in which case that's just even more time for Singer to make the best movie possible, instead of a film where the script was allegedly written in a week, pre-production went along without a director, and when they finally do get a director, it's two months before shooting starts, then he quits, and Ratner comes on with little more than a month to prepare! And it shows. Scenes just jump from one to the next with no real transition, some effects weren't conceptualized very well (especially Colossus), and far too many characters are there just to be there. Aside from Callisto and Psylocke being little to nothing like their characters, they're not even referred to by name anyway! Not to mention other characters who don't even speak!! Which would be forgiveable if they had been involved in any halfway decent action/fight sequences! Deathstrike may not have had any lines in X2, but her fight with Wolverine was fantastic. We don't get any of that with X3.

I'm not saying the film didn't have its moments, but most of those moments don't particularly relate back to the story, or add to the story. It's basically a lot of various comic nuances like Beast reading while hanging upside down, Bobby turning himself into ice, etc. It's cool to see stuff like that, but I'd much prefer to see more character/story-driven moments that are well-executed.

A scene was very much looking forward to from the trailers and commercials was X-Men suiting up to go to Alcatraz, and Bobby, Kitty, and Peter volunteered to join them, with Wolverine initially rejecting them, because he knows how dangerous it'll be. Instead we get Wolverin monologuing and persuading them to join. Even from a casual filmgoer's standpoint, that's not something the film Wolverine would do. The films always established Logan as someone who'd try to keep the kids out of harm's way. Even in the context of this one film, it began with them in a training session and him making it abundantly clear that they're not ready to handle a combat situation. But by the end of the film, he's persuading them to go into battle with mutants that could, and have, easily whooped his ass?!? To say nothing of the fact that between the beginning of the film, and the climax, he has ZERO interaction with the students, except for Rogue, and no scenes are presented to develop on the idea of the students training to be X-Men.

Any focus on the students during the course of the film aims for frivolous high school melodrama, and it even fails on that level. Rogue's jealousy of Bobby and Kitty's friendship is completely unfounded, and Peter, he's given three words of dialogue in a gag scene. At least X2 had a minor acknowledgment of the fact that in the comics, Peter likes to draw. And it worked far better at evoking humor than in X3 with him walking down the hall with a giant TV in his arms (and doesn't his superhuman strength only apply when he's in metal form, anyway?).

And on a more shallow note. . . . .Anna Paquin looked too damn good in that X-uniform to only wear it once throughout the whole film!! Instead with get Storm without the high heels, and Kitty who's built like a twelve-year-old boy!

Exactly. Well said. This truly deserves post of the week, month, and year.

 

[X-Maniac]

I'm not saying that I didn't notice there being a theme. The issue is that the film as a whole was not well-made!! There was an under-developed feeling to everything that was done in the film to the point that whatever themes are being presented are irrelevant. I'm not going to excuse bad filmmaking just because a movie has a clear theme. Bearing that in mind, I can't totally blame Ratner, or the screenwriters, because the "choice" was always in Fox's hands. The choice was theirs to either secure Singer & Co. as soon as X2 made 85 million its first weekend, and immediately start development on the third film, will all the time in the world to do everything they would need long before May of last year, or let me do it after Superman Returns, as he always said he'd gladly come back. The only thing that would have kept X3 from coming out in 2005 would have been Fantastic Four, another Fox production of a Marvel comic, in which case that's just even more time for Singer to make the best movie possible, instead of a film where the script was allegedly written in a week, pre-production went along without a director, and when they finally do get a director, it's two months before shooting starts, then he quits, and Ratner comes on with little more than a month to prepare! !

Moving on from your slip above (“or let ME do it after Superman Returns” – is Mr Singer himself on here!!!???)…. I really don’t know what was going on behind the scenes, why they delayed, so I can’t comment with any authority. I have no idea what their thoughts were on the success of X2 and the need/demand for an X3. But I’m sure the script wasn’t written in a week – that’s hardly possible!

And it shows. Scenes just jump from one to the next with no real transition, some effects weren't conceptualized very well (especially Colossus), and far too many characters are there just to be there. Aside from Callisto and Psylocke being little to nothing like their characters, they're not even referred to by name anyway! Not to mention other characters who don't even speak!! Which would be forgiveable if they had been involved in any halfway decent action/fight sequences! Deathstrike may not have had any lines in X2, but her fight with Wolverine was fantastic. We don't get any of that with X3.

I didn’t feel the scenes jumped around. Pacing and editing was pretty fast (mostly, but not all the time) but the movie did flow. Nothing seemed irrelevant to the story it was telling.

With Colossus, I’m sure they said they used ‘real’ FX (actual armoured bodysuit and face mask) to limit the need, cost and lengthy task of CGI-ing all the metal on to him in post-prod. That sounds fair enough. Obviously they touched up areas in post-prod. We saw Colossus far more in X3 (though he wasn’t developed and you can see why, with everything else that was going on), so there is more to criticise than in a tantalising few seconds’ glimpse in X2. To me, from memory, the X2 FX on him did seem cooler, better, slicker – but I can understand why they opted to minimise expensive, lengthy post-prod on him. What little time he had could have been better used – the scene carrying the TV could have instead been some other scene with him in. I don’t think I expected that much more from him in this movie, given that we had other characters that were directly linked to the story.

Callisto’s name not being used was bad, though not noticed by anyone I know off this site. It may be that scenes with her were cut; it seems Psylocke scenes were cut if we are to believe Mei Melancon’s interviews.

As for having these minor characters, I didn’t mind too much. We had Siryn in X2 just to do her sonic scream, we had a made-up character called Jones flicking TV channels (it could instead have been an established comicbook mutant, someone nocturnal), we had Artie there (nothing like the comicbook Artie) poking a blue tongue out twice, we had Jubilee in the background (her one power display moment, which was inaccurate for her ‘plasma ball’ firework powers, was cut).

I'm not saying the film didn't have its moments, but most of those moments don't particularly relate back to the story, or add to the story. It's basically a lot of various comic nuances like Beast reading while hanging upside down, Bobby turning himself into ice, etc. It's cool to see stuff like that, but I'd much prefer to see more character/story-driven moments that are well-executed.

I think the Danger Room sequence was perhaps the worst for me. It served its purpose but seemed like something that was not executed/realised to its potential. The Sentinel head was an Easter egg I didn’t really need to see; I’d rather the real Sentinels in a future movie.

But I did like Beast reading while hanging upside down, and also Iceman’s icing up – both seemed part of the movie and part of the telling of the story. Neither seemed forced into it. In fact, the Iceman scene illustrates exactly why the younger X-Men were ready – they’d obviously been continuing to train and hone their skills (I don’t know how many DR training sessions could or should have been shown to illustrate that… this wasn’t about the young X-Men training, it was about the urgency of being needed to face an army….)

A scene was very much looking forward to from the trailers and commercials was X-Men suiting up to go to Alcatraz, and Bobby, Kitty, and Peter volunteered to join them, with Wolverine initially rejecting them, because he knows how dangerous it'll be. Instead we get Wolverin monologuing and persuading them to join. Even from a casual filmgoer's standpoint, that's not something the film Wolverine would do. The films always established Logan as someone who'd try to keep the kids out of harm's way. Even in the context of this one film, it began with them in a training session and him making it abundantly clear that they're not ready to handle a combat situation. But by the end of the film, he's persuading them to go into battle with mutants that could, and have, easily whooped his ass?!? To say nothing of the fact that between the beginning of the film, and the climax, he has ZERO interaction with the students, except for Rogue, and no scenes are presented to develop on the idea of the students training to be X-Men.

I agree the Wolverine speech to the students felt wrong. I prefer the alternative take with Bobby talking. But you know Fox has a raging stiffie for Wolverine….

Any focus on the students during the course of the film aims for frivolous high school melodrama, and it even fails on that level. Rogue's jealousy of Bobby and Kitty's friendship is completely unfounded, and Peter, he's given three words of dialogue in a gag scene. At least X2 had a minor acknowledgment of the fact that in the comics, Peter likes to draw. And it worked far better at evoking humor than in X3 with him walking down the hall with a giant TV in his arms (and doesn't his superhuman strength only apply when he's in metal form, anyway?).

And on a more shallow note. . . . .Anna Paquin looked too damn good in that X-uniform to only wear it once throughout the whole film!! Instead with get Storm without the high heels, and Kitty who's built like a twelve-year-old boy!

Well, they are high school students, so I would expect high school student behaviour – hormone-fuelled crushes, lusts and jealousies. Sounds like high school to me. Unless you were in a monastery! And even then…

As I said I didn’t like the odd scene with Colossus and a TV. But wasn’t Rogue’s role also influenced by the fact that Anna Paquin signed to do Margaret and her role had to be rewritten and reduced? Either way, I can get that her seeing someone (Kitty) being able to touch Bobby properly might set off a teenage angst attack. It seems perfectly realistic even if I’d rather she hadn’t taken the cure, which I think was a bad move….

So, yes, it could have been better. But now what? We all want it to be better somehow, in varying degrees of acceptance/tolerance. Which leads us where? What’s next?

 

[The Kid]

I'm sorry you're a hack, Brett Ratner.

 

[KenK]

Moving on from your slip above (“or let ME do it after Superman Returns” – is Mr Singer himself on here!!!???)…. I really don’t know what was going on behind the scenes, why they delayed, so I can’t comment with any authority. I have no idea what their thoughts were on the success of X2 and the need/demand for an X3.

Well, ideally, a film as successful as X2 from both a commercial and critical standpoint (the comic fans and professional critics), it just makes sense to secure all the necessary elements in a timely fashion. Plenty of other studios that have handled comic properties have done it. Seems foolish of Fox, since their comic movie franchise is near the top of the heap, second only to Spider-Man.

But I’m sure the script wasn’t written in a week – that’s hardly possible!

Okay, maybe it wasn't a week, but beyond the speculation of how long it took for the script to be written, there's still the fact that it leaked online, and people hated it. And the studio KNEW people hated it, and tried to debunk elements of the script under the LIE that it was an "early draft" that was being heavily revised, despite countless elements of the so-called "early draft" ending up in the final film, anyway.

I didn’t feel the scenes jumped around. Pacing and editing was pretty fast (mostly, but not all the time) but the movie did flow. Nothing seemed irrelevant to the story it was telling.

I don't know, some transitions just felt very rough to me. Then there's the third act, where it's just before dusk in San Francisco as Magneto moves the Golden Gate Bridge, then immediately turns to nighttime with they hit Alcatraz Island. Mind you, that means it should have already been nighttime when the X-Men left Westchester instead of the sunny afternoon day that it was, on the EAST COAST!! California is three hours BEHIND, remember?!?

With Colossus, I’m sure they said they used ‘real’ FX (actual armoured bodysuit and face mask) to limit the need, cost and lengthy task of CGI-ing all the metal on to him in post-prod. That sounds fair enough. Obviously they touched up areas in post-prod. We saw Colossus far more in X3 (though he wasn’t developed and you can see why, with everything else that was going on), so there is more to criticise than in a tantalising few seconds’ glimpse in X2. To me, from memory, the X2 FX on him did seem cooler, better, slicker – but I can understand why they opted to minimise expensive, lengthy post-prod on him. What little time he had could have been better used – the scene carrying the TV could have instead been some other scene with him in. I don’t think I expected that much more from him in this movie, given that we had other characters that were directly linked to the story.

I just think he should have been fleshed out in the same way Bobby, Kitty and Pyro were fleshed out after their brief appearances in the first film. Seeing the Fastball Special was nice, but there's so much more to the character, it's a shame he barely even speaks, let alone does anything beyond hit a few guys and toss Wolverine around.

As for having these minor characters, I didn’t mind too much. We had Siryn in X2 just to do her sonic scream, we had a made-up character called Jones flicking TV channels (it could instead have been an established comicbook mutant, someone nocturnal), we had Artie there (nothing like the comicbook Artie) poking a blue tongue out twice, we had Jubilee in the background (her one power display moment, which was inaccurate for her ‘plasma ball’ firework powers, was cut).

I just think some of it was overdone, more in relation to how much a character was meant to factor into the story. Colossus "graduates" to the X-Men. I think that's something that warrants a lot more attention to be paid to his character than what we were given, compared to Jubilee or Siryn, who were never more than just students at the school in the context of the film series.

I think the Danger Room sequence was perhaps the worst for me. It served its purpose but seemed like something that was not executed/realised to its potential. The Sentinel head was an Easter egg I didn’t really need to see; I’d rather the real Sentinels in a future movie.

Well, like I said, they establish the idea of the younger X-Men training, the problem is that there's no elaboration on that idea in the time before they go to Alcatraz. And yeah, the sentinel head was a real disappointment.

In fact, the Iceman scene illustrates exactly why the younger X-Men were ready – they’d obviously been continuing to train and hone their skills (I don’t know how many DR training sessions could or should have been shown to illustrate that… this wasn’t about the young X-Men training, it was about the urgency of being needed to face an army….)

But it just comes out of nowhere. And it's not that there needed to be more danger room scenes, but there needed to be acknowledgment beforehand of continued training. Especially with a character like Storm as a teacher. I remember a few issues of the comic where Bobby actively sought Storm's help in mastering his powers, since they're both elemental manipulators. The would be been perfect for the film.

Well, they are high school students, so I would expect high school student behaviour – hormone-fuelled crushes, lusts and jealousies. Sounds like high school to me. Unless you were in a monastery! And even then…

But like I said, it's done rather poorly. There's no real elaboration on it. Rogue never confronts Bobby or Kitty after she sees them ice skating in the courtyard, and the next time we see her, she's off to get the cure. To say nothing of the fact that there's no indication of Bobby even being conflicted over his thoughts for Rogue, or of there being any attraction between him and Kitty. It's not enough for Rogue to take every moment they're together and say, "something's going on", when nothing really is. Something NEEDS to be going on. Bobby NEEDS to exhibit conflict regarding his feelings for Rogue, to which things between them would ultimately come to a head. That doesn't happen. Rogue jumps to conclusions like a Three's Company episode, then leaves without confronting Bobby about her fears that she's losing him!

But wasn’t Rogue’s role also influenced by the fact that Anna Paquin signed to do Margaret and her role had to be rewritten and reduced?

Margaret who?

Either way, I can get that her seeing someone (Kitty) being able to touch Bobby properly might set off a teenage angst attack. It seems perfectly realistic even if I’d rather she hadn’t taken the cure, which I think was a bad move….

But like I said, she wouldn't leave things unresolved with Bobby and rush to take the cure. Teenagers can be impulsive, but not THAT impulsive! It's the same as women asking their men (and I can attest to this, believe me!) "Do you think I look fat?" If Rogue really thought strongly about the cure and its implications for her relationship with Bobby, she'd at least ask what he thought about it.

 

[Storm22]

I really don't see the problem with Colossus' fx in X3. I mean X2's fx were better but the X3 fx were fine imo and hardly distractingly bad. The body suit and mask were used in long distance shots anyway so they weren't that noticeable. My one complaint about Colossus in X3, besides him not doing much, was the fact that his hair metalled up.

 

[Theweepeople]

Okay, maybe it wasn't a week, but beyond the speculation of how long it took for the script to be written, there's still the fact that it leaked online, and people hated it. And the studio KNEW people hated it, and tried to debunk elements of the script under the LIE that it was an "early draft" that was being heavily revised, despite countless elements of the so-called "early draft" ending up in the final film, anyway.

My interest in discussing how bad X3 was has all but, evaporated, however I agree with X-Maniac that the script wasn't written in a week. What's really astonishing is Kinberg and Penn actually spent 6 months writing that piece of crap. One of my friends who graduated from film school 7 years ago could write a better script in a day than that rubbish.

 

[X-Maniac]

Well, ideally, a film as successful as X2 from both a commercial and critical standpoint (the comic fans and professional critics), it just makes sense to secure all the necessary elements in a timely fashion. Plenty of other studios that have handled comic properties have done it. Seems foolish of Fox, since their comic movie franchise is near the top of the heap, second only to Spider-Man.

What can I say? I don’t know why they delayed. It would have been much better if it had been planned as a trilogy from the beginning but it wasn’t – there was no way they would know the first movie would be a success. Why they didn’t leap in and get X3 going as soon as X2 did well is beyond me. I have no idea why they delayed so I can’t help you here.

Okay, maybe it wasn't a week, but beyond the speculation of how long it took for the script to be written, there's still the fact that it leaked online, and people hated it. And the studio KNEW people hated it, and tried to debunk elements of the script under the LIE that it was an "early draft" that was being heavily revised, despite countless elements of the so-called "early draft" ending up in the final film, anyway.

From which you can take the lesson that Fox isn’t listening to you. If they won’t change a very controversial script that was leaked – deliberately or not – then they are obviously going to do exactly what suits their needs, not yours and not anyone else’s. What goes in a movie isn’t for you – or us – to decide. Oh how I wish I could shout and have a tantrum and get exactly what I want in every movie. Petitions to Sony over organic webbing didn’t help either.

I don't know, some transitions just felt very rough to me. Then there's the third act, where it's just before dusk in San Francisco as Magneto moves the Golden Gate Bridge, then immediately turns to nighttime with they hit Alcatraz Island. Mind you, that means it should have already been nighttime when the X-Men left Westchester instead of the sunny afternoon day that it was, on the EAST COAST!! California is three hours BEHIND, remember?!?

Differences in US time zones would only be obvious to nitpicking American viewers. Since I’m not in the US and do not carry around lists of time zones, or flight-time calculations, then it means very little to me. The sudden dusk-to-night change is bad and obvious, mainly due to editing – they should have changed it on the DVD release at least.

I just think he should have been fleshed out in the same way Bobby, Kitty and Pyro were fleshed out after their brief appearances in the first film. Seeing the Fastball Special was nice, but there's so much more to the character, it's a shame he barely even speaks, let alone does anything beyond hit a few guys and toss Wolverine around.

He’s not had a story that has involved him, so has ended up as a peripheral character. Singer obviously decided he couldn’t do more than give a brief glimpse in X2 because it would clutter the story to have him around after that. In X3, we did have him around more but we saw that it doesn’t entirely work to have people hanging around who aren’t connected to the main plot. I guess at least the fastball special made him necessary to Wolverine! Oh well, maybe the next movie will find some way to involve him more.

I just think some of it was overdone, more in relation to how much a character was meant to factor into the story. Colossus "graduates" to the X-Men. I think that's something that warrants a lot more attention to be paid to his character than what we were given, compared to Jubilee or Siryn, who were never more than just students at the school in the context of the film series.

Well, like I said, they establish the idea of the younger X-Men training, the problem is that there's no elaboration on that idea in the time before they go to Alcatraz. And yeah, the sentinel head was a real disappointment.

It's not that there needed to be more danger room scenes, but there needed to be acknowledgment beforehand of continued training. Especially with a character like Storm as a teacher. I remember a few issues of the comic where Bobby actively sought Storm's help in mastering his powers, since they're both elemental manipulators. The would be been perfect for the film.

Yes, perhaps those who did ‘graduate’ perhaps needed another line or two to show their training had progressed to a sufficient level, but it was obvious it had when they boarded the X-jet. We were shown that they were now deemed ready for combat, without need for spoonfeeding via exposition or additional scenes. It was a story about Phoenix and Magneto’s war, not about young mutants training and graduating, so I can see why they didn’t focus on it and introduce a distracting sub-plot. I think you’re expecting far too much from a franchise that has a hell of a lot of characters and plots to try to service. Even X2 got attacked by some critics for what it was trying to pack into the space of one movie – read the Box Office Mojo review for instance…. http://www.boxofficemojo.com/reviews/?id=141&p=.htm

But like I said, it's done rather poorly. There's no real elaboration on it. Rogue never confronts Bobby or Kitty after she sees them ice skating in the courtyard, and the next time we see her, she's off to get the cure. To say nothing of the fact that there's no indication of Bobby even being conflicted over his thoughts for Rogue, or of there being any attraction between him and Kitty. It's not enough for Rogue to take every moment they're together and say, "something's going on", when nothing really is. Something NEEDS to be going on. Bobby NEEDS to exhibit conflict regarding his feelings for Rogue, to which things between them would ultimately come to a head. That doesn't happen. Rogue jumps to conclusions like a Three's Company episode, then leaves without confronting Bobby about her fears that she's losing him!

But like I said, she wouldn't leave things unresolved with Bobby and rush to take the cure. Teenagers can be impulsive, but not THAT impulsive! It's the same as women asking their men (and I can attest to this, believe me!) "Do you think I look fat?" If Rogue really thought strongly about the cure and its implications for her relationship with Bobby, she'd at least ask what he thought about it.

I didn’t see her behaviour as being that wild. She knows she can never touch Bobby, there’s no point in her confronting him as it won’t alter her mutation. She sees what happens as a reflection on her, it heightens her insecurity/inferiority because her powers are a disadvantage. It’s really quite simple. When she sees him get close to someone physically, she’s jealous, she knows she will never be able to do that (unless she is cured) and she decides to stomp off and do something about it. I don’t see this as being a poor aspect of the movie at all, even though I’d rather she not be cured. I remember my sister’s various antics and impulses as a teenager and Rogue’s behaviour seems very much like a teenage girl to me. Teenage girls do impulsive things – they turn up at home with bodypiercings, don’t come home at the time their parents specify, the press has stories of them running away with strangers they meet on the internet or committing suicide over bullying (all of which they do without confronting anyone). Internalised teenage angst, moodswings, tantrums and secrets are a part of our world. I can’t see why you can’t grasp it. Rogue isn’t confrontational anyway, she has been shown running away before. I see no problem with this aspect of the movie. You are overthinking it.

Margaret who?

The movie Margaret. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0466893/

 

[X-Maniac]

My one complaint about Colossus in X3, besides him not doing much, was the fact that his hair metalled up.

Yes, that's true... but there is the gap in logic of why he would have protective armour everywhere but over the top of his brain.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Yes, that's true... but there is the gap in logic of why he would have protective armour everywhere but over the top of his brain.

Not true.

The metal would still cover up the top of his head, the skin beneath the hair.

It wouldn't just stop at his forehead, and then have the top of his head and hair uncovered. The top of his head would be uncovered, and his hair would remain unmetaled up. Just like the comics, and the previous film.

 

[X-Maniac]

Not true.

The metal would still cover up the top of his head, the skin beneath the hair.

It wouldn't just stop at his forehead, and then have the top of his head and hair uncovered. The top of his head would be uncovered, and his hair would remain unmetaled up. Just like the comics, and the previous film.

That depends.

If his metallic armour is beneath the skin, then perhaps it might flow around hair follicles. If it is over the top of the skin, then I can't see how it could move around every single strand of hair and leave the hair poking out of it.... Why would it leave his hair exposed?!

The creative team for X2 said in an article (I think) that they envisaged he had liquid metal beneath his skin that formed into a protective layer (with the skin becoming transparent). Okay... but that means the skin is on top of his armour....which seems odd... The skin would be damaged by attacks on him. If you then say: no, the skin would be invulnerable, then what's the point of the metal beneath it!?

As I said, there are logic gaps!

 

[BMM]

That depends.

If his metallic armour is beneath the skin, then perhaps it might flow around hair follicles. If it is over the top of the skin, then I can't see how it could move around every single strand of hair and leave the hair poking out of it.... Why would it leave his hair exposed?!

The creative team for X2 said in an article (I think) that they envisaged he had liquid metal beneath his skin that formed into a protective layer (with the skin becoming transparent). Okay... but that means the skin is on top of his armour....which seems odd... The skin would be damaged by attacks on him. If you then say: no, the skin would be invulnerable, then what's the point of the metal beneath it!?

As I said, there are logic gaps!

Nell's right. Colossus' mutation allows him to transform his tissue into an organic, steel-like substance, which would include the skin covering the top of his head. His hair isn't necessarily affected by the transformation of his tissue, and this transformation isn't limited by the presence of hair follicles... otherwise, it would seem as though arm, leg, or any other kind of body hair would serve as a hindrance to his mutation.

...and I believe the creative team for X2 was simply using that explanation as a visual guide for what his transformation would look like... in other words they said it almost looks as though that explanation was occuring but not that his transformation was actually occuring in that way.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

That depends.

If his metallic armour is beneath the skin, then perhaps it might flow around hair follicles. If it is over the top of the skin, then I can't see how it could move around every single strand of hair and leave the hair poking out of it.... Why would it leave his hair exposed?!

The creative team for X2 said in an article (I think) that they envisaged he had liquid metal beneath his skin that formed into a protective layer (with the skin becoming transparent). Okay... but that means the skin is on top of his armour....which seems odd... The skin would be damaged by attacks on him. If you then say: no, the skin would be invulnerable, then what's the point of the metal beneath it!?

As I said, there are logic gaps!

Well then, I guess it just comes down to how nit picky are you going to get in a science fiction film based on a comic book about people with genetic mutations that give them fantastic powers?