General Motors

[BlackLantern]

What if you buy a GM or Ford and you still are paying it off and they declare bankruptcy...what does that mean for those car owners?

 

[deathfromabove]

What if you buy a GM or Ford and you still are paying it off and they declare bankruptcy...what does that mean for those car owners?

seriously?

it means nothing. you are paying the loan off to whatever bank loaned you the money in the first place. if GM goes under you will still owe your bank the balance of your loan. if you default on your loan the bank, not the car maker, repos your car.

 

[Addendum]

I think they'd still have to pay it off. The money probably wouldn't go to GM or Ford if they were bankrupt, it would go to the creditor or whomever was handling the bankrupt company

 

[BlackLantern]

seriously?

it means nothing. you are paying the loan off to whatever bank loaned you the money in the first place. if GM goes under you will still owe your bank the balance of your loan.

I wasn't sure...I've only owned 3 cars and got them all from private owners...I've never purchased from a dealership

 

[deathfromabove]

I think they'd still have to pay it off. The money probably wouldn't go to GM or Ford if they were bankrupt, it would go to the creditor or whomever was handling the bankrupt company

its already not going to the automaker. your car payment goes to the bank that loaned you the money.

 

[Paradoxium]

Found some interesting stuff from the market ticker. It involves government regulation....

Second, we need to allow the diesels sold in Europe into the US. They can't be sold here due to the Greenie BS. That's stupid; hang the greenies up by their toenails. While we're at it, if the crash standards are good enough for Europe, they're good enough for the US. Now we can have small cars that get 60mpg with those diesel engines; a huge part of why we can't get there from here now is the crash standards in the US that prohibit the sale of vehicles available across the Atlantic. Why can't we build those here? Emissions and crash standards - period. We detune engines and then on top of it mandate hundreds of pounds of extra weight that make impossible the sort of fuel economy that is routinely achieved on European roads.

Remember in early 2007, Consumer Reports made a huge mistake on baby car seat crash data? The fact that such a massive error even made it to publication, let alone squeaked past in-house review, shows how pathetic we are in letting bogus safety stuff and and bad science ruin real production. Personally, I think this Consumer Reports mistake was a major news story...how many other "mistakes" turn into law? Part per thousand regulations for part per billion issues.

Thank you for getting it exactly right on the Automobile engineering.

We COULD build efficient cars, and even safe cars, but Congress is trying to repeal the laws of physics. Cars that are required to have hundreds of extra pounds to meet political regulations (they aren't mandated to be safe, they are mandated to have such and such a bumper - the same for NY and SD, and green stuff - VW once had a car that would meet emissions without a catalytic converter, so they mandated catalytic converters).

LA is in a nearly permanent air inversion. They might need special emission requirements, but they really need mass transit. And buses (not the public transport horrors, but private "luxury" jitneys which would still be cheaper). Not subways. Perhaps even street-cars.

But "green" is not so much a movement as an obstruction. And a stupid one. Making 100 cars cleaner out of the lot won't fix the one which pollutes more than the others combined. And making them sit in traffic gridlock makes the pollution worse.

Consumers want safety and environmentally conscious cars, but the technology is there. Instead government is trying to mandate a 30+ MPG tank.

Laws of Unintended Consequences with regulations come into play.

 

[dnno1]

Been doing some homework on this issue, but I believe if any of the big three were to file chapter 11, they are legally not obligated to honor old debts or warranties prior to chapter 11.

BUT, here is the BIG BUT, it doesn't mean they can't do it still, because of the importance of not wanting to lose patronage. The bankruptcy courts understand this inherent value, and so do creditors. So my point is, in the circumstance that either of these big three hit the curb, it doesn't mean you warranties are dead automatically. In the short-term after the bankruptcy you might run into some issues, but I think in the long term, I am pretty certain your warranties will remain intact.

If anyone sees any holes with this feel free to add, I don't want to mislead.

Sounds like you spoke to the judges and creditors (...not). What you are missing is the fact that most consumers won't buy a car from a bankrupt automaker, because there is no guarantee that they will honor the warranty. it will be pretty hard to if they discontinue a model and do not supply the parts for it. BTW here is a case where an extended warranty was not honored due to bankruptcy. Formally filing chapter 11 is the kiss of death for an automaker since they would more than likely not get the customers back to make them profitable.

 

[Paradoxium]

Sounds like you spoke to the judges and creditors (...not). What you are missing is the fact that most consumers won't buy a car from a bankrupt automaker, because there is no guarantee that they will honor the warranty. it will be pretty hard to if they discontinue a model and do not supply the parts for it. BTW here is a case where an extended warranty was not honored due to bankruptcy. Formally filing chapter 11 is the kiss of death for an automaker since they would more than likely not get the customers back to make them profitable.

Now you are just trying to provoke me.

My post premises a chapter 11 that's it, which I even don't think will happen since Pelosi and Frank seems bent on bailing them out. More to the point where did I say it legally binding? I said they would honor it out of good faith not to lose customers.

Oh darn, I almost got bingo

 

[Paradoxium]

I admit you know how to push my buttons so I am cutting it out with you from hereon in. I am going to get into trouble if I keep this up.

 

[dnno1]

Now you are just trying to provoke me.

My post premises a chapter 11 that's it, which I even don't think will happen since Pelosi and Frank seems bent on bailing them out. More to the point where did I say it legally binding? I said they would honor it out of good faith not to lose customers.

Oh darn, I almost got bingo

Very funny. I think what you are really hoping is that there is a way the big three don't get the money and file chapter 11. You also believe the going that route is the right way, but it isn't. The last time an automaker filed chapter 11 was 25 years ago when the DeLorean Motor Company collapsed. The company finally closed that chapter in 2000. DeLorean never sold another car since 1982. Any automaker would be suicidal to want to declare bankruptcy.

 

[dnno1]

I admit you know how to push my buttons so I am cutting it out with you from hereon in. I am going to get into trouble if I keep this up.

You invited anyone to contribute if they saw any holes. I just though I would throw in my 3 cents since I saw one.

 

[The Incredible Hulk]

Very funny. I think what you are really hoping is that there is a way the big three don't get the money and file chapter 11. You also believe the going that route is the right way, but it isn't. The last time an automaker filed chapter 11 was 25 years ago when the DeLorean Motor Company collapsed. The company finally closed that chapter in 2000. DeLorean never sold another car since 1982. Any automaker would be suicidal to want to declare bankruptcy.

DeLorean isnt a great example to use considering the owner got caught trafficking cocaine in the cars right as he was filing for bankruptcy. Even though he was acquitted because they said the government entrapped him into doing it, his reputation with the public went to hell. John DeLorean ruined DeLorean not Chapter 11.

 

[Addendum]

Plus he made a ****ty car

 

[BlackLantern]

....his love for the White Lady doomed him.....

 

[The Incredible Hulk]

Plus he made a ****ty car

Doc Brown would like to have a word with you....

 

[BlackLantern]

It's a super conductive ****ty car....

 

[Addendum]

....his love for the White Lady doomed him.....

DeLorean is the auto industry's version of Dr. Rockso

 

[Holiday]

Ford and Delorean is not a great comparison by any means. And as far as the warranties go, the government could step in and back the warranties. That what those in favor of the big 3 filing bankruptcy propose.

 

[The Major]

If the car industry does get the bailout the government should make it an extremely air-tight contract that the companies must abide by.

The money must be kept under close scrutiny with the government revamping the companies from the inside to make sure the companies do what they say and actually be innovative. It can't be business as usual IMO.

The management must do some serious sacrificing of their own, as well.

Extreme penalties should be meted out to the individuals who don't play along.

It can't be an AIG repeat.

The government watchdogs need to watched like hawks, as well. This should be as transparent as possible.

 

[Holiday]

Yes, definitely can't give em' a bailout and think they'll fix it on their own.

I would love to see a whole new government appointed managrmernt come in and run these companies. People who could run a business properly.

I think some common ground will be reach before the big 3 go bankrupt. A bailout of sorts full of stipulations.

 

[The Major]

Yes, definitely can't give em' a bailout and think they'll fix it on their own.

I would love to see a whole new government appointed managrmernt come in and run these companies. People who could run a business properly.

I think some common ground will be reach before the big 3 go bankrupt. A bailout of sorts full of stipulations.

They should get some consultants like Steve Jobs and other creative business people for the management side.

Bring in inventors from the alternative fuel industries for the R & D branches for the engineering side, as well.

 

[Holiday]

I wanna see Mitt Romney involved. He knows a thing or two about turning a bad business around.

And manufacturing fuel efficent vehicles needs to be priority number one. No more gas guzzlers.

 

[The Major]

I wanna see Mitt Romney involved. He knows a thing or two about turning a bad business around.

And manufacturing fuel efficent vehicles needs to be priority number one. No more gas guzzlers.

Agreed.

 

[Malice]

They should get some consultants like Steve Jobs and other creative business people for the management side.

Bring in inventors from the alternative fuel industries for the R & D branches for the engineering side, as well.

Steve Jobs would not have a clue to really fix the problems with GM...they need someone who is from the Manufacturing side, that is a major fiscal conservative and can be creative.

 

[The Major]

Steve Jobs would not have a clue to really fix the problems with GM...

It was just a suggestion. Jobs was the only person I could think of.

they need someone who is from the Manufacturing side, that is a major fiscal conservative and can be creative.

True.