War of the Supermen

[Sawyer]

I am so GD sick of the Miller inspired Batman beating up Superman scenes. **** that crap.

Then they wonder why people look at Superman in a bad way. Maybe it's because they've been pushing the idea that Batman is cooler and more badass than him for oh, 20+ years now.

*****es.

Well, he is cooler and more badass. He just shouldnt beat him up so often.

 

[kguillou]

Batman can only take on superman with kryptonite attached to him. No matter how badass batman is, Superman could murder him in an instant if he wanted to.

 

[Kurosawa]

Well, he is cooler and more badass. He just shouldnt beat him up so often.

DC basically castrated Superman across the board in the mid-80's and he has since become a joke. Before CRISIS they would never dare allow Batman or any other character to show him up like they have since, silly covers notwithstanding.

If I was in charge of DC one of my first rules would be no character and ESPECIALLY not Batman would EVER be allowed to humiliate Superman in any manner, physically of verbally. He would be paid TOTAL respect at ALL times and would be rightfully acknowledged as the greatest hero in the universe.

That's not to say he wouldn't be challenged and could not struggle mightily. But the 20 years of Bat-humiliation has been a good part of what has ruined Superman. That and the complete rejection of all of Jerry Siegel's established concepts of who Superman is and who he should be.

When you move 100% from what the character's creators intended for them to be, you end up with something that is not the character at all.

But New Earth doesn't really deserve a good version of Superman, and the writers at DC aren't worthy of writing the Earth-One version, so it is this crummy hybrid of Byrne and Silver-Age that Superman fans are stuck with. I guess it's fair that Byrne fans have lost their version just like Pre-Crisis fans did.

The destruction of Superman that DC has done since 1986 is a perfect example of how you destroy a once popular and respected character and make them completely inferior to a pet character. DC doesn't deserve to own Superman, but then again they gave the fans who whined about him for years and wanted him Marvelized what they deserved really.

 

[Young Superman]

Who wants to bet New Krypton gets blown up and most of the Kryptonians die?

 

[Kitsune]

The problem with Superman is that he tends to be written as either an unbeatable, and thus boring as hell, Mary Sue, or as an overpowered wimp... I wish writers would find a decent median between the two

 

[Kurosawa]

It's not even the power level where they mess up, it's the personality and the attitude. He should always be in control and always be an adult. Instead they write him as a pathetic mama's boy, running to Martha for advice while Batman figures everything out.

 

[Kitsune]

It's not even the power level where they mess up, it's the personality and the attitude. He should always be in control and always be an adult. Instead they write him as a pathetic mama's boy, running to Martha for advice while Batman figures everything out.

Well not necessarily always, he can falter and be human, but it has to be for understandable reasons, if he goes to Bruce or Martha for support because his enemies have been threatening everything he cares about in attempt to break his spirit, that's okay, we want to show that he's human as well as superhuman, but when it goes to far it's annoying.

 

[Kurosawa]

He's been mostly a ***** for 20+ years. The Man of Steel has become Batman's *****.

 

[Kitsune]

He's been mostly a ***** for 20+ years. The Man of Steel has become Batman's *****.

That would explain why he gave Bruce a ring before Lois

 

[Anubis]

Ohhhhhh snap!

 

[SouLeSS]

If I was in charge of DC one of my first rules would be no character and ESPECIALLY not Batman would EVER be allowed to humiliate Superman in any manner, physically of verbally. He would be paid TOTAL respect at ALL times and would be rightfully acknowledged as the greatest hero in the universe.

Batman is easily EARTH'S greatest hero. If it wasn't for Superman, there would be no one able to 'stop' him or keep him in check other than himself. So in a way, it makes sense that Batman can beat the **** out of Superman - when Superman lets him. Giving Superman this Godlike status where everyone obeys him, no one talks back or talks out against him, so on and so forth, reminds me of the Nazi's, which isn't what Superman is like, at all.

 

[Eros]

Batman is easily EARTH'S greatest hero. If it wasn't for Superman, there would be no one able to 'stop' him or keep him in check other than himself. So in a way, it makes sense that Batman can beat the **** out of Superman - when Superman lets him. Giving Superman this Godlike status where everyone obeys him, no one talks back or talks out against him, so on and so forth, reminds me of the Nazi's, which isn't what Superman is like, at all.

LOL................... WTF This post was a bad Joke right................. right?

Anybody who had Kryptonite and is within 20 feet of superman, can probbaly beat him, batman "Badassness" has nothing to do with this. Give Wonder Woman a K ring, and she can beat him, give Robin and K ring, put him a few inches away from superman, and Robin wins. Vive versa is siperman wanted to, he could vaporize Batman from space with heat vision, Drop an old tanker on wayne Manor, use his near light speed flight to kill batman before bruce knows whats going on....thier are literally 100 ways superman can kill or beat Batman without even touching him, or being in the same zip code.....thats a fact. if superman wanted to, he casue an earthquake and demolish Gotham and wayne Manor. If superman wanted to he could freeze batman in place, and then break him into pieces etc. If superman wanted to he could he could slap his hands together really hard, and created a massive shockwave which would turn Batman into goo. If superman wanted to he could fly in circles and create a cyclone, and batman would be swept away and die.t:

I could literally make a list of 100 ways superman would kill batman while not even touching him, or being within K ring distance...its kind of funny.

 

[SouLeSS]

Ok, so basically what you just said was "Unless Superman lets them, he won't lose". Which is what I said. Only when Kal wants to be slapped around by Batman or whoever does he get slapped around by Batman or whoever - unless it's one of his villains - in which case most of them have abilities that dampen Kal's.

 

[Eros]

Ok, so basically what you just said was "Unless Superman lets them, he won't lose". Which is what I said. Only when Kal wants to be slapped around by Batman or whoever does he get slapped around by Batman or whoever - unless it's one of his villains - in which case most of them have abilities that dampen Kal's.

No what Im saying is, why would SUPERMAN let anybody kick his ass. silver-age superman would never let batman or any other hero talk down to him or make him look a fool. Hes freaking superman,a living al Legend, the greatest hero earth will ever know.

 

[SouLeSS]

 

[Spike_x1]

Give Wonder Woman a K ring, and she can beat him

Wonder Woman did fight Superman with kryptonite during Sacrifice, and Clark still slapped her around. Kryptonite alone does not guarantee a win against Superman at all. It weakens him and causes pain, but unless the radiation comes from a character that's capable of focusing it to cause instant damage, like Metallo or the Kryptonite Man or some crazy green k gun made by Lex, then it's going to take time before it completely fries his strength.

 

[Young Superman]

No what Im saying is, why would SUPERMAN let anybody kick his ass. silver-age superman would never let batman or any other hero talk down to him or make him look a fool. Hes freaking superman,a living al Legend, the greatest hero earth will ever know.

Agreed

P.S I HATE the "Batgod" version of Batman, it's pathetic.

 

[PaleRider]

Wonder Woman did fight Superman with kryptonite during Sacrifice, and Clark still slapped her around. Kryptonite alone does not guarantee a win against Superman at all. It weakens him and causes pain, but unless the radiation comes from a character that's capable of focusing it to cause instant damage, like Metallo or the Kryptonite Man or some crazy green k gun made by Lex, then it's going to take time before it completely fries his strength.

did she use kryptonite in that? I'm not doubting you I only read that once when it first came out and I don't remember that. It bothered me when they showed Supes beating Bats in that story and still having Batman walk around after it. He would have been paste if Supes beat him like that.

 

[Eros]

did she use kryptonite in that? I'm not doubting you I only read that once when it first came out and I don't remember that. It bothered me when they showed Supes beating Bats in that story and still having Batman walk around after it. He would have been paste if Supes beat him like that.

Wonder Womans didn't have a k ring, because superman thought giving it to powerless Batman, would make more sense then giving it to trainned super powerful warrior wonder woman. Also superman went "all out" when he attacked batman, but batman recovered in a few weeks.

 

[Spike_x1]

Yes, she did have kryptonite with her.

It wasn't a ring with a small bit of kryptonite, but rather a sizable chunk that she pulled out right in Superman's face. And it didn't make a lick of difference in the fight.

 

[Eros]

Yes, she did have kryptonite with her.

It wasn't a ring with a small bit of kryptonite, but rather a sizable chunk that she pulled out right in Superman's face. And it didn't make a lick of difference in the fight.

Thanks for the correction dude, hadn't read the fight in awhile.

 

[Nitehawk013]

Supes always represented the real "Heroes Hero" to me. The guy who all other heroes hoped to become. The person who represented the very best of what humanity had to offer, even thouh he wasn't human. That was a big part of his appeal to me.

DC has pee'd all over that at times.

Having Bats beat him up, even with Kryptonite is indeed a disgrace. Supes should never be put down by a mere human, even one as talented as Bats. It is insulting. One has the power to move almost at light speed, shoot eye beams and used to juggle planets. The other has a utility belt. Give me a friggin break.

 

[SouLeSS]

How does him being beat up change the fact that he's the hero all others look up too or change his humanity?

If anything, him letting someone like Batman 'beat' him is showing more of his humanity than him slapping him into the sun.

 

[yenaled]

People in this thread need a dose of Joe Kelleys Whats so funny about Truth, Justice and the American way. There is probably only one other character in litrature that represents Lawful Good as well as Superman does and that's Captain America. The difference being Superman does have the power to destroy everyone doing Evil but he won't. If Superman thinks letting Bruce get his yahyahs out on him is better than Bruce killing a mugger in a rage - then Superman will let him.

 

[Kurosawa]

Batman is easily EARTH'S greatest hero. If it wasn't for Superman, there would be no one able to 'stop' him or keep him in check other than himself. So in a way, it makes sense that Batman can beat the **** out of Superman - when Superman lets him. Giving Superman this Godlike status where everyone obeys him, no one talks back or talks out against him, so on and so forth, reminds me of the Nazi's, which isn't what Superman is like, at all.

I've been a Batman fan for almost 40 years, but he should never EVER be depicted as a greater hero than Superman and in fact should look up to him the same as all the other heroes. Screw Bat-god. It's not that people "obey" Superman, it's that the other heroes should respect and admire him. But I don't feel the Post-Crisis Earth nor the Post-Crisis fans really deserve that caliber of hero. The castrated Superman is what they wanted and it's what they deserve. And there is no one around that I trust with the Earth-One Superman, so it is best that he is just a memory.

I am grateful that DC brought back a Multiverse so those stories are more or less canonical somewhere, and I'm also grateful that they are leaving those Earths alone for the most part. As much as I've hated seeing junk like Superman's castration, Black Canary, Batgirl and Sue Dibny being raped and degraded, and the takeover of Bat-god....to see those sorts of disgusting actions done to the Earth-One versions would be even more sickening. So I'm happy DC is leaving those worlds alone. They don't have writers who can compose a story without extreme gore, mutilation, etc, and I have no desire to see those characters handled in a modern manner.