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[ntcrawler]

Jean was uncontrolable in 2 ways..one split personality, and the other being her power... she couldnt turn it on and off all the time.. sometimes it lashed out, but it was very much influenced by her emotion... at extreme anger and rage it would lash out, as well as extreme pleasure. The phoenix was a creature of great emotion.

That's not a unique thing. Storm has the same problem. When Storm gets pissed = hurricane Katrina. But I don't see how experiencing pleasure would cause her destructive forces to lash out. If anything, what Scott was doing, the comfort and feeling of safety and warmth he was offering as well as his clear and sincere mind, that should have been as strong and effective as anything at keeping the Phoenix persona relaxed and at bay.

The movie unfortunately took a very simplistec approach to solving the whole dilemna, one which is common for Wolverine, who likes to solve all his problems using his claws. If they gave Magneto the cure, they should have at least tried doing the same with Jean. There was nothing in the movie to suggest that this would have been impossible. Yes she'd still be messed up in the head, but at least then they'd be able to buy themselves some time and try to heal her mental wounds in a more appropriate setting. She'd still be messed up, but at least then she'd be alot less dangerous, her only weapons being her teeth and fingernails.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

That's not a unique thing. Storm has the same problem. When Storm gets pissed = hurricane Katrina. But I don't see how experiencing pleasure would cause her destructive forces to lash out. If anything, what Scott was doing, the comfort and feeling of safety and warmth he was offering as well as his clear and sincere mind, that should have been as strong and effective as anything at keeping the Phoenix persona relaxed and at bay.

The movie unfortunately took a very simplistec approach to solving the whole dilemna, one which is common for Wolverine, who likes to solve all his problems using his claws. If they gave Magneto the cure, they should have at least tried doing the same with Jean. There was nothing in the movie to suggest that this would have been impossible. Yes she'd still be messed up in the head, but at least then they'd be able to buy themselves some time and try to heal her mental wounds in a more appropriate setting. She'd still be messed up, but at least then she'd be alot less dangerous, her only weapons being her teeth and fingernails.

it was extreme emotion.. and uncontrolable power... look at it this way.. and i dont wanna gross anyone out or offened them in anyway.. but im going to compare it to an orgasm.. its extreme pleasure.. but your not in control at the time... and its very possible if you had an explosive power (see piper on charmed for instance) that when your not incontrol of your power at a hightened emotion like that, your power can trigger and be deadly

how exactly could they trick jean into the cure? thats what id like you to explain... the only reason Wolverine could kill her and get close to her is the simple fact that he had a metal skeleton and a healing factor... no one else could get close enough.. and the cure itself couldnt get close enough without being vaporized

 

[ntcrawler]

it was extreme emotion.. and uncontrolable power...

Oh I understand what you're saying but I don't agree on the concept of "uncontrollable power". There are other mutants just as dangerous as Jean. Storm was one example. her powers are directly linked to her emotions and she's capable of levelling entire cities too. Yet you don't see Storm clutching her her screaming "no!!! too much power! can't control!!!". Another good example is Professor Xavier. He is the world's most powerful telepath. not bragging rights but a fact. He can mentally rape anyone on the planet, and with the use of Cerebro he can mentally kill anyone or everyone on the planet. Yet again you don't see him giving into his temptation or clutching his head screaming "no! I can't control it! too much power!!!". There's nothing about Jean's powers that's inherently evil or sinister. In fact, looking at what she was doing in X2 her power was quite benevolent. She only used it for protection or defense.

but your not in control at the time... and its very possible if you had an explosive power (see piper on charmed for instance) that when your not incontrol of your power at a hightened emotion like that, your power can trigger and be deadly

Oh I agree. Except that Scott didn't raise her temperature or bring her to sensual excitement. If anything, What Scott did had a calming effect on her, which would be opposite of what you say is needed to cause the Phoenix inside to lash out at someone.

how exactly could they trick jean into the cure? thats what id like you to explain... the only reason Wolverine could kill her and get close to her is the simple fact that he had a metal skeleton and a healing factor... no one else could get close enough.. and the cure itself couldnt get close enough without being vaporized

Very simple. He stabs her with a syringe instead of with his claws. Wolverine has a healing factor but not his claws. She could have kept him alive but vaporized his claws. Adamantium may be unbreakable, but to someone with her telekinetic strength who can manipulate matter, no problem. She didn't want to kill Wolverine, she was toying with him, hurting him at a controlled amount that was just enough to cancel out his healing factor. She could hav easily killed him off, or hurled him away, in fact she could have done that to any of the other X-Men, but didn't. If he could stab her with his claws, he could stab with her a syringe. He got close to her because she LET him. And he managed to deliver that final hit because she LET him. He could have done the same with the syringe if it actually ocurred to him to save one or 2 for Jean instead of using all 4 on Magneto. Besides, the ground was littered with syringes. Wolverine just prefers to take the simpler approach, which usually involves using his claws.

 

[BMM]

No... but Magneto's arrogance is what made him think he had control of her... He let it get the best of him. When he should have never had him with her.. or helped xavier contain her. Thats why he said "what have i done" not for "causing" her to go crazy... because he didnt.

and i thought you just explained the phoenix perfectly.. i dont see where your confused.. because you pretty much nailed her. I think people get confused because there defining and tryin to understand who the phoenix is when the phoenix breaks all the rules... and by trying to gain her purpose through the eyes of another. Jean was with magneto on her own free will becuase she had "now where else to go" and Magneto was not threatening her like Xavier did. And he was the only other friendly face she knew.. so she was drawn to him in a way... but not once chose his side. in the midst of her crazyness she felt safe with eric.

Oh, I agree with everything you just said. I thought in your prior post (when talking about the Magneto's fail safe weapon and Jean being the Queen used to protect Magneto, the King) that you were alluding to the idea that Magneto effectively manipulated Jean into being his fail safe weapon for his protection in the end . . . but I see what you're saying now.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Oh I understand what you're saying but I don't agree on the concept of "uncontrollable power". There are other mutants just as dangerous as Jean. Storm was one example. her powers are directly linked to her emotions and she's capable of levelling entire cities too. Yet you don't see Storm clutching her her screaming "no!!! too much power! can't control!!!". Another good example is Professor Xavier. He is the world's most powerful telepath. not bragging rights but a fact. He can mentally rape anyone on the planet, and with the use of Cerebro he can mentally kill anyone or everyone on the planet. Yet again you don't see him giving into his temptation or clutching his head screaming "no! I can't control it! too much power!!!". There's nothing about Jean's powers that's inherently evil or sinister. In fact, looking at what she was doing in X2 her power was quite benevolent. She only used it for protection or defense.

Again you don't understand.. Storm and Xavier have control over there powers, where as jean doesn't... the power controls her. And Jean isn't evil.. isn't sinister... SHE IS NOT IN CONTROL... shes able to lash out and kill anyone not on purpose but because her power is controling her.

Oh I agree. Except that Scott didn't raise her temperature or bring her to sensual excitement. If anything, What Scott did had a calming effect on her, which would be opposite of what you say is needed to cause the Phoenix inside to lash out at someone.

umm i think you need to take a look at the kiss again... it was not a calming kiss.. it was a very hard kiss of passion... and passion ties in with hieghtened emotion. it was definately a kiss to make ones "temperature rise" it was very sensual

Very simple. He stabs her with a syringe instead of with his claws. Wolverine has a healing factor but not his claws. She could have kept him alive but vaporized his claws. Adamantium may be unbreakable, but to someone with her telekinetic strength who can manipulate matter, no problem. She didn't want to kill Wolverine, she was toying with him, hurting him at a controlled amount that was just enough to cancel out his healing factor. She could hav easily killed him off, or hurled him away, in fact she could have done that to any of the other X-Men, but didn't. If he could stab her with his claws, he could stab with her a syringe. He got close to her because she LET him. And he managed to deliver that final hit because she LET him. He could have done the same with the syringe if it actually ocurred to him to save one or 2 for Jean instead of using all 4 on Magneto. Besides, the ground was littered with syringes. Wolverine just prefers to take the simpler approach, which usually involves using his claws.

ahh my friend.. but did u not see what she did to the syringes? the syringes are plastic.. and not made of adamantium... this is why magneto couldnt even deflect them. And jean can't vaporize adamantium... wich is why he was the only one able to withstand her.Magneto can lift and move wolverine... but he cant even twist his adamantium into other shapes.. thats how strong that metal is

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Oh, I agree with everything you just said. I thought in your prior post (when talking about the Magneto's fail safe weapon and Jean being the Queen used to protect Magneto, the King) that you were alluding to the idea that Magneto effectively manipulated Jean into being his fail safe weapon for his protection in the end . . . but I see what you're saying now.

exactly, magneto thought he had control, but really didnt. To be honest if you reall pick apart X3 like i have.. i feel it makes the movie much much more intelectual for the fact it's not all telling you in your face whats going on... i really see the writers point of view and subtle things they put into it wich really makes the movie come full circle. These days the audience is to dumb to think for themselves.. they need everything told right in front of there face

 

[ntcrawler]

Again you don't understand.. Storm and Xavier have control over there powers, where as jean doesn't... the power controls her. And Jean isn't evil.. isn't sinister... SHE IS NOT IN CONTROL... shes able to lash out and kill anyone not on purpose but because her power is controling her.

Incorrect. Her power and her personalities are 2 separate entities (3 technically). The power itself does not corrupt her. The power itself does not make her evil. Her power does not call out to her and tempt her to kill people or level buildings. It's her other persona that makes her bad as you like to point out. Nothing about her powers are evil or sinister. They are a part of her the same way that Scott's optic blasts are a part of him. They are her natural evolution having had a chance to reach its completion thanks to Magneto's machine. If her powers had been evil or the cause or her being evil we would have seen that in X2. Therefore, as far as her powers are concerned, she is very much in control. She may not be in control of herself mentally as you say, but she is quite able to wield, or avoid using her powers. How she chooses to use her power is by choice, and not because the power itself tells her how to use it.

umm i think you need to take a look at the kiss again... it was not a calming kiss.. it was a very hard kiss of passion... and passion ties in with hieghtened emotion. it was definately a kiss to make ones "temperature rise" it was very sensual

It was also a controlled kiss. Scott wasn't trying to rip her clothes off or trigger her hormones, he kept a relaxed, gentle pace with her (scientific terms, hehe). Scott is also one of the few things that Jean is able to focus on and to supress the Phoenix inside her. At any other point that Scott was mentioned it had the effect of distracting her or snapping her back to her senses. The fact that he was there, in person, holding her, shedding tears and her able to read his mind would have been that much stronger. If anyone could have a calming effect on her, give her a feeling of being safe, of trust, it would be him. More than anyone else alive. Their love, their relationship is more than skin deep, having been that long together it would have been almost instinctive, regardless of whether they have a mental block or not. That relationship is supposed to be one of the key elements of the X-men, as much as a trait of the characters as Xavier being bald and in a wheelchair, Cyclops having a visor, or Jean having red hair. To ignore that and say that Jean killed him "because she's evil" or "because she's the phoenix" underlies the whole point behind their relationship and the true strength of the characters and what they mean to each other.

ahh my friend.. but did u not see what she did to the syringes? the syringes are plastic.. and not made of adamantium... this is why magneto couldnt even deflect them. And jean can't vaporize adamantium... wich is why he was the only one able to withstand her.Magneto can lift and move wolverine... but he cant even twist his adamantium into other shapes.. thats how strong that metal is

The syringes were plastic, but not the needles. Magneto could not control them because they were made of a metal that's non-ferrous, but I won't nitpick the details here. As for adamantium, it's supposed to be unbreakable, but then humans aren't supposed to be able to turn into ash in a split second either. Jean has the power to manipulate matter at the molecular level. She would have been quite capable to blow Wolverine across the island or rip him apart or rip ALL his flesh off his body at the same time or decapitate him or toss him into a pit of acid, or rip his adamantium apart. The fact that it was adamantium is not a problem for someone who can destroy a city and literally think all its inhabitants out of existence. She was toying with him plain and simple. She wanted to see how strong he is and how much pain he was willing to go through for what he believed in. She was injuring him at a rate just about equal to his healing factor. In short, he was alive because she let him live, and he approached her because she let him get close. Wolverine's abilities are overrated and he would have been one of the least harmful people for her to run into during the course of the film.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Incorrect. Her power and her personalities are 2 separate entities (3 technically). The power itself does not corrupt her. The power itself does not make her evil. Her power does not call out to her and tempt her to kill people or level buildings. It's her other persona that makes her bad as you like to point out. Nothing about her powers are evil or sinister. They are a part of her the same way that Scott's optic blasts are a part of him. They are her natural evolution having had a chance to reach its completion thanks to Magneto's machine. If her powers had been evil or the cause or her being evil we would have seen that in X2. Therefore, as far as her powers are concerned, she is very much in control. She may not be in control of herself mentally as you say, but she is quite able to wield, or avoid using her powers. How she chooses to use her power is by choice, and not because the power itself tells her how to use it.

Did i ever say her power is making her evil? no... Phoenix isn't making her evil either.. its just angry at Xavier for being repressed. She is not in control though... this is why scott died.. again im going to compare it to an orgasm... Gambit for instance.. he kinetically charges something.. imagine if during an orgasm his power charged the girl he was having sex with and she exploded. Gambit didnt mean for it to happened, but what happened was during extreme emotion he lost control. Now take that loss of control and amp it up, and you got jean. Im not really sure why you can't understand that.

It was also a controlled kiss. Scott wasn't trying to rip her clothes off or trigger her hormones, he kept a relaxed, gentle pace with her (scientific terms, hehe). Scott is also one of the few things that Jean is able to focus on and to supress the Phoenix inside her. At any other point that Scott was mentioned it had the effect of distracting her or snapping her back to her senses. The fact that he was there, in person, holding her, shedding tears and her able to read his mind would have been that much stronger. If anyone could have a calming effect on her, give her a feeling of being safe, of trust, it would be him. More than anyone else alive. Their love, their relationship is more than skin deep, having been that long together it would have been almost instinctive, regardless of whether they have a mental block or not. That relationship is supposed to be one of the key elements of the X-men, as much as a trait of the characters as Xavier being bald and in a wheelchair, Cyclops having a visor, or Jean having red hair. To ignore that and say that Jean killed him "because she's evil" or "because she's the phoenix" underlies the whole point behind their relationship and the true strength of the characters and what they mean to each other.

Scott was in control, scott isn't the issue.. this is about jean. Phoenix wanted to kiss scott... he felt a connection with him because jean loves him. same way it felt a connection with wolverine. look at jean in the scene.. she was full of emotion like a cat in heat... if she didnt accidentally kill him, she would have ripped his clothes off and done him on the rock they were on.

The syringes were plastic, but not the needles. Magneto could not control them because they were made of a metal that's non-ferrous, but I won't nitpick the details here. As for adamantium, it's supposed to be unbreakable, but then humans aren't supposed to be able to turn into ash in a split second either. Jean has the power to manipulate matter at the molecular level. She would have been quite capable to blow Wolverine across the island or rip him apart or rip ALL his flesh off his body at the same time or decapitate him or toss him into a pit of acid, or rip his adamantium apart. The fact that it was adamantium is not a problem for someone who can destroy a city and literally think all its inhabitants out of existence. She was toying with him plain and simple. She wanted to see how strong he is and how much pain he was willing to go through for what he believed in. She was injuring him at a rate just about equal to his healing factor. In short, he was alive because she let him live, and he approached her because she let him get close. Wolverine's abilities are overrated and he would have been one of the least harmful people for her to run into during the course of the film.

one could argue that jean was holding back the phoenix and letting wolvie get through then... but again with the needles.. regardless of adamantium and if she could destory it or not.. theres still a plastic case in wich houses the cure wich she could have easily destoryed

 

[ntcrawler]

Did i ever say her power is making her evil? no...

"shes able to lash out and kill anyone not on purpose but because her power is controling her."

That sounds evil to me. And you're contradicting yourself here. First you say that it's the phoenix persona that's controlling her, and then you say that it's the power itself which is controlling her, which I already proved is not the case. Her power is a concious act. She controls it. It,s how she chooses to wield it which is evil, but not her powers themselves. In addition, she does not vaporize someone with a single thought, but must really concentrate and focus to do this. Which we see manifest itself as black eyes and veins. It's not something she does matter of factly.

Phoenix isn't making her evil either.. its just angry at Xavier for being repressed.

So getting rid of Xavier should have satisfied one of the primary basic needs of her ID and let her ego and superego reestablish itself. She had now gotten rid of a major frustration. If you read the book you can see that she's alot more coherent and in control of herself than you give her credit for. The only thing really missing from the puzzle and why she couldn't bring herself to return to her good side was because she was convinced she had killed Scott, and that was unforgiveable.

She is not in control though... this is why scott died.. again im going to compare it to an orgasm... Gambit for instance.. he kinetically charges something.. imagine if during an orgasm his power charged the girl he was having sex with and she exploded. Gambit didnt mean for it to happened, but what happened was during extreme emotion he lost control. Now take that loss of control and amp it up, and you got jean. Im not really sure why you can't understand that.

I do. i'm trying to assert the fact that that's not Jean, or how Jean is supposed to be portrayed. That Jean is stronger than you give her credit for. That in spite of the state she was in there are certain stimuli she would respond to in a positive way, or certain memories, triggers that would stir things inside her or that she would instinctively react to. And one of those of course being Scott. Her willingness to do no harm to Scott would overrule anything else she was feeling or thinking. That's the nature of their relationship, of their bond. And it's a known factor in their relationship.

Scott was in control, scott isn't the issue.. this is about jean. Phoenix wanted to kiss scott... he felt a connection with him because jean loves him. same way it felt a connection with wolverine. look at jean in the scene.. she was full of emotion like a cat in heat... if she didnt accidentally kill him, she would have ripped his clothes off and done him on the rock they were on.

And how do you know that that's not what happened? Scott certainly wouldn't mind. He wouldn't resist the way Wolverine did. Maybe that's exactly what happened and then she tossed Scott aside into the woods the way she hurled Logan across the room? Technically speaking, Scott's death was never established in the film. Only implied by some of the chars.

one could argue that jean was holding back the phoenix and letting wolvie get through then... but again with the needles.. regardless of adamantium and if she could destory it or not.. theres still a plastic case in wich houses the cure wich she could have easily destoryed

She could have easily destroyed his claws as well. What they're made from isn't important, and in this case Wolverine's strength and hardiness is sorely overrated. The fact that she let Wolverine join her was proof that she wanted to be saved. She wanted him to do something to stop her powers and stop her from hurting anyone else. She didn't have a preferred method for being "saved", except that if you really want to get technical, the first time, in the infirmary she said "please.... kill me" during one of the more hysterical moments, but the second time around at Alcatraz she said "please... save me". To me it's a difference. Unfortunately, it wasn't to Wolverine. If she let hem approach to save her, if she didn't vaporize his claws because she wanted him to save her, if she didn't blow him away because she wanted him to save her, then using cure syringes wouldn't have made a differenc. She wouldn't have destroyed those either. In fact the ground was scattered with them. Hundreds. I assert that the scene was put together badly and the writers got sloppy. Their intention was to kill Jean and they ignored other obvious methods which could have allowed her final fate to not be fatal. For the same reason that they apparently "killed" Scott. It's this kind of sloppiness that results in the characters acting out of character and in a bizarre way, and it's for these reasons that I cannot accept the scenes as they are presented.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

"shes able to lash out and kill anyone not on purpose but because her power is controling her."

That sounds evil to me. And you're contradicting yourself here. First you say that it's the phoenix persona that's controlling her, and then you say that it's the power itself which is controlling her, which I already proved is not the case. Her power is a concious act. She controls it. It,s how she chooses to wield it which is evil, but not her powers themselves. In addition, she does not vaporize someone with a single thought, but must really concentrate and focus to do this. Which we see manifest itself as black eyes and veins. It's not something she does matter of factly.

ok so your telling me a person who has a heart attack behind the wheel of a car and kills some kids crossing the street as the loose control, evil? dude she doesnt have CONTROL lol hows that make a person evil because she can't control what she does and how she acts? Jean/Phoenix is a tormented creature.. your suppose to feel for her... Phoenix is controlling her when that persona takes over.. but that persona is developed from her power... so her power is indeed controlling her. and the black eyes and veins is DARK phoenix breaking through with jean completely unable to hold her back at all.

So getting rid of Xavier should have satisfied one of the primary basic needs of her ID and let her ego and superego reestablish itself. She had now gotten rid of a major frustration. If you read the book you can see that she's alot more coherent and in control of herself than you give her credit for. The only thing really missing from the puzzle and why she couldn't bring herself to return to her good side was because she was convinced she had killed Scott, and that was unforgiveable.

should have, but didnt, because again.. due to her surpressed power she developed the phoenix persona... thats just not going to go away merely cuz she killed Xavier... look at it this way, jean is struggling and fighting the other personality... wich is caused by what her power has become. While she's fighting.. the death of scott hit her hard.. and when she remembered it, she couldnt forgive herself.. so for a while she simply gave up. Wich is when phoenix took control... and its animal instinct took her back to her childhood home. Jean didn't pop back out until Xavier talked to her. And she was in pain and agony over what she did.. wich made her loose control, when she looses control the phoenix takes over. Consider it like when bruce banner becomes angry, he then becomes the hulk. Movie phoenix is very similar.. and once again, does it make the Hulk evil because he can't control his rage and may kill people on the way?

I do. i'm trying to assert the fact that that's not Jean, or how Jean is supposed to be portrayed. That Jean is stronger than you give her credit for. That in spite of the state she was in there are certain stimuli she would respond to in a positive way, or certain memories, triggers that would stir things inside her or that she would instinctively react to. And one of those of course being Scott. Her willingness to do no harm to Scott would overrule anything else she was feeling or thinking. That's the nature of their relationship, of their bond. And it's a known factor in their relationship.

We know thats not jean.. its the phoenix. Jean comes through in moments but you really have to decypher when jean is coming through, or when the phoenix is taking over. and the phoenix takes over when jean is experiencing hieghtened emotion... jean sees scott... and wants to hug and kiss him... the phoenix realises this.. and takes over her and feeds off the passion and love.. wich is so great, it looses control and kills scott... phoenix awakes, login is staring at her... it senses jean's heated passion and forbidden attraction... it feeds off it.. and just when it at its height, jean looses what little control she has left and the phoenix takes over, logan notices and snaps out of it..... jean comes through when wolverine shows scotts glasses, and asks about him.. jean panics and remembers the events and guilt of what she did... she losses control again and phoenix breaks through... Ncrawler have you read phoenix endsong? it really dipicts whats happening brilliantly.. jean is always fighting the dark side of her.. shes very much a tragice character when shes not in control.

And how do you know that that's not what happened? Scott certainly wouldn't mind. He wouldn't resist the way Wolverine did. Maybe that's exactly what happened and then she tossed Scott aside into the woods the way she hurled Logan across the room? Technically speaking, Scott's death was never established in the film. Only implied by some of the chars.

We can hope soo... personally i like to think jean thinks she killed scott.. but really she sent him somewhere else.. or who knows where hes at.. but not dead lol and she just thinks she killed him.. because all the memories she has, adds up to that.

She could have easily destroyed his claws as well. What they're made from isn't important, and in this case Wolverine's strength and hardiness is sorely overrated. The fact that she let Wolverine join her was proof that she wanted to be saved. She wanted him to do something to stop her powers and stop her from hurting anyone else. She didn't have a preferred method for being "saved", except that if you really want to get technical, the first time, in the infirmary she said "please.... kill me" during one of the more hysterical moments, but the second time around at Alcatraz she said "please... save me". To me it's a difference. Unfortunately, it wasn't to Wolverine. If she let hem approach to save her, if she didn't vaporize his claws because she wanted him to save her, if she didn't blow him away because she wanted him to save her, then using cure syringes wouldn't have made a differenc. She wouldn't have destroyed those either. In fact the ground was scattered with them. Hundreds. I assert that the scene was put together badly and the writers got sloppy. Their intention was to kill Jean and they ignored other obvious methods which could have allowed her final fate to not be fatal. For the same reason that they apparently "killed" Scott. It's this kind of sloppiness that results in the characters acting out of character and in a bizarre way, and it's for these reasons that I cannot accept the scenes as they are presented.

ok i see what your getting at but really you have to understand whats happening 100% and your not. Jean is at war in her head with phoenix during wolverines approach... jean is fighting the phoenix (who would probably be wearing down a bit due to her mass destruction and extreme chaos thats ensuing) and due to the fact shes fighting her.. did you ever think that jean stopped the phoenix from killing logan? in order for him to kill her? so she could be at rest? to be saved? take into account that jean wore the phoenix down who was still attacking logan.. but she couldnt destroy him because jean was holding back the amount of concentration the phoenix needed in order to kill logan and dissolve the adamantium. the phoenix could have destroyed a plastic needle holding the cure much much much more easier then destroying adamantium... Jean wouldnt have wanted cured anyways because in no way could she, nor would she want to live with the fact she killed scott, killed charles... and killed all those people at alcatraz... jean would have killed herself anyway if she was cured

 

[flavio_lebeau]

i didnt read all this, but what i think is that people are trying to understand a crazy peersonality (phoenix) when crazy personalities cant be understood. I loved her arc in X3.

 

[antariksh]

exactly, magneto thought he had control, but really didnt. To be honest if you reall pick apart X3 like i have.. i feel it makes the movie much much more intelectual for the fact it's not all telling you in your face whats going on... i really see the writers point of view and subtle things they put into it wich really makes the movie come full circle. These days the audience is to dumb to think for themselves.. they need everything told right in front of there face

EXACTLY!!!

TOM ROTHMAN from FOX always said in interviews that X3 is a thinking man's movie. I knew from the very beginning that Xavier won't die because of the scene that showed in the beginnign of te movie where Prof xavier was talking to the kids and discussing about a patient without a Brain (mind)!!!

 

[spideyboy_1111]

EXACTLY!!!

TOM ROTHMAN from FOX always said in interviews that X3 is a thinking man's movie. I knew from the very beginning that Xavier won't die because of the scene that showed in the beginnign of te movie where Prof xavier was talking to the kids and discussing about a patient without a Brain (mind)!!!

 

[borinquenknight]

EXACTLY!!!

TOM ROTHMAN from FOX always said in interviews that X3 is a thinking man's movie. I knew from the very beginning that Xavier won't die because of the scene that showed in the beginnign of te movie where Prof xavier was talking to the kids and discussing about a patient without a Brain (mind)!!!

I agree with him wholeheartedly about the thinking man part. Cause throughout the whole movie I was thinking about how much better X1 and X2 were than X3!

 

[ntcrawler]

I agree with him wholeheartedly about the thinking man part. Cause throughout the whole movie I was thinking about how much better X1 and X2 were than X3!

that's what I was thinking too. Maybe Rothman didn't check with the rest of the FOX Staff and Rattner. Their opinion was that X3 was more of a summer popcorn blockbuster action flick.

 

[borinquenknight]

that's what I was thinking too. Maybe Rothman didn't check with the rest of the FOX Staff and Rattner. Their opinion was that X3 was more of a summer popcorn blockbuster action flick.

They were thinking about explosive philosophical popcorn!

 

[X-Maniac]

And I can honestly say I felt X3 was tons better than Superman. Tons better. I heard the moaning about Superman as I left the cinema last night - most people don't seem to like it.

 

[Retroman]

I agree with him wholeheartedly about the thinking man part. Cause throughout the whole movie I was thinking about how much better X1 and X2 were than X3!

lol

And I can honestly say I felt X3 was tons better than Superman. Tons better. I heard the moaning about Superman as I left the cinema last night - most people don't seem to like it.

I haven't been able to see SR for myself because the movie hasn't been released here yet but from i what i've read the majority of people are positive and do think it is a good film.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I agree with him wholeheartedly about the thinking man part. Cause throughout the whole movie I was thinking about how much better X1 and X2 were than X3!

and thats exactly why you hated the movie... you went in thinking you would hate it.. so you did.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

lol


I haven't been able to see SR for myself because the movie hasn't been released here yet but from i what i've read the majority of people are positive and do think it is a good film.

its about 50/50 here in cali... but in ohio next to half the people i knew didnt wanna see it

 

[X-Maniac]

I haven't been able to see SR for myself because the movie hasn't been released here yet but from i what i've read the majority of people are positive and do think it is a good film.

I expected it to be much better than X3, I expected a blockbuster. It didn't feel that way at all. Flawed on so many levels. Lois is heartbroken over Superman's disappearance, then manages to meet someone else and become pregnant so quickly that the paternity of the child is in question.... Superman is rendered powerless by an island laced with kryptonite (enabling Lex and his goons to beat him up and stab him with kryptonite), then he manages to lift the island into space with its kryptonite right next to him and with a small shard of kryptonite still embedded in his flesh...

Too long, too slow, over-indulgent. Big plotholes. Very disappointed. I was expecting this to dazzle me.

 

[Chris Wallace]

and thats exactly why you hated the movie... you went in thinking you would hate it.. so you did.

As did many of its detractors.

 

[gambitfire]

and thats exactly why you hated the movie... you went in thinking you would hate it.. so you did.

so what's my excuse . i had faith in the entire movie up until the week before, i started losing faith; but when i saw the movie, well being the enormous X-Men fan that i am......i died a little inside .

 

[spideyboy_1111]

so what's my excuse . i had faith in the entire movie up until the week before, i started losing faith; but when i saw the movie, well being the enormous X-Men fan that i am......i died a little inside .

really? i just saw it for the 4th time last night... and felt once again like this had much more of the whole "x-men" feel from the comics then any of its predocessors... I felt like i was watching Whedons X-men with some new x-men elements as well as claremont and a bit of Phoenix endsong.. but ot each his own i guess...

 

[gambitfire]

^ i guess, to each his own.

Considering i felt that the characters where not potrayed to there true form, and story got lost behind panels of action and overexposure to certain characters.