Comics Are there 2 histories for Spidey or just one?

[Doc Destruction]

Two.

 

[UK_Stu]

I've said 2 .

I don't see how saying the marriage never existed, can't affect particular storylines after that time.

As others have said, I see one time line up until the marriage, then since they alter the outcome here, history branches a different way, but because we have read stories about a married couple already, this means there are two branches now.

 

[imdaly]

I say there's one history which everyone now recalls differently.

 

[farmernudie]

^ So you think Marvel is lying when they keep telling us that Pete and MJ never actually married thanks to Mephisto?

Or do you think they're going to reverse themselves when they have to fix this reboot....And say they DID get married even though they are saying now that they never did??

 

[shinlyle]

2 histories.

In one, Peter go tmarried, and had a lif ewith Mary Jane. In the other, he didn't get married to Mary Jane, and from there, everything was different. Of course, if you go by the "No one knows Peter's Identity" thing, then I guess the histories and their differences are a little more glaringly obvious.

 

[carnageehw]

The whole idea of a retcon is that it undoes things that have happened. There is one history. A history that know one knows because everything is slightly different than the issues we have.

 

[kainedamo]

Your logic is that a retcon undoes things.

But the marriage happened. It exists in the books that I own, forever. Nothing changes that.

 

[farmernudie]

carnagee: The whole idea of a retcon is that it undoes things that have happened. There is one history. A history that know one knows because everything is slightly different than the issues we have.

HUH???!

Your own words seem to negate themselves. They confused me.

So, they retcon, undo the things that once happened, so they no longer happened...that would make one still? One that happened= the original way, and one that happened the new way they declared where it didn't happen and it happened some new way different (retconned way) than the issues we had where it DID happen?? SO if it undoes things that once happened, llike you said, how is it the same???

my head is spinning....

 

[carnageehw]

HUH???!

Your own words seem to negate themselves. They confused me.

So, they retcon, undo the things that once happened, so they no longer happened...that would make one still? One that happened= the original way, and one that happened the new way they declared where it didn't happen and it happened some new way different (retconned way) than the issues we had where it DID happen?? SO if it undoes things that once happened, llike you said, how is it the same???

my head is spinning....

Mine, too, but I think you nailed it

I'll try to clarify, but I fear spelling mistakes and my ability to screw up a simple sentance might hold me down:

So this retcon undid the things that already happened in the issues we have.

The "original way" still exists in the sense that we have the issues, and can see them happening in a comic book, but if you go down to the comic book store and pick up a 616 Amazing Spider-Man, none of those things (well some of them could have happened exactly the same) happened to the spider-man you would be reading about.

And to me, that makes one history.

I mean, you could make the argument that the "original history" ends with BND, and the new history is the ongoing 616 Spidey we have now, and that would make two histories, but I think an actual history still has to be ongoing, and not finite, if you know what I mean.

 

[USMC]

2 .

 

[Blader5489]

Pointless argument. There's a "new history" for Spider-Man every time his past is changed. There's well more than two at this point.

 

[Styleshift]

???
please give an example blader.....

I'm pretty sure this was the only retcon i've read that does not fit his continuity, yet changes it.

 

[kainedamo]

I believe Blader would be referring to minor things, like, changing which war Connors was a medic in. That kind of thing.

 

[farmernudie]

This is the first time Marvel has come out and said something hasn't happened at all (the marriage) that did originally happen. Changing history entirely.

I'm not sure what Blader is talking about. Minor things that got tweaked within continuity or mistakenly written maybe? I dunno.

 

[kainedamo]

Only thing I can think of is when they did a total 180 about baby May and said she got killed instead of having been kidnapped. But the thing is they never flat out stated at the start baby May had been kidnapped. They showed it, sure, but ya only really saw glimpses of it. And even this, going back and saying baby May just died, pissed me off to no end.

Going back and saying the marriage never happened is a totally different thing.

 

[imdaly]

What about things like Doc Connors being in control of The Lizard all along, even though we've watched his inner monologue for YEARS before that where he was fighting it?

Or how about having Dr. Ock's origin take place at the same time as Spider-Man's even though we've CLEARLY seen that it was separate before that?

What about the timeline where Uncle Ben was killed inside his house, and the one where he was killed outside after a walk?

 

[kainedamo]

What about things like Doc Connors being in control of The Lizard all along, even though we've watched his inner monologue for YEARS before that where he was fighting it?

That's bad writing. It happens when the writer and editor don't pay attention to previous continuity.

Or how about having Dr. Ock's origin take place at the same time as Spider-Man's even though we've CLEARLY seen that it was separate before that?

Same as above.

What about the timeline where Uncle Ben was killed inside his house, and the one where he was killed outside after a walk?

It's been a while since I read it, but did Amazing Fantasy #15 show where Ben was killed exactly?

None of these are comparable to Marvel purposefully changing decades of history.

 

[Doc Destruction]

Pointing out other stories that suck doesn't make the current situation suck any less, FYI.

Bad continuity is one thing. Corporate driven timeline divergence is another.

 

[carnageehw]

Or how about having Dr. Ock's origin take place at the same time as Spider-Man's even though we've CLEARLY seen that it was separate before that?

Nothing John Byrne did on Spider-man ever happened.

 

[Styleshift]

Nothing John Byrne did on Spider-man ever happened.

lol you beat me to it Carnageehw . =)

as for conners being able to control the lizard. that does not change the previous stories it adds background to it, spider lizard can be an example of the transformation being uncontrollable but he only under went it one time where as conners has done it multiple times ....even if the story sucked. its more comparable to sins past than OMD, triangle head. =)

 

[Blader5489]

Nothing John Byrne did on Spider-man ever happened.

Kind of like the marriage?

 

[Styleshift]

Kind of like the marriage?

except it was good magic.

 

[shinlyle]

Pointing out other stories that suck doesn't make the current situation suck any less, FYI.

Bad continuity is one thing. Corporate driven timeline divergence is another.

You have to love how some people rely solely on misdirection....like that elephant over there!

*runs away*

 

[carnageehw]

Kind of like the marriage?

Kinda, except I don't use books featuring the marriage as toilet paper

 

[farmernudie]

Saying that the marriage never happened, the past 20 years is a giant change in HISTORY.

It'd be like saying that Pete never went to high school, or that Gwen never fell off a bridge and died or that Pete was really a girl the past 20 years and not a guy or something obviously totally not corrrect.

Trying to find small miscues here and there is not comparing apples to apples. Sure there are small variations to stories here and there. BUt that's just it.

It's like saying PETE NEVER WORKED AT THE DAILY BUGLE A DAY IN HIS LIFE....BUT THEN MARVEL WANTING TO SAY HE STILL KNOWS ALL THOSE PEOPLE THO AND HAS THE SAME RELATIONSHIPS WITH THEM,...SOMEHOW, MAGICALLY. It changes EVERYTHING.

They are "Variations"......this undoing of the marriage and saying it never happened also is altering history significantly. Like saying Bill Clinton was never president for all those terms, when he was....i love how people down play the facts, when they're just the facts, not your opinions of whetehr or not you like OMD/BND or not.