Colin Farrell IS The Penguin

Discussion in 'The Batman' started by Kane52630, Nov 5, 2019.

  1. Art Vandelay Registered

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    I think you answered your own question, fat and ugly actors aren't in high demand. Plus, it's not the first time he's played fat before.

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  2. Jekecy Registered

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    Jonah Hill was the first person to get offered, was he not? The role precisely being fat and ugly is probably a stereotype he wants to avoid now for obvious reasons.
     
  3. WatchProtect Registered

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    I like that we're seemingly getting a much tougher Penguin, I feel like a lot of versions of him cant make up their mind on wether he's a viscous man or just a coward hiding behind his gang, im sure thats usually on purpose but still this Penguin seems a lot more sure of himself.
     
  4. JubJub86 Registered

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    I don't know why anyone would see the monocle as too over-the-top or whatever.

    We've already seen the fashion & architecture etc isn't "current day real-world" but rather pulling from a mix of 30s/40s and 80s vibes, you can see a lot of that in the funeral pics. People don't actually dress like that as of now.

    People used to wear monocles. Yeah, wasn't some super-common thing, but they were a thing especially among the snooty upper-crust types. If Penguin's trying to climb the social ladder and be taken seriously as a society man - which he never will be - the guy being self-absorbed enough to wear a monocle and a top-hat and a tux in situations where a tux is being overdressed is a really simple & easy & effective way to convey that. "Look at me, I'm more than a thug! Some day I'll be your mayor!"

    Doesn't make sense here for a first movie, given we know he's not king of the hill yet. But going forward...
     
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  5. DKDetective Elementary, Dear Robin (he/him/his)

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    Personally, I have no need of the monocle. I don't find it a core part of Penguin's comic book look. to me, that is boiled down to a fat crime boss with a prominent nose and relatively formal wardrobe with a thing for umbrellas, which we have gotten.

    I also really want to highlight the awesome details that Durran has embedded in both of Oswald's major looks we have seen to date. The first is the suit and leather trenchcoat at the mayor's funeral:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    It has a lot of classic 80s mobster vibes with the leather coat and suit jacket with extremely low buttoning point. Given the sheen of the suit fabric, I would also guess it is silk. A classic, but flamboyant and very 80s/Italian choice of suiting material. The suit's pattern appears to be Glen Plaid, a classic British pattern, which with the striped shirt, once again evokes Cobblepot's sometimes British heritage in the comics and other adaptations.

    It is also completely in the Penguin's traditional colour scheme of black (including some very dark charcoal grey) and purple (see the shirt), and accessorized with the large umbrella.

    Now coming to Oswald's "penguin suit", aka tuxedo or dinner suit, that we see at the Iceberg Lounge, we get more similarly great details:
    [​IMG]
    Durran continues the black/purple colour scheme by having Oswald wear a tartan dinner jacket. It is a legitimate style of men's clothing that is actually on the rise in creative black tie and makes him flamboyant without looking artificial or like a costume.
     
  6. JubJub86 Registered

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    Just kinda don't see why you wouldn't escalate the look as you go into sequels. We don't know if he'll be called "Penguin" here (probably sarcastically/mockingly if so), but assumedly Reeve'll use the name down the line.

    Might as well play up the limping walk & add some more black & white flair to the clothes on top of that. I get that top-hats & monocles don't really have anything to do with Penguins, but it's a pretty accepted part of the character in most incarnations. You don't have to have him in it all the time, but I do think Penguin out for some fancy night on the town with his goons & mob-moll floozies would be a time for both of those. Dude stepping out of a limo dressed to the nines, bodyguards & broads, dressed ridiculously and all the other richies thinking he's ridiculous but of course not daring say a thing.
     
  7. Doctor Jones Super Moderator

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    Is it just me or does the make up in this trailer look slightly different from the last one? He looks bigger here. Even in the car scene at the end it looks slightly different. Was his stuff reshot because Farrell lost the weight during the shut down and they had to redo the prosthetics? Am I seeing things?
     
  8. Invader Joker Registered

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    I think you're just seeing things tbh. We got extremely small glimpses of him last time around.
     
  9. Art Vandelay Registered

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    I think some of you are just latching too much onto how these characters appear in the comic books, when I don't think Reeve is all that interested in that. It's why the Riddler isn't wearing a green suit and bowler, and probably why Catwoman is barely shown wearing a mask in these trailers.

    The only reason Penguin is still depicted wearing a top hat and monocle is because comic book fans are anal and comic writers are too afraid to change things up. But in 2021, the whole look is really stale. Same with a bowler wearing Riddler, and 1930's gangster Joker.

    Personally, if Penguin is to be dressed extravagantly, I'd rather it be modern, rather than what some comic fan thinks is "classy".
     
  10. ArmsHeldOut Registered

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    This is random and probably won't amount to anything in the actual film, but given Oswald's Anglo-sounding name combined w/ his outward De Niro-esque appearance, I like to think that (on a purely conceptual level) he's a bit like Goodfellas' Jimmy Conway and Henry Hill. Those who watched the film might recall that both Hill and Conway were barred from becoming "made men" in the Sicilian mafia on account of having only 50% Italian lineage; the other half being Irish-American, respectively.

    If we're to believe that Cobblepot is of mixed English-Italian heritage, and much like the aforementioned, couldn't move up in the ranks as he wasn't full-blooded Italian, this would be an obvious source of frustration on his part. Further, it'd make for an interesting motive behind him wanting to venture out on his own and ultimately rival other prominent crime families in Gotham, namely the Maronis and Falcones.
     
  11. JubJub86 Registered

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    Yeah, heh, doubt "Cobblepot" is exactly Sicilian. :funny:

    Don't know that you have to get into any British background exactly (actually really glad they didn't go with that cockney-accent interpretation here, always hated that for some reason), but yeah, he should clearly be an outsider of sorts within the high-class mafia circles. Whether that's simply economic, like he grew up poor and unconnected but rose through the ranks with his effective ruthlessness his bosses could acknowledge/reward, or it's him not being "legit mafia" due to no Italian background, it works either way. Kinda thinking it's more the former, but a throwaway line from a rival underboss about him being "some Limey's kid" or something wouldn't go astray either.

    Art, I'd kinda question the logic there. Just because he went way out-of-the-box with Riddler doesn't mean he'll approach everything & everyone that way. There's a lot of classic iconography in this already as it gets, even Movie 1. Whether it's the oldschool 60s/70s influence on the suit's silhouette, or the car, or Catwoman being pretty "classic". Gotham itself with all the art-deco stuff, maybe even blimps from what we're hearing.

    If it makes sense for his vision I think he'd "upgrade" Penguin no problem, the hat & monocle & umbrella gun, or at least some of the three. Could be as simple as "Riddler's overall look is admittedly a little goofier than most - we need to retool it given the tone here". That doesn't apply to everyone necessarily. For example, I could totally see Two-Face in this universe having one half of his business suit "conservative lawyer court attire" and the other side all "cliche pinstriped 40s mob boss".

    That works with Two-Face because he's off his rocker. The monocle & hat applies to Penguin because, yes, character-wise he's a vain insecure guy trying to artificially climb the social-status ladder, who'd never be taken seriously if it weren't for the fact he'd snuff anyone who called him out over it.

    The look we're getting works just fine here, it's perfect for "Oswald" proto-Penguin. But we've seen Reeves hasn't shyed away from using the name "Riddler" or at most of the iconography other than the costume (which again, I'd argue is more just because bright-green-leotard-or-suit-with-domino-mask-and-bowler is at the sillier end of the Rogues Gallery looks). Can't see why he'd have any problem having Oswald embrace the "Penguin" schtick, like maybe it starts out as an insult/mockery from people that he decides to own and run with. Sorta like TDK Harvey.

    Just, like, keep it to scenes where he's out on the town mingling with the rich & famous, playing himself up as "legitimate". Doesn't mean he can't look the way he does now in the first movie while just hanging out at his club day-to-day, or in gunfights or whatever. But this is a guy who runs in fancy circles, at least once he's kingpin - you can have a scene or two with him looking all dandy-dude. There's a sensible middle-ground for this.

    *Holy rambling posts Batman. Got a little carried away there. Hail Satan.
     
  12. The Batman The Dark Knight

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    I disagree, modern Penguin has often ended up being a more generic crimeboss who just dresses differently. And while not a crimeboss, Catwoman has been better at the whole "sane criminal in Gotham" concept.

    PersonalIy, I don't see how mob Penguin is better than OG Penguin, the guy who was actually Batman's second biggest rogue after Joker as opposed to now.
     
  13. JubJub86 Registered

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    I can't even recall, but hasn't he always basically been a mobster in some way shape or form? He's sure a crook with a bunch of crooks working for him.
     
  14. BatLobster Trailer Timewarper

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    If the Cobblepots were an influential family, I could def see them going the route where he's a bastard child or something and his father has cut he and his mother off.

    But he has a sense of entitlement because of his name and wants to rise to power any means necessary (IE organized crime). Yet the mob doesn't see him as truly of their own so he'll never be a made guy. After seeing the trailer it's clear why this guy wants to be called Oz. "Eyyy call me Oz will ya?"

    Rejected by both his family and his organized crime family cast as an outsider, he'll finally embrace being The Penguin.

    That'd me be my guess for the general shape of his arc.
     
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  15. Art Vandelay Registered

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    Honestly, this just sounds like more "maybe he gets the real suit later on?" fan rationalizing on why a character doesn't look like his comic book counterpart.

    I'd just prefer, if Oswald is trying to create a more lavish look for himself, that he be relevant to today's tastes, not some comic geek's outdated ideal of what is supposed to classy. I see him more as being like Johnny Sack. He might be a criminal, but he's a criminal who is up on the times.



    I also think Gotham illustrated how bad comic book faithful costumes can look. This is like something you'd see at an amusement park.

    [​IMG]
     
  16. JubJub86 Registered

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    Dude. He's not "Penguin" yet.

    It's not some irrational thing to think this guy's going to grow and have an arc, sense of clothes and overall 'self' moving with that. He's literally just an underboss as of now, working for someone else.

    And why would it necessarily have to be "relevant to today's tastes"? Half the people in the funeral scene sure aren't wearing anything like that. It's straight-up 40s noir meets 80s greed/indulgence.
     
  17. CondimentKing Mitchell Mayo

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    All the toy marketing has him actually called "The Penguin." I'm sure he'll embrace it by the end of the movie. And he even has Iceberg Lounge (maybe that's where the nickname comes from).
     
  18. Gothamsknight A Dark Knight

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    Yeah, I'm fully confident he'll be the penguin by the end. Actually, i think that shot of Penguin looking out the window is probably towards the end.
     
  19. shauner111 Registered

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    He’s either the main villain of the sequel or he’s at least the kingpin of the city while Freeze/Batman dominate the story. Either way, it already looks like he’s being hyped up as a big deal moving forward. The rise to crimelord status and all.
     
  20. CondimentKing Mitchell Mayo

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    How amazing is it that that idea might literally be the plot of a Batman movie. Gotham in snow. Mr Freeze. Penguin. Two-Face. I love Matt Reeves. I have complete faith.
     
  21. Gothamsknight A Dark Knight

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    Absolutely. I truly believe he'll have a presence in all 3 movie going forward. As well as his own show too, obviously lol.
     
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  22. chintai80 oh hi.

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    penguin taking over the criminal empire by the end of the batman can set the stage for the sequels, as he's more willing to work with the "freaks" / supervillains compared to the old school mob guys like falcone.
     
  23. DKDetective Elementary, Dear Robin (he/him/his)

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    That's not accurate. There are no real 40s noir references in the attire at the Funeral. It is at most indirect, in that the 1980s and early 1990s styles being used are influenced and inspired to some extent by the styles of the 1930s and 1940s. As we have had a lot of retro 1980s and 1990s fashion trends lately, the use of 1980s/1990s fashions seems to me to be a way of harkening back to noir and mob cinema of the past, but also updating same. For instance, Pattinson's preppy early 1980s style as Bruce bears a lot of similarities to current menswear trends (such as narrow ties, lapels, collars, etc.)

    There is definitely an attempt to create a heightened aesthetic for this film, but they are also clearly trying to ground it in current times. There are no jarring anachronisms like say as seen in the Burton Batfilms. A monocle does not fit with this aesthetic at all. It was anachronist even in the 1930s/1940s. It was a parody of stuffy old rich people even at that time.

    I'm guessing something along those lines. The new trailer makes it very clear that Oswald wears a full tuxedo (aka "penguin suit") while holding court at the Iceberg Lounge. There are plenty of reasonable, non-over-the-top ways that Oswald could get that nickname. It could be that he plays the fancy host at his club or that he is a "cold fish" who doesn't really get along with other mobsters, etc.
     
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  24. shauner111 Registered

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    He waddles from his leg brace, ugly nose and plump. Hence the nickname.
     
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  25. Doctor Jones Super Moderator

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    Could even be the last time we see him. It has that uncertain fate look about it.
     
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