The Amazing Spider-Man 2 Better 3 Villains: TASM2 Or SM3?

[A Necessary Evil]

Electro and Rhino were almost as bad as Venom and New Goblin but Harry in TASM2 is the best villain in Spider-Man movies.

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

Honestly, I thought this would be closer given the amount of hate Spider-Man 3 gets from fans.

TASM series needs stronger villains. That's the one thing Raimi did better without a doubt.

 

[Spiderine]

As much as I find all six villains lacking in certain aspects I will go with SM3 ever so slightly over ASM2. SM3 had some great moments with all 3 villains no matter how poorly they were written. The aerial fight between Peter and Harry as well as the house fight were outstanding. Harry also has the benefit of 3 films leading to his turn. Sandman's origin scene was a thing of beauty even till this day. And Venom, who wasn't amazed with the church scene that came to life right out of the comics. That was the moment that film went dark and grabbed my attention of course everything was ruined immediately after that. Can't think of any scene that did that for me in ASM2.

 

[The Joker]

So for CBM what is ever one's top 5 villians?

1. The Joker - TDK
2. Doc Ock - SM-2
3. Magneto (both McKellen and Fassbender were equally great at playing Magneto at different stages of his life)
4. Two Face - TDK
5. Stryker - X2

Honestly, I thought this would be closer given the amount of hate Spider-Man 3 gets from fans.

Likewise. It's refreshing to see that many people recognize that despite the flaws of Spider-Man 3 (and it has many), it did a better job at portraying the villains than TASM 2.

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

My top 5 CBM villains.

Damn I hate these. So many choices, so little positions.

In order particular order:

Joker = Jack Nickelson and Heath Ledger
Magneto = Ian and Fassbender
Zod = Terrence Howard
Doc Ock = Alfred Molina
Grigori Rasputin = Karel Roden

 

[Leenie]

Spider-Man 3, as heavily flawed as that movie is, looks like freakin Citizen Kane compared to TASM2 in my eyes. Heck, I think Spider-Man 3 did their villains better than the ONE villain in the first TASM (which is crazy to me, since I think Lizard is one of the most adaptable comic book villains ever, and they screwed it up big time).

Anyway, my top 5 comic book movie villains (in no particular order):

1. Doc Ock
2. Joker (Heath Ledger AND Jack Nicholson, don't make me choose! Both performances are iconic.)
3. Loki
4. Magneto (Michael Fassbender)
5. Green Goblin (Willam Dafoe)

Very close runners-up are General Zod (Terence Stamp) and Catwoman (Michelle Pfeiffer).

 

[allthingsuper]

Amazing Spider-Man 2 for me. I know I'm gonna make some people angry, but I hated the Sandman retcon, Venom was a footnote, and Harry didn't get to do anything really evil. TASM2 had an awesome Harry, IMO, Electro was decent, not super great, but not as bad as some make it out to be, and Rhino was good for what they set out to do. Rhino has always been a joke character. He's the guy PSidey beats up at the beginning of a story, and that's what he was in the movie.

 

[allthingsuper]

Sorry for the crappy spelling.

 

[OcStat]

Harry (Franco)
Harry (Dehaan)
Electro
Sandman
Venom
Rhino

The action sequences were better in 3. The motivations are all over the place for all six. But in both cases, Harry is the best villian in each movie.

 

[Doctor Octopus]

The motivations were not all over the place for the Spider-Man 3 villains. They were all very clearly defined. Sandman was doing it for his sick daughter. Eddie for revenge on Peter. Harry to avenge his father's death.

 

[The Batman]

Spider Man 3, easily. Even the worst villains of Raimi's trilogy blow away any villain in the Webb films.

 

[LizardMan07]

The motivations were not all over the place for the Spider-Man 3 villains. They were all very clearly defined. Sandman was doing it for his sick daughter. Eddie for revenge on Peter. Harry to avenge his father's death.

TASM2:

Harry wanted to survive, peter took that away, harry mad
Electro wanted a friend, Peter took that away, Electro mad.
Rhino wanted to rob stuff, Peter took that away, Rhino mad

 

[A Necessary Evil]

"Electro wanted a friend" ahhahahahahahahahaha

hahahahahahahaha


lol so hard

 

[LizardMan07]

Hey, they're pretty awful motivations, but at least they're clear-ish

 

[Majik1387]

TASM2:

Harry wanted to survive, peter took that away, harry mad
Electro wanted a recognition, Peter took that away, Electro mad.
Rhino wanted to rob stuff, Peter took that away, Rhino mad

Fixed.

 

[OcStat]

The motivations were not all over the place for the Spider-Man 3 villains. They were all very clearly defined. Sandman was doing it for his sick daughter. Eddie for revenge on Peter. Harry to avenge his father's death.

Right, poor choice of words on my part. Though as mentioned, Electro and Dehann's Goblin are also clearly defined.

I guess what I meant was, the way they go about seeking what they want is all over the place.

Franco's Harry could've been a lot more sinister. I felt Dehaan was, or perhaps could be, if his character returns. The flip side to this is I don't see Dehaan's Harry ever getting redemption, which is an important part of the character's journey.

Sandman had become a thief to help his daughter but do we ever see more of that? He had more than one heist in the movie... how much did he need for her? How was he going to pass the money off? Why did he never go see her and instead is just wandering the streets at night? (Yes, I know there is deleted scenes showing more of that, but we can only go off what we're shown right?)

Eddie was humiliated and wanted revenge. He blames Peter for stuff that's his own fault. But compared to his comic origin, while similar, it is like Venom-lite.

Electro wanted recognition, but he never even was given a chance to seek it. As soon as he turns, he is just as soon locked up, and destroying his own power plant isn't exactly going to get Oscorp to say, "Hey sorry Max! We'll get a press release made up right now to set the record straight!" But, if he had succeeded, he would have had the entire city as his feet, he would definitely be recognized.

Rhino, he was there, he served his purpose, maybe he will be built up later, maybe not. Do we actually count him as a main villain?

 

[Doctor Octopus]

I never felt Electro's was clearly defined. He wanders into Times Square, and flips out, gets the paranoid idea Spider-Man set him up, and then gets defeated and is irrelevant until the end of the movie when Harry breaks him out so he can kill Spider-Man. It was very flimsy and under developed.

Dehaan's Goblin wants a cure, Spider-Man refuses to give him his blood, so his solution is to take some serum that he has no idea will affect him. Go and try and kill Spider-Man. More rushed under developed motives.

Rhino was such a brief campy caricature that he is barely a character.

Sandman was never all over the place in his quest. He tries to steal money to help his sick daughter. Spider-Man tries to kill him when he gets taken over by the symbiote. So in order to protect his own life and his daughter's because he is her only hope, he tries to kill Spider-Man.

Harry's tactics were very clearly defined and concise.

Venom's were also very clearly defined. He joined forces with Sandman to kill Spider-Man, and abducted MJ to ensure they could lure Spider-Man to his fate.

I don't see what was so all over the place about it.

 

[Victarion]

So for CBM what is ever one's top 5 villians? This is how I would go.

1. Bane (TDKR)
2. Two-Face (TDK)
3. Prince Nuada (Hellboy II)
4. Joker (TDK)
5. Ra's Al Ghul (BB)

 

[Frodo]

I never felt Electro's was clearly defined. He wanders into Times Square, and flips out, gets the paranoid idea Spider-Man set him up, and then gets defeated and is irrelevant until the end of the movie when Harry breaks him out so he can kill Spider-Man. It was very flimsy and under developed.

Dehaan's Goblin wants a cure, Spider-Man refuses to give him his blood, so his solution is to take some serum that he has no idea will affect him. Go and try and kill Spider-Man. More rushed under developed motives.

Rhino was such a brief campy caricature that he is barely a character.

Sandman was never all over the place in his quest. He tries to steal money to help his sick daughter. Spider-Man tries to kill him when he gets taken over by the symbiote. So in order to protect his own life and his daughter's because he is her only hope, he tries to kill Spider-Man.

Harry's tactics were very clearly defined and concise.

Venom's were also very clearly defined. He joined forces with Sandman to kill Spider-Man, and abducted MJ to ensure they could lure Spider-Man to his fate.

I don't see what was so all over the place about it.

I would agree as well. While I do think the villains in SM3 are weak , I do think they were stronger and more developed than the ones in ASM 2. Plus they fit into the overall narrative a bit more and each sort of reflected a side or conflict in the hero. Sandman sort of reflected Peter's lingering guilt over Uncle Ben's death and his indirect role in it, Harry reflected alot of the baggage that being spiderman has brought to his interpersonal relationships, and Brock was suppose to be a mirror or dark version of what Peter. Overall the plot and themes just work together in a better way than in ASM2.

Than again ASM 2, was trying to not so much tell a story with complimentary themes as it was a foundation to build a universe on, with ongoing story arcs which would be resolved several films down the line and characters like Electro and Rhino sort of supplement those arcs as opposed to driving them. Hence ,they are disposable as opposed to integral to the arcs. I think that's probably why Harry was the stronger villain or baddie of the 3 since its clear Sony had a plan for the Osborn family going forward.

 

[Venus]

Spider-man 3 definitely, action and acting wise.

 

[Rorschach2012]

Screw it! I liked SM3 when it first came out and i like it now! Take out the dancing scenes and it's an entertaining movie.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

I love Spider-Man 3.


I also love the dancing scenes lol, they're hilarious.

 

[DX]

The dance scenes have nothing on Dr. Kafka.

 

[StarkTheProdigy]

Screw it! I liked SM3 when it first came out and i like it now! Take out the dancing scenes and it's an entertaining movie.

Yes. I really enjoyed SM3, and I'm glad I am not the only one. Yeah there are some face palm moments, but I loved it other wise.

 

[Da Games Elite]

I actually like Spider-Man 3 as much as the other Raimi films. I just don't particularly like Raimi's films in general (great villains, but I can't stand Tobey as Peter or Dunst as MJ...). That probably invalidates a lot of my opinion, but...

Anyway, yeah, I'm going with TASM2 on this one.

Rhino might have just been a cameo, but he did something I've been hoping they would do with Spidey films for years: introduce a smaller villain for Spidey to face at the beginning and end of the film. Just to show that there are other threats that they didn't need to cover on screen in Spidey's world. To show that it isn't just stopping generic villains and bank robbers all day. And, honestly, while not really developed, Rhino's scenes were fun.

Electro was a little weak in terms of narrative, but he made sense. He wanted to be recognized, had a chance to, and went berserk when he felt that Spider-Man was taking away his recognition. Which, to be fair, he was. It's not that weird, considering that Electro is clearly unstable from the get go. He's not like Doc Ock or GG, who were mentally stable and well in the head before they became bad guys. No, Electro is clearly nuts long before becoming a bad guy. I was surprised they took so much time justifying why he was a nut job. He seemed like the kind of guy who would come into work one day with a sawed off shotgun just to prove he was there.

As for DeHaan...I still don't get why people think he was underdeveloped. Aside from the fact that the Goblin syrum clearly screwed with his brains (he only laughs like a maniac while transformed), he had very good reason for hating Spider-Man and Peter. The guy didn't jump at the chance to save his life. He would have died. I fail to see how that's a bad motivation for a character's introduction.

And yes, it's an introduction. TASM series appears to be a story that is better told when you have all the pieces, unlike Raimi's films, which, individually, were complete and self-contained (save for Harry's arc). Looking at it like that makes the ASM series a better narrative. A little messy, but it works better that way.

Looking at SM3...it's a mess.

Look at Harry. Becomes Goblin at the start, builds up to a huge conflict---amnesia! Taken out before things can get going, until the plot needs him to do stuff. And what does he do? Force MJ to break up with Peter. It's a dilemma that could be solved if MJ just TOLD Peter that Harry was the Goblin. Sure, James Franco is just awesome as Harry, so that makes it easier to overlook the flaws...but what was Harry's plan? Just to screw with Peter? Okay, fine, but that's not really villainous. It's a little *****y, but that's...not really worth the three films of build-up.

Look at Sandman. While he had some great scenes, and his motivation made sense, Raimi had to retcon major details of Spidey's history just to add that personal element that was so essential to the plot. Complain about TASM all you like, but the fact that only half of the villains have a personal tie to Peter before becoming villains is a huge plus. It avoids repeating the whole "this guy is a personal enemy of mine" thing, reserving it for only the biggest bads. If every villain has a personal connection to Peter, then what's so special about that?

And then Venom. A huge disappointment. It's kinda...sad. Complain about Electro or Rhino, but neither of them had a whole deal of tragedy or nuance to their origins like Venom. Electro and Rhino are both jerks, and become bigger jerks with superpowers. Venom starts off as a fairly decent guy (albeit a little unethical with journalism), gets screwed, blames Spider-Man (who, to be fair, isn't an unreasonable claim), then merges with an equally rejected alien. If told right, it could've been on par with Two-Face's fall from grace in the Dark Knight. Instead...it's a joke.

So yeah, TASM2 wins for me. Easily.