Can JLA do without Superman and Batman?

[GNR]

It can work in the comics,but a huge gamble for the films.

 

[WhatsHisFace]

Batman isn't even in the Justice League.

 

[I Am The Knight]

Batman isn't even in the Justice League.

Yes he is

 

[Wally West]

Replace them with Captain Marvel and Dr. Fate. I'd be happy with that.

 

[The Guard]

It continues the Ras story based on Batman Begins. They had originally written the script with Bale and Routh in mind but Nolan AND his writers got pissed at this.

Uh huh. I was unaware the "Ra's story" begun in BATMAN BEGINS featured Talia Al Ghul (who Nolan didn't bother to use) killer cyborgs, Brother Eye, a plot to discredit all metahumans, or metahumans, period.

I don't think anyone actually knows how Chris Nolan feels about this so far.

But seriously, Nolan needs to get over himself if he's actually mad about this. Aside from the fact that there are simply BETTER STORIES to be told in BATMAN 3 than simply bringing Ra's Al Ghul back and deigning to finally use Talia (Two-Face, Joker, Catwoman, Hugo Strange, the list goes on and on)...Chris Nolan had his chance, and it was a golden one He could have easily utilized Talia in BATMAN BEGINS, and chose not to.

If Nolan's idea for BATMAN 3 is using Talia as some kind of twist (the weakest kind of twist, the kind that is never developed) and bringing Ra's back for a second go-round, I think we're screwed anyway.

 

[Sun_Down]

Uh huh. I was unaware the "Ra's story" begun in BATMAN BEGINS featured Talia Al Ghul (who Nolan didn't bother to use) killer cyborgs, Brother Eye, a plot to discredit all metahumans, or metahumans, period.

I don't think anyone actually knows how Chris Nolan feels about this so far.

But seriously, Nolan needs to get over himself if he's actually mad about this. Aside from the fact that there are simply BETTER STORIES to be told in BATMAN 3 than simply bringing Ra's Al Ghul back and deigning to finally use Talia (Two-Face, Joker, Catwoman, Hugo Strange, the list goes on and on)...Chris Nolan had his chance, and it was a golden one He could have easily utilized Talia in BATMAN BEGINS, and chose not to.

If Nolan's idea for BATMAN 3 is using Talia as some kind of twist (the weakest kind of twist, the kind that is never developed) and bringing Ra's back for a second go-round, I think we're screwed anyway.

Great post. People need to stop thinking that they know what Nolan's thinking and stop making stupid connections like "Talia's in JLA, so it's the same as Begins".

 

[Jake Cassidy]

Replace them with Captain Marvel and Dr. Fate. I'd be happy with that.

I'd say replace them with Green Arrow and Zatanna, but maybe that's just me.

 

[The Guard]

Or, you know, two INTERESTING DC characters.

I kid, I kid.

 

[Octoberist]

Great post. People need to stop thinking that they know what Nolan's thinking and stop making stupid connections like "Talia's in JLA, so it's the same as Begins".

I really think it's been overexgerated. Wasn't there someone here (or at another website) who said that Nolan won't return for part 3? How does she/he know about this? Come on.

 

[The Guard]

Exactly. I repeat, though: If Nolan's big plan for BATMAN 3 was to bring back the villain he "realistically killed off" and his daughter who had not been even hinted at in BATMAN BEGINS for a revenge scheme...we're all screwed. Even if it's Ra's engineering a kind of KNIGHTFALL scenario.

 

[Crook]

We're all screwed? This is based off....nothing?

While I think there are other stories to tell, the potential of telling a true Ra's Al Ghul story still has not been remotely reached yet. I could swear you'd think this was the coming of a second B&R or something.

 

[Satch]

Yes

 

[Jake Cassidy]

Or, you know, two INTERESTING DC characters.

I kid, I kid.

You're pushing it, Guard. You'd better watch yourself. t:

 

[The Guard]

We're all screwed? This is based off....nothing?

While I think there are other stories to tell, the potential of telling a true Ra's Al Ghul story still has not been remotely reached yet. I could swear you'd think this was the coming of a second B&R or something.

My thoughts are based of seeing what Nolan did with Ra's Al Ghul the first time around. Nolan made him a vigilante with aspirations of punishing criminals and cleansing the Earth of crime, and a monastary in the mountains. So what's he going to be when he comes back? Suddenly he'll have a worldwide organization that he "forgot" to utilize in the movie and seek the eradication of all human life instead of just criminals? Suddenly the Lazarus Pit will exist and he'll have come back to life in a move that will SHATTER any realism this franchise claims to have? Suddenly his daughter will exist and Bruce will fall her in the midst of all this "Rachel nonsense"?

That doesn't seem "cheap" to anyone else, and sooo far off Nolan's style?

And more importantly: If Ra's Al Ghul comes back, what will it be at the expense of? Rounding out the stories of The Joker, Two-Face, perhaps meeting a new version of Dick Grayson? The introduction of Catwoman? A serious version of The Penguin?

I love Ra's Al Ghul. I love how Talia intersects with the Batman mythology. However, in my mind, the time to utilize her was in BATMAN BEGINS. Anything they do now will feel that much "cheaper", and will prevent us from seeing another element of the mythology.

 

[NotFadeAway]

A serious Penguin.....I would like that as well!

 

[The Guard]

More than a "twist" involving Talia?

 

[NotFadeAway]

Hey, like you said, Nolan had his shot with Talia. He didn't use it AND it really wouldn't have mattered in the context of the story unless Rachel was rewritten and made to be Talia so how.

Yes, I'd love a serious Penguin!

 

[NotFadeAway]

I'm also going to repeat what I've already said. Batman could, and should, be left out of this film for Nolan and Bale's sake because there just to good to be possibly brought down by this, and I don't want to see another Batman. Replace Batman with Green Arrow and your set.

Superman, on the other hand, needs to be on this. I don't want to see MOS, and I think WB is looking for an excuse to not to make it as well, so Superman needs to be in the film as the clear cut leader of the JL.

 

[Steelsheen]

venom, a JLA without Batman is like Superman without the S shield, you'll recognize the figure, but you know something is sorely missing.

 

[dnno1]

venom, a JLA without Batman is like Superman without the S shield, you'll recognize the figure, but you know something is sorely missing.

Yet it has happened before in the comics. We wouldn't have the Outsiders if it didn't.

 

[Steelsheen]

thats in the comics Dnno. you know the GP arent as sharp as us

 

[dnno1]

thats in the comics Dnno. you know the GP arent as sharp as us

Don't take the GP for granted. They are not as dumb as you think. If Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman were not in the Justice League it wouldn't confuse them. They just wouldn't be as popular. Let us not forget this image:

The Justice League leverages and feeds on the popularity of the Big Three like icing on a cake. That's the only reason why they are in it.

 

[Steelsheen]

^^ wsnt that so hated that it flopped?

 

[dnno1]

^^ wsnt that so hated that it flopped?

Yet the sales of pirate copies of the pilot are still on the shelves in comic book shops and on the internet.

 

[Steelsheen]

hey so are Raskin and Bass versions of LOTR, but you dont see the GP stumbling all over themselves to go get it.