A World without Metahumans

[Zeu]

I think people here are too set in their own ways to even grasp the possibility of discussing new perspectives.

When we are at a point where they cant´t even begin to accept the possibility of a Jonn or a Clark being helpfull in mitigating the "Hotham" crime levels, then all chance of dialogue is lost.

 

[Tropico]

No, but I clearly did quote a section of your post, which should indicate that I was responding to that comment. I think that idea is pretty clear. So why you made your initial statement, is beyond me.

Because it IS something that the Bat Team can't do and would still apply to make crime fighting easier. It's a completely logical answer to the question that was asked of me. YOU'RE the one that took into a tangent in that Batman wouldn't like it. That wasn't the question asked and that wasn't what I was replying to. It's beyond you because you took it out of context or you're not reasing the whole post and what I'm replying to.

And it is true that Batman doesn't like his privacy violated. He doesn't want folks snooping in the batcave, or looking under his mask, or invading his mind. That is a whole lot different than listening in on criminal conversation.

LOL, I never questioned that Bats wants HIS privacy respected; I said he IS a hypocrite about it. Listening in a criminal conversation isn't valid, huh? How about building a satellite to spy on his colleagues? How about following Superman all the way to Metropolis just to find out who he was? How about breaking and entering? How about bugging different places without a warrant?

Or did we forget that the entire reason Batman got his mind wiped, is because he started to have a physical fight with the JLA, over wiping a criminals mind. Even though Dr.Light committed rape, against one of his friends wife, Batman was still against it. That should tell you something about how Batman would feel about using a telepath against even his enemies. So I think you are arguing moot point, versus obvious and recent characterization.

You don't have to "wipe" minds to be a telepath, you don't even have to alter personalities; it's been stated in DC and Marvel that some people's voices are so loud that you hear stuff without even focusing on them. Arguing a moot point? If my point was that Batman would work with a telepath, sure; but that wasn't my point if you bothered to read. I'm curious to see if Bats will allow for mental links if J'onn comes back to the League.

 

[XwolverineX]

Vertigo is where it's at for comics without capes. Fables and Y: The Last Man own.

 

[BrianWilly]

Still waiting for you to list all those meta partners Batman works with all the time in Gotham.

He's worked with Jason Blood before, and like I said he's enlisted the aid of Ralph Dibney. It's a bit of a stretch since none of them are omnipresent partners, but these are pretty narrow guidelines I'm working with here. Oh, and hello to the obvious...Batman founded the Outsiders, and even had them based in Gotham for a while!

And hey...who says Canary doesn't count?

I have nothing more to add to this discussion that hasn't already been said and ignored other than to trot out this image one. More. Time.

http://premium1.uploadit.org/saintfish//manofsteel03-21.jpg

 

[Tropico]

 

[Arach Knight]

1)Why did he build a satellite? Oh, that's right, to monitor the people who wiped his mind, so it could never happen again. He didn't infringe on them first...he retaliated...huge difference.

2)Why did he follow Superman back to Metropolis? Oh that's right, to monitor the man who just FOUND OUT HIS IDENTITY. Hmm, why would he ever need to know the person who knows his identity? Oh I dunno....something about self defense. Huge difference. Clark just x-rayed his mask, without even asking. Bruce retaliated because it could be dangerous for Clark to know who Bruce is, out of costume, but not the other way around (relative to the time that the event happened obviously).

3)Is Batman friends with the crime lords who pedlle drugs and prostitution? Who rape and murder? No..he isn't. Spying on CRIMINALS is an entirely different idea than having your FRIENDS spy on you. Especially when they turn on you. You are making the worst comparisons imaginable. Criminal activity, compared to friends betraying you. And for that matter, the police monitor people at a distance, without your information. In fact, the only illegal monitoring comes to phone tapping, and obviously that changed recently. Otherwise thermal and audio equipment, have never been specifically off limits. How else do you think police organize a sting?

I think all that can be said, can be said. You aren't even making new points, and your juxtapositions are highly absurd. Oh yeah one more thing

BrianWilly For The Win!

I believe he exercised the best points.

 

[Zeu]

1)Why did he build a satellite? Oh, that's right, to monitor the people who wiped his mind, so it could never happen again. He didn't infringe on them first...he retaliated...huge difference.

2)Why did he follow Superman back to Metropolis? Oh that's right, to monitor the man who just FOUND OUT HIS IDENTITY. Hmm, why would he ever need to know the person who knows his identity? Oh I dunno....something about self defense. Huge difference. Clark just x-rayed his mask, without even asking. Bruce retaliated because it could be dangerous for Clark to know who Bruce is, out of costume, but not the other way around (relative to the time that the event happened obviously).

3)Is Batman friends with the crime lords who pedlle drugs and prostitution? Who rape and murder? No..he isn't. Spying on CRIMINALS is an entirely different idea than having your FRIENDS spy on you. Especially when they turn on you. You are making the worst comparisons imaginable. Criminal activity, compared to friends betraying you. And for that matter, the police monitor people at a distance, without your information. In fact, the only illegal monitoring comes to phone tapping, and obviously that changed recently. Otherwise thermal and audio equipment, have never been specifically off limits. How else do you think police organize a sting?

I think all that can be said, can be said. You aren't even making new points, and your juxtapositions are highly absurd. Oh yeah one more thing

BrianWilly For The Win!

I believe he exercised the best points.

Has Animal Man ever conspired to wipe his memory?
Perhaps Mr. Terrific?
Orion?
Big Barda?
Cyborg?
Raven?
Starfire?
No?


Then why did he "retaliate" against them by putting a satelite monitoring people who never did anything against him?

Or are you just putting all capes together in one bunch again?

Five guys wipe 10 minutes of his life and suddenly he´s targetting the entire cape community. Talk about overcompensation!

 

[Tropico]

Batman has had his privacy violated twice (first when Clark used X-Rayv vision to see his identity and a second time when the JLA wiped his mind). Batman doesn't like it done to himself, he sure as hell wouldn't have it done to others.

Check out the post beforeZeu's. You're full of contradictions and only address the points that are convenient to you. It's funny how you praise BrianWilly for his use of pictures that are too old and display a Batman with a very different attitude than what we see today, after all you're the one that insisted in his recent portrayals due to the mind tampering. Both BrianWilly and you don't take into account that Superman says: "And you seem well suited to the task doing it." It's not the same as saying: "And you ARE the one to do this task." But I digress, I realize now that this had always been a contest to you of who's right or wrong and not a real discussion. I'm glad it's over.

 

[Tally Man]

Has Animal Man ever conspired to wipe his memory?
Perhaps Mr. Terrific?
Orion?
Big Barda?
Cyborg?
Raven?
Starfire?
No?


Then why did he "retaliate" against them by putting a satelite monitoring people who never did anything against him?

Or are you just putting all capes together in one bunch again?

Five guys wipe 10 minutes of his life and suddenly he´s targetting the entire cape community. Talk about overcompensation!

He's a billionaire who dresses up in a bat suit to fight crime...what did you expect

 

[BrianWilly]

It's a completely logical answer to the question that was asked of me.

Has Animal Man ever conspired to wipe his memory?
Perhaps Mr. Terrific?
Orion?
Big Barda?
Cyborg?
Raven?
Starfire?
No?


Then why did he "retaliate" against them by putting a satelite monitoring people who never did anything against him?

Or are you just putting all capes together in one bunch again?

Five guys wipe 10 minutes of his life and suddenly he´s targetting the entire cape community. Talk about overcompensation!

Are you on this same dang topic again? Jesus. If you want to think that Batman's this big frakkin' stupid unreasonable fascist who has a stupid unreasonable fascistic grudge against all metahumans, then just go ahead and think so. Not all people agree, as should be obvious by now. There was certainly no need to start an entire thread trying to prove it in some sort of roundabout logic trap. And even with that in mind, almost everyone here -- including Tropico who's now arguing your side -- has given you some degree of answer to the question. You keep acting like no one is responding sufficiently to your claims, but that's all anyone here has been doing, with responses ranging from "he's a psychotic control freak" to "metahuman villains would overrun Gotham" to "metahumans' methods don't work in Gotham."

If you don't like those answers or just plain flat out don't want to accept them, fine. But don't act like you've caught us all in some sort of debate trap or accuse everyone of being "too set in their own ways to even grasp the possibility of discussing new perspectives," as if anyone who doesn't agree with you is just blindly hanging on to outdated opinions. Everyone here has been defending their opinions just fine. Just because it's not the one you agree with or the one you want to hear does not make it any weaker. Really, you're here accusing people of being stubborn and unaccepting of different perspectives when you've been flat-out calling everyone else's opinion wrong for the last four pages?

 

[Zeu]

Hold your horses there, mate, it was YOUR new fan Arach Knight who brought up that topic up again, not me.

 

[BrianWilly]

Way to focus on the first sentence of my entire post and ignore the rest. Either way, it's clear from your posts that this thread is just another extension of your personality conflict with Batman. Which is just fine, and I don't know how anyone else feels, but I suspect that they're all as tired of coming up with new ways of convincing you and being accused of stubborness when they can't as I am.

 

[Arach Knight]

The over all objective of a debate is "who is right and who is wrong." By your perspective Tropico, Batman can use the help of metahumans, for the various reasons you brought up. I am obviously opposed to the idea. Nobody gets into a debate to agree with a person. You either find your view to be wrong, or right. And as is the case, one usually tries to prove that point until concession is made about aspects of the entire debate. We are all better off just agreeing to disagree, because

1)The characters are fictional and have no bearing on real life
2)We are all fans of the same characters
3)Comics are meant to be fun and entertaining.

There is no reason for anybody to spawn an unreasonable personal grudge here, when we don't even really know each other. So lets just agree to disagree, and be on our merry way. The time may come in future debates, where we will be on the same side of the same coin. So lets not ruin the future.

 

[Darthphere]

So whats the "real" topic of this thread again?