Batman Begins Britishness

[Tacit Ronin]

Is it just me or does Begins have a prevailing sense of Britishness in every scene? Barring the accents of course. Very James Bondish. Its just weird. Maybe its the dry, monochromatic look?

The Dark Knight doesn't have this problem. TDK feels undeniably American in every frame (except Hong Kong).

People talk of the difference in feel of the two movies. Here's one.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

I too have always felt that Batman Begins and The Dark Knight felt somewhat different not only visually but tonally as well. Perhaps not quite as striking a difference as the contrast between Batman and Batman Returns for instance... but it's still very much there.

However I wouldn't say its 'Britishness' per say... even if the movie can have quite a strong James Bond vibe at times.

I think Begins was perhaps the only movie where Nolan contained himself... restricted in some ways. It still didn't affect the overall quality of the movie, though things just seemed a little more basic, simple and down-to-earth.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

I think Begins was perhaps the only movie where Nolan contained himself... restricted in some ways. It still didn't affect the overall quality of the movie, though things just seemed a little more basic, simple and down-to-earth.

It definitley is Nolan's most mainstream work, I think.

 

[returntovoid]

It definitley is Nolan's most mainstream work, I think.

Actually I think The Dark Knight was more mainstream.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

The Prestige and Insomnia felt more mainstream than either of the two. But that's just me. No, I wouldn't say it felt 'British', frankly I think that's a very poor discussion. Aristocratic in some sense perhaps, but that doesn't equate Britain for me! No, Austin Powers does. Sorry, couldn't resist. Yeah baby, yeah!

 

[returntovoid]

Yeah baby, yeah!

That sounded like a British Hippie getting stoned to 60's American Psychedelic music.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

That sounded like a British Hippie getting stoned to 60's American Psychedelic music.

just the way we love em!

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Actually I think The Dark Knight was more mainstream.

Pretty sure they are not talking Box Office rather filmmaking.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

By mainstream I mean...I don't want to use the word "compromised," but...yeah, compromised. It was an avant guarde director doing standard summer box office fare.

I love Begins, and I don't think its a "dumb" movie in comparison to 90% of other blockbusters, but do I think its much easier to digest and with a lot less on its mind than Nolan's other works. I think in TDK and Inception he found that perfect balance between art and product.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

My film-history is a bit sketchy, but for some (obvious) reason I get the feeling that 'reboots' became a trend AFTER Batman Begins and not BEFORE. If you place it in a superhero genre, Begins is nothing like its peers (except maybe The Shadow).

 

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

Wha are you talkin about, guvnah?

 

[Brother Jack]

By mainstream I mean...I don't want to use the word "compromised," but...yeah, compromised. It was an avant guarde director doing standard summer box office fare.

I love Begins, and I don't think its a "dumb" movie in comparison to 90% of other blockbusters, but do I think its much easier to digest and with a lot less on its mind than Nolan's other works. I think in TDK and Inception he found that perfect balance between art and product.

I think that has more to do with Goyer's script than Nolan's own direction, though they do work hand-in-hand.

 

[GothamAlleys]

I doint really sense any Britishness in any of them, which was quite surprising (in a good way). I think theyre both very mainstream, with big "American" action and overall scale.

 

[Mister Meddle]

Batman Begins had more of a vintage look. Wayne Manor pretty much looked like an old castle. The little village looked like a 1940's neighborhood. The streets of Gotham (especially in the end of the movie) was built in a studio and the set really had a nice vintage look to it as well. I guess the same applies to the old prison Bruce was being held prisoner in as well as Ra's Al Ghul's house.

In TDK they pretty much used the streets of Chicago for everything, which is why it looked more 2008 and less 'Britishness'.

 

[returntovoid]

TDK just felt like a big Hollywood epic film that has become very mainstream.

 

[Fudgie]

I think Begins is more mainstream. Standard superhero origin capped off with a city in peril plot at the end. Throw in damsel in distress who is also love interest saved by hero twice, villain personally connected to hero, and destructo machine stopped at the very last second before disaster in the finale.

 

[RustyCage]

There's really nothing to draw this idea from.

 

[Brother Jack]

TDK just felt like a big Hollywood epic film that has become very mainstream.

TDK had quite the subversive script, especially for a superhero blockbuster. It's not very often in these types of films that the love interest dies and the protagonist basically fails at everything he set out to do. It's rightly considered to be one of the most serious and mature of its ilk, and that is anything but common among comic book flicks.

 

[returntovoid]

the protagonist basically fails at everything he set out to do.

Batman had also failed in Batman Returns yet he didn't give up. In The Dark Knight, he wanted to give up being Batman like Spiderman 2 and Batman Forever which is a very cliche way of humanizing a hero. I do agree with you on the love-interest getting killed, though.

The Dark Knight had more bigger action sequences, car chases and explosions as well as a lot going on in the plot that created plot-holes. Very common in summer blockbusters.

Don't get me wrong, just stating my opinion why I think it's mainstream.

 

[Mace Dolex]

Is it just me or does Begins have a prevailing sense of Britishness in every scene? Barring the accents of course. Very James Bondish. Its just weird. Maybe its the dry, monochromatic look?

The Dark Knight doesn't have this problem. TDK feels undeniably American in every frame (except Hong Kong).

People talk of the difference in feel of the two movies. Here's one.

Maybe BB feels more British also because most of the roles are by foreign actors with the exception of the few American actors Morgan Freeman, Katie Holmes, Mark Boone Junior.

 

[Brother Jack]

Batman had also failed in Batman Returns yet he didn't give up.

Batman Returns is about as subversive as blockbusters come, but Batman doesn't really fail in it, other than in saving Selina I guess.

Don't get me wrong, just stating my opinion why I think it's mainstream.

Of course it's mainstream, it's Warner Brothers-owned Batman. That doesn't mean it can't be unconventional and daring, which TDK (and to a lesser extent Begins) is.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

TDK had quite the subversive script, especially for a superhero blockbuster. It's not very often in these types of films that the love interest dies and the protagonist basically fails at everything he set out to do. It's rightly considered to be one of the most serious and mature of its ilk, and that is anything but common among comic book flicks.

Agree and disagree. Love interests tend to die a lot in super-hero stories/films. TDK is neither the first, nor the last. I think the greatest (and overlooked) gem in the film is the role of Harvey Dent, with him we see a tragic fall, a true lapse in morality and it effecting everything our protagonist set out to do. For Batman, the idea that his very existence attracts/creates the villains is nothing new (Batman in 1989 was all about this, as was a scene deleted in Batman Forever) but the way they delivered it in The Dark Knight is as original as it can be. Batman struggles with his own morality against unmasking or 'making the choice no one else will make'. Alfred's line reminded me (as I'm sure it did others) of Spider-Man, only while that film completely nullified the choice, with TDK we see the hero stepping up to make it happen. Yes, it is unique in its own regard, it is about a hero failing and falling, only to learn to pick himself up, and it will always be an inspiring story, on par with Watchmen in its meditations on heroism.

 

[The Joker]

I can't think of many superhero movies that had the balls to have the love interest killed off by the villain. I guess Elektra in Daredevil is one, but as we know she came back in a spin off.

 

[returntovoid]

Batman Returns is about as subversive as blockbusters come, but Batman doesn't really fail in it, other than in saving Selina I guess.

He let his guard down for Selina Kyle/Catwoman many times, He got framed for murder by The Penguin, defeating evil at the cost of being rejected by Selina, he was unable to save the Ice Princess from getting killed, The Penguin sabotaged his Batmobile that hit police cars and some people etc. Failure after failure.

That's how you humanize Batman without the "I want to give up" theme.

I'm good if people prefer how it was done in TDK but this is how I prefer it.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

I can't think of many superhero movies that had the balls to have the love interest killed off by the villain. I guess Elektra in Daredevil is one, but as we know she came back in a spin off.

Yes, should've said that they usually all COME BACK. That's something Nolan won't do (hopefully). But female-leads die all the time. In the super-hero genre alone we've seen it in RoboCop 3, X2 AND X3, Daredevil, The Punisher, Blade II, and Gwen Stacy in the upcoming film(s). I'm not even going to go into the actual comics.