Movies that were so popular by being likes and talked about that you got sick of...

[Solidus]

I'm not going to go all the way back to what Ace started to say but I will share my thoughts on it which Carmine already said some of what I think.

First there is no such thing as a perfect movie, without flaws, it just does not exist. That and perfect is in the eye of the beholder, not some objective standard.

TDK is considered by many, to be a masterpiece, it shook the ground when it came down, and critics/the film industry/the general public loved it.

Now as for the rest its your opinion. You don't like the fight scenes, I've many times disagreed with you on this, just recently on the "Inception" thread. First talking about the Keysi fighting method, where it is primarly nothing but elbows, and knees, and it truly is one of the more deadly fighting methods out there, period. And that is why Nolan went with this fighting method.

And I agree there are some parts that are not perfect and do seem slightly choreographed, trust me lol, I'm not blind. But for the most part it does not fail to do so IMO. The great thing about TDK, is that the action may have its flaws, but it makes up for it, and to me and many is considered one of the all time greats not because the action is perfect, but due to the fact that you become so attached to the characters, and the story and movie to a whole its more about the emotion of everything then the action itself. Like one of the most exhilarating action moments to me was int he Penthouse, not because it was perfectly choreographed, but the build up with the Joker's speech, and the fear of Rachael dying and so forth, you really felt attached to the whole situation.

But like I said to Max earlier, there is nothing wrong with you not liking it. But first, don't ever claim that any movie is perfect, cuz that will never be true lol. Yet, like I told him about Halo. I hate Halo, I hate the 360, I hate Gears of War, they are to me the most over rated, pieces of garbage I've ever seen, and I've been gaming for 22 years. Yet I do accept I'm in a giant minority. Halo I thought would come and go, but it clearly is some franchise that will be here to stay. Now these are not the best examples, there are some other films that I know I'm in the minority of disliking. It happens. The majority do see TDK as a classic, but if you don't, no biggie, but it is clear it hit a nerve with people worldwide.

PS. I thought it was one of the greatest films ever lol. I thought it was closer to being a "graphic novel" then any of the others. But to eaches own.

I have a feeling this thread will shut down soon, and maybe it should lol.

 

[Solidus]

Many people have been saying its up there in a short time. One things for sure, its definetly one of the best films this decade, probably in the top 5-10. And when you look at like that, sure I think you could put it somewhere in a 100 best films catergory, and many have.

Just in terms of scope, character study, debate, iconic performance and reinvention of a genre, I think it qualifies. Its not that crazy of a notion, especially when critical experts who have tons of films have echoed similar statements.

I get that people cant shake the notion that a comic book film should ever be in that list, but I think this was something geninely speacial.

And with that, I dont think I can say Im sick and tired of it

Everything but the last line I agree with. I think some people just feel that a comic movie can't be in the ranks of all time greats. I think most people think that any film released in the internet era can't be great because there are always people hating on something, and sometimes trying to act as a majority, then others try to fit into that mold.

But I truly see it as one of the all time greats, and I've been a avid film goer for quite some time.

 

[Super_Ludacris]

Everything but the last line I agree with. I think some people just feel that a comic movie can't be in the ranks of all time greats. I think most people think that any film released in the internet era can't be great because there are always people hating on something, and sometimes trying to act as a majority, then others try to fit into that mold.

But I truly see it as one of the all time greats, and I've been a avid film goer for quite some time.

Oh man lol I couldnt agree with you more about the internet and people hating/stanning on things and people without rational thought (being a Krisitn Kreuk fan I know)

But isnt that the wonderful thing about the Dark Knight? (Not to sound like Tony Kornheiser) It was the one movie that united many people in liking it, and its popularity transcended the online hype (which is something Batman Begins probably couldnt do)

I think its definetly one of the great films of all time, I just dont feel that personal attachment to it like a did Batman Begins but thats not the movie's fault, I think it goes back to the "Your band" mentality that people have with films. You root for a franchise for so long and once its achieved its success you're like "eh my work is done, Im good." lol

 

[Laderlappen]

Many people have been saying its up there in a short time. One things for sure, its definetly one of the best films this decade, probably in the top 5-10. And when you look at like that, sure I think you could put it somewhere in a 100 best films catergory, and many have.

Just in terms of scope, character study, debate, iconic performance and reinvention of a genre, I think it qualifies. Its not that crazy of a notion, especially when critical experts who have tons of films have echoed similar statements.

I get that people cant shake the notion that a comic book film should ever be in that list, but I think this was something geninely speacial.

And with that, I dont think I can say Im sick and tired of it

If you say top 100 then I can say 'thats reasonable' though its not on my personal top 100 list. It has nothing to do with being a comicbook movie to me.

 

[Solidus]

If you say top 100 then I can say 'thats reasonable' though its not on my personal top 100 list. It has nothing to do with being a comicbook movie to me.

I think even Empire magazine put TDK up in their top 20. I can't remember what mag it was, but there was one that put it pretty high up. And there is nothing wrong with that, and as time goes on, I think it clearly will. It's in my top 3 lol. But I truly think as time goes on, it did do something different, and transcended genres, and helped make some people look at comic films differently.

But like I said, to each person's own.

Now I'm not saying this with you, I'm going off on a different topic, but sometimes I think that the majority of the hate comes from people that are not Bat fans, and some of them I think are jealous of all the popularity and praise that Batman received, and their favorite super hero did not. I've noticed that a lot on the forums.

 

[The Joker]

The Pirates of the Carribean movies.

I don't see what the big deal about them is.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Now as for the rest its your opinion. You don't like the fight scenes, I've many times disagreed with you on this, just recently on the "Inception" thread. First talking about the Keysi fighting method, where it is primarly nothing but elbows, and knees, and it truly is one of the more deadly fighting methods out there, period. And that is why Nolan went with this fighting method.

And I agree there are some parts that are not perfect and do seem slightly choreographed, trust me lol, I'm not blind. But for the most part it does not fail to do so IMO. The great thing about TDK, is that the action may have its flaws, but it makes up for it, and to me and many is considered one of the all time greats not because the action is perfect, but due to the fact that you become so attached to the characters, and the story and movie to a whole its more about the emotion of everything then the action itself. Like one of the most exhilarating action moments to me was int he Penthouse, not because it was perfectly choreographed, but the build up with the Joker's speech, and the fear of Rachael dying and so forth, you really felt attached to the whole situation.

Batman shouldn't have ONE fighting style. He is a master of various different martial arts.

And there was no knees used at all in his fights in TDK.

And people standing around WAITING to be punched. People falling down BEFORE being punched. You say everything else makes up for it? Maybe so. But a film about a master martial artist, the fights should be the STRONG point. Not the weakness.

A film about "the worlds greatest detective" but not having any real detective work? C'mon. And don't anyone dare mention that pathetic bullet thing. Last time I checked bullets have casings. How the **** can you get finger prints off a bullet?

Batman Forever had better detective work/use of Bruce's intellect with the riddle solving. That is a fact.

And don't get me started on the bus coming out of the bank in a packed street and driving past the police with debris still falling off of it...

As I said TDK is a great film. But I just don't think it is a masterpiece.

Iron Man didn't have as many glaring faults as TDK did. There was no scene like the bus scene. There was no inaccuracy to the Stark character like there was with Bruce who was never shown to be a detective.

So if you can call TDK a masterpiece, I can call Iron Man a masterpiece.

 

[Solidus]

Batman shouldn't have ONE fighting style. He is a master of various different martial arts.

And there was no knees used at all in his fights in TDK.

And people standing around WAITING to be punched. People falling down BEFORE being punched. You say everything else makes up for it? Maybe so. But a film about a master martial artist, the fights should be the STRONG point. Not the weakness.

And don't get me started on the bus coming out of the bank in a packed street and driving past the police with debris still falling off of it...

As I said TDK is a great film. But I just don't think it is a masterpiece.

I agree there needs to be some improvements to the fight scenes, but there were scenes that were very well done. Mainly the chase sequence. The thing is I'm not obsessed with action, to me I noticed the flaws, but the flow, and the music, and just like I said the whole feeling made it feel above and beyond then 99.9% of action movies out there. Where there is great action, but I don't give two s***ts about the characters in the ordeal.

As for the bus thing, I just punched it in dude. The debris is completely off before the cops even pass him. And there are buses in front and behind him by the time. There are cars in front of the cops and so forth as well. The cops additionally are not looking for a school bus I'm sure, that is why the Joker so masterful planned it to do at at that time. I just put in TDK and watched that scene.....there is nothing wrong with it.

Yet for some of the other fights I agree there are some problems, but to me, they are minor, and insignificant to the overall film, they did their job to a point, just as much as the fighting scenes in Matrix Reloaded/Episode I, II and III, all had very clearly choreographed fights. It happens, but it usually does not take most people out of the action.

EDIT: You can call what ever you want a masterpiece. The point being the majority see TDK as that. And I never said you could not. But to me there were more important things wrong with Iron Man, though I loved it/owned it, its character development, and its pacing, and mainly its music was horrid. That took me out of the experience. But yes the action was not bad, but there was not a lot of human fighting, it was mainly CGI, where it is easier to make action look even better then doing it for real.

Yet again I am watching the bus scene right now....and your dead wrong, I'm looking at it. The cops are way to far back to see the debris. And even if they did, how do they know a bus crashed threw the bank? All they knew it was being robbed, a bomb could have gone off and covered the street and near by cars with debris. But get the children out of the way is how the cops would see it. But still, the cops don't see it. I'm watching it right now.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

I agree there needs to be some improvements to the fight scenes, but there were scenes that were very well done. Mainly the chase sequence. The thing is I'm not obsessed with action, to me I noticed the flaws, but the flow, and the music, and just like I said the whole feeling made it feel above and beyond then 99.9% of action movies out there. Where there is great action, but I don't give two s***ts about the characters in the ordeal.

As for the bus thing, I just punched it in dude. The debris is completely off before the cops even pass him. And there are buses in front and behind him by the time. There are cars in front of the cops and so forth as well. The cops additionally are not looking for a school bus I'm sure, that is why the Joker so masterful planned it to do at at that time. I just put in TDK and watched that scene.....there is nothing wrong with it.

Yet for some of the other fights I agree there are some problems, but to me, they are minor, and insignificant to the overall film, they did their job to a point, just as much as the fighting scenes in Matrix Reloaded/Episode I, II and III, all had very clearly choreographed fights. It happens, but it usually does not take most people out of the action.

So if you was a civilian in the street or one of those cars (and it was PACKED), you wouldn't notice a bus smashing out of a bank? And you wouldn't try to notify the police that are like, 2 seconds away? Or there wouldn't be a crowd gathered around a massive hole in the wall of the bank?

C'mon man, that was flawed. It was a great concept and shows Joker is a genius, but it was ridiculous considering the film aims for that "realism"

 

[Super_Ludacris]

The fighting was fine and it was better than B89.

 

[Super_Ludacris]

So if you was a civilian in the street or one of those cars (and it was PACKED), you wouldn't notice a bus smashing out of a bank? And you wouldn't try to notify the police that are like, 2 seconds away? C'mon man, that was flawed. It was a great concept and shows Joker is a genius, but it was ridiculous considering the film aims for that "realism"

What makes you think a Civillian didnt call the cops? By the time it exited the bank and blended in with the other school buses it was too late. I always thought that was the point *shrug*

 

[Ace of Knaves]

The fighting was fine and it was better than B89.

Egh...

People falling over before getting hit and standing around waiting to be hit is not fine. Batman throwing some guy into another guy who is about to shoot him setting the gun off in a packed out room full of civilians is not fine.

Am I imagining things?

 

[Solidus]

So if you was a civilian in the street or one of those cars (and it was PACKED), you wouldn't notice a bus smashing out of a bank? And you wouldn't try to notify the police that are like, 2 seconds away? C'mon man, that was flawed. It was a great concept and shows Joker is a genius, but it was ridiculous considering the film aims for that "realism"

Well if A you played the viral, which was not in the movie, but they found the bus soon after, the Joker ditched it quick.

And no doubts that they did notify them. But now that there are millions of buses, which one is it? Even if the stand by civilian said hey, I'm gonna call the cops...it does not happen like that. They go through dispatch, then tell the cops. And by then now the Joker is blending in with the school buses, and I'm sure ditched it way before. This is not hard to swallow. Some people I think try to dig so deep to find flaws where they do not exist. And during a crisis people do stupid things, and are sometimes in shock, that is why rarely cops like to use eye witnesses anymore because its proven, that during such events, their mind may not remember things the way they actually went down.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

What makes you think a Civillian didnt call the cops? By the time it exited the bank and blended in with the other school buses it was too late. I always thought that was the point *shrug*

Yes there is. You run up to the cop car that turns up literally 2 seconds later (with the buses still in view) and say "Hey Mr Police Officer! One of those buses just crashed out of that bank!"

 

[Super_Ludacris]

Egh...

People falling over before getting hit and standing around waiting to be hit is not fine. Batman throwing some guy into another guy who is about to shoot him setting the gun off in a packed out room full of civilians is not fine.

Am I imagining things?

Yo...

The ninja comes at Batman right? Swings around his little weapon. Stops. Batman kicks him.

It aint better fam.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Well if A you played the viral, which was not in the movie, but they found the bus soon after, the Joker ditched it quick.

And no doubts that they did notify them. But now that there are millions of buses, which one is it? Even if the stand by civilian said hey, I'm gonna call the cops...it does not happen like that. They go through dispatch, then tell the cops. And by then now the Joker is blending in with the school buses, and I'm sure ditched it way before. This is not hard to swallow. Some people I think try to dig so deep to find flaws where they do not exist. And during a crisis people do stupid things, and are sometimes in shock, that is why rarely cops like to use eye witnesses anymore because its proven, that during such events, their mind may not remember things the way they actually went down.

I'm not looking for flaws that are not there...you are blinding yourself to flaws that are there because of fanboyism.

The buses were still in view as the cop cars were rolling up. You telling me none of those civvies said to the cops "Hey, it was one of those buses...100 yards away from us!"

And how long was the bus in the bank? How long was there a gaping hole in the wall of the bank? 10, 20 minutes? So a crowd never gathered outside? "Hey there is a big hole in the wall of that bank!" "So" "Yea I see your point, nothing strange there"

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Yo...

The ninja comes at Batman right? Swings around his little weapon. Stops. Batman kicks him.

It aint better fam.

I ain't comparing. I'm just saying what I see with my own to eyes.

 

[Super_Ludacris]

Yes there is. You run up to the cop car that turns up literally 2 seconds later (with the buses still in view) and say "Hey Mr Police Officer! One of those buses just crashed out of that bank!"

This is Gotham City, what makes you think a cop car is 2 seconds in vincity of a bank with all the corruption in the unit and crime taking place as it is?

On top of that, would you really know which bus it is, after it gets over that bridge and out of sight? probably not.

 

[Solidus]

Egh...

People falling over before getting hit and standing around waiting to be hit is not fine. Batman throwing some guy into another guy who is about to shoot him setting the gun off in a packed out room full of civilians is not fine.

Am I imagining things?

No there are small flaws, but I think your making them way bigger then they are, and maybe because you don't care for the film and don't understand the majorities love for it. That's just fine.

But by the way if you think Iron Man is a masterpiece that is fine, in my post above I put an EDIT and explained more.

But even greats like Aliens, have so many freaking flaws with the action if you watch carefully, but I don't try to nitpick everything because every film has flaws. And some may find some that really bug them and thats fine. But TDK in terms of action I agree there are faults, with the bus, not at all. There have been stories of normal stand byers helping out thieves load stolen TV's into their truck. People can be stupid lol.

And lastly they are all just films. We could nit pick anything and say "I would have done this or that if that really happened to me." Maybe, or maybe not, hard to say.

 

[Super_Ludacris]

I ain't comparing. I'm just saying what I see with my own to eyes.

Im gonna give you a second to correct that or at least find the irony in the statement

 

[Ace of Knaves]

This is Gotham City, what makes you think a cop car is 2 seconds in vincity of a bank with all the corruption in the unit and crime taking place as it is?

On top of that, would you really know which bus it is, after it gets over that bridge and out of sight? probably not.

Umm...because you see the cop cars rolling up as the bus drives away.

 

[Solidus]

I'm not looking for flaws that are not there...you are blinding yourself to flaws that are there because of fanboyism.

The buses were still in view as the cop cars were rolling up. You telling me none of those civvies said to the cops "Hey, it was one of those buses...100 yards away from us!"

First off lol, I like how you get angry enough to call me a blind fanboy. Thanks, that shows me that I guess I'm hitting a nerve with you. I am a fan, but I'm not blind. I just spent the past few posts telling you how I agree the action is not the best, and there are flaws with it. Maybe your just a troll that is trying to find something to hate? If you decide to call me a fanboy maybe your just a troll hmm? Though I know your not but... I thought you were better then this, we always got along in the past, I thought we were just fine, but to call me a blind fanboy....hmmm not really cool.

When anyone is a fan of anything they may excuse more things, but not everything. And yet again. What would the cops do. First they need to secure the bank. How to the stand byers know that the thugs are using that bus? It could have just crashed in there. How to they even know its being robbed? Remember 9/11 everyone thought it was just an accident at first, until the second got hit. The cops are more worried probably about that there are fully armed thugs in the bank still for all they know. And even if the civ came up and said look they are getting away! Even if the cops said okay. They don't know which bus, they all looked the same. And by the time they got out and heard that, the buses would have all gone different ways lol. And it would be near impossible to find them. Real life is not like "24" where the cops are super awesome and run to it right away. Most of the time the cops don't stop a majority of crimes right away lol.

I don't see any problem with the bus scene because I don't see anything wrong with it, the cops don't see it, and even if the stand by person would say anything to the cops. Well it would not be like they could jump in their cars and turn around in .5 seconds flat and catch up to them. Like I said cops are probably more worried about the thugs that are known about inside. How does the by stander even know the thugs are in the bus?

But I hope your not serious about the fanboy thing cuz I respect your stuff, but now I'm a little confused by such a statement, I thought we were debating.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

No there are small flaws, but I think your making them way bigger then they are, and maybe because you don't care for the film and don't understand the majorities love for it. That's just fine.

But by the way if you think Iron Man is a masterpiece that is fine, in my post above I put an EDIT and explained more.

But even greats like Aliens, have so many freaking flaws with the action if you watch carefully, but I don't try to nitpick everything because every film has flaws. And some may find some that really bug them and thats fine. But TDK in terms of action I agree there are faults, with the bus, not at all. There have been stories of normal stand byers helping out thieves load stolen TV's into their truck. People can be stupid lol.

And lastly they are all just films. We could nit pick anything and say "I would have done this or that if that really happened to me." Maybe, or maybe not, hard to say.

Yes I am being nit picky. I could be nit picky over Iron Man and not find a glaring fault in the same mold as the bus thing.

Yes all films have flaws, but TDK fans are a breed of fans who will strenuously deny any flaw in the movie. Not saying you are, but some TDK fans are a different breed.

 

[Solidus]

Umm...because you see the cop cars rolling up as the bus drives away.

The cops are a full city block away as he pulls out, I'm watching the film right now. To double check. They just turn a corner as he pulls out. They did not see it.

And like I said I'm sure some one did report it, and they found the bus. But it was too little too late, do you think that the Joker drove around in it all day? I'm sure not, I'm sure he ditched it quickly. Why would he wait around in it?

 

[Ace of Knaves]

First off lol, I like how you get angry enough to call me a blind fanboy. Thanks, that shows me that I guess I'm hitting a nerve with you. I am a fan, but I'm not blind. I just spent the past few posts telling you how I agree the action is not the best, and there are flaws with it. Maybe your just a troll that is trying to find something to hate? If you decide to call me a fanboy maybe your just a troll hmm? I thought you were better then this, we always got along in the past, I thought we were just fine, but to call me a blind fanboy....hmmm not really cool.

When anyone is a fan of anything they may excuse more things, but not everything. And yet again. What would the cops do. First they need to secure the bank. How to the stand byers know that the thugs are using that bus? It could have just crashed in there. How to they even know its being robbed? Remember 9/11 everyone thought it was just an accident at first, until the second got hit. The cops are more worried probably about that there are fully armed thugs in the bank still for all they know. And even if the civ came up and said look they are getting away! Even if the cops said okay. They don't know which bus, they all looked the same. And by the time they got out and heard that, the buses would have all gone different ways lol. And it would be near impossible to find them. Real life is not like "24" where the cops are super awesome and run to it right away. Most of the time the cops don't stop a majority of crimes right away lol.

I don't see any problem with the bus scene because I don't see anything wrong with it, the cops don't see it, and even if the stand by person would say anything to the cops. Well it would not be like they could jump in their cars and turn around in .5 seconds flat and catch up to them. Like I said cops are probably more worried about the thugs that are known about inside. How does the by stander even know the thugs are in the bus?

But I hope your not serious about the fanboy thing cuz I respect your stuff, but now I'm a little confused by such a statement, I thought we were debating.

I apologize for the fanboy thing, got a little heated. But as you will see in my previous post, I believe some TDK fans are a different breed of fans. Not saying you are, but they are.

This is probably THE main reason for the recent TDK backlash. Because these, "fans" are ****ing obsessive and annoying, on par with Twilight fans. There is a reason why so many people avoid the Bat boards. Granted it ain't that bad now. But when the next movie starts production, it will all start up again.

But as I've said I'm not on a TDK backlash tip, I'm just pointing out what I genuinely believe are flaws and why I don't think it should be called a masterpiece. And also as I've said, I do think TDK is a great film. But it is not the holy be all and end all like some people like to believe.