The Dark Knight Joker Scars: Accidental; self inflicted?

[gwynplaine]

I think the line "Whatever doesn't kill you simply makes you stranger" implies accidental. Something terrible happened to the Joker, and he survived it, having become "stranger" because of it.

Because, otherwise, wouldn't it imply that he attempted to kill himself?

Interesting point.

 

[Sandouras]

I really think this is what happened. Look at the Joker's face in pictures, and this is especially obvious in that first shot that was ever released. One side of his face is mangled, while the other looks like it was done on purpose.

You must be a coroner!

 

[Psycho Clown]

Aren't you all forgeting that The Joker clearly states "I believe whatever doesn't kill you simply makes you." in the prologue before removing his mask and showing his scarred face to the bank manager. Also Chelsea Smiles are most comonly the result of hooliganism where people are jumped by street thugs.

 

[The Shape]

I think the line "Whatever doesn't kill you simply makes you stranger" implies accidental. Something terrible happened to the Joker, and he survived it, having become "stranger" because of it.

Because, otherwise, wouldn't it imply that he attempted to kill himself?

True, but that could still fit into the half-accidental, half-on-purpose theory. The Joker goes through some sort of experience and comes out of it scarred on one side of his face, but the experience really put him over the edge, and he completes the scar to form a smile, almost like a sick joke.

 

[Nepenthes]

Batman freaking out is not the huge problem I had, Batman calling a hitman is though. It seems like he felt he could not solve the problem, so he calls a hitman to fix everything; is batman going to do that everything he is confused now

I think the point of that was to show Batman's self-doubt and undefined priniciples in his formative years. That Batmans involvement with jokers birth helped shape his current principls today in taking complete control and responsibilty over everything. You can look at it the same way some choose to view Batman in BB, letting Ras die on the train. It's still early days and he doesn't really know what he's doing. And he's paying for what he did. I don't totally agree with the hitman thing but I think thats what was intended. It's a great thought but maybe a hitman wasn't the best way to convey it. That said, it's clearly a very desperate move and it showed how demoralised Bruce felt by this Joker. Joker bought him down to a degenerate level - once, but never again.

 

[gwynplaine]

If we get the origins of the Joker's scarred smile I guess It would have to be in a flashback which I don't think we'll get in TDK.
Harvey is the tragic "Phantom of the opera" figure in the movie not the Joker who as stated by Nolan is an "absolute" (no grey just shades of purple or something). But then again I might be wrongt: .

 

[Crook]

True, but that could still fit into the half-accidental, half-on-purpose theory. The Joker goes through some sort of experience and comes out of it scarred on one side of his face, but the experience really put him over the edge, and he completes the scar to form a smile, almost like a sick joke.

I thought this was all pretty much common knowledge, judging from the Wizard interview with the make-up artist, and the various angles we've seen of Joker's face.

 

[Beanjuice]

but it said in the wizard interview that he is responsible for most of the scarring

 

[Crook]

That's not what I remember reading. I'm pretty sure she (the makeup artist) let it slip out that Joker carved out the rest of his smile.

 

[Nepenthes]

The cause of the scars won't be shown. It's doesnt need to be, it's obvious already.

 

[Sandouras]

The cause of the scars won't be shown. It's doesnt need to be, it's obvious already.

Exactly. Is it so important whether it was the mob, a street mugger, some teen gang or the power rangers? No.
And clearly he seems like a tormented man by the "stranger" line. So i think that him inflicting it on himself one way or the other is far fetched. The Shape came with the 50-50 idea, which frankly is based on nothing besides his fiction (no offense) and now only sees it. I could equally argue about another far fetched idea and defend it thoughout this thread.

Point is, as Nepenthes says, lets keep it simple. Some dude/gang whatever tortured this man. End of story. Imagining Darkseid coming down on earth and doing it isnt necessary nor does it enhance the experience.

 

[Mr. Credible]

True, but that could still fit into the half-accidental, half-on-purpose theory. The Joker goes through some sort of experience and comes out of it scarred on one side of his face, but the experience really put him over the edge, and he completes the scar to form a smile, almost like a sick joke.

i like that idea... it sounds very plausible.

 

[Marx]

Exactly. Is it so important whether it was the mob, a street mugger, some teen gang or the power rangers? No.
And clearly he seems like a tormented man by the "stranger" line. So i think that him inflicting it on himself one way or the other is far fetched. The Shape came with the 50-50 idea, which frankly is based on nothing besides his fiction (no offense) and now only sees it. I could equally argue about another far fetched idea and defend it thoughout this thread.

Point is, as Nepenthes says, lets keep it simple. Some dude/gang whatever tortured this man. End of story. Imagining Darkseid coming down on earth and doing it isnt necessary nor does it enhance the experience.

The Power Rangers huh? I don't think all of them together could take Joker!

 

[Seditionary]

I've noticed that one side of his face is kinda curled and the other is straight. I think

 

[Marx]

I've noticed that one side of his face is kinda curled and the other is straight. I think

You're right, it's not symmetrical. Thankfully!

 

[Closerframe]

The true answer is. well never know. It may be hinted what happen, but Nolan will leave it up to the audience to make their own conclusions.

 

[Thythoutrust]

It's obviously self inflicted...
It's crazy, it's brand new....hey it's the joker.
He has an eternal smile.
They won't even tell us.

 

[Thythoutrust]

You're right, it's not symmetrical. Thankfully!

Well, I don't think that if you'd cut your cheeks in half you'd take the time to make them symmetrical.

 

[BillLoomis]

Aren't you all forgeting that The Joker clearly states "I believe whatever doesn't kill you simply makes you." in the prologue before removing his mask and showing his scarred face to the bank manager. Also Chelsea Smiles are most comonly the result of hooliganism where people are jumped by street thugs.

Wow, nice point. I had no clue what a "Chelsea" grin was. For all else who are wondering...here ya go. Also known as a "Glasgow Smile."

"A Glasgow smile (also known as a Chelsea grin or Chelsea Smile) is a nickname for the practice of cutting a victim's face from the edges of the mouth to the ears: the cut - or its scars - form an "extension" of what resembles a smile. Sometimes to further hurt or even kill the victim, he or she would then be stabbed or kicked, most notably in the stomach (or in case of kicking, the groin), so that the face would be ripped apart when the victim screamed. The practice originated in the Scottish city of Glasgow, which gave it its name. It also became popular in Chelsea, London (where it is known as a "Chelsea grin") and other areas of Britain, for gangs hoping to leave a message to rival gang members" -wikipedia

 

[Marx]

Well, I don't think that if you'd cut your cheeks in half you'd take the time to make them symmetrical.

You're right

 

[gwynplaine]

I hope we see some Chelsea grins and I hope they look better than the ones on Nip/Tuck.t:

 

[Tracales]

I think about the theory of the suicide...maybe the joker was an atormented man (for unknown causes) who try to kill himself putting a gun in his mouth and, for any cause he miss the shot and the bullet destroy a half of his mouth making the "accidental" half smile. Then he turns insane and forgot the idea of suicide and sadness to rebirth in a new crazy mind (remember the killing joke??). Then he complete his smile cutting the other size of face and finale create the joker. Well...it's only my deduction xD sorry for my poor english

 

[gwynplaine]

I think about the theory of the suicide...maybe the joker was an atormented man (for unknown causes) who try to kill himself putting a gun in his mouth and, for any cause he miss the shot and the bullet destroy a half of his mouth making the "accidental" half smile. Then he turns insane and forgot the idea of suicide and sadness to rebirth in a new crazy mind (remember the killing joke??). Then he complete his smile cutting the other size of face and finale create the joker. Well...it's only my deduction xD sorry for my poor english

Interesting theory and welcome to the Hype.

 

[carltio x]

what is the zipline theory????

 

[Drz]

I believe that that the scars are accidental just as him dropping (or well, wasn't it in some comics that he jumped to the chemicals to swim for freedom or did he trip because he got spooked out of Batman) and that created the Joker. I believe the "whatever doesn't kill you makes you a stranger" is somewhat a hint, and when he became this stranger he got the idea of an Joker clown and yeah.