In Defense of Man of Steel

[roach]

And isn't that the essence of the character?

Anyway, I'm dissapointed with this thread, I thought it would be like this:

In Denfese of Man of Steel

I think the problem is people expect Superman day one to be Superman 75+ years. A man with no formal training or guidance is going to make a few mistakes the first day on the job.

God I love the action in that movie

 

[C. Lee]

Why couldn't this be posted in the Man of Steel forum?

It is now.....

 

[Noctis]

Well Superman could have just flew him to a less populated area before Zod's lazer eye reaches those civilians.

 

[SofNascimento]

I think the problem is people expect Superman day one to be Superman 75+ years. A man with no formal training or guidance is going to make a few mistakes the first day on the job.

I believe that's reasonable. But also that it doesn't negate people who didn't agree with it.

Personally I think it could have been handled better.

 

[Isearch4dope]

I believe that's reasonable. But also that it doesn't negate people who didn't agree with it.

Personally I think it could have been handled better.

I'll grab the hammer and hit the nail to make sure it went in deep enough. Could have been handled way better and that's the thing that is still grinding the gears of the people who despise it until BvS does the same or manages to wipe MOS out of our brains.

*cue the you didn't get the movie you wanted or you didn't get the story replies etc.t:

 

[Isearch4dope]

Don't get me started on those gifs above.....the choreography was decent (there's so much more imagination that could have gone into showcasing the deadly speed and power of these super-powered people) but......the damn cgi overload, grey death palette, lack of damage, lack of any sense of danger, lack of any weight in the hits made it dull and repetitive to sit through....lol Faora can dodge and choke grab Supes here but when Supes charges her from the vault a lot slower he hits her through the bank....it also didn't help that Foara could grab and throw Supes like a piece of paper...where's the basic consistency in power levels at least and for God's sake how much more proof do these military men need to see they are ants in this clash

 

[smallville fan]

I was watching Captain America: Winter Soldier the other day with my roommate and we get to the scene where Cap puts Bucky to sleep in a choke hold. My roommate mentions...See Superman could have done that to Zod.
I mentioned that Bucky can be imprisoned by conventional means....deactivate his arm, put him in a regular max security prison.
When Zod wakes up there is no prison on earth that can hold him. There's no phantom zone to chuck him in.
His response is "He's Superman...he could have found away"

That mentality is just plain idiotic on so many levels. At the end of the movie he has no way to contain Zod, throwing him out into space is useless, there's no way to stop him, pure and simple. Saying that is like Batman fans saying that "Because he's Batman" he can do anything. Superman did the Earth a favourite by killing off Zod. I don't think many people will even like the idea of someone like Zod even living on Earth. He's like a living nuclear bomb just waiting to go off.

 

[Batmannerism]

OOoohhh this is tempting, because I'm the guy who periodicaly goes to the "spoilers, what are your complaints thread" to dispute some of people's complaints -or at least recast those issues in a more positive light.

I stick up for this film all the time, I just cannot understand people's problems with it -particularly the critics. I often have it on in the background at home, when I'm doing chores, or use the score for background music when I'm at work.

I could launch into a long statement of the film's vitrues (action, effects, Krypton !, particularly strong performances by Adams, Crowe and Lane, a more regular-guy Superman who wears jeans and does blue-collar jobs, Zimmer's score, the Smallville battle, the pleasant surprise that was Traue's Faora , the list goes on and on).

However, I will simply say this. Snyder, Goyer and Nolan had the balls to do something different with Superman rather than re-hash the old films - like Singer did so woefully with Superman Returns - barf ! Everything that is essential about Superman, was in the film, plus a few 21st century twists ( I go a bit nuts when people complain he didn't save anyone....did they watch the film ? the busload of kids, his mom, Lois Lane on three occasions, the helicopter gunner, the oil rig workers, the family in the train station plus the entire human race).

I've always thought of Superman as a man of action, not words. I found Cavill's Superman spot-on, because he didn't say much, but you could tell what he was thinking through his expressions - and his actions. In TASM I found Garfield pretty annoying as Spider Man, but in TASM 2 he was much more comfortable in the role both as Spidey and Peter, and did a great job. Cavill was solid as Superman/Clark in MOS, and I'm expecting him to really bring it home in the sequel.

All that really matters to me is that at the end of it, I walked out feeling the same thrill I got when I was a kid, seeing Superman the Movie.


Other than that, I think all the previous posters who mentioned that people who didn't like MOS are unlikely to be persuaded otherwise by forum posts, are correct.

As such, if you didn't like it try watching it again with an open mind.

Cheers

 

[Tra-El]

That mentality is just plain idiotic on so many levels. At the end of the movie he has no way to contain Zod, throwing him out into space is useless, there's no way to stop him, pure and simple. Saying that is like Batman fans saying that "Because he's Batman" he can do anything. Superman did the Earth a favourite by killing off Zod. I don't think many people will even like the idea of someone like Zod even living on Earth. He's like a living nuclear bomb just waiting to go off.

He did go off and like many people have said, no imprisonment on Earth to hold him. Earth was literally an ant farm to him at that point and in many ways, was basically Doomsday in the form of being caplable of Earth's instinction and the danger he brought. Without the Phantom Zone, there literally "is no way" and the ignorance in that response above from roach's friend is tiresome and disturbing (as a Supes fan.)

The only thing that Supes didn't have to defeat Zod was not only the Phantom Zone, but time. Maybe with time, Supes could have used Kryptonian technology in some form or fashion to build a new prison or PZ for Zod, but that's with time. Supes didn't have any luxury at that point. People want to point to the death toll. If Supes doesn't kill Zod..that toll would have risen by the billions. Sucks people don't see that and it makes me like the descision to killl Zod and put Supes in a position to make a choice even better than just the same 'ol "It's Superman, he'll find a way" shtick.

In fact, roach's friend proved Zack Snyder's point. With this universe going forward, now that Superman did in fact NOT have another way, eliminates the audiences mind-set of being complacent and predicting the predictable. In the end, this will help the Superman character and his portrayal of not being so dry and redundant... or....simply BORING.

 

[smallville fan]

He did go off and like many people have said, no imprisonment on Earth to hold him. Earth was literally an ant farm to him at that point and in many ways, was basically Doomsday in the form of being caplable of Earth's instinction and the danger he brought. Without the Phantom Zone, there literally "is no way" and the ignorance in that response above from roach's friend is tiresome and disturbing (as a Supes fan.)

The only thing that Supes didn't have to defeat Zod was not only the Phantom Zone, but time. Maybe with time, Supes could have used Kryptonian technology in some form or fashion to build a new prison or PZ for Zod, but that's with time. Supes didn't have any luxury at that point. People want to point to the death toll. If Supes doesn't kill Zod..that toll would have risen by the billions. Sucks people don't see that and it makes me like the descision to killl Zod and put Supes in a position to make a choice even better than just the same 'ol "It's Superman, he'll find a way" shtick.

In fact, roach's friend proved Zack Snyder's point. With this universe going forward, now that Superman did in fact NOT have another way, eliminates the audiences mind-set of being complacent and predicting the predictable. In the end, this will help the Superman character and his portrayal of not being so dry and redundant... or....simply BORING.

Too true. It makes me wonder if Zack Snyder wants to be unpredictable with our characters, I wonder what he'll do with Batman?

 

[WBwins]

It seems that in the initial plans for Man of steel Clark was going to be a Journalist from the beginning like in Birthright.I suspect that was the version of the Man of steel story that Nolan approved

However that got changed and Clark was a wanderer in MOS.Do you guys think that was a good choice?

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

I think the problem is people expect Superman day one to be Superman 75+ years. A man with no formal training or guidance is going to make a few mistakes the first day on the job.

God I love the action in that movie

That's an excellent point

 

[smallville fan]

It seems that in the initial plans for Man of steel Clark was going to be a Journalist from the beginning like in Birthright.I suspect that was the version of the Man of steel story that Nolan approved

However that got changed and Clark was a wanderer in MOS.Do you guys think that was a good choice?

Don't really mind as you do have depictions of Clark as a wanderer in comics too.

 

[Rodrigo90]

I was just reading John Bryne's Superman run last night and it's so much like MOS...in ways.

And I'm pissed because I spilt my Pepsi all over my Kingdom Come book and some splashed on that as well...looks like it's fell in diarrhea

 

[CoolHandLuke]

Can I ask some questions about MOS and have them answered? I'm not trolling, I just have questions. I'm not going to insult anyone or try to hurt anyone's feelings. I just have questions about a movie.

 

[Nemeres]

One thing I'll find myself defending is the neck snap. It was the filmmakers' prerrogative to put him in a difficult situation, and the choice he made was the right one. As simple as that (despite the logic issues. He can't turn his head away, so he kills him by turning his head away? Eh.).

Still, it baffles me that in a movie where Superman willingly lets his father die, that's still the most controversial element. I'd say it multiplies those levels of cluelessness by 1000x. Anyway.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

It seems that in the initial plans for Man of steel Clark was going to be a Journalist from the beginning like in Birthright.I suspect that was the version of the Man of steel story that Nolan approved

However that got changed and Clark was a wanderer in MOS.Do you guys think that was a good choice?

Not really, I feel it would have been fine to have him as a wanderer if he didn't get an instant job at the planet at the end. I think having g him be a free Lance journalist or blogger who traveled would have fit better. Then we would see evidence of why he was hired at the DP.

 

[BH/HHH]

Well Superman could have just flew him to a less populated area before Zod's lazer eye reaches those civilians.

Then what?

This is the problem with that comment, there is nothing he can do, he has to kill him, no jail will hold him, the phantom zone is shut off. Also you'll also notice Superman is struggling to get a grip on Zod. Whose to say he could just simply fly away with him? Zod is pretty nailed to the floor.

 

[BH/HHH]

Can I ask some questions about MOS and have them answered? I'm not trolling, I just have questions. I'm not going to insult anyone or try to hurt anyone's feelings. I just have questions about a movie.

Just post them

 

[Doctor13]

I genuinely love Man of Steel. Love it. ANd I thinkt he vast majority of complaints about it are kind of unfounded. Like Supes having any choice in killing Zod. He didn't. There was no other option at that moment. Zod was never going to stop. Clark pleaded with him to stop. He tried..it was no use.

Also...Superman is not responsible for the vast majorotiy of the damage done to Smallville or Metropolis. That fault goes to Zod and his army. These are people bred to be soldiers against a single man who has never lifted his hand in violence once in his life. There's a sequence in Smallville where Superman tries to fly away, to draw them out of Smallville...and he's slammed into the ground and pummeled for this. In Metropolis, he's out of his element again. Zod is the ultimate soldier and Clark's one advantage of being able to fully control his powers is now gone as Zod can do that as well. The damage is all on Zod.

The one time I truly, truly can put fault on Clark is when he slams Zod through that silo and gas station. However, from Clark's point of view, his anger got the better of him, Zod was threatening the only family he had left.

I genuinely feel people expect Superman to be perfect out of the box instead of being able to learn. It's an odd catch 22 for the character. He's hated by people for being too perfect, but the minute you give him flaws those same people complain because Superman is supposed to be perfect. It seems that the character just isn't allowed to win sometimes.

 

[Steamteck]

I genuinely feel people expect Superman to be perfect out of the box instead of being able to learn. It's an odd catch 22 for the character. He's hated by people for being too perfect, but the minute you give him flaws those same people complain because Superman is supposed to be perfect. It seems that the character just isn't allowed to win sometimes.

That's the impression I get also although there's no way to know if they're the same people.

 

[Steamteck]

Well Superman could have just flew him to a less populated area before Zod's lazer eye reaches those civilians.

I think you have an incredibly exaggerated opinion on how much control Kal had over Zod and the situation. It just seems more of the "He's Superman. He should always have the perfect solution.

 

[Mr Para]

Loved the film, I agree with many comments it did feel a bit cold and experimenty but it had to we have a superman untrained and unsure of himself you can't expect that calm and coolness of reeve/rooth we got a very raw first time superman. MoS did things differently, no fortress of solitude, no training etc....

But we saw him show that coolness and collected side towards the end with carol ferris/star sapphire? saying he is hot......

Id like to imagine this superman is still raw but in the next film or superman 2 id like to see him trained and more comfortable with playing the hero and knowing who he is and what he is.

If they attempted the same reeve/rooth superman it would have been boring, predictable and failed.

 

[Frodo]

If they attempted the same reeve/rooth superman it would have been boring, predictable and failed.

I agree. I think alot of what MOS was was a break from Reeve films which needed to happen. Unfortunately WB hadn't made a Superman film for 20 years when SR came out and even then it was still holding onto the past Reeve films. That meant that for alot of people Superboy,Smallville, L&C, STAS, JLA , etc basically didn't matter and that the Reeve version was the only standard for the character.

So MOS had the task of doing what had to be done which was to make a break from the past. Yes, it upset alot of fans of the Reeve films but ultimately its what had to be done. Arguably , it should have been done a long time ago and WB shouldn't have waited so long to restart the series, but what's done is done.

MOS was a bit like getting a flu shot. You don't want to do it, and you may moan about having to go through it and getting through it. However, after you're done, you know it was for your own good, and you can get on with things. After making the break from the past and establishing this version, warts and all, we can move forward and the character can have new adventures in a new expanded DCU, which aren't bound to a 40 year old film.

 

[mace1]

Anybody seen this?
Comic Book vs. Film: Man of Steel vs. Superman Unchained
https://litreactor.com/columns/comic-book-vs-film-man-of-steel-vs-superman-unchained