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Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episodes IV - VI' started by Soapy, Aug 6, 2013.
I am pro change also I like palptine hologram change and the Anakin swap so I enjoyed it.
The originals are much better. The only change I like is the new celebration music at the end of ROTJ.
I'm pro-90% of the changes. For example I think almost all the battle shots that were touched are better. I like the Celebration in Jedi, and the extra sweeping shots of Tattooine and Cloud City. The re-done Emperor scene is a very nice addition. I think the Sarlacc mouth is cool. I don't mind Jango-voice Boba for continuity purposes. I like seeing Oola's extra shot when she falls into the Rancor pit. I also like the little changes, like extra troopers and the Dewback in the droid hunt, or adding extra troopers when Han and Chewie chase them down the Death Star hallway.
I am not a fan of the song in Jabba's Palace. I'm not a fan of Vader's NOOOOOO in the Blu Rays. I can take or leave Hayden in the end of Jedi, but I also understand the line of thinking that led Lucas to that change. I don't hate the Jabba scene in ANH, but it basically does the exact same thing the Greedo scene does. And of course, speaking of the Greedo scene, I can't stand the Greedo-shoots-first version, but the recent Blu Ray edit that fixes that crappy jump cut and sort of gives them a quick draw where the shots happen almost simultaneously is alright.
I guess what I'm saying is, there's a few changes I'm not a fan of, but overall, I grew up with the SE's as much as the originals, and the SE's were what I got to see in theaters, and I may not have gotten that privalege had George not decided to do those.
Some of the changes weren't bad ideas, but some were very poorly handled, the new emperor hologram comes to mind, yeah, i welcome them reshooting it with the actual emperor, but the final scene they ended up with felt like a test scene, not a final one, Ian McDiarnid lacked any of the passion or playfulness he usualy brought into the character.
Theses are the changes that I like.
I like the visual effects clean ups of original elements.
I like the added CG Jabba sequence.
Overall I like the changes to Episode IV, except for the few below.
I like the new flying in on Cloud City.
I like the new music and celebration montage at the end of ROTJ.
These are the changes I don't like.
I don't like the new Obi-Wan krayt call.
The unnecessary fake looking rocks that R2D2 hides behind. In the next shot when R2 is out from his hiding the CG rocks are no longer there in the background.
There's a pink color over the whole movie, the blaster flashes reveals it when the whole picture turns pink.
When Luke leaves the Wampa cave they added in the sound of the lightsaber turning off but the sabre is still lit.
There are new outside window shots on Cloud City in one shot and then not there in the next.
I don't like Boba Fett's voice change.
I don't like the color grading in Empire especially how it has turned Vader's lightsaber pink.
I don't like Vader's return to the Executor sequence in Empire and the changed line, "Alert my star destroyer to prepare for my arrival." which he says so suavely and out of character to what had happened before. The arrival scene is just a sequence not used from the arrival of Vader at beginning of ROTJ.
The sarlac beak is really dated looking CG as well as the Oohla band CG as also looks dated, updating the CG or just restoring these scenes would be an improvement.
The Vader 'No' at the end of ROTJ ruins the scene.
I don't like the Hayden force ghost.
the movie that was least affected with the SE changes was Empire Strikes Back. overall, it helped make the film look much better without really affecting anything else
obviously, in A New Hope, i still hate the fact that hey had Greedo take a shot at Han in the cantina. and although the scene between Han & Jabba was good, i wasn't a fan of how Jabba looked visually. the added scenes during the Death Star battle at the climax was great overall
in Return of the Jedi, i prefer the SE celebration ending. much better music and i liked that we got glimpses of celebrations from other planets. still hate the fact that they had to insert Hayden Christensen alongside Obi Wan & Yoda. i also wasn't a fan of the musical number in Jabba's palace
I like the additions to the films in the special editions, especially ESB.
I still haven't seen the 2004 special editions(other than clips of the changes on youtube), just the theatricals and the 1997 SEs. I don't think I really ever questioned most of the changes until I saw the negative reactions on the internet a few years later. Dubbing Palpatine's scream over Luke's fall in ESB was one that always made me scratch my head, though. Han stepping on Jabba's tail was pretty goofy too. Oddly enough, I never noticed the difference in the Greedo scene until I read about the "Greedo shoots first" controversy, most likely because I didn't remember how exactly it played out in the unaltered version.
I guess if they were to improve the Han/Jabba scene so Han somehow isn't so close to Jabba and stepping on his tail, restore the Greedo scene to its original form, restore Jason Wingreen's Fett performance, cut out the Jedi rocks musical number, get rid of Vader's "NOOOOO!!" when he kills Palpatine, and bring back Sebastian Shaw during the last scene, I'd be pretty okay with the current special editions.
I could also do without all the little insignificant things that have nothing to do with plot or improving the effects like rocks in front of R2.
I don't understand what the big deal is when it comes to the special editions of star wars. I had never seen the star war movies another then the special editions has I am 26 so I wasn't alive when star wars first came out and the special edition trilogy was the first time I owned them and I don't remember how old I was when I first saw star wars. The another day I saw for the first time a break down of the changes the movies have and most of the changes are very very small and most of them are just changes to make some of the outdated special effects to look better. So really most of the changes are good. What is so bad about the changes? Do people really hate Hayden christanstin that much? I mean him being put in to episode 6 has a ghost is about the only real big change another then replacing the female empire in episode 5 with the guy who played him in 6 and 1,2,3 and who wast great any way. So yeah I don't get it.
So I think people just hate on it because it was not what they saw day 1 growing up. So people hate on it when just like 90% of the changes are changes that just make the special effect look better? So people would rather watch the movie with worse special effects that look more outdated? People would rather watch the movie with a worse empier? The hate makes zero sinces to me on it and I was shocked when I saw the break down of the differences has I would have that there would have been way more changes and way more big changes then there are with the way people act.
The changes people complain about aren't effects touchups, it's things like:
-The ridiculously silly Kryat dragon call
-The cantina mess
-The useless Jabba scene in ANH that only serves to ruin the buildup both to Jabba and the Falcon
-Ruining one of the best scenes of the trilogy by having Vader scream "NOOOOOOOOOOOOO" over it
-Erasing performances and replacing them with bored-sounding actors
-Hayden Christensen's creepy stare force ghost
-Stupid CG additions to Mos Eisley, including having a green dinosaur block out the entire screen for a moment
-While in theory a reasonable change, the Emperor hologram is botched by the awful ROTS makeup
-Then there are the little dialogue changes that, while not film-ruining, seem to come from Lucas thinking the audience is stupid and can't figure things out for themselves.
And, most importantly, not releasing the original versions of films that had such a massive influence on film making. If the originals were out alongside those, they'd be mocked but I doubt hated as people could still watch quality transfers of the original films. They may not bother you, but it should be really simple to see why people don't like them.
People hate on the changes because Lucas doesn't allow the original versions to be allowed, films that are important cinematic achievements. Instead of that, fans can only own frankensteined editions that have 70s-80s special effects mixed with 90s cgi that has aged very badly.
I also grew up watching the special editions, but looking at stuff like that fan-cut that's supposed to look like the original film releases, i'm starting to feel like many of these changes are simply terrible. I mean, an ugly elephant-like creature that walks in front of the camera and obstructs the view for a while? Greedo shooting first or at the same time as Han? Even some good ideas for changes were badly Directed and integrated, changing the Emperor in Empire Strikes Back for Ian McDiarmid's was the right choice, but it was delivered in such a flat way, he looks bored and lacks all his usual playfulness in the way he talks.
Even Adyan did a better job at keeping the emperor's mystique, but sinse he doesn't have access to McDiarmid, he can only go so far:
Anyway, the main problem with the re-releases is the fact that Lucas doesn't let the theatrical cuts be available.
I liked the small fixes. Ian McDiarmid's hologram in Empire Strikes Back, the Dewbacks in A New Hope. Other than those little things, I think Lucas overdid it. I reckon he doesn't have anyone telling him, "Hey George, that's a bit crap." I disliked the digital Jabba, hated the dance sequence on ROTJ (ugh... it's so cringeworthy). I really didn't like the Hayden Christensen Force-ghost either.
But the thing I hated the most was Vader's, "No. NOOooo!" upon grabbing the Emperor. That was totally unnecessary. I think the scene holds much more emotional impact without it. The camera shots, the music. It was already perfect. You could see the wheels moving in Vader's mind, even through the mask.
Now, if Disney would just release the regular versions... I can happily stay in my camp and the pro-Special Editioners can stay in theirs.
Greedo shooting first is the most upsetting as it's another example of the guy who invented the characters not really getting what was great about them (to a large chunk of the fanbase anyway). That one shot would cut Han's journey over the films in half.
I wasn't a fan of Hayden appearing in Jedi.
A lot of the other minor "improvements" adding silly little creatures baffled me as to why even bother.
But the added Jabba scene in ANH I did like.
I definitely enjoyed seeing the new effects throughout even if they are dated now and it was great to watch all of these as they came out in the cinema as I was too young to see the originals that way. I'm quite happy watching the special editions now all the time, I just have to go to the bathroom when it comes to the Greedo scene.
The only home version I had of the original trilogy were of the SE on VHS so I'm pretty pro-SE. Having seen the unaltered versions that were recorded from other sources, I can't say anything added in the SE really struck me as being film-ruining like some say.
I hope Disney makes their own special editions where they simply take the theratrical versions and remaster them visually and in sound .
I was a kid when they started updating them, so I have no memory of ANH prior to the special editions, but I remember ESB and RotJ as we actually had those on VHS.
At the time I liked the updated SFX but now I feel bad for the original people who worked on them and essentially had a lot of their hard work erased.
I hated Hayden at the end of RotJ and Greedo shooting first.
Greedo shot first twenty years ago today.
I didn't grow up with the theatrical versions so there is no nostalgia there but alot of the changes i think make the movies look visually better, although some of them i think were not necessary but still remastering alot of it helps keep the movies looking good for kids today