Superman Returns Does any one know what 6'3" and 225 pounds lean actually looks like?

[SuperMike335!!]

Superman can't build muscle....atleast, not like normal people. He might have to move planets as workouts.

That same logic, and I already coverd it in my first post because it is the most common argument there is for superman to be skinny.

By that same logic the normal muscular stress of living would not be enough to sustain his muscle mass, and although strong would look like he came out of a concentration camp.

Saying he cnt build muscle, blah blah blah...

Why doesnt any one ask if he would even need to do any activity for his muscle?

You cannot apply human exersice physiology to him. He is an ALIEN.

He can be built like whatever his genes dictate under a yellow sun.

And I NEVER said I wanted him to look like a bodybuilder.

IMHO he should be built like Clint Walker was, see dirty dozen, Clint was also bigger in build than Welling was from SV5, welling has gotten into good shape, but he is no Clint Walker.

Clint walker would however look like a toothpic next to a modern IFBB Pro Bodybuilder.

 

[lujho]

By the way, I read on this forum that one of the reasons they didn't use the yellow symbol on the cape was because it would have been too hard for the CG artists to pull off.

I don't think there's anything to that at all. The problem is NOT with CGI, it's that with the way they chose to attatch the cape there are a lot of folds on the back of it, and if you put the S there it would be all wobbly and not "read" well - whether or not it's live-action, CG, standing still or rippling about.

If they'd hung the cape a different way they could have had the S.

 

[Mr. Socko]

I still hate that they don't have the yellow S. They could have made it CG when he was flying

 

[JBElliott]

JBElliot, how in the world is Routh 'skinny'? lol

Dude was so big, he was prone to ripping his costume...and had to slim down. Take your ,male muscle infactuation elsewhere...

He's skinny compared to how Superman is generally portrayed.

Ripped his costume? Big deal. Make anything too tight and even the skinniest guy in the world will rip it.

Nice try with the "male muscle infactuation" jab. You're a jerk and a loser with no better arguments than to try and make fun of me. Too bad you're still wrong.

 

[JBElliott]

JB,
Superman is drawn the way he is because of aestetics, It looks good on paper but is impractical in real life. Brandon Routh is hardly skinny. A Mike O'hearn Superman in live action looks ridiculous because he's supposed to be passing himself off as an average person.
We only get away with in the comics because we say the disguise works.

JYI, Sure Superman is drawn the way he is because of aestetics. So why not work to pull it off on film as well? Why through out seven decades of aestetics for no good reason?

O'Hearn didn't have the right build either. His upper body was good, but his legs were too big for the aestetics of Superman. A guy with the build of Clint Walker and the acting ability of Chris Reeve could pull of the look and the role of Clark/Superman very well.

As for what works in comics, well the same works in films: We only get away with things in films because we say they work, and the audience willingly suspends disbelief, if the story and production values are good.

 

[dark_b]

I still hate that they don't have the yellow S. They could have made it CG when he was flying

you would never be able to see the S on the cape. you would only see something yellow on the cape. but i guss this would be better than nothing right?

 

[JBElliott]

ya guessed wrong. i obviously do since i'm posting here.

They why aren't you complaining that the Superman in the animated series isn't skinny and wearing a t-shirt with a tiny S shield and drawn to look like he's 15 years old?

good luck finding a dude as big as O'Hearn who can actually act.

They're out there. It's the responsibility of the people making the movie to find those actors and the responsibility of the actor to look the part. A good director can get a good performance out of a so-so actor.

gotta question for ya...do you think Christopher Reeve was built enough to play Supes?

Nope, he needed 20 or so more pounds of muscle. That said he was closer to the size of Superman than Routh is.

 

[JBElliott]

Personally I don't know how anyone can actually LIKE that humongous, steroidal-looking Superman of the comics. He looks like a freakin WWE star nowadays. Even in the old days when he was big and beefy, he didn't have veins popping out of his arms or a neck the size of a tree trunk.

To me there's something a lot more magical about watching a more naturally-built Superman fly into the air or lift a tank over his head. You can imagine yourself BEING that guy. When most kids fantasize about being Superman, being ultra buff probably has nothing to do with it. They just want to have his powers and fly through the air. I think the comics have gotten away from that too much.

Much more often than not, he's not drawn humongous, steroidal-looking. The "naturally" big look of Clint Walker would be perfect and is almost identical to the way Alex Ross portrays Superman in his photo realistic art work. If you don't think a large build for Superman would work on film, take a look at Ross' work and see that it will work on film just fine.

 

[DorkyFresh]

Ripped his costume? Big deal. Make anything too tight and even the skinniest guy in the world will rip it.

you DO realize these types of statements make you seem ignorant, right? i'm not attacking you are trying to act higher than you or anything but when you blow off facts like that, it shows you're IGNORing the facts and not taking them into consideration at all.

 

[JBElliott]

i personally could NEVER accept a Superman that looks like that.

I take it you don't read comics then.

There was a skit with The Rock on SNL where he wore a suit so tiny that he looked like a steriod freak. And that's how a guy like O'hearn would look as Superman. It'd be too obvious, there'd be no need for a secret identity. He'd rip he jacket and shirt every time he bent over to pick something up.

Yeah, that was hilarious. I loved it. The thing is that the skit saterizes all versions of Superman just the same. Glasses aren't going to work for Reeve, Routh, Caine, Welling or the Swan version, the Byrne version, the Ross version and so on. We accept that the disguise works because we willingly suspend our disbelief.

Routh is not skinny. The guy seems buff.

He's too skinny to play the part of Superman.

Well I suppose that's not quite right. He's too skinny to play the part of the Superman we see in comics. However, in Elseworlds comics like Red Son there can be a lot of variation in Superman. Thus, Superman Returns is an Elseworlds version of Superman where Superman looks like he's 15 years old and built like a decent high school swim team member. I suppose that's okay, but I'd rather see the "real" Superman on screen.

 

[JBElliott]

I doubt that, seeing as how he cannot work out. He'd have to lift tons at a time to break a sweat.

Superman doesn't have to work out, the yellow sun radiation pumps him up. He's "naturally" built like that.

 

[JBElliott]

Originally Posted by ChrisBaleBatman
I doubt that, seeing as how he cannot work out. He'd have to lift tons at a time to break a sweat.

Exactly. He shouldn't look like a 'roid ape, just a very in shape reguler guy.

By that logic, then Superman would be a super skinny guy with totally atrophied muscle, muscle skinnier than even Routh.

 

[DorkyFresh]

They why aren't you complaining that the Superman in the animated series isn't skinny and wearing a t-shirt with a tiny S shield and drawn to look like he's 15 years old?.

because the animated series is just one interpretation of Superman. it's not the end all be all of everything Superman. i prefer my live action Supermen believable. i don't want my live action Superman to look like he can't even cross his arms...

They're out there. It's the responsibility of the people making the movie to find those actors and the responsibility of the actor to look the part. A good director can get a good performance out of a so-so actor.

you have some kinda mouth on you. it's easy for you to say while sitting in front of your monitor but when it comes down to the nitty gritty it ISN'T that easy and if you think it is then you really don't know much about filmmaking. you can talk the talk, but if you were to walk that line you'd fall flat on your face.

 

[JBElliott]

Yet someone who doesn't understand the characters OR the mythos. Superman's powers aren't a deriviative of the size or bulk of his muscles...but of the radiation from the yellow sun. Dumb ass. Nolan owned Batman, and did it about as spot on as you can get.

Hi ya dumb ass! You don't understand the characters or mythos. Superman's size isn't the result of working out and it's not the source of his strength. But it is the way he's been drawn for about seven decades. So if you're going to make a Superman movie, then it seems logical that you'd get a guy to play the part of Superman who actually looks like the Superman we've see in comics and animated series and so on for the past seven decades. Got that dumb ass?

Nolan didn't own jack *****. Batman Returns was a decent Elseworlds version of Batman and little else. Nice try dumb ass.

 

[DorkyFresh]

Thus, Superman Returns is an Elseworlds version of Superman where Superman looks like he's 15 years old and built like a decent high school swim team member. I suppose that's okay, but I'd rather see the "real" Superman on screen.

superman is real????!!!!!!!

 

[JBElliott]

my point is that just because its drawn a certain way does not mean it will look just as good in real life. think outside the funny pages man

Yet, that's how Superman has been draw for about seven decades. If you don't think it will work in a movie, they why make a movie about Superman at all? Why not make a movie that's based on Superman, but call it something else and say that it's based on similar ideas, but since Superman won't work on film, it's going to be something other than Superman.

I believe a Superman who looks like Superman in the comic would work on film. Alex Ross proves that in his photo realistic art work. If Ross could paint several million photo realistic pictures in a few months, then he could make his own film that would look just like a "real" movie.

 

[JBElliott]

superman is real????!!!!!!!

That's why I put it in quotes dork. The "real" Superman is the Superman we've read in comics for about seven decades.

 

[JBElliott]

ok, as some people are now calling the description I gave fro 225 punds at 6'3" as a "bodybuilder", is absurd.

My point was just that I prefer superman to look bigger than Routh does, at least by a little bit, and get his hair cut too.

Not Rouths fault the suit was so constricting he actually had to slim down, if he gets a trainer for a sequel they will have to make him a bigger costume.

And who ever posted the picture of Clint Walker is right on the money.

If I were the casting director, and I am not, I would have tried to find some one who looks like him.

NOT bodybuilder size, but an actor who has a physique like Clint Walker had at his peak.

Tall, powerfully built, but not the look of a competative bodybuilder.

Thanks Mike! Nice to have another friendly voice in here. Glad you made it back safe and sound from Iraq.

 

[DorkyFresh]

That's why I put it in quotes dork.

if you're gonna use the word "dork" to address me, please add the "y" at the end of it so i know wether or not you're saying it to diss me...

The "real" Superman is the Superman we've read in comics for about seven decades.

you mean....YOUR Superman is the Superman you've read in comics. there's no such thing as THE Superman.....he's a fictional character that doesn't exist in reality, therefor he's different depending on who you ask.

 

[JBElliott]

ok, as some people are now calling the description I gave fro 225 punds at 6'3" as a "bodybuilder", is absurd.

My point was just that I prefer superman to look bigger than Routh does, at least by a little bit, and get his hair cut too.

Not Rouths fault the suit was so constricting he actually had to slim down, if he gets a trainer for a sequel they will have to make him a bigger costume.

And who ever posted the picture of Clint Walker is right on the money.

If I were the casting director, and I am not, I would have tried to find some one who looks like him.

NOT bodybuilder size, but an actor who has a physique like Clint Walker had at his peak.

Tall, powerfully built, but not the look of a competative bodybuilder.

Thanks Mike! Nice to have another friendly voice in here. Glad you made it back safe and sound from Iran.

On the topic of a constricting costume. I'm not sure I understand that. A human body is made up of about 60% of water (in adult men, about 60% of their bodies are water. However, fat tissue does not have as much water as lean tissue). Water, as is the case with most fluids, is incompressible. So how could Routh's suit compress his muscles? If it really did, then his body would have to bulge out somewhere that the suit was not constricting him. Maybe his hands or head is swollen. I almost said his neck too, but we can see that that's not the case.

 

[JBElliott]

Also we have to remember that the suit compresses his build so that might be making him look smaller.

The suit can't compress him with out causing Routh to bulge somewhere not covered by the suit. Where is that?

 

[JBElliott]

I don't think there's anything to that at all. The problem is NOT with CGI, it's that with the way they chose to attatch the cape there are a lot of folds on the back of it, and if you put the S there it would be all wobbly and not "read" well - whether or not it's live-action, CG, standing still or rippling about.

If they'd hung the cape a different way they could have had the S.

I don't there's anything to it either. It was an excuse. Why did they even bother trying to say that? Did they feel they were wrong in leaving it off and needed the excuse?

 

[dark_b]

I take it you don't read comics then.

do you?

 

[JBElliott]

you DO realize these types of statements make you seem ignorant, right? i'm not attacking you are trying to act higher than you or anything but when you blow off facts like that, it shows you're IGNORing the facts and not taking them into consideration at all.

Statements like that don't make me ignorant at all. I don't ignore any facts and consider them all.

People point to the ripping of the suit as proof of how massive Routh is. The truth is that any one of any build will rip clothing that is too small for them. So Routh ripping the suit proves only that the suit was too small for him. It proves nothing about his bulk, or lack thereof.

 

[JBElliott]

because the animated series is just one interpretation of Superman. it's not the end all be all of everything Superman. i prefer my live action Supermen believable. i don't want my live action Superman to look like he can't even cross his arms...

A believable Superman? Then I guess you don't want him to fly, be super strong, invulnerable and so on, since all of those charateristics are completely unbelievable.

The animated series is just one interpretation, but it's an extremely good and well recieved one that translates the core of the comics into a motion medium (all the mediums we're talking about: comics, animation and live action are images on a flat surface and thus all of the same dimension).

you have some kinda mouth on you. it's easy for you to say while sitting in front of your monitor but when it comes down to the nitty gritty it ISN'T that easy and if you think it is then you really don't know much about filmmaking. you can talk the talk, but if you were to walk that line you'd fall flat on your face.

I'm not sure how writing: "They're out there. It's the responsibility of the people making the movie to find those actors and the responsibility of the actor to look the part. A good director can get a good performance out of a so-so actor" gives me any different mouth than anyone else around here (for example I've been called a dumb ass in this thread).