Cloak & Dagger Cloak and Dagger General Discussion

[Dark Raven]

I doubt the characters will suit up.

Cloaks costume is a simple cloak but Daggers outfit is a bit impractical and fleshing bearing for a teen show. All Dagger needs is to wear some all white clothing

She wears a white leotard. It's not that flesh baring. It's only her dagger cleavage that makes it so but she could just have a dagger symbol in its place there.

 

[scarlet-witch]

She'll have this without the cut outs, IMO.

 

[Dark Raven]

It's easy to make that costume. They could either make the dagger black (but that probably would drift too much into Cloak's territory) or make it gold, silver or orange, or white with a gold-embroided outline so it stands out from the rest of the white suit. If they can't make that and find it as difficult to do as Iron Fist's costume, then there's no hope for them.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

It's easy to make that costume. They could either make the dagger black (but that probably would drift too much into Cloak's territory) or make it gold, silver or orange, or white with a gold-embroided outline so it stands out from the rest of the white suit. If they can't make that and find it as difficult to do as Iron Fist's costume, then there's no hope for them.

I like the idea of making it black. And somehow incorporating something white into Cloak, like maybe the broach or clasp that holds the cloak together.

It would give them the visual yin/yang thing.

 

[Dark Raven]

They could have a nod to the dagger cleavage if the symbol is a separate part stitched onto the leotard that actually fills in the gap, and it comes off in a fight, leaving that part exposed. But otherwise it can just be a solid piece of fabric so that we can actually have her costume instead of her going round in street clothes the whole time.

 

[Loki882]

She'll have this without the cut outs, IMO.

If I'm not mistaken, the Ultimate version of the costume has the parts filled in. But it's with a fabric that's a different color, so you still get the dagger symbol with out the creepy/awkward "teenage boob window" mess.


http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net...ltimate.png/revision/latest?cb=20160426183126

Here it is.

https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/6302383/Tmzvga70Rj.0.png

And here's her costume in the Ultimate Spider-Man cartoon. I wouldn't be surprised if they go for more this look on the show.

 

[Dark Raven]

If I'm not mistaken, the Ultimate version of the costume has the parts filled in. But it's with a fabric that's a different color, so you still get the dagger symbol with out the creepy/awkward "teenage boob window" mess.


http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net...ltimate.png/revision/latest?cb=20160426183126

Here it is.

https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/6302383/Tmzvga70Rj.0.png

And here's her costume in the Ultimate Spider-Man cartoon. I wouldn't be surprised if they go for more this look on the show.

Lol, that second pic is tiny. I can't see anything properly in that.

And I'm not fond of the first design in the Ultimate universe. It makes most of her costume darker and more silvery, with the dagger the lighter part. It makes her look too much like Silver Sable. I think the bulk of the costume should be white and lighter, with the dagger symbol the darker bit.

 

[Loki882]

Or make it yellow or blue.

 

[metaphysician]

Well, the trailer is really aggressively teen drama, but that's neither shocking nor entirely inappropriate for the source material. We'll see how much they manage to avoid the multiply dire unfortunate implications of the original, and how much they lean into it.

So. . . when does this show get its own forum? I mean, its got a main cast, its got a trailer. . . does it wait for the show being formally picked up for the season?

 

[Mike Murdock]

This show seems very grounded from the pilot trailer.

It will be interesting to see if they go into supernatural and science fiction territory of the MCU.

Most of the supernatural elements tended to be linked to Cloak's powers. Various villains trying to steal, control or manipulate them.

While there are undoubtedly supernatural elements to their powers, I've always seen them as street level and not very supernatural.

I hope they stick with the drug aspects though. Has Freeform done anything with that subject matter before?

I hope so too. Pretty Little Liars has apparently had addiction on their show (I don't know how well it was handled) and they did a show called Recovery Road that was about an addict going to rehab and recovering sobriety. So I know it's not completely off limits. Now whether Marvel would approve it is just as important a question.

 

[TyBig]

Solid trailer.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

She wears a white leotard. It's not that flesh baring. It's only her dagger cleavage that makes it so but she could just have a dagger symbol in its place there.

I think the ballet stuff is meant to setup why she would be okay fighting in a tight leotard outfit and be comfortable.

This looks so weird. Like I'm not sure it's interesting enough on it's own to rely on the drama and not strong supernatural mythos or supporting characters.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

The trailer just looked so bad. I get its Freeform, but I was still hoping for it to feel like the other strong MCU properties.

 

[Sithborg]

The FX clearly still needs work. But for a teenage drama, it looks ok.

 

[Panacea]

This is Marvel TV. She probably won't have any "costume" at all.

 

[TheVileOne]

No costumes = no buys!

 

[zenith16]

Lol, that second pic is tiny. I can't see anything properly in that.
.

here

 

[chamber-music]

While there are undoubtedly supernatural elements to their powers, I've always seen them as street level and not very supernatural.

They are street level heroes but the darkforce of Cloak brought them into contact with supernatural villains and it was revealed in later stories that their powers were tied to supernatural beings.

There was a retcon with Cloak and Dagger's powers came from the demon D'Spayre who put portions of his soul in the drug D-Lite.

Predator, an ancient demon that lives in the Dark Dimension and is the reason Cloak hungers for the light of life.

Cloak and Dagger also had run ins with Mister Jip, who is evil sorcerer and former apprentice of the Ancient One as well as Vampire Tessa Goodwin.

Marvel has never really made up it's mind if Cloak and Dagger's powers come from them being mutants, come from supernatural demons or come from science fiction style experimental drugs.

I don't know if in this show they are going to go the science is a form of magic route like in the rest of the MCU. They certainly aren't making them mutants.

 

[javonstokess]

As much as I'm a fan of Cloak and Dagger, it really can be hard to overlook the obvious racist undertones of the concept.

 

[DrCosmic]

As much as I'm a fan of Cloak and Dagger, it really can be hard to overlook the obvious racist undertones of the concept.

Hmmm... I don't know if it's so much overlooking that's required, but something more than a cursory glance. You can make a case for "see, White girl with good positive powers, Black guy with dark scary powers" or even "Why the Black guy gotta wear black? Is this 1990s Power Rangers?"

BUT I think if we actually see what their powers are, and the core conceit of their abilities, that the show seems to be well focused on: that they need each other, it's really hard to make a case for "obvious racism" when the White person needs the Black person and the Black person is much MUCH more powerful than the White one. Also... interracial couple counts for *something* especially in the absence of any actual aggression.

Plus... if we actually explore how Cloak operates in society as someone who people feel is dark, scary and powerful, then we're actually exploring racism instead of just being racist. That's actually a lot cooler than giving him a power that has nothing to do with how he's perceived in society. There's a reason these characters have endured and other actually obviously racist characters have fizzled out.

 

[Dark Raven]

here

Sorry, I actually meant the first pic. They must've opened the other way round on my browser so that I thought this was the first pic and the other was the second. This one's size is fine. The other one is tiny.

 

[javonstokess]

Hmmm... I don't know if it's so much overlooking that's required, but something more than a cursory glance. You can make a case for "see, White girl with good positive powers, Black guy with dark scary powers" or even "Why the Black guy gotta wear black? Is this 1990s Power Rangers?"

BUT I think if we actually see what their powers are, and the core conceit of their abilities, that the show seems to be well focused on: that they need each other, it's really hard to make a case for "obvious racism" when the White person needs the Black person and the Black person is much MUCH more powerful than the White one. Also... interracial couple counts for *something* especially in the absence of any actual aggression.

Plus... if we actually explore how Cloak operates in society as someone who people feel is dark, scary and powerful, then we're actually exploring racism instead of just being racist. That's actually a lot cooler than giving him a power that has nothing to do with how he's perceived in society. There's a reason these characters have endured and other actually obviously racist characters have fizzled out.

There's truth to what you've said, but in many an iteration of the characters, Cloak has been characterized as "evil" without Dagger's "pure white light".

Their characters have endured for many of the same reasons Luke Cage has survived by subsequent writers working to evolve their concepts. Though, many of the tenants of their concept is really screwed up...IMO of course.

 

[chamber-music]

Ultimate Cloak and Dagger are all right. The two of them are high school sweethearts that get injured in a car crash. Roxxxon experiments on them with dark matter which gives them their powers. Cloak is a lot less angsty and blood thirsty.

 

[zenith16]

Originally Posted by Dark Raven
Sorry, I actually meant the first pic. They must've opened the other way round on my browser so that I thought this was the first pic and the other was the second. This one's size is fine. The other one is tiny.

yeah I already figured this out. anyway this is the look they should go for regardless on make sure her looks like dagger visibly

Originally Posted by chamber-music
They are street level heroes but the darkforce of Cloak brought them into contact with supernatural villains and it was revealed in later stories that their powers were tied to supernatural beings.

There was a retcon with Cloak and Dagger's powers came from the demon D'Spayre who put portions of his soul in the drug D-Lite.

Predator, an ancient demon that lives in the Dark Dimension and is the reason Cloak hungers for the light of life.

Cloak and Dagger also had run ins with Mister Jip, who is evil sorcerer and former apprentice of the Ancient One as well as Vampire Tessa Goodwin.

Marvel has never really made up it's mind if Cloak and Dagger's powers come from them being mutants, come from supernatural demons or come from science fiction style experimental drugs.

I don't know if in this show they are going to go the science is a form of magic route like in the rest of the MCU. They certainly aren't making them mutants.

look they are definitly mutants there has been debate but that also came with the fox feud which they were pulledinto before they became x-men inthe books .
cloak problem is his mutation came his connection to the dark force make him suseptable to alot of the demon like dormamoo to manipulate him
which they showed inthe animated serise of ultmate spider man and he had crabby attuted for bit when the spider warrior came while he was used we saw less of him so it wasn't that he mellowed out it was more that he was used limited.


and there plety of mutants that mutantions were adpted to magic magik 's one after being pulled into limbo her mutant powers adapted that place as demonist with stepping disk power and magic use
she' consider a hybrid of the two lol ther japnis shows that fallowed this concept which marvel has done butthat's another story.


and dagger biological dad in the books of marvel is a mutant and the two them (both cloak and dagger )shows sign of the usual stress that actvates the mutant xfactor gene the drugs were forced on the two . there's the issue the Xbooks where they showed wolfbane and the mutant bolt who was train by the older ice man that got their powers at age 14 -15 and alot of teens are still going through puberty or change's at that age despite some people being in denial able that. not every get a deep voice change at age 12. some do some others take longer.

truth be told and if you been keeping up with what marvel been pushing to the news outlet's that cover most of animated and live action show and movies this is what marvel has been doing when they talk thor is mostly see a science they even showed when doctor strange brought thor into demon world his Azgardian power didn't do what thor wanted cause his powers aren't seen as magical too. oh and there was this thing with ghost rider as well .

Originally Posted by
zenith16

well it look (where thor is involved )like what been said in both the movies and animated series of avengers assemble through avenger ultron revolution and what currently supposed happen with carol / captain (cornel fits her better)marvel and black pather supposed show up inthe latter animated series.





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36 mins ·







In the Marvel Cinematic Universe, magic is just science we don't understand yet, and that rule seems to apply to Ghost Rider.




Agents of SHIELD's Ghost Rider Is Based in Science, Not Magic

In the Marvel Cinematic Universe, magic is just science we don't understand yet, and that rule seems to apply to Ghost Rider.Read more

In the Marvel Cinematic Universe, magic is just science we don’t understand yet, and that rule seems to apply to “Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.’s” own Ghost Rider. Speaking to IGN, executive producers Jed Whedon and Jeffrey Bell explained how Ghost Rider is, in fact, based in science rather than magic.


“The Marvel rule is that magic is science we don’t understand, but when we are trapped between [dimensions] in [Episode 7], we’re in the quantum energy fields between dimensions. The Ghost Rider very clearly says, ‘That’s where I came from. I know where you’re being dragged down and I don’t want to go back,’” Whedon revealed.


RELATED: Agents of SHIELD EPs Reveal Ghost Rider’s Status, Why His Arc Ended


“One of the things that it allows us, and ‘Doctor Strange’ allowed us, to do is to have something you would call a ‘hell demon’ on our show because we’re opening holes between worlds and between universes,” he continued. “Any time there’s something that on another show would be a wave of the wand magic thing, we can chalk it up to, oh, it’s from another dimension. There’s another set of physics rules in that world and so it’s allowed us to put it all under the science umbrella. The word ‘dimensions’ is sort of covering a lot of ground there.”

“In [‘Guardians of the Galaxy’], if some of these aliens showed up, they might look like a hell demon. It might be named Larry in his world and there might be a lot of other guys with flaming heads going, ‘Good morning, Larry,’ ‘Good morning Frank,’ and it would be normal,” Bell added. Here, he is referring to Ghost Rider’s signature look: a flaming skull.

RELATED: Agents of SHIELD Fall Finale Isn’t the End for Ghost Rider, Says Henrie


Though the show has wrapped its ongoing Ghost Rider storyline, “Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.” got to play with the notion for a solid eight episodes. In them, Ghost Rider was treated like an entity separate from Robbie Reyes, his host; in fact, the Ghost Rider jumped into Mack’s body for an episode in order to escape being dragged into the void which Whedon referred to as another dimension.

In “The Laws of Inferno Dynamics,” Eli Morrow — Robbie Reyes’ nefarious uncle — went nuclear in an attempt to stop Ghost Rider, who has been working with Daisy Johnson and her S.H.I.E.L.D. team all season. As a result, both Ghost Rider and Morrow disappeared into thin air, and they didn’t resurface before the episode drew to a close. If the show is playing with other dimensions in the same vein as “Doctor Strange,” then the two could have easily fallen into one of these alternate realities.


Airing Tuesdays at 10 pm ET/PT on ABC, “Marvel’s Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.” stars Clark Gregg as Agent Phil Coulson, Chloe Bennet as Daisy “Quake” Johnson, Ming-Na Wen as Melinda May, Iain De Caestecker as Leo Fitz, Elizabeth Henstridge as Jemma Simmons, Henry Simmons as Alphonso “Mack” Mackenzie and more.

CBR.COM


the only one that fully into ways of magic is doctor strange and maybe scarlet witch the other are ether hybrids or something else mistaken for magic .

 

[zenith16]

oh and there's another marvel character with a flame skull and his powers have nothing to do with magic his name is

this is the link top his bio:>>Blazing Skull

OF[FONT=&quot] :>>>[/FONT]A.R.M.O.R.[FONT=&quot],


that's also a link .







And I'm sure most people in marvel might mistake him for those that have the demon gene like johnny blaze , his half brother [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Daniel Ketch and [/FONT]Robbie Reyes and that female ghost rider Alejandra Jones that's in the marvel heroes omega game that'll be in the ps4 and Xbox one . So it's as Bell said. but blazing skull's a mutated human and trained by people in the MU that have the ability to turn them selve's into skull people .