Isaiah Thomas Okay With Black Men Calling Sistas' "*****es"

Tupac makes some songs about his mama and that makes up for the majority of the vile mysogenistic crap he normally pumped out? Nelly raises money for cancer and that makes up for the damaging and demeaning images of black women in his videos?? Even if a woman doesn't realize that what she is doing is wrong, a real man will treat her how she "SHOULD" be treated....not how she will allow herself to be treated. Some women don't know better. Nelly and others like him exploit these women to make themselves rich.

You've gotta be kidding me. Tupac I can see where you're coming from, but Nelly?! His songs are hardly sexist or demeaning at all. It's mostly love songs or songs about clothes. And this just in. Women of all races love to shake their bodies. They do it at the club, they do it at parties, they do it for fun, they do it as a proffession, and they do it in videos. Sure there are some women who don't like dancing or showing their body, but that's rare. These are just things women do to get a mans attention with their own free will.
 
Yeah, I mean I went to a conservative Baptist (formerly) school in the South. And the white girls there would grind their ass in your crotch and s*** your d*** pretty much just for showing up at a frat party. If by buffer you mean "their families could pay for their abortions to cover up their bad behavior", then yes they had a buffer :rolleyes:
 
Given all the white kids in the 'burbs (like Neil, for example) that listen to these rappers' albums, I'd say their potentially damaging effects and examples have a much farther reach than just young black kids.

jag

hi, thanks, please don't make assumptions about me when you don't know me. it's getting a bit old.

kthxbye
 
you gotta be kidding me?

men(in general) didnt enslave the entire population of women(in general) for 100's of years.

they did on planet gor, in the john norman paperback gor novels, but slaverly was limited on that planet, anyone and everyone were potential slaves if they were caught by slavers.

yes I am making a joke.
 
The white kids in the burbs have better buffers than those in the hood, Jag and you know it. Most will still in up in college. Most of those whites kids are just acting out. They only dabble. Rebelling against mommy and daddy for a time. But my little sistas and brothas totally absorb this sub-culture. They make it a way of life thing. And most never recover from it. No father in the home. Mom working two jobs 'cause she had babaies out of wedlock.....kids unattended after school......watching booty shaking...dope smoking, bling wearing thugs.

"Dabbling" can be just as dangerous as someone who is supposedly "immersed" in it. You know how many of those 'burb kids are in single-parent homes where they really aren't getting parenting from either parent, so they basically run free and do whatever the hell they want to? A lot. Any kid with poor parenting and a lack of an ability to think for himself and do the right things is going to fall into the traps you're describing that could come from the influences of a "rebel" musician or celebrity. That goes for rap, hip-hop, metal, pop music, or whatever.


hi, thanks, please don't make assumptions about me when you don't know me. it's getting a bit old.

kthxbye

Are you not a white kid from the 'burbs that listens to hip-hop and rap? And stop typing like a twelve year old girl.

jag
 
The white kids in the burbs have better buffers than those in the hood, Jag and you know it. Most will still in up in college. Most of those whites kids are just acting out. They only dabble. Rebelling against mommy and daddy for a time. But my little sistas and brothas totally absorb this sub-culture. They make it a way of life thing. And most never recover from it. No father in the home. Mom working two jobs 'cause she had babaies out of wedlock.....kids unattended after school......watching booty shaking...dope smoking, bling wearing thugs.
I agree with you.
 
You've gotta be kidding me. Tupac I can see where you're coming from, but Nelly?! His songs are hardly sexist or demeaning at all. It's mostly love songs or songs about clothes. And this just in. Women of all races love to shake their bodies. They do it at the club, they do it at parties, they do it for fun, they do it as a proffession, and they do it in videos. Sure there are some women who don't like dancing or showing their body, but that's rare. These are just things women do to get a mans attention with their own free will.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=DhSc9k2U2R0

I don't know what paralell universe you live in, But check this out. Oh...and watch the part where he slides his credit card down the girl's butt crack. :dry: Not demeaning at all.....:dry: :dry: :dry:

This just in!!! These images hurt little girls. Especially those in the hood. When you don't see many images of yourself of TV, that's one thing. But when most of the images of you are booty shakers and hardly anything else? That's pitiful! what then do you want to aspire to?
 
Yeah, I mean I went to a conservative Baptist (formerly) school in the South. And the white girls there would grind their ass in your crotch and s*** your d*** pretty much just for showing up at a frat party. If by buffer you mean "their families could pay for their abortions to cover up their bad behavior", then yes they had a buffer :rolleyes:



But it's still there. Whether I agree with how mom and dad handled the situation is not the issue. The issue is that they were there! That black kid in the hood will have to deal with it on her own.

But also know this....the scenario you painted isn't always like that. There are some girls who don't.
 
Are you not a white kid from the 'burbs that listens to hip-hop and rap? And stop typing like a twelve year old girl.

jag

no, i am not. i am white, but i'm not from the "burbs".

and no, i'm not "ghetto". i'm not a "thug", i'm not a "gangsta", and i don't think that i am.

but i know where i came from. and it wasn't the "burbs"
 
The only kids musicians raise are their own, though some may have more than others
 
[/b]


This all kinda' reminds of the character Nino Brown from New Jack City. Killer, dope dealer to his own people, woman abuser, every day thug. Selling stuff that his people would buy (knowing that it was bad for them). All the while justifying it because he was making mad dollars. He was just a business man, in his own mind. Sound familiar?

But once a year at thanksgiving, good ol' Nino would use the money he killed for, to buy a truck load of turkeys for "His People". :dry: And you better know that excused all the dead black people he left in his wake, in the eyes of some. "Ain't Nino a great brotha' cause of what he's doing'?" But one old dude still saw Nino for what he was....a parasite.....a blood suckin' leech! He shot Nino at the end.

Tupac makes some songs about his mama and that makes up for the majority of the vile mysogenistic crap he normally pumped out? Nelly raises money for cancer and that makes up for the damaging and demeaning images of black women in his videos?? Even if a woman doesn't realize that what she is doing is wrong, a real man will treat her how she "SHOULD" be treated....not how she will allow herself to be treated. Some women don't know better. Nelly and others like him exploit these women to make themselves rich.

And what gets me is the "It's not our fault" card they all play. Like they had no "influence" in how young vulnerable black minds (without good parental buffers) act out. Maybe they didn't start the social fires (I'll give them that) of bastard children, crime, disrespect for authority, bad language, disrespecting women, drug use and violence. But they don't try to put out the fires either. Instead, they walk by and throw fresh matches on the flames or squirt lighter fluid on the thing. Then they come by and benefit from it all, by roasting their hot dogs and marshmellows on the fires of their own people. So they really don't care about our people. They need those social fires to keep burning....they need the record sales.

bull****.

do you listen to music or do you just skim through it?

talking about being thugs and gangstas, using half naked women in music videos, it's called -entertainment-

it has absolutely no impact what so ever on the mentality of people if there is good parenting involved. but instead of wanting to take responsibility of teaching their children good morals, parents would rather take the easy way out and blame rap music, or violent video games, or what have you.

my parents never once censored me from music, or movies, or video games. instead, they took the responsible approach, and they decided to familiarize themselves with what i was exposing myself to. when i decided to start listening to rap music in 6th grade, my dad sat down with me, and asked me to play the music for him. and when they realized what i was listening to, my parents took the responsible approach and taught me the difference between right and wrong, entertainment and reality. and as such, i knew that what i was hearing in my violent rap music was not something that i was to emulate. and as i grew older, and began paying more and more attention to the music, i also realized that the music was telling me these things were things that i was not supposed to emulate.

people like yourself pay absolutely no attention to the music. you see a half naked woman in a music video, and think the rappers are about objectifying women. not realizing that when they say "*****" and "hoe" they are talking about the women that actually are *****es and hoes, and not generalizing an entire gender as these things. why do they feel the need to speak on these things? because these are the things that these people experience. this is what these people see.

so yea, "one" song by 2pac dedicated to his mother is enough. because all that other **** he is spewing out isn't "venom", it's not corrupting youth. and if you listen to it, 2pac is trying to tell you that the bad things that he speaks of are the things that need to change. with 2pac in particular, it's a lot more than "one" song. listen to "keep ya head up", "dear mama", "changes", "brenda's got a baby", "unconditional love", "life goes on", "i ain't mad at cha" and tell me exactly what you think 2pac's message is.

listen to some bone thugs-n-harmony. listen to "tha crossroads", "if i could teach the world", "family tree", "change the world", "don't worry", "get up & get it", "if i fall", "don't stop", "do it again", "so good so right", "order my steps" and "i tried" and tell me what message you think these guys are trying to get across.

listen to some n.w.a. and i mean REALLY listen. not just skim through it. you tell me what point they are trying to get across. because the point ISN'T that being a gangsta, and drug dealer, and woman abuser, is cool. or "runaway love" by ludacris. most anything by nas. "slippin'" by dmx.

yea, there is a lot of hostile lyrics in rap music. because the world that these artists come from is hostile. that's what they know. but rap music is hardly the first form of music to say not so nice things. the doors, anyone? one of the most respected bands of all time. yea, morrison wasn't all rainbows and flowers with his lyrics. but nobody *****es about "break on through", "riders on the storm", or any doors death music as a poison to society. well, maybe back in the 60's when ed sullivan thought that morrison singing "baby we can't get much higher" was the ultimate evil, but these same people calling for the heads of hip hop artists, wanting to ban them, and force them into taming their lyrics, are the same people who think that morrison was god. and morrison was ****ing amazing. i love the doors. but let's not be so hypocritical here.

don't generalize an entire genre of music, and entire culture, off of some stupid ****s like 50 cent, and all the other ****ers out there right now, who are a bunch of idiots and bring the entire culture down. hip hop is more than just what you see on mtv. and hip hop is also more than just "*****" "hoe" and "*****". hip hop is legitamate music, just like rock n roll, jazz, blues, country, etc...

and the lyrics that come out of hip hop aren't a venom. you need to listen to the music, not skim through it. but that takes too much effort. people would just rather cry about everything and have it all banned, so that they don't have to put any effort into actually teaching values and morals to their children.
 
]bull****.[/b]

Why was an "explitive" the first word to your response? That remark alone tells me why you think putting this filth out is okay. Why the the profanity?? Was that even necessary?
do you listen to music or do you just skim through it?

talking about being thugs and gangstas, using half naked women in music videos, it's called -entertainment-

If vile negative things like that give you joy, there's a deeper problem. How about some things that uplift black people?

it has absolutely no impact what so ever on the mentality of people if there is good parenting involved. but instead of wanting to take responsibility of teaching their children good morals, parents would rather take the easy way out and blame rap music, or violent video games, or what have you.

my parents never once censored me from music, or movies, or video games. instead, they took the responsible approach, and they decided to familiarize themselves with what i was exposing myself to. when i decided to start listening to rap music in 6th grade, my dad sat down with me, and asked me to play the music for him. and when they realized what i was listening to, my parents took the responsible approach and taught me the difference between right and wrong, entertainment and reality. and as such, i knew that what i was hearing in my violent rap music was not something that i was to emulate. and as i grew older, and began paying more and more attention to the music, i also realized that the music was telling me these things were things that i was not supposed to emulate.

people like yourself pay absolutely no attention to the music. you see a half naked woman in a music video, and think the rappers are about objectifying women. not realizing that when they say "*****" and "hoe" they are talking about the women that actually are *****es and hoes, and not generalizing an entire gender as these things. why do they feel the need to speak on these things? because these are the things that these people experience. this is what these people see.

so yea, "one" song by 2pac dedicated to his mother is enough. because all that other **** he is spewing out isn't "venom", it's not corrupting youth. and if you listen to it, 2pac is trying to tell you that the bad things that he speaks of are the things that need to change. with 2pac in particular, it's a lot more than "one" song. listen to "keep ya head up", "dear mama", "changes", "brenda's got a baby", "unconditional love", "life goes on", "i ain't mad at cha" and tell me exactly what you think 2pac's message is.

listen to some bone thugs-n-harmony. listen to "tha crossroads", "if i could teach the world", "family tree", "change the world", "don't worry", "get up & get it", "if i fall", "don't stop", "do it again", "so good so right", "order my steps" and "i tried" and tell me what message you think these guys are trying to get across.

listen to some n.w.a. and i mean REALLY listen. not just skim through it. you tell me what point they are trying to get across. because the point ISN'T that being a gangsta, and drug dealer, and woman abuser, is cool. or "runaway love" by ludacris. most anything by nas. "slippin'" by dmx.

yea, there is a lot of hostile lyrics in rap music. because the world that these artists come from is hostile. that's what they know. but rap music is hardly the first form of music to say not so nice things. the doors, anyone? one of the most respected bands of all time. yea, morrison wasn't all rainbows and flowers with his lyrics. but nobody *****es about "break on through", "riders on the storm", or any doors death music as a poison to society. well, maybe back in the 60's when ed sullivan thought that morrison singing "baby we can't get much higher" was the ultimate evil, but these same people calling for the heads of hip hop artists, wanting to ban them, and force them into taming their lyrics, are the same people who think that morrison was god. and morrison was ****ing amazing. i love the doors. but let's not be so hypocritical here.

don't generalize an entire genre of music, and entire culture, off of some stupid ****s like 50 cent, and all the other ****ers out there right now, who are a bunch of idiots and bring the entire culture down. hip hop is more than just what you see on mtv. and hip hop is also more than just "*****" "hoe" and "*****". hip hop is legitamate music, just like rock n roll, jazz, blues, country, etc...

and the lyrics that come out of hip hop aren't a venom. you need to listen to the music, not skim through it. but that takes too much effort. people would just rather cry about everything and have it all banned, so that they don't have to put any effort into actually teaching values and morals to their children.


Let me tell you somethin'......I was a big fan of rap before '92. But, when NWA hit, the whole genre took a dive. Then came the east vs. west fueds. Then came the waving of the guns, the marijuana use (The Chronic), Suge Knight, shootings and beat downs. Black Women were on stripper poles and were objects.

And do I listen to it or skim thru it??? I really don't need to go into the sewer to know it stinks. I can walk by one and the stinch reaches out to me. The stinch I see on the videos BET, MTV and others show what is being produced. And logic dictates that if the crap they show on TV and play on the radio is considered air worthy to play, then I know the the other stuff must be worse!

And no!! Making some song about your mom is not enough to justify violating women!! What are you thinking??? Good Lord, man....some of those women are young mothers....somebody else's mom. Would Tupac want someone to disrespect HIS mother?? His sister???? His daughter??? This is not art! It's trash! He was a hypocrite. I don't care how you felt about his music.


You talk about the power of lyrics and images in the 60's?? Jim Morrison's antics were copied by many white kids. See what it led to. Drug use went up. Sexually transmitted diseases went up! Drop outs went up.........

So what do you think is happening to the young minds in the hood who see these thugs and think that's cool??? The little girls who see the booty shakers and think "That's what a real woman does."


Dude...quit making excuses for the problems we keep bringing on ourselves.... We're our own worst enemy!!
 
And respectfully, you're a white guy trying to tell me that I need to "understand" the poisoning of "MY" own people.

Does that even compute?
 
I agree with Memphis on some of these issues....

I'm a black male, more moderate/liberal than Memphis.....but I understand the frustration he sees in music. I grew up listening to lot of rap in high school, still do a little bit, but I've always pondered about this hypocrisy and mixed messages sent in the music even when I was a big fan. Black culture isn't going anywhere when the entirety of music on young "black" channels and radio stations promotes promiscuity, crime, ignorant behavior, or sexual abuse. Throwing a little "Dear Mama" or "Slippin" here or there doesn't excuse the gluttony of depraved, ignorant music that is promoted by corporate culture that takes advantage of down-trodden society. You might not go out and act like a stereotypical rapper, but your views and attitude on life will be influenced by what you listen to. You ARE what you eat. That is a fact.
 
no, i am not. i am white, but i'm not from the "burbs".

and no, i'm not "ghetto". i'm not a "thug", i'm not a "gangsta", and i don't think that i am.

but i know where i came from. and it wasn't the "burbs"

Dude, you're from San Jose, what gangs are rolling through there?
 
Memphis Slim, did it ever occur to you that most white music is about sex, violence and loose women. Rap is just another form of music therefore it will subscribe to the same topics which are common to the human experience. The Beatles, Rolling Stones, The Who and Alman Brothers all were singing about "f***ing the police" and hoes long before the Sugar Hill Gang even came out. They might not have used the same phrases and beats, but it was the same message. "Tambourine Man" by Bob Dylan was about cocaine, specifically the purchase of it. As was "Friend of the Devil" by the Dead. And much the same, people like Bill O'Reilly back then talked, at length, about how damaging the music was.
 
Rap's just the new scape goat for society. Personally I can't stand it but whoever thinks it's going to turn its listeners into drug addicted womanizers is an idiot.
 
You've gotta be kidding me. Tupac I can see where you're coming from, but Nelly?! His songs are hardly sexist or demeaning at all. It's mostly love songs or songs about clothes. And this just in. Women of all races love to shake their bodies. They do it at the club, they do it at parties, they do it for fun, they do it as a proffession, and they do it in videos. Sure there are some women who don't like dancing or showing their body, but that's rare. These are just things women do to get a mans attention with their own free will.

WHOA! 2Pac actually was more positive than Nelly. They BOTH weren't really role models, but 2Pac actually has said/done more for the community than Nelly has.
 
If a woman acts like a *****, then I will call her a *****, regardless of what race she is.
 
I should also add the world's most notorious murderers, bigots and charlatons rarely, if ever, are results of popular culture.
 
Dude, you're from San Jose, what gangs are rolling through there?

yea, san jose is pretty nice, overall, but there are areas where **** wasn't so pretty. and i just happened to be in one of those areas where that **** was around me.

was it as bad as harlem? compton? east oakland? richmond? hell no. i'm not from the "ghetto", and i don't compare my situation to the situations of people who actually DO live in REAL ghettos.

but, i didn't grow up in the burbs, either, and YES, i lived in one of the not so nice neighborhoods in san jose where there was a lot of gang activity, and you had to be careful the **** you said, did, or wore, because if you did any of those things wrong, you could end up shot. luckily, myself, and all my friends that i grew up with were able to avoid it. but i have watched a few people fall into that **** in my time in this area.
 
You talk about the power of lyrics and images in the 60's?? Jim Morrison's antics were copied by many white kids. See what it led to. Drug use went up. Sexually transmitted diseases went up! Drop outs went up.........

So what do you think is happening to the young minds in the hood who see these thugs and think that's cool??? The little girls who see the booty shakers and think "That's what a real woman does."


Dude...quit making excuses for the problems we keep bringing on ourselves.... We're our own worst enemy!!

well i can't quote your entire post, because of how i formatted it, but i will respond to it anyways.

the point is this - music imitates life, not the other way around.

there have been womanizing, drug dealing, gang banging people long before rap music ever came around. and even if you censor all of that stuff, and ban it, and it is never made or heard again, it is still going to exist. rap music has no impact what so ever on the fact that all of that stuff exists and happens in the world.

the "problem" with rap music is not that it says "*****" and "****" and "*****" and "hoe", it's the fact that rap music talks about stuff that's already going on in the world, that people want to be blind to.

you can talk about how nelly degrades women in his music videos all you want. but you are a male, correct? have you ever gone to a strip club? have you ever viewed pornography? or a playboy magazine? or forget all of that even - have you ever seen an attractive woman, and thought to yourself about how she had nice breasts, or a nice ass, or nice legs?

the music that talks about that stuff is just speaking out on what REALLY goes on in the world. and because you are a guy, who likes women, half naked women, or fully naked women, or what have you, does not mean you are degrading women, and don't respect them. you CAN call a woman a hoe, and still respect women. because some women ARE hoes. and some women DON'T deserve that respect. but just because i think ONE woman is a hoe, doesn't mean that i think that all women are hoes, and that i don't respect women. trust me, what i see in music videos has no influence what so ever on how i treat women. a woman is a person, not an object, and while as a male, i may love all the physical things that come from women, i also know that they are more than just a piece of meat for my sexual enjoyment. and just because i listen to a rapper talk about a hoe in his song doesn't mean i'm all of a sudden going to fall into some trap where i start disrespecting women.

take out all the rap music in the world, and drug dealing will still exist. gang banging will still exist. abuse towards women will still exist. poverty will still exist. murder will still exist.

these things are a part of our world, whether we like it or not. but, instead of living in a bubble and pretending everything is fine and there are no problems in the world, rap artists talk about the world that they live in, and the world that they come from. and while yes, there is a sense of negativity in the lyrics of rap music, most of the negative comes from pure entertainment. but the real quest of these artists is to send a message that things DO need to change, and that while this is the way the world is, there needs to be another way. and that is why, yes, those songs from 2pac, or bone thugs, or whoever, are enough to balance out the negative songs by these artists. because these POSITIVE songs are what the artists are truly trying to say in their music.

just because you say you are black doesn't make you some kind of expert on the message behind rap music. you obviously DO just skim through it, and don't pay attention to the music, and the lyrics, and the message.

i'm not saying rap music has -no- influence. but it is also not some kind of venom, poisoning the minds of black youth. the truth lies somewhere in the middle. and that middle is that these things that rap music depicts would happen whether or not rap music spoke on these topics. rap music didn't make these things happen. what rap music does, is speak on subjects that actually exist in this world, subjects that these artists have experienced 1st hand in their own lives. this is what they know. so through their music, their art (and yes, it IS art, whether you like it or not), they express those experiences. artists of ALL eras speak out on their experiences, and what they know, and what they feel and believe. this is hip hop's version of that, and it is no more corrupting than anything else in entertainment. because while music and entertainment DOES have it's impact and influence, it is an influence that can easily be swayed by a little something called "parenting", something that people don't seem to understand the concept of anymore.
 
^Post of the Week material...Actually, I haven't seen you around for some time now, Nell!

-TNC
 

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