The Wrestling Thread: Woo woo woo, you know it!

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

K. Miz' ring work doesn't bother me or bore me. So... Yea

 

[Hunter Rider]

 

[Kane52630]

I havent been watching a lot of wrestling but I do remember not liking the Miz when he first started and his HOORA persona but when he began teaming up with John Morrison I he gain some respect from me as a character. As for the In ring work he's average, nothing worth talking about other than some of the tag team moves he and Morrison did.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

I mean there's nothing left to say on the subject. I like miz. You dont. I've explained why I like miz, and it doesn't work for you. You've explained why you dislike miz and it doesn't work for me. I like the current product. You dont. I like the product for different reasons than you do, and neither one of us can understand why the other watches wrestling the way they do. There's not really much left to say on the subject of the miz until tonite when there is more progress in the storyline. I'll be waiting for it.

 

[Kaleb]

Can't wait to see the buyrate no for WM,lol

 

[Nemi]

I didn't know that no.

I would agree that his best work has been as a heel, but I would say it's his current work that he's doing. His current work is brilliant. The whole thing he did with Cena, taking over Nexus, and everything with Orton.

His SES heel gimmick I hated. When I first got back into WWE and he was the scrappy face, I was into it. And I'm really into it now. Just not that damn straight edge stuff.

Yeah his father was something he mentioned in ROH i think. I never watched it myself but i come across some videos of his promos there and a list of hilarioius quotes from him. One of my favorites being...


10 year old kid in the front row - "I Hate CM Punk"
(10 seconds later)
CM Punk - "I hope your parents DIE"

 

[Hunter Rider]

I mean there's nothing left to say on the subject. I like miz. You dont. I've explained why I like miz, and it doesn't work for you. You've explained why you dislike miz and it doesn't work for me. I like the current product. You dont. I like the product for different reasons than you do, and neither one of us can understand why the other watches wrestling the way they do. There's not really much left to say on the subject of the miz until tonite when there is more progress in the storyline. I'll be waiting for it.

You're right Nell I don't understand you, I have met plenty of fans who require wrestlers to have a personality they can get into, hell it's not like I am a huge HBK fan based solely off his great matches, I do understand and appreciate guys who have the full package, however I will never understand such a disregard for the match quality.

I often feel like you'd watch wrestling for the promos and angles and not actually bother at all with the matches that are part of the storylines, and to me that is like being a fan of the Fast and The Furious movies and not caring about the car chases.

 

[strikezone89]

Going to Raw tonight live in Chicago! I've heard Sin Cara will be working a dark match! If so I'll def be giving you guys updates and see how the crowd will be. I've noticed that Chicago has a pretty good Latino fanbase so I expect the roof to explode tonight.

 

[Lunar_Wolf]

When is the Chicago show?

 

[strikezone89]

When is the Chicago show?

Tonight

 

[Lunar_Wolf]

Man, that should be one hell of a show.

 

[Kaleb]

Raw is going to be in Chicago? Well we should be expecting massive cm punk chants then.

 

[Metallo]

well....people ARE measuring Hogan by his success in WCW....he signed there in 1994 and the nWo hit in 1996

the guy had lightning strike twice for him in his career....he got wrestling into the mainstream in the 80s and then turned it on his head in the 90s

In the 80's Hogan had a huge machine behind him and in the 90's while his arrival made an initial splash soon WCW was directionless again and people weren't buying the Hogan act as much as they used to. it wasn't Hogan but the proper catalyst in Scott Hall showing up in WCW to really help kick off WCW's success. Hogan was just the final piece of that puzzle. it wouldn't have worked without him but it wouldn't have worked without everyone elses work either.

I think Hogan's reaction is reasonable. While lightning striked twice in his lifetime, the odds of it happening a third time, in 14 months, are near impossible. We need to give it more time to see what he can do to help build the company up.

We're an impatient yet fickle lot, it shows a lot when we constantly claim XYZ is going to be the next big star, and in the same sentence say ZYX is getting pushed too fast. People expected change overnight because Hogan claimed it would happen, and I think now that he sees how tough it really will be to bring this company to a higher level after being there a year, he's come to his senses and has a better understanding of how to tackle this.

Well, we can hope.

I agree with all that. Hogan just said what he said for hype. Thats understandable. Btu I never had huge expectations for TNA to make a quantum leap in terms of success. Even if their creative was any good its going to take time.

Hogans done some good work on screen recently but they still have a fool in charge of creative.

Shawn Michaels vs Mr Perfect comes to mind, everyone was really anticipating their match at Summerslam 93 but things just didn't really click, perhaps expectations were too high.

Oddly enough they had a singles match in 91 when Shawn was part of The Rockers and it was a better match, maybe the fact the roles were reversed with Shawn as the face made it work better.

Yeah I was looking forward to them going at it but it let me down. I'm not sure they told the right kind of story or hyped it up the proper way. If anything Perfect should have taken Shawn under his wing and then Shawn could have turned on him.

They had a lot of similarities as heels and I wish that had been played up more

Miz is the perfect example of everything that is wrong with current WWE IMO.

Vince preferring gaga over legitimately built deep long term talent. I can't say its all the Miz's fault. Vince booked for the short term instead of the long term. Same thing happened to Sheamus at first.

The match is meant to be a story as well, the art of being a good pro wrestler is you enable the audience to suspend their disbelief and get swept away in the drama, Miz is a by the numbers worker with some decent psychology, but far removed from being a genuine main event worker.

He's average at best in the ring and doesn't do anything exceptionally well.

Thats why I just don't buy him as a top guy right now. He can't overpower most guys, he can't out wrestle them, he can't out brawl them...I mean how can I believe he can beat most guys physically? I suppose he can outsmart them but he hasn't even really been shown to be that crafy...and a wrestler can only do that for so long before it gets boring.

Ric Flair stayed at the top by simply outsmarting a lot of guys but when push came to shove he could outwrestle almost anyone if he had to survive.

to me, a true superstar is a guy who can go to any promotion and belong...the Miz is a WWE product, without the WWE he is Mike Mizanin from Cleveland, Ohio....a f'ng nobody

like HR said, he is where he is due to a the industry being in a lean period and he is (like Cena) a company man

Miz's current reign is comparable to Jerichos first in some ways but Jericho was a guy who could do certain things amazingly well. If he looked weak then i can't imagine most people taking Miz seriously as a top contender unless he improves in many areas. He's basically a watered down Jericho right now with about a 100th of the talent.

The one major flaw with The Miz is that he doesn't have "the look". Somebody like Sheamus is more believable to being the world champion. Now granted, smaller guys than Miz have been champion, but at least they gave 5 stars matches to make up for it. The Miz is not somebody people in general are willing to pay $50 a month to see.

Yeah its not just about the look but he doesn't have the overall talent either. Even guys who don't have that big man look can make a place for themselves among the greats. Thats how Shanw Michaels did it.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Hogan was doing Michaels a favor by having him play heel as it brought out his best mic work in years and had HBK kept his fu**ing mouth shut, he might have gotten his win back.

Wasn't gonna happen. Hogan had already decided he wasn't goign to lose to Michaels. From what I understand when if was asked if Michaels would be winning in later matches Hogans response was "Oh we can have more matches...but I'm winning them all" If they had kept having matches there's no way Michaels would have gone over. It was best to leave it there with one match since Hogan was being selfish. And Michaels had every right to mock Hogan the way he did the next night. He had to get a little of his face heat back after losing to The red and yellow geriatric. I'm a huge Hogan fan but if anything Hogan robbed the fans of a feud that could have been much longer and better.

He was screwed over, he had every right to call out Hogan's ******** and he didn't ***** he simply told the truth, it had **** all to do with doing a job, he put plenty of less famous people than Hogan over, it was the manner in which Hogan did business that caused HBK's anger.

Hogan only jobs when he doesn't have creative control or when he was a heel in WCW.

Even in WCW he usually had to be convinced to job or he did the job to get something in return.

I"m half expecting them to promote her as Kamala's daughter.
[YT]I2pPe4Ejzs4[/YT]

...Or Mark Henry's sister...

 

[Dr. Evil]

Apparently WWE JUST copyrighted the name Tyson Kidd. That tells me that they might be looking to prevent someone from using it on the indie circuit, if you know what I'm saying. Either that, or they just forgot until now.

Regarding Awesome Kong...a rumor I heard was that Michael Cole will be winning the Divas title shortly after Wrestlemania. What better way to debut Kong than have her come out after Cole issues an open challenge to any Diva for his title, and have her crush him???

If Tyson is released, he'll go back to his given name of TJ Wilson and maybe cut off whatever that is on his forehead.

 

[strikezone89]

Raw is going to be in Chicago? Well we should be expecting massive cm punk chants then.

I've noticed that at Chicago shows, Punk gets a huge reaction but sadly there are more kids in the audience in the last Chicago show (Night of Champions) at I went to. By the time we had a good Punk chant going, he started talking to make our voices seem distant. By at the end of the match he did making minor points and references to his boots/tights where the Chicago stars are on.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

I dont "disregard" match quality. I need matches to be fun and exciting. However, what constitutes a "good match" to me is apparently completely different than what makes a good match to you.

The Rock is my favorite ever because his personality and his promos were out of this world. But he was also one of my favorites to watch in the ring because his personality was completely reflected in his ring style.

Was The Rock a great technical wrestler? No. If anyone fought in real life the way Rock did, they'd be in a hospital. There was nothing believable about his fighting style. If this were real fighting, The Rock could not be a credible champion.

But its not real fighting. Its scripted, and these guys are characters. So therefore he became "believable", and thus, credible.

While The Miz isn't a great technical master, I find his ring work to be very enjoyable from a character standpoint. But even more importantly I think that Miz is a great character guy. His character work gets me invested in his matches. Miz has gone a long way in getting me hyped for this wrestlemania match. Yes, The Rock's involvement is a huge contributor, but The Miz is getting me excited for the match in his own right.

Fact is this. When it comes to wrestling, I want my main event to feature great characters first and foremost. The midcarders I feel is the place for the in ring standouts who dont quite have the character. Guys like Jeff hardy, Chris Benoit, hart dynasty, dolph ziggler, John Morrison, these are all guys in my book who have little to no character, but are great ring workers. They belong on the card, but not in the main event. Then you have guys like Shawn Michaels, Kurt Angle, Chris Jericho, etc... who are great workers and great characters too. Thus, it makes these guys all time greats.

But yes, in the main event particularly, I need guys who can carry a story first. If they aren't amazing in ring, that's one thing, but then again, none of the guys who I've loved have ever been lame in the ring. Rock, Austin, Jericho, Michaels, Kurt Angle, Triple H, Undertaker, these guys all brought something to their style even if they weren't the greatest (and some of these guys are). Same with Orton, Cena, Batista, and a lot of these new guys. I've never been bored by a Cena match, or an Orton match, due to their abilities in the ring. I might get bored by the predictable outcome, but I've never been bored by Cena's abilities.

The Miz is no Michaels in the ring. Maybe he's not even Cena. But im not bored by Miz in the ring. I enjoy him as a character, greatly, and his in ring skill as at worst, adequate, to me to be a main eventer.

So perhaps what we have here isn't so much me disregarding match quality, but me having a different definition of a quality match.

 

[Phatman]

Apparently WWE JUST copyrighted the name Tyson Kidd. That tells me that they might be looking to prevent someone from using it on the indie circuit, if you know what I'm saying. Either that, or they just forgot until now.

Regarding Awesome Kong...a rumor I heard was that Michael Cole will be winning the Divas title shortly after Wrestlemania. What better way to debut Kong than have her come out after Cole issues an open challenge to any Diva for his title, and have her crush him???

That would be the perfect way to debut Kong. Then after she destroys Cole, then we can start seeing Divas destroyed in fun and creative ways up till the Beth Phoenix match at SummerSlam. Really wanna see Divas on stretchers, busted open, left broken in the ring; scared to have a match with her, something very similar to the way Brock ran roughsod over the WWE roster when he debuted.

Kong would be so much fun on SD! where Vickie could use her to bully and harass some of the lesserDivas.

 

[Metallo]

Well, at least he got a thread named after he before he likely gets canned after Wrestlemania. Besides him, I'd say these people probably have the most to worry about for their jobs:

Chavo
Chris Masters
Curt Hawkins
David Hart Smith
The Usos
JTG
Primo
Rosa Mendes
Trent Baretta
Tyler Reks
Tyson Kidd
Yoshi Tatsu
And maybe a few of the Nexus guys that didn't really work, like Husky Harris, Michael Tarver, and Skip Sheffield.

I think all the people I bolded have a good chance of sticking around. There's no way Husky's getting fired with his pedigree. He'll have to many people goign to bat for him. They'll keep Yoshi just to have someone to trot out for the Japanese market (plus he's talented). Thats why Khali is still around and why they are hiring people like Sin Cara. They want stronger international representation.

Skip has the look Vince loves plus he was getting better before he got hurt.

Michael Cole posted a homophobic slur this afternoon on his recently launched Twitter account, as he called fellow WWE announcer Josh Mathews a '******'. The tweet was in response to Mathews writing "Chicago!", the host city of this Monday's Raw taping.

The one word message was deleted approximately half an hour later and an apology was issued.

"I apologize to any and all who were offended by my tweet toward young Josh Mathews," Cole wrote. "It was obviously not meant the way it was taken."

World Wrestling Entertainment recently came under fire from the Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation (GLAAD), which took issue with the 'homophobic taunts' John Cena directed towards Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson on the February 28 episode of Monday Night Raw. Cena's unsavory verbiage prompted WWE to issue an apology and form a partnership with the organization on an anti-bullying campaign.

That explains why Cole sucks as an announcer so much. He's not clever enough to always say the right thing. They company has a PG direction and after the Cena debacle you'd think he would realize he should have chosen his words more carefully.

- Steve Austin is promoting WrestleMania 27 and Tough Enough in a new interview with IGN. In the interview, Austin revealed that each week on Tough Enough, he will select the "Bottom 3." These will be the lowest level performers on the show. Austin will give them a chance to convince him to let them stay before eliminating one and allowing the other two to stay.

Here are some highlights from the interview

What?
"I tell you what, I would have never in a million years went up to Vince and said, 'Hey, I've got this thing that I'm going to do and it's going to make people say 'What?' after every pause or break in someone's promo for the next ten years. I had no idea that even these days, when Michael Cole's in the ring cutting a promo, if he puts that pause in there, they'll come with a 'What?!' - but it's been interesting!"

Indeed, Steve, indeed. I don't think anyone knew that was going to happen.

I don't know if I'd say he's pretty good. I see a LOT of potential but when he's not working with someone much better his matches are completely forgettable. Even the Matches he's had with more established talent haven't been all that great.

He's great on the mic and has a great look and a good character...but he's got to step it up in the ring. If he can do that he has a bright future.

Rock selling a stunner is just electrifying to see, this to me was my favorite stunner.

Scott Hall did a pretty entertaining oversell of the Stunner.

 

[NotFadeAway]

On a TNA note, what I would do.....

Turn friggin RVD at Lockdown, have him win the title with the help of Hogan and become the centerpiece of Immortal. Anderson joining Immortal is too predictable and RVD has been a face the last 12 years and is in serious need of a switch up. I like he idea of RVD going along the lines of Jarrett joining Immortal and saying he didn't sell out, but finally bought in and was sick of being on the outside of the political spectrum.

With Anderson, I know it may be another Russo retread of Austin/McMahon, but I really like the idea of doing something similiar with Anderson/Hogan. I never in my wildest dreams thought I'd see and hear someone call Hogan a *****e bag to his face and in the middle of the ring like Anderson did last thursday and I loved it. No matter what the storyline or regardless of Hogan being face/heel, no one has ever gotten to stand up to Hogan like that on the mic and Anderson is really the perfect guy. Once Hogan gets healthy, I'd actually like to see the feud get the blow off with an Anderson vs. Hogan match at Bound For Glory 2011.

 

[Twitch]

Scott Hall did a pretty entertaining oversell of the Stunner.

The camera angle hides it but good lord how did Hall propel himself that high? He plant his feet to jump? Either way its an impressive bump.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Yeah I was looking forward to them going at it but it let me down. I'm not sure they told the right kind of story or hyped it up the proper way. If anything Perfect should have taken Shawn under his wing and then Shawn could have turned on him.

They had a lot of similarities as heels and I wish that had been played up more

They went with the story that Shawn was the athlete of the 90's, and was looking to take Mr Perfect's spot, they had the memorable brawl in New York outside the building where Raw was held every week at the time, where they battled onto a car, that was pretty radical stuff back in 93.

I think their similarities are what hurt the match in the long run, they both liked to do much of the same thing, and with Perfect as the face it meant him bumping in his style for the smaller HBK, which was awkward visually.

Vince preferring gaga over legitimately built deep long term talent. I can't say its all the Miz's fault. Vince booked for the short term instead of the long term. Same thing happened to Sheamus at first.

I actually thought up until the last few weeks they had booked Miz well, as the fluke champion who didn't deserve the belt, it was when they suddenly tried to book him as Cena and Rock's equal that it went downhill IMO.

He's average at best in the ring and doesn't do anything exceptionally well.

Thats why I just don't buy him as a top guy right now. He can't overpower most guys, he can't out wrestle them, he can't out brawl them...I mean how can I believe he can beat most guys physically? I suppose he can outsmart them but he hasn't even really been shown to be that crafy...and a wrestler can only do that for so long before it gets boring.

Ric Flair stayed at the top by simply outsmarting a lot of guys but when push came to shove he could outwrestle almost anyone if he had to survive.

Exactly, he just has no attributes that make him credible.

 

[Dr. Evil]

Is Chris Jericho still on Dancing with the Stars?

 

[Marx]

Is Chris Jericho still on Dancing with the Stars?

Yes. The new season just started. The first elimination isn't until tomorrow night and I have a very hard time believing he'll be booted first.

 

[Hunter Rider]

I dont "disregard" match quality. I need matches to be fun and exciting. However, what constitutes a "good match" to me is apparently completely different than what makes a good match to you.

The Rock is my favorite ever because his personality and his promos were out of this world. But he was also one of my favorites to watch in the ring because his personality was completely reflected in his ring style.

Was The Rock a great technical wrestler? No. If anyone fought in real life the way Rock did, they'd be in a hospital. There was nothing believable about his fighting style. If this were real fighting, The Rock could not be a credible champion.

But its not real fighting. Its scripted, and these guys are characters. So therefore he became "believable", and thus, credible.

While The Miz isn't a great technical master, I find his ring work to be very enjoyable from a character standpoint. But even more importantly I think that Miz is a great character guy. His character work gets me invested in his matches. Miz has gone a long way in getting me hyped for this wrestlemania match. Yes, The Rock's involvement is a huge contributor, but The Miz is getting me excited for the match in his own right.

Fact is this. When it comes to wrestling, I want my main event to feature great characters first and foremost. The midcarders I feel is the place for the in ring standouts who dont quite have the character. Guys like Jeff hardy, Chris Benoit, hart dynasty, dolph ziggler, John Morrison, these are all guys in my book who have little to no character, but are great ring workers. They belong on the card, but not in the main event. Then you have guys like Shawn Michaels, Kurt Angle, Chris Jericho, etc... who are great workers and great characters too. Thus, it makes these guys all time greats.

But yes, in the main event particularly, I need guys who can carry a story first. If they aren't amazing in ring, that's one thing, but then again, none of the guys who I've loved have ever been lame in the ring. Rock, Austin, Jericho, Michaels, Kurt Angle, Triple H, Undertaker, these guys all brought something to their style even if they weren't the greatest (and some of these guys are). Same with Orton, Cena, Batista, and a lot of these new guys. I've never been bored by a Cena match, or an Orton match, due to their abilities in the ring. I might get bored by the predictable outcome, but I've never been bored by Cena's abilities.

The Miz is no Michaels in the ring. Maybe he's not even Cena. But im not bored by Miz in the ring. I enjoy him as a character, greatly, and his in ring skill as at worst, adequate, to me to be a main eventer.

So perhaps what we have here isn't so much me disregarding match quality, but me having a different definition of a quality match.

With The Rock when you removed his talking you still had the look, the magnificent athletic ability, the explosive offense and the bumping, so with Rock I saw a main event guy that was more than merely adequate, the guys you list I get it, I really do, they are packages who could deliver and were believable, however your Miz thing makes zero sense to me because unlike Rock or the limited Batista, he ticks not a single box.

 

[TX85]

OMG!!!!

Sin Cara In Action at House Show Vs Primo:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ioxx4j8Un8s

La Mistica finisher FTW!,I sure hope he gets to keep that and not get replaced by some watered down finisher latter on.

Is that his new theme??,Can't hear it good But I much prefer his Ameno theme.