Two New York cops shot dead, execution style

[warhorse78]

The police are already equipped with military grade weapons. That's what I'm talking about. The line is blurring already.

No they are not. When they have fighter jets, then we will talk! There is a BIG difference between civilian police and the military.

Here's the thing, the majority of people out there, are ****ing stupid. They do stupid and disgusting things like this when they get pissed off. Plain and simple. There's nothing that can excuse or justify any of this. Now, that being said, what do people think is going to happen with such an incredible amount of police brutality stories popping up every day, every where, in this country? I'm genuinely asking a question. What do people expect to happen? People are stupid, a person is smart, people are stupid and they do stupid stuff. A LOT of people are seriously enraged right now, and understandably so. It still doesn't justify any violence towards anybody. I just want to know what people expect out of people given the current climate surrounding law enforcement. I think a lot of people are giving too many people too much damn credit. People get pissed off enough they do **** like this.

On my facebook page, I have quite a few number of co-workers and friends of friends that have been cluttering my page with these random accounts of violence from the police. They just find the stuff and post it without trying to find if it holds any water, and I guess some of these people thing that, "oh gosh, if it's on the internet, then it must be real". The latest one hitting my facebook page was the Sandy Hook was a hoax.

 

[warhorse78]

double post

 

[Thundercrack85]

Yeah, military police can't get away with half the crap civilian police do.

 

[warhorse78]

A lot of people are worried that de Blasio will give the NYPD the go ahead to retaliate by cracking down hard on the protestors. I'm worried about that, but I'm also worried that de Blasio will be firm in telling them no, and they'll go ahead and do it anyway. A total breakdown in the chain of command in New York City's municipal government would make things so much worse.

Actually, there are rumors flying like crazy that the NYPD might just have a protest of their own, and simply not show up for work. City don't want the cops, then fine, lets see how they can get along without them for a few days.

 

[warhorse78]

Yeah, military police can't get away with half the crap civilian police do.

Yeah, keep telling yourself that. And goood for you for missing the point between civilian authority and a military one. Police aren't the enemy here. It's the puppets behind the curtains that are pulling the political strings are the enemy. The ones that own the media and lobbyst for the politicians, who practically push for military intervention throughout the world because of the billions in defense contracts.

 

[The Question]

Actually, there are rumors flying like crazy that the NYPD might just have a protest of their own, and simply not show up for work. City don't want the cops, then fine, lets see how they can get along without them for a few days.

So, I think this reasoning is super flawed.

1: The need for a criminal justice system doesn't mean that demands for more fairness with that system, as well as agents of that system being held to a higher standard, are not warranted.

2: Uniformed police patrols aren't that vital to the day-to-day operation of a city. They only end up intervening in about 1% of crimes as they are in progress. And a lot of the functions they do serve on a day to day that aren't related to crime prevention could be handled by non-police agencies. The main use of a police force is in the investigative departments.

 

[Maximus One]

Nothing gets on my nerves than those people saying Sandy Hook victims are actors and all that ****. So incredibly stupid.

 

[warhorse78]

Nothing gets on my nerves than those people saying Sandy Hook victims are actors and all that ****. So incredibly stupid.

Oh, and the newest one I have seen, people actually think someone who knew James Holmes and someone who knew Adam Lanza, were the same people, when it's clear as day and night that they are different people.

 

[Tempest]

So many feelings.

I don't know where to begin.

 

[warhorse78]

So, I think this reasoning is super flawed.

1: The need for a criminal justice system doesn't mean that demands for more fairness with that system, as well as agents of that system being held to a higher standard, are not warranted.

2: Uniformed police patrols aren't that vital to the day-to-day operation of a city. They only end up intervening in about 1% of crimes as they are in progress. And a lot of the functions they do serve on a day to day that aren't related to crime prevention could be handled by non-police agencies. The main use of a police force is in the investigative departments.

Well, it might not be so easy. The regular beat cops seem to be the ones getting all of the hatred. The guy that killed these two cops seemed to have a rap sheet. We saw the Fergeson kid steal and bully a clerk on video, and just recently, there was a Florida cop who was killed by a guy with over 32 felons on his jacket. So, the cops arrest these guys, only for them to be thrown out a short while later because of the justice system. So, is the justice system failing the cops, the criminals or just regular folk like you and me? I'm trying to see both sides, and I myself have seen outstanding cops, and horrible cops, and then the justice system comes in and plays havok on everything. Right now, one of my best friends has a head injury from a horse kicking her in the head. Since then, she's gone all crazy on us. She's scaring her mom since she dragged all of the furniture out of the house and set it on fire, claiming that the government is bugging her house. Her mom calls the cops, and wants them to force her to go to a hospital before she really does hurt someone or herself, but the cops hands are tied. They literally said they can't touch her until she does actually hurt someone. And since she burned the furniture outside, and it was hers to begin with, they can't even get her for arson. So right now, because of the law, all of our hands are tied and we all feel my friend is a ticking time bomb.

 

[Victarion]

So, I think this reasoning is super flawed.

1: The need for a criminal justice system doesn't mean that demands for more fairness with that system, as well as agents of that system being held to a higher standard, are not warranted.

2: Uniformed police patrols aren't that vital to the day-to-day operation of a city. They only end up intervening in about 1% of crimes as they are in progress. And a lot of the functions they do serve on a day to day that aren't related to crime prevention could be handled by non-police agencies. The main use of a police force is in the investigative departments.

They could just give New Yorkers the old Castle Doctrine prior to the hypothetical police strike.

 

[The Question]

Well, it might not be so easy. The regular beat cops seem to be the ones getting all of the hatred. The guy that killed these two cops seemed to have a rap sheet. We saw the Fergeson kid steal and bully a clerk on video, and just recently, there was a Florida cop who was killed by a guy with over 32 felons on his jacket. So, the cops arrest these guys, only for them to be thrown out a short while later because of the justice system. So, is the justice system failing the cops, the criminals or just regular folk like you and me? I'm trying to see both sides, and I myself have seen outstanding cops, and horrible cops, and then the justice system comes in and plays havok on everything. Right now, one of my best friends has a head injury from a horse kicking her in the head. Since then, she's gone all crazy on us. She's scaring her mom since she dragged all of the furniture out of the house and set it on fire, claiming that the government is bugging her house. Her mom calls the cops, and wants them to force her to go to a hospital before she really does hurt someone or herself, but the cops hands are tied. They literally said they can't touch her until she does actually hurt someone. And since she burned the furniture outside, and it was hers to begin with, they can't even get her for arson. So right now, because of the law, all of our hands are tied and we all feel my friend is a ticking time bomb.

Are you arguing that the justice system is a failure because it is to lenient on criminals?

Because, if so, that is demonstratively untrue.

The United States has the highest prison population in the world, both in terms of sheer numbers and as a percentage of the overall population. And prison conditions are unnecessarily harsh.

The failure of our criminal justice system is, in part, that it is a punitive system and not a rehabilitative system.

 

[Victarion]

Are you arguing that the justice system is a failure because it is to lenient on criminals?

Because, if so, that is demonstratively untrue.

The United States has the highest prison population in the world, both in terms of sheer numbers and as a percentage of the overall population. And prison conditions are unnecessarily harsh.

The failure of our criminal justice system is, in part, that it is a punitive system and not a rehabilitative system.

I don't know about that. During the few times that I have had to visit an ER, I've seen prisoners taken to ER's by way of ambulance bypass the people in the waiting area. They're usually given a room right off the bat. Seems pretty nice. I'd say we're too lenient.

 

[Tempest]

I don't know about that. During the few times that I have had to visit an ER, I've seen prisoners taken to ER's by way of ambulance bypass the people in the waiting area. They're usually given a room right off the bat. Seems pretty nice. I'd say we're too lenient.

I have a relative who is in and out of jail all the time. Definitely too lenient.

 

[The Question]

I don't know about that. During the few times that I have had to visit an ER, I've seen prisoners taken to ER's by way of ambulance bypass the people in the waiting area. They're usually given a room right off the bat. Seems pretty nice. I'd say we're too lenient.

1: If putting an effort into keeping people alive is your definition of too lenient, I think your priorities are skewed.

2: People in the waiting room in the ER are waiting to be examined by a doctor to determine what is wrong with them. Prisoners who are sent to the ER are sent there by prison doctors who have already either determined what is wrong with them or determined that whatever is wrong with them is serious enough for an ER visit.

3: How else is a prisoner going to be taken to the ER besides an ambulance? And how is taking them in an ambulance being too lenient? That is what ambulances are for.

4: I want to point out that your opinion isn't based on the actual living conditions within a prison.

5: Rehabilitative models of corrections are more effective and reduce crime. What is the value in being harsh?

 

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Actually, there are rumors flying like crazy that the NYPD might just have a protest of their own, and simply not show up for work. City don't want the cops, then fine, lets see how they can get along without them for a few days.

So...they'd go on strike like in Robocop?

Alot of people may die, if that happens. That'd be like telling everyone in New York that they have a free day to commit crime.

I'm really happy I moved out of the boroughs.

 

[The Question]

I have a relative who is in and out of jail all the time. Definitely too lenient.

How do you think that longer sentences would help?

 

[ChrisBaleBatman]

They could just give New Yorkers the old Castle Doctrine prior to the hypothetical police strike.

I think it'd be presumed already, by most New Yorkers, to be honest. I think it'd be understood as an 'anything goes'.

Kind of like the Purge, actually. But, at that point State Troopers, or the National Guard would become the NYPD for a time, I guess.

 

[Feenix]

How about we as a species stop blaming each other and stop escalating things? Do these idiots really want the government officials to put their communities in the grips of martial law where anyone can be shot dead with no questions asked? When fear takes over these things tend to happen.

Er....what? Do you really think this will escalate to the point where cops will just shoot civilians at random?

When has fear taken over and "these things" happened as you put it?

Your post is so ridiculous.

 

[ChrisBaleBatman]

I have a relative who is in and out of jail all the time. Definitely too lenient.

It'd probably depend on the crime. Some crimes are too lenient, others are not. I don't think it's an across the board thing. White collar crimes are too lenient. Drug crimes are probably way too harsh.

 

[Feenix]

Also, to the people talking about the justice system being too lenient, you're wrong. Statistically speaking, harsher sentences do not reduce crime. Take a look at the criminal justice systems around the world that focus more on rehabilitation. Norway is a good example. Their crime rates are lower. The US criminal justice system is a good example of what not to do.

 

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Er....what? Do you really think this will escalate to the point where cops will just shoot civilians at random?

When has fear taken over and "these things" happened as you put it?

Your post is so ridiculous.

Yeah, it does sound far fetched.

The veiled threat I often see from Police unions, though, is to not do their jobs. Walk away, strike, etc.

I don't think it'll happen, though. I understand that unions are tight, and are strong. But, I don't believe every police officer would walk out of their job. Even if they're hated and become scabs afterward.

 

[warhorse78]

Are you arguing that the justice system is a failure because it is to lenient on criminals?

Because, if so, that is demonstratively untrue.

The United States has the highest prison population in the world, both in terms of sheer numbers and as a percentage of the overall population. And prison conditions are unnecessarily harsh.

The failure of our criminal justice system is, in part, that it is a punitive system and not a rehabilitative system.

The prison system being privatized probably isn't helping matters, and I can totally see them only wanting the weakest in there. The ones who are a real pain in the ass they don't want, which is why so many crooks do fall in the cracks.

And please explain to me, why is it that my friend can't get the help she needs till she actually does something bad? Where is the justice in that?

 

[The Question]

The prison system being privatized probably isn't helping matters, and I can totally see them only wanting the weakest in there. The ones who are a real pain in the ass they don't want, which is why so many crooks do fall in the cracks.

That is not what happens at all.

And please explain to me, why is it that my friend can't get the help she needs till she actually does something bad? Where is the justice in that?

It's not. I never said that it was. I just said that being harsher isn't the answer. The problem there, I think, is that American society doesn't give a **** about the mentally ill.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

How about we as a species stop blaming each other and stop escalating things? Do these idiots really want the government officials to put their communities in the grips of martial law where anyone can be shot dead with no questions asked? When fear takes over these things tend to happen.

But isn't that the point? People think we are already there. All we ever hear is, "don't question the cops", they have authority. You don't want to get hurt? Do what the cop says, even if it is wrong. The cops even take it worse when you are right and invoke your rights. Look at the 76 year old man that tasered twice for expired tags. Tags that were actually completely legal. And once he tried to explain that to the officer the officer got mad.