Who here considers him or herself a full-on Snyderverse fan?

[rogbngp]

I haven't been here in forever and I'm curious whether sentiments have evolved since 2016 about the Snyderverse. I remember back in 2016 when BvS released there were lots of folks here that bitterly hated it. There were a lot of very caustic posts bashing it.

If you're not a fan, I'm not particularly interested in hearing those beefs. I'm very familiar with them and disagree. But it is a forum so if want to weigh in, fine. Do you, etc.

Mainly I'd like to get some sort of measurement of percentage of regular posters that really appreciate what Snyder set out to do with his five film arc, and overall like his approach. Thanking you in advance.

 

[Erzengel]

Zack Snyder Directing Justice League (The Snyder Cut Edition)

If there is a place where Snyder/DCEU fans congregate, it's the above referenced thread. There are probably approximately 30 posters who I would say are active Snyder fans here.

However, if you want to talk in terms of percentages, I think it's still a smaller percentage of the overall population. The majority of which, probably haven't changed their minds since 2016. So in other words, I don't think must has changed in 4 years.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

I'm generally a fan, and I'd love to have seen his five film arc play out. I'd rate his DCEU as,

Man of Steel ~ 7/10

Batman v Superman ~ 8/10

Justice League ~ 4/10 (but that wasn't Snyder's fault)

I like his style. Watchmen is one of my very favourites. Heck, I love Sucker Punch!

 

[Frodo]

I liked 300 and Man Of Steel.

I didn't like BvS and my opinion of JL is TBA depending on seeing the Snyder cut.

I don't have the intense feelings one way or another that alot of my fandom cohort do.

 

[Neil McCauley]

My rating of Snyder's movies.

300 7/10

Sucker Punch - haven't seen

JL 5/10

BvS 7.5/10

MoS 8/10

Watchmen 8/10

Rest, i haven't seen.

 

[Fincher]

I liked Man of Steel, but I don't care for Batman v Superman or Justice League (as is). If I'm going by my expectations for the franchise (and in particular for Batman) rather than just movie quality, then my feelings about those two, especially BvS, get more critical.

 

[Micromind]

You want to know reactions of Snyder fans or DCEU fans ? Because the two are not exactly the same. lol.

 

[SupermanFan]

I’m a fan but I don’t think he’s flawless, I think the Snyderholics (or Snydercult if you rather) who oppose anyone who says anything against his films or even filmmakers who dare do it different are morons who need to get a life.

 

[Neil McCauley]

^ this

 

[GREEN =w= DAY]

You want to know reactions of Snyder fans or DCEU fans ? Because the two are not exactly the same. lol.

This lol

The DCEU as a whole I like for the most part and it looks like it’s finally starting to find its footing

As for the Snyder films themselves, I love Man of Steel and I am on the fence with BvS

With that said, I am looking forward to Snyder’s cut of Justice League. I’m certain it will be much better and more cohesive than the mess WB & Whedon delivered

 

[T-Ray]

I must admit that I was very excited when Snyder was announced as a director of MoS.
I adore his visual style, it just works for DC properties, IMO. It is so "comic booky", exactly how I have always imagined live action DC to look like. There is a certain stylization about DC in contrast to Marvel, which I think Snyder's visuals nail perfectly. I can't explain it.

But (a very big "but"), he definitely needs better scripts or a better team, better consultants or whatever. MoS was very good, but it was a clash between Snyder style and Nolan style of filmmaking, so it did feel a bit disjointed. BvS was OK, I get what they were trying to do, but the script needed a lot of work. If they let the Snyderverse develop more naturally, instead of cramming everything into BvS, it would have been much better received, IMO. MoS 2 and a Batman film before BvS would have helped a lot. There is a reason why MCU is less messy, they let the audience get to know main characters before cramming every bit of lore down the audience's throat.

As for JL Shyder Cut, I know I'm going to like how it looks, I just hope the story and flow are as good as the visuals.

 

[Draganmac]

If Marvel was a week-long Woodstock-like rock concert with fifty bands in attendance, then Snyder's DC is like an opera...this is the best way I can describe the difference between the Marvel and DC films now, and I love both rock concerts and opera. I know they're highly criticized but I still enjoy the experience each DC film has given me. The worst thing would have been if the DC and Marvel studios tried to mimic one another, so I'm happy with the fact that each studio has its own style of film, DC mainly being Snyder's style.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

I must admit that I was very excited when Snyder was announced as a director of MoS.
I adore his visual style, it just works for DC properties, IMO. It is so "comic booky", exactly how I have always imagined live action DC to look like. There is a certain stylization about DC in contrast to Marvel, which I think Snyder's visuals nail perfectly. I can't explain it.

But (a very big "but"), he definitely needs better scripts or a better team, better consultants or whatever. MoS was very good, but it was a clash between Snyder style and Nolan style of filmmaking, so it did feel a bit disjointed. BvS was OK, I get what they were trying to do, but the script needed a lot of work. If they let the Snyderverse develop more naturally, instead of cramming everything into BvS, it would have been much better received, IMO. MoS 2 and a Batman film before BvS would have helped a lot. There is a reason why MCU is less messy, they let the audience get to know main characters before cramming every bit of lore down the audience's throat.

As for JL Shyder Cut, I know I'm going to like how it looks, I just hope the story and flow are as good as the visuals.

Agree with every word of this.

 

[rogbngp]

Agree with every word of this.

I do get the sentiment behind this...

But when you realize that Snyder intended a five film arc what seems like compression in BvS makes much more sense, imo. BvS is really our introduction to what Batman looks like in this deconstructed world. It's the story of Batman's psychological transformation told through a deconstructionist approach to the genre.

But moreover Snyder didn't want to compete directly with the MCU and make a 24 film saga. He wanted to tell an elseworlds story in five films. When you appreciate it that way... and especially with Batman's and Superman's origins being so well known in contrast with the MCU's comparatively less familiar (to the GA) Avengers roster of characters like Iron Man, Captain America, Nick Fury, Black Widow, Falcon, Hawkeye, Vision, Ant-man, et al... you can see how he was using key ingredients from The Dark Knight Returns as a jumping off point to tell his own original story in five films. And it was also deeply influenced by Watchmen as a deconstruction, as Snyder himself has explained.

Emphasis here on it being an elseworlds tale.

We're now going to see where he was taking it with ZSJL. If ZSJL is a hit, I think it makes sense that we'll get JL 2 and 3 since HBO Max would love for continuation of the mini-series (i.e., to have three seasons of it) to be their Game of Thrones, Stanger Things, Mandolorian, etc. But if we do get completion of the five film saga, watching all five of the films (with the JL trilogy probably each being like 4-5 hrs long, lol), it may all come together very nicely. If your mind is open to it that way, anyway.

 

[souperman]

All other Snyder films aside, I am curious as to how non fans or indifferent fans judge MoS and BvS if asked to clarify their judgment based on story, characterization, production value etc.

This is only MY opinion...

1) For me, the visual style and production values of both MoS and BvS are tremendous. Great style, visuals/cinematography, production design,VFX, costumes etc. As good as the best films out there IMO.

2) Story and screenplay. As written, meaning for what the stories are about, I think are incredibly well thought out and filled with subtext,allegory, morality and metaphors. They are BIG deep stories with nuance and subtlety, but this is where I think Snyder could use help sometimes. In the edit.

3) Characterization. This is where I feel lots of DC fans had problems. Many have preconceived notions of what they want to see and how the characters should behave and be represented. That's fair enough. Always room for other views, but these particular stories are a different take on the characters. For me, I love them for that. We had Donner's Superman and Nolan's /Burtons Batman. Both different. I like them all for what they are.

4) IMO, Snyders kryptonite is editing and filler. He either rejects or refuses to add "filler" to the film. Maybe due to the length, he needs to trim what the audience would consider "needed" context or detail but he considers superfluous fill ? Like an inside joke, he and the cast and crew live the story daily and may feel some small details can be omitted with no harm... but we miss the joke sometimes and need to fill in missing questions ourselves... which we all do to different effect, and we don't like to HAVE to do it.

This is probably why the longer directors cuts work better for Snyders epic tales? He can afford to keep details that help "explain" holes.

I would be surprised if most viewers of MoS and BvS had any complaint from points 1&2. What's not to like? They are beautiful films IMO.

3, I can understand but disagree.

4) For me is the obvious biggest problem. MoS is very close to perfect "for that story" Only a few nits I would pick there and both MoS and BvS could be made more perfect with only a few small edits or dubs... IMO...

 

[Neil McCauley]

Snyder’s take on Superman is divisive and mixed due to him changing off Reeves/routh tbh

 

[Mandon Knight]

Me. Completely.

 

[Babillygunn]

I’d say that Snyder’s Superman is divisive because it differs from nearly 80 years of what we have seen with the character. And his Batman is largely panned because he diverted even more so from the core tenants of the character.

 

[Arachnerd]

Snyder fan here. Personally love what he's done with MOS and BvS (Ultimate Edition) and I can't wait to see what he's got planned for JL. I understand why a lot of folks dislike them though.

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

I describe myself as a Zack Snyder apologist. Even while I recognize their flaws, his films are incredibly rewatchable. The visuals are incredible and his casting is great.

The biggest problem with Snyder IMO is that he's not a good storyteller. His biggest strength is making things look cool. I don't think anyone can deny he's very talented in that regard, but that can only get you so far.

I love the director's cut of Watchmen. One could argue he actually improved the ending from the graphic novel. There are so many things I love about MoS and the Ultimate Edition of BvS (the only version of that movie as far as I'm concerned). At the same time, every time I watch them the problems become more obvious; yet I still admire their ambition.

Snyder by and large doesn't play it safe, and there's something to be said for that. His reach often exceeds his grasp, but it's more interesting for me to see somebody swing for the fences and fail than to see something completely safe and by-the-numbers (e.g. the Whedon version of Justice League).

 

[SiegePerilous]

I still think MoS is flawed but interesting and had potential, it was just let down by its follow ups. I used to go to bat for BvS a lot, since I desperately wanted to love it due to my three favorite superheroes being on screen for the first time ever. My hype for that movie was insane and the reality was a let down. After getting more less divisive DCEU films since then and learning what the five film arc was gonna be, I've slid into accepting that it's just kind of a dumb and bad movie that isn't as smart as it thinks it is. And wasn't likely to get any better.

So nope, not a fan. Snyder got a raw deal from the studio Snyder Cut may be a well deserved redemption for him, but I feel like it will be even more "pure Snyder" than even the BvS ultimate cut.

Snyder’s take on Superman is divisive and mixed due to him changing off Reeves/routh tbh

Not really. Routh wasn't really that popular either and it was a Reeves rehash. Even Snyder kind of rehashes Reeves, he just puts more grit over it.

It's just overall not an engaging take on the character. There seems to be an aversion at WB to just embrace how weird, cool and exciting Superman is just by being himself and that's how we get these "try too hard" takes to make him appealing to modern audiences. And not really working.

 

[Neil McCauley]

I still think MoS is flawed but interesting and had potential, it was just let down by its follow ups. I used to go to bat for BvS a lot, since I desperately wanted to love it due to my three favorite superheroes being on screen for the first time ever. My hype for that movie was insane and the reality was a let down. After getting more less divisive DCEU films since then and learning what the five film arc was gonna be, I've slid into accepting that it's just kind of a dumb and bad movie that isn't as smart as it thinks it is. And wasn't likely to get any better.

So nope, not a fan. Snyder got a raw deal from the studio Snyder Cut may be a well deserved redemption for him, but I feel like it will be even more "pure Snyder" than even the BvS ultimate cut.



Not really. Routh wasn't really that popular either and it was a Reeves rehash. Even Snyder kind of rehashes Reeves, he just puts more grit over it.

It's just overall not an engaging take on the character. There seems to be an aversion at WB to just embrace how weird, cool and exciting Superman is just by being himself and that's how we get these "try too hard" takes to make him appealing to modern audiences. And not really working.

I liked MoS tbh.

 

[Batmannerism]

Not a Snyder fan but got to give him credit for the things he does well.


1) Watchmen: always going to be a massive task to adapt this, and he does a pretty faithful job. I've argued that his ( or Alex Tse's) Dr Manhattan frame job makes a lot more sense than the giant psychic squid attack, so that improves the story. Some of the casting is a bit so-so, and Dr Manhattan could have benefitted from a less whiny voice and less shots of his big glowing blue penis ( even Dave Gibbons was more subtle).
But Rorschach was spot on, and that carried a lot of the film. The visuals are superb, and Snyder recreates iconic panels from the original flawlessly.

Given the limitations of the movie format, it was about as good an adaptation as anyone could do IMO. The extended version is the way to go, also IMO.

2) Man of Steel: gets points for taking a different approach to Superman's origin. I liked HC as Superman, and the first shot of him in the suit still gives me chills, because it's as if Superman has walked off a comic panel. Wow.

Russell Crowe was a much cooler Jor El, Lois Lane was likeable and not just a damsel in distress.

It's not perfect, Kevin Costner could have been an amazing Pa Kent, and the " You are my son" speech is pretty emotional - but I hated the death scene, which made zero sense please let's not argue about that , because I know there are those who feel obligated to defend it - please don't bother, we aren't going to agree.

Back to the good stuff- his scenery and establishing shots are breathtaking. The Smallville battle works wonderfully because he seamlessly brings together the ordinary and the supernatural. It really felt like a Superman fight scene from the comics.

There's lots of other pros and cons, but let's not worry about that. I feel like this film was very underrated, but I understand why.

All in all I really enjoyed MOS, 8/10.


3) 300: this was such a testosterone fest, it was right up Snyder's alley. It was never going to win an Oscar, but its pretty faithful to its source material- so he was the right guy for this one.

I can't talk about B v S or JL because I haven't got much to say that's good. I understand why some people like them, but I didn't.

 

[metaphysician]

I think that, in essence, what Snyder needs is an editor. He needs someone competent who is able and willing to look at his directing work, and tell him "No, this is terrible and/or unnecessary", or sometimes "This seems like a bad idea, could you explain your justification for it?" The problem is, editors in this sense don't *really* exist in movies, at least in any consistent manner. Which is a pity, since not only would this improve his movies ( by cutting down on his indulgent excesses ), but it would probably also help him grow as a storyteller.

 

[souperman]

I think that, in essence, what Snyder needs is an editor. He needs someone competent who is able and willing to look at his directing work, and tell him "No, this is terrible and/or unnecessary", or sometimes "This seems like a bad idea, could you explain your justification for it?" The problem is, editors in this sense don't *really* exist in movies, at least in any consistent manner. Which is a pity, since not only would this improve his movies ( by cutting down on his indulgent excesses ), but it would probably also help him grow as a storyteller.

I don’t mind his indulgences. It’s what is missing that irks me most. Simple. Quick explanations.