Nay. He was never one of the darkest characters in all those eras. BTW: you do know that Batman used his "Batman persona" just as a tool to scare criminals and was quite nice without his costume? Well, okay then, they made him a psycho-ninja who sits in his cave 24/7. Brooding and thinking "my parents are dead!" What a loser!
I've already responded to this in the other thread, and that you think that Forever is anywhere near better than Returns proves me point.
Yeah. Batman Forever: better pacing, better action
I don't see anything!
Yeah.
I know you said most of them, but this would indicate that comic writers can't have researched certain topics in order to bring them into their character's world. The creator of Wonder Woman was a psychologist, and he acknowledged this influence on his work.
Yeah. Superhero bondage
He also loves Post-Crisis Batman, having praised TDKR and Year One numerous times, as well as having wrote a forward for the former.
THERE-IS-NO-POST-CRISIS-Batman, character-wise.
You don't read enough comics, then. "Maus?"
"Cerberus?"
"Berlin?"
Phoebe Gloekner's "A Child's Life?" (Well, any of Gloekner's stuff, actually)
"Stray Bullets?"
"Hate?"
"Love and Rockets?" (Anything by the Hernandez brothers, actually)
I mean, should I go on?
Yeah. When I would say "Men are taller than Women" you would answer "Well, once I saw a woman who was 6'8''"
How many people do you actually talk to?
Get over it. No one knows Watchmen, DKR, Maus outside the comic book "scene" and some literature interested guys.
There are still horror stories, crime comics ("Criminal Minds" by Brubaker is great), and 'real' science fiction.
See the point about "Man being taller than woman". Once upon a time superhero comics were ONE part of the whole output, nowadays they are almost the complete output.
I love how you're showing your complete ignorance of the history of the industry.
Yeah, an industry that totally imploded and will cannibalize itself if nothing will change.
Actually, much like The Shadow and Doc Savage, as well as most science fiction in fact, they sprung not up as tools of wish fulfillment, but as pulp heroes - the only era they were truly wish fulfillment tools was during the fifties-sixties. That's about it.
The Shadow and most science fiction was - of course - not. But Doc Savage, yes, and Batman and Superman and and and.
"The only reason genre conventions exists is that we may break them."
Also, comics were never truly just for kids - in the sixties, Marvel's biggest fans were largely college kids (Stan Lee recounts this in "An Evening With Kevin Smith") and so on - younger children were a larger part of the fanbase back then, sure - but, they've moved on to other things, for the most part. It isn't because 'we taken them away from their audience,' it's because they've found more attractive interests.
Yeah. You seem to accept the current "conventions" while I want to break them! Who is the visionary now?!
Of "Graphic Novels" (
) like Watchmen, DKR. That's marketing-babble. They changed the comic book scene, but not the public perception. Don't lie to yourself.
Now? No. In the eighties? When he wrote TDKR, "Year One," "Ronin," and all of those? totally.
"Ronin" is boring, TDKR didn't stand the "test of time", "Year One" is great-- He is/was a good comic book writer--nothing more. But he said one true thing:
"People are attempting to bring a superficial reality to superheroes which is rather stupid. They work best as the flamboyant fantasies they are. I mean, these are characters that are broad and big. I don't need to see sweat patches under Superman's arms. I want to see him fly."--Frank Miller
I am with him.
Wow. You really have a confined view of the comics industry. The ones I mentioned above, especially the writer of Maus, are critically acclaimed writers, who've also wrote books that met with warm reception as well.
Ed Brubaker's working on one as we speak, and I'd love to pick that up.
The name is "Spiegelman". Those aren't the big-selling creators. The big-selling creators are guys like Bendis and Miller. That says all to the state of the comic book industry
I wish I had a gif from Scanners of that guy's head exploding.
Scanners is the quality of movie you like?
I hope I don't overcharge you.
You know that quite a few novelists have started to branch out into comic writing relatively recently, right?
Orson Scott Card being one of them (writing Ultimate Iron Man), Tad Williams being another, as well as Warren Ellis (writing various series' in the Ultimate line as well as a few others that I haven't picked up). Stephen King, and on and on.
Yeah. Probably guys that liked superheroes when they were young and took the change to write them because of their name. I'm talking about NON-Superhero comics. You prove again that comics mean "superheroes" in most cases. And THAT's the shame!
If by 'right' you mean 'wrong,' then I agree.
witty-witty.
It seemed pretty straightforward to me. Sure, there were a few examinations and theories as to what made the villains (and Batman himself) tick, but over all, I thought it was one of the simplest comics I've ever read. Mind you, I'm sure it's not as simple as Batman vs. King Kong would be. 
