Season 2 Spoilers And Speculation

[The Rose]

Is there another episode premiereing today, or no?

It's meant to be on weekdays, if I remember right.

 

[smpinoy]

Does it mean weekdays pacific time...we will be getting the last 3 episodes

 

[MasterGandalf]

After watching the Gang War arc, I've become convinced that Norman Osborn is the real Big Bad of TSSM, and has been all along (and not just because of his place in the Spidey mythos). If you look at things from the beginning, he's been an important player in every arc except for the Venom ones (and he may have set that off inadvertantly- I think there's a pretty good chance he was the 'captain of industry' Black Cat was working for).

Let's examine things:

Arc 1- Lizard: Norman's only in the first episode, but he's introduced early on, along with his family situation, less than ethical work practices, and connection to both Peter and Spidey. There's a reason for this, I'm quite certain, and not just because he's an important villain in the source material.

Arc 2- Supervillains: Norman gets in with the mob for the first time creating supervillains for them. I'm guessing he tastes real underworld power here, and decides he wants some, which sets up the next arc.

Arc 3- Green Goblin: When the Goblin is revealed as Harry, Norman's dialogue with Spidey doesn't check out. He said he was trying to extract himself from the Big Man's operation, but just last episode he was still buddies with Hammerhead, and is still working closely with the mob in season two. As a result, Harry's motivation for becoming the Goblin is suspect- unless Norman put him up to it, possibly without Harry's knowledge. It would be easy enough to arrange for Harry (who really wants to be an athlete) to get his hands on the Green, and in at least one continuity (Ultimate) Norman has used hypnotherapy on Harry to get him to do what he wants- he could very well be doing the same here. Also, while Harry's not dumb, he never shows the subtle brilliance that characterizes Gobby's schemes- a sign that the plans aren't actually coming from Harry, but from someone a bit more intelligent.

Arc 4- Venom: Norman's layng low in this one, his plans involving the Goblin being derailed by Harry's failure.

Arc 5- Master Planner: Norman's back in town, and has inserted his man (Miles Warren) into the ESU labs, probably so he can capitalize on Dr. Connors' research for his own ends. He's also either figured out the Peter is Spidey or that there's a connection, hence his sudden interest in mentoring Pete. Also, there's another player for him to deal with in the 'control the underworld' front- Doc Ock.

Arc 6- Venom II: Norman sits this one out.

Arc 7- Gang War: A clear sign that Norman and Goblin are at least on the same page, here- Norman starts the job of turning Hammerhead against Tombstone, and Gobby finishes it. Norman plays all his msot dangerous rivals against each other, and resulting in Ock and Silvermane being jailed, Tombstone is discredited, and the most powerful presence left in the underworld is Hammerhead- not terribly bright and easily manipulated. Also note Norman's line to Hammerhead about masks, a hint that he definately knows what Harry's up to as the Goblin, and may have him under direct control.

Arc 8- Goblin II: Haven't seen this one yet (obviously), but it seems like the Goblin is going to be trying to consolidate the gangs under his leadership- nature abhors a vacuum and all that. Also, spoilers indicate that the Goblin's true identity will be revealed, which makes no sense at first, as the Goblin was revealed as Harry last season. So either this means that the identity of whoever's controlling Gobby will be revealed, or there will be a different Green Goblin- namely, Norman has decided that the time for an expendable pawn causing chaos is past, and it's time to wear the green tights himself for a full power-grab. If he hasn't figured out the Spider-man=Peter Parker already, he probably will in this arc, and make use of that knowledge.

In any case, I think we've been seeing rather a lot of Norman and his plotting for a reason, and that this final arc will be his bid for all-out control of the underworld, the culmination of two seasons worth of schemes. It's a bit convoluted, but then this is from the writer who gave the world David Xanatos. Whatever happens, I trust that Weisman and co. have created a strong storyline, and I'm very much looking forward to its conclusion.

 

[SpaceWay2009]

After watching the Gang War arc, I've become convinced that Norman Osborn is the real Big Bad of TSSM, and has been all along (and not just because of his place in the Spidey mythos). If you look at things from the beginning, he's been an important player in every arc except for the Venom ones (and he may have set that off inadvertantly- I think there's a pretty good chance he was the 'captain of industry' Black Cat was working for).

Let's examine things:

Arc 1- Lizard: Norman's only in the first episode, but he's introduced early on, along with his family situation, less than ethical work practices, and connection to both Peter and Spidey. There's a reason for this, I'm quite certain, and not just because he's an important villain in the source material.

Arc 2- Supervillains: Norman gets in with the mob for the first time creating supervillains for them. I'm guessing he tastes real underworld power here, and decides he wants some, which sets up the next arc.

Arc 3- Green Goblin: When the Goblin is revealed as Harry, Norman's dialogue with Spidey doesn't check out. He said he was trying to extract himself from the Big Man's operation, but just last episode he was still buddies with Hammerhead, and is still working closely with the mob in season two. As a result, Harry's motivation for becoming the Goblin is suspect- unless Norman put him up to it, possibly without Harry's knowledge. It would be easy enough to arrange for Harry (who really wants to be an athlete) to get his hands on the Green, and in at least one continuity (Ultimate) Norman has used hypnotherapy on Harry to get him to do what he wants- he could very well be doing the same here. Also, while Harry's not dumb, he never shows the subtle brilliance that characterizes Gobby's schemes- a sign that the plans aren't actually coming from Harry, but from someone a bit more intelligent.

Arc 4- Venom: Norman's layng low in this one, his plans involving the Goblin being derailed by Harry's failure.

Arc 5- Master Planner: Norman's back in town, and has inserted his man (Miles Warren) into the ESU labs, probably so he can capitalize on Dr. Connors' research for his own ends. He's also either figured out the Peter is Spidey or that there's a connection, hence his sudden interest in mentoring Pete. Also, there's another player for him to deal with in the 'control the underworld' front- Doc Ock.

Arc 6- Venom II: Norman sits this one out.

Arc 7- Gang War: A clear sign that Norman and Goblin are at least on the same page, here- Norman starts the job of turning Hammerhead against Tombstone, and Gobby finishes it. Norman plays all his msot dangerous rivals against each other, and resulting in Ock and Silvermane being jailed, Tombstone is discredited, and the most powerful presence left in the underworld is Hammerhead- not terribly bright and easily manipulated. Also note Norman's line to Hammerhead about masks, a hint that he definately knows what Harry's up to as the Goblin, and may have him under direct control.

Arc 8- Goblin II: Haven't seen this one yet (obviously), but it seems like the Goblin is going to be trying to consolidate the gangs under his leadership- nature abhors a vacuum and all that. Also, spoilers indicate that the Goblin's true identity will be revealed, which makes no sense at first, as the Goblin was revealed as Harry last season. So either this means that the identity of whoever's controlling Gobby will be revealed, or there will be a different Green Goblin- namely, Norman has decided that the time for an expendable pawn causing chaos is past, and it's time to wear the green tights himself for a full power-grab. If he hasn't figured out the Spider-man=Peter Parker already, he probably will in this arc, and make use of that knowledge.

In any case, I think we've been seeing rather a lot of Norman and his plotting for a reason, and that this final arc will be his bid for all-out control of the underworld, the culmination of two seasons worth of schemes. It's a bit convoluted, but then this is from the writer who gave the world David Xanatos. Whatever happens, I trust that Weisman and co. have created a strong storyline, and I'm very much looking forward to its conclusion.

Well said, MasterGandalf. You make some valid points about the Green Goblin.

 

[Webhead2006]

very possible.

 

[sauronthegreat]

After watching the Gang War arc, I've become convinced that Norman Osborn is the real Big Bad of TSSM, and has been all along (and not just because of his place in the Spidey mythos). If you look at things from the beginning, he's been an important player in every arc except for the Venom ones (and he may have set that off inadvertantly- I think there's a pretty good chance he was the 'captain of industry' Black Cat was working for).

Let's examine things:

Arc 1- Lizard: Norman's only in the first episode, but he's introduced early on, along with his family situation, less than ethical work practices, and connection to both Peter and Spidey. There's a reason for this, I'm quite certain, and not just because he's an important villain in the source material.

Arc 2- Supervillains: Norman gets in with the mob for the first time creating supervillains for them. I'm guessing he tastes real underworld power here, and decides he wants some, which sets up the next arc.

Arc 3- Green Goblin: When the Goblin is revealed as Harry, Norman's dialogue with Spidey doesn't check out. He said he was trying to extract himself from the Big Man's operation, but just last episode he was still buddies with Hammerhead, and is still working closely with the mob in season two. As a result, Harry's motivation for becoming the Goblin is suspect- unless Norman put him up to it, possibly without Harry's knowledge. It would be easy enough to arrange for Harry (who really wants to be an athlete) to get his hands on the Green, and in at least one continuity (Ultimate) Norman has used hypnotherapy on Harry to get him to do what he wants- he could very well be doing the same here. Also, while Harry's not dumb, he never shows the subtle brilliance that characterizes Gobby's schemes- a sign that the plans aren't actually coming from Harry, but from someone a bit more intelligent.

Arc 4- Venom: Norman's layng low in this one, his plans involving the Goblin being derailed by Harry's failure.

Arc 5- Master Planner: Norman's back in town, and has inserted his man (Miles Warren) into the ESU labs, probably so he can capitalize on Dr. Connors' research for his own ends. He's also either figured out the Peter is Spidey or that there's a connection, hence his sudden interest in mentoring Pete. Also, there's another player for him to deal with in the 'control the underworld' front- Doc Ock.

Arc 6- Venom II: Norman sits this one out.

Arc 7- Gang War: A clear sign that Norman and Goblin are at least on the same page, here- Norman starts the job of turning Hammerhead against Tombstone, and Gobby finishes it. Norman plays all his msot dangerous rivals against each other, and resulting in Ock and Silvermane being jailed, Tombstone is discredited, and the most powerful presence left in the underworld is Hammerhead- not terribly bright and easily manipulated. Also note Norman's line to Hammerhead about masks, a hint that he definately knows what Harry's up to as the Goblin, and may have him under direct control.

Arc 8- Goblin II: Haven't seen this one yet (obviously), but it seems like the Goblin is going to be trying to consolidate the gangs under his leadership- nature abhors a vacuum and all that. Also, spoilers indicate that the Goblin's true identity will be revealed, which makes no sense at first, as the Goblin was revealed as Harry last season. So either this means that the identity of whoever's controlling Gobby will be revealed, or there will be a different Green Goblin- namely, Norman has decided that the time for an expendable pawn causing chaos is past, and it's time to wear the green tights himself for a full power-grab. If he hasn't figured out the Spider-man=Peter Parker already, he probably will in this arc, and make use of that knowledge.

In any case, I think we've been seeing rather a lot of Norman and his plotting for a reason, and that this final arc will be his bid for all-out control of the underworld, the culmination of two seasons worth of schemes. It's a bit convoluted, but then this is from the writer who gave the world David Xanatos. Whatever happens, I trust that Weisman and co. have created a strong storyline, and I'm very much looking forward to its conclusion.

Great observations MasterGandalf, and this comes from SauronTheGreat

I especially like your theory about Norman's involvement with the Black Cat, I didn't think about it at all, and always wondered who might that be.

Then again, there is another mystery, why Norman decided to enter Oscorp by the front entrance, and he never did before, the night the Goblin steals Oscorp's tech, while that same Norman was downloading some files. Not to mention Goblin's reaction when he saw Norman.

And then, in the next episode we see Chameleon wearing Norman's face. I am convinced that Chameleon had something to do with that whole plot. For whom he worked (maybe for Kingsley, maybe Norman himself, maybe the Big Man, or even Silvermane... maybe someone we didn't even meet), and what did he want we don't know, but we know that he wasn't caught at all.

And judging by last episode's final confrontation between Spidey and the Big Man this season somehow ties the lose ends. I hope this mystery gets resolved in the upcoming episodes.

 

[MasterGandalf]

I was only guessing about Norman and Black Cat because of the symbiote- it seems like something Norman would be very interested, and how many corrupt CEOs have the scientific background to really appreciate a lump of alien ooze? It also means that, directly or indirectly, Norman has had a hand in almost every major villain in the series. Whatever happens, I am very looking forward to the resolution of the Goblin subplot, and hope we get lots of answers then about everything Norman's been scheming in.

 

[Spiderine]

Great observations MasterGandalf, and this comes from SauronTheGreat

I especially like your theory about Norman's involvement with the Black Cat, I didn't think about it at all, and always wondered who might that be.

Then again, there is another mystery, why Norman decided to enter Oscorp by the front entrance, and he never did before, the night the Goblin steals Oscorp's tech, while that same Norman was downloading some files. Not to mention Goblin's reaction when he saw Norman.

And then, in the next episode we see Chameleon wearing Norman's face. I am convinced that Chameleon had something to do with that whole plot. For whom he worked (maybe for Kingsley, maybe Norman himself, maybe the Big Man, or even Silvermane... maybe someone we didn't even meet), and what did he want we don't know, but we know that he wasn't caught at all.

And judging by last episode's final confrontation between Spidey and the Big Man this season somehow ties the lose ends. I hope this mystery gets resolved in the upcoming episodes.

Thank you. Great observation, I have been thinking about Chameleon since that whole arc. Nice to see someone else remember that. Chameleon was also confirmed for this season and apparently the one villain that has not shown up. And he is still roaming the streets.

 

[sauronthegreat]

It's a good guess.

Norman is definitely a mastermind here. And that's the best thing about the show. Where we have all kinds of different characters/villains. While in TAS from the 90's there was Kingpin and only Kingpin as a main villain and all other supervillains were his henchmen. Here we have Tombstone who represent the underworld, Norman who is a mastermind and and always appears differently than he represents himself, Octopus leading the super-powered and a Master Planner, and Jameson whose hate for Spidey is yet to rich that point when the Scorpion and Spider Slayers will be created.

 

[anarchistguy]

Is it just me or did Osborne in the '90s cartoon seem a bit too nice, or is it that THIS Osborne is extremely evil?

 

[sauronthegreat]

Thank you. Great observation, I have been thinking about Chameleon since that whole arc. Nice to see someone else remember that. Chameleon was also confirmed for this season and apparently the one villain that has not shown up. And he is still roaming the streets.

And by my guess the most ideal time for him to strike will be in Opening Night. Maybe he is the one that lock's Spidey in the Vault with all other villains Spidey has captured. I am also expecting Mysterio to have a bigger role there.

 

[SpaceWay2009]

Yeah, I agree. In STAS, there was only one bad villain: Kingpin.

Here, we have so much more villains to explore.

Norman is like the Kingpin in this show. He's involved with almost everything. Peter's life, underworld, super-villains...

 

[Spiderine]

And by my guess the most ideal time for him to strike will be in Opening Night. Maybe he is the one that lock's Spidey in the Vault with all other villains Spidey has captured. I am also expecting Mysterio to have a bigger role there.

I like your way of thinking. You may be on to something. They may reveal his connection with this entire plot as well.

 

[sauronthegreat]

I like your way of thinking. You may be on to something. They may reveal his connection with this entire plot as well.

Thank you. In three days we'll know eventually... and then comes the long wait for next season's commission.

 

[Spiderine]

It would be a travesty not to renew this show. So many storylines and villains to see adapted. And this production team has done a marvelous job with this show.

 

[sauronthegreat]

I suppose Disney will renew this show for one more season for sure... they would have not taken it and advertise it, and show the whole first season if they are not planning on continuing it. I think that it will get a third season for sure, and then it will be examined if it is profitable to continue it for the fourth and fifth seasons. It's too early to cancel it, and by now there aren't any real negative responses for this show, I just hear positive reaction.

 

[Webhead2006]

well even great shows could just end out of the blue.

 

[SpaceWay2009]

Season three only gets commissioned if the rating does well in the US, right? It doesn't matter how popular/good the show is in Canada, Bulgaria, or Australia.

Yeah, I think so, too. I'm sure there will be a season three. If there is, I hope all of the production members will return.

 

[Webhead2006]

yea i hope if they get the call soon everyone can return or are able to work on both ssm and what other productions they have moved on to. That as i said is reason i would like the call to have come already since we know everyone was laid off months ago and the longer its not picked up the harder it is to get everyone back. I really dont want to see someone else come in and take charge of the show and it wouldnt have the same quality as Greg W and his crew.

 

[Rincewind]

What I hope is that if there is a Season 3, we do not wait till 2010...

 

[carnage899]

^well if season 3 is confirmed in the summer (when season 2 is airing in US) then probably january or fabruary 2010 will be the earliest for us to see it.

 

[Webhead2006]

yea it would likely be airing early 2010 because it takes a few months for scripts to get handed him, then the animation work to be done and sent back to cali for final touch ups. The quickest thing for the show is voice work which could be done in a matter of a few weeks if they have all the scripts in.

 

[SpideyTheBest]

I have a feeling that Hobie Brown might speak in the last episode of this season.

 

[The Flea]

Anyone excited about the vault episode?
- We have Rhino, Doc, Silvermane, Ox, Fancy Dan, Montana, and Mysterio all at Rykers
- John, Electro and Brock are all at Ravencoft.

Since Rhino is the only one who would have his super powers, I wonder if Goblin gives all the inmates back their stuff (empowering suits & batteries/tentacles)...or if we will just see them powerless ganging up with other mooks against spidey (w cameo villains, of coruse!)

 

[carnage899]

it will be somehow cool to see them battle Spidey not as villains but as people. and Rhino isnt the only one who would have his super powers - Electro's there and Ock too.