Shutter Island

[Solidus]

Can you guys elaborate on these points further, specifically with how the movie is presented? I get the obvious part with Teddy's perspective being messed with throughout the entire movie, but it seems you've both taken that further as a sociopolitical commentary of sorts. To be honest, I just did not get that at all. Not to undermine the many layers this film has, but I think this particular point is analyzing the film a bit too much. At best, this was a psychological deconstruction of Teddy, and we were simply along for the ride...at a certain point.

I don't think it is looking to deep at all. A few of my friends, not all of them of course kinda came to the same conclusion though I know that argument is a moot one using ones "friends" as support.

To me the way I "felt" through out the film really was where I saw more of the depth, and how I felt watching certain images and scenes.

Spoiler

Like I said earlier. The whole thing of the movie is Teddy is living in such a complex lie so he does not have to face reality. Right away most people got the "twist" if we wish to call it that. And I right away was like "he's crazy and its in his mind" kind of thing. So he made up this complex reason not to face reality. Yet the reality was simple. The twist itself was simple. But through out the film I kept thinking....no its gotta be more, it can't be that simple. It can't be just that he's a nut job. It can't. So I started to through out the film wonder maybe he's not crazy, maybe the conspiracy is all true.

So in a sense you are brought into the character in such a deep way *to me anyways and an emotional one* You don't want the simple clearly obvious answer like Teddy's reality. You too want to believe the nutty crazy conspiracy. Then when he is talking to Dr. Rachael down in the cave. That is where the sociopolitical stuff really got to me. What is insane? As she said, everyone has something in their past that can be easily linked to you being "insane" and so they can just grab anyone, and if they were labeled insane, you (and most doctors do it this way) work backwards. Find whats wrong with them, then go backwards. So they can go back in anyone's life (even mine) and say he's had a tragic experience that is what made him crazy, hence my theory of him being crazy is right, he's insane. So in reality is our system actually a good one? Maybe we all are insane. In a sense I think that is brought up in an emotional way. I did not want Teddy to be insane. I wanted this crazy conspiracy to be right. But sadly (maybe) it was not. So in a way it kinda feels like most people probably do feel, no one wants to be labeled insane, because we all could easily end up like Teddy. To me it treads in the waters some don't like to wade in.

Yet again this was my view of it, I've heard others on the forum think the same thing. Does not mean we are right, nor wrong. I just think some will take this interpretation and maybe have some emotional connection while watching the film who knows? But to me it many depths that hit me while I watched the film.

 

[Crook]

Spoiler

Like I said earlier. The whole thing of the movie is Teddy is living in such a complex lie so he does not have to face reality. Right away most people got the "twist" if we wish to call it that. And I right away was like "he's crazy and its in his mind" kind of thing. So he made up this complex reason not to face reality. Yet the reality was simple. The twist itself was simple. But through out the film I kept thinking....no its gotta be more, it can't be that simple. It can't be just that he's a nut job. It can't.

You're right in one way. It can't simply be that, because Scorsese would be taking a huge misstep in presenting a story [blackout](that being nothing is real, and thus of no significance)[/blackout]. But there was more to it, which nicely wraps up the entire film. It's weird how people talk about the twist, but fail to integrate the "other" twist [BLACKOUT](investigative role-play)[/BLACKOUT] that is essential to how all the events play out in the first place.

So I started to through out the film wonder maybe he's not crazy, maybe the conspiracy is all true.

So in a sense you are brought into the character in such a deep way *to me anyways and an emotional one* You don't want the simple clearly obvious answer like Teddy's reality. You too want to believe the nutty crazy conspiracy. Then when he is talking to Dr. Rachael down in the cave. That is where the sociopolitical stuff really got to me. What is insane? As she said, everyone has something in their past that can be easily linked to you being "insane" and so they can just grab anyone, and if they were labeled insane, you (and most doctors do it this way) work backwards. Find whats wrong with them, then go backwards. So they can go back in anyone's life (even mine) and say he's had a tragic experience that is what made him crazy, hence my theory of him being crazy is right, he's insane.

[BLACKOUT]I get that, but it was all a defense mechanism to cover up an entirely traumatic event. A lie to cover another lie, and so forth[/BLACKOUT]. The logic is sound, in the same way that many of the Joker's concept of society is "reasonable" under a certain light. But under the circumstances to which the character's motives are brought into play, it doesn't seem so right any more. [BLACKOUT]Teddy was wrong in every sense of the word. He even admitted it.[/BLACKOUT]

So in reality is our system actually a good one? Maybe we all are insane.

What system are you referring to, exactly? Our psychological institutions? Because that is one mighty radical claim to put forth. I'm not sure where you're getting these implications of shared insanity. The conspiracy theory is closely related to the incident. And the incident is specific to Teddy alone and cannot possibly be generalized because of it's highly improbable nature. Not to mention the fact that [BLACKOUT]Teddy. was. wrong.[/BLACKOUT]

Spoiler

In a sense I think that is brought up in an emotional way. I did not want Teddy to be insane. I wanted this crazy conspiracy to be right. But sadly (maybe) it was not. So in a way it kinda feels like most people probably do feel, no one wants to be labeled insane, because we all could easily end up like Teddy. To me it treads in the waters some don't like to wade in.

Like I said, I totally got this part of the movie. I've no doubt Scorsese intended it to be that way. But again...only up to a point (we all know what that means) for dramatic and immersive purposes. My issue with the [BLACKOUT]"he's really sane, and they tricked him" theory[/BLACKOUT] is it literally throws everything in the movie out the window. Including Teddy's introspective last words.

All the subtle cues and visual hints lead to the plain-as-day conclusion presented in the movie. That's why the movie works so damn well. It's a mystery with all the relevant pieces laid out right in front of our faces. Marty leaves it to us to figure it out as the story goes along. When you take those into account, I can't fathom how one would come to your particular interpretation without presenting a whole slew of plot holes and strange directorial misdirection.

If you can further clarify how the pieces fit your interpretation, then feel free. I'm interested. Currently, I just do not see it.

 

[-Arya-]

What system are you referring to, exactly? Our psychological institutions? Because that is one mighty radical claim to put forth. I'm not sure where you're getting these implications of shared insanity. The conspiracy theory is closely related to the incident. And the incident is specific to Teddy alone and cannot possibly be generalized because of it's highly improbable nature. Not to mention the fact that [BLACKOUT]Teddy. was. wrong.[/BLACKOUT]

I just wanted to quote this part and backup the claim that Teddy's condition is an extremely severe case and a very rare one as well.

 

[Solidus]

To Crook:

I won't quote ya cuz I don't want to worry about all the spoiler stuff.

I guess I may not be fully understanding what your trying to say. That and I may not be making myself clear at all.

Spoiler

First, yes Teddy's case was rare, and I'm not saying we are all "insane' to such a vast degree, but that we could all be labeled as such. And some of the other stuff is just many debates I've heard at school about the current state of "psychology and its institutions". On this aspect I guess I did not make myself clear.

What I was saying just over all though what is insanity? Yes what Teddy was clearly was something very extreme. But what Rachel said in the cave to him does make some points. In the fear that any of us could be considered insane to a point. Not to the Teddy degree I don't' want to say that. But the dialogue in the cave to me was something true of all of us. She said that anyone could be labeled insane in some ways. I'm not saying all ways. I hope that clears up a little of where I'm coming from. I guess I pulled more from the Rachel speech more then most. I hope that clears my position on it, its just how I saw it.

Off topic to this post maybe but I watched Alien 3 and watching Shutter Island I kinda thought of this line: " In an insane world, a sane man must appear insane."

And for the other stuff maybe I'm just too tired tonight to reply to this. Maybe some one else like Carmine that agreed with my view on it can explain it more clearly then I tonight. But don't worry Crook tomorrow I will try to respond to your post with more clarity in the mind. I just got so much work I'm doing right now I may not be explaining myself well at all.

EDIT: Okay I think I am understanding what I'm trying to say and you as well. As for the post above for the social commentary I still think is there. Though yes Teddy is insane. Like I said the Rachel speech spoke clearly to me some ideas, not necessarily aimed at Teddy but the audience over all. So I still saw that.

As for the idea of that "he was not insane". I may need to watch it again. The more I think about it that is most likely not the case that he is "sane". But my point still stays resolute that through out the film I did not want him to be insane. Even for a while even though there was many points that he was "insane" I kept thinking maybe the conspiracy is actually the twist, or there is some other twist I can't even think of right now. So in that aspect I was connected to the character and to me the conspiracy was true until the end.

I have changed some of my ideas on that "final shot" that you originally questioned me about. Sorry Crook I think I originally took your question out of context and did not get what you were asking me. Now I see that you were wondering why I thought the end meant he possibly may have been right and sane. Sorry for that misunderstanding. I have changed a little bit on that final shot and that he may have been sane. I really do have to see it again so I can soak it up more. But as for the rest of my sayings of Teddy and the emotional journey and wanting to believe his lie was how I experienced the film. And the commentary as well. But the final part of the lighthouse I think I've changed my view on that. He was insane. But at the same time, who could blame him? Again sorry for the misunderstanding of what you were fully asking me. I think I understand at least what your asking. Hopefully I gave some what of an insight of what I mean.

 

[Crook]

Spoiler

First, yes Teddy's case was rare, and I'm not saying we are all "insane' to such a vast degree, but that we could all be labeled as such. And some of the other stuff is just many debates I've heard at school about the current state of "psychology and its institutions". On this aspect I guess I did not make myself clear.

I'm asking you based on what. "Aren't we all insane?" is a very loaded question. The question as presented in the movie applies to a very drastic degree of derangement. I assume these "debates" you've heard in school don't quite reach that level of severity.

What I was saying just over all though what is insanity? Yes what Teddy was clearly was something very extreme. But what Rachel said in the cave to him does make some points. In the fear that any of us could be considered insane to a point. Not to the Teddy degree I don't' want to say that. But the dialogue in the cave to me was something true of all of us. She said that anyone could be labeled insane in some ways. I'm not saying all ways. I hope that clears up a little of where I'm coming from. I guess I pulled more from the Rachel speech more then most. I hope that clears my position on it, its just how I saw it.

I don't think you can quite go that far, because you're ignoring her precursor question; "have you had any past traumatic experiences?". It's integral to the proposed philosophy. Even so, it's an indication of susceptibility. Which isn't new, nor is it a disputed claim. For mental health or any other abnormal behaviors.

Spoiler

I have changed some of my ideas on that "final shot" that you originally questioned me about. Sorry Crook I think I originally took your question out of context and did not get what you were asking me. Now I see that you were wondering why I thought the end meant he possibly may have been right and sane. Sorry for that misunderstanding. I have changed a little bit on that final shot and that he may have been sane. I really do have to see it again so I can soak it up more. But as for the rest of my sayings of Teddy and the emotional journey and wanting to believe his lie was how I experienced the film. And the commentary as well. But the final part of the lighthouse I think I've changed my view on that. He was insane. But at the same time, who could blame him? Again sorry for the misunderstanding of what you were fully asking me. I think I understand at least what your asking. Hopefully I gave some what of an insight of what I mean.

Heh, might want to add on the "I agree" sentiment earlier on in your posts so I don't realize halfway through my typing that we're not on opposing ends anymore.

 

[Solidus]

Heh, might want to add on the "I agree" sentiment earlier on in your posts so I don't realize halfway through my typing that we're not on opposing ends anymore.

Lol, sorry my bad.

 

[Doctor Jones]

Spoiler tag some of this stuff people.

But I tend to lean in Solidus's position.

Spoiler

I was getting suspicious of Teddy's real state at the last quarter of the film. At the part when Max caught him sneaking around. But like Solidus said I too was thinking, "No, it can't be like that. It can't be that simple, there has to be more." I too wanted to believe the conspiracy theory so I could be wrong. I was invested in Teddy's journey so much Scorsese managed to twist out minds in thinking what was the truth. But it's all there. It's not the case of predictability, it's not really a mystery film, everything is there. Like I said before, naturally we react with surprise (for a select people, including myself) at the end on first viewig. But this film definitely needs a second viewing. It will be seen in a whole different perspective now. It's not the point during the second viewing when you think "I already know what happens" like in all the other films with twists. Here it's already been apart of the narrative. Everything is there for you. At first viewing you feel kind of like Teddy yourself. You don't want to believe it, but it is there. You have to recognize it, as they tried to have Teddy do.

Not disagreeing with you Crook, you have valid points, as valid as ours could be. I just like to think about the film more than others might think. It keeps me interested.

And people in my school seem to really be digging this. A couple people say it's confusing at the end.

 

[Crook]

Don't take this the wrong way, but I really don't see how the other viewpoint could be valid. Interpretative films do not have conclusive evidence to sway one interpretation over the other. That is why it's open-ended by nature.

By film's end, it's clear-cut how the pieces fit. I say this because if you're going for the other approach, NONE of the pieces fit (nor make sense), and fly in the face of what happened in the last 30 minutes.

As I said before though, if you can further clarify the position, I'm all ears.

 

[Doctor Jones]

Don't take this the wrong way, but I really don't see how the other viewpoint could be valid. Interpretative films do not have conclusive evidence to sway one interpretation over the other. That is why it's open-ended by nature.

By film's end, it's clear-cut how the pieces fit. I say this because if you're going for the other approach, NONE of the pieces fit (nor make sense), and fly in the face of what happened in the last 30 minutes.

As I said before though, if you can further clarify the position, I'm all ears.

But all the pieces fit for me. It'll take a second viewing to really get my head wrapped around it, but thinking about it now it seems to make sense. It all falls into place for me.

But how do you interpret Teddy's final words in the film? I think that relates to my thought process of the film.

One half

Spoiler

you want to believe he isn't insane, he is faking it because he doesn't want to deal with the trauma. The other part, he doesn't want to deal with it, that makes him insane. It goes both ways in one line. It's open ended in that way? Basically it's about what we want to believe and what not to. So you could be right about that actually. t:

 

[Crook]

But all the pieces fit for me. It'll take a second viewing to really get my head wrapped around it, but thinking about it now it seems to make sense. It all falls into place for me.

So your position is that [BLACKOUT]he really was sane, there was a conspiracy theory, and they managed to fool him? If so, how does that explain him remembering EXACTLY what happened that fateful spring day, down to why he killed her and the date of the incident? None of this info was given to him. There's more that contradicts your theory, but this is a pretty big one.[/BLACKOUT]

But how do you interpret Teddy's final words in the film? I think that relates to my thought process of the film.

Spoiler

He's accepted what he did, but even though he's now sane he cannot bear to live with himself. Teddy can't force his psyche to create the delusions, so he opts to fake the insanity so the doctors can rid him of his misery. He refuses to "live as a monster".

One half

Spoiler

you want to believe he isn't insane, he is faking it because he doesn't want to deal with the trauma. The other part, he doesn't want to deal with it, that makes him insane. It goes both ways in one line. It's open ended in that way? Basically it's about what we want to believe and what not to. So you could be right about that actually. t:

[BLACKOUT]But he does believe it. It's not wanting to deal with it anymore that makes him go for the lobotomy. If he didn't believe it, he certainly would not decide to have his entire mind essentially wiped. He'd still try and take the hospital down. [/BLACKOUT]

 

[DACrowe]

Well that is the beauty of the ending.

Spoiler

I personally think in the movie that he was sane and did not want to live with the guilt of what he had done or experienced so he pretended to be Teddy so they would cut his head open.

On the other hand, if he was pretending to be Teddy perhaps he was forcing himself to be Teddy and this is how his insanity starts. He wants to believe he is Teddy Daniels out to kill Andrew Laetus so badly, that perhaps he really is sane, but just won't go along with it for fear. Could you take it further? In the back of his mind did he know he was Andrew all along?

It is so wonderfully twisted with that one added line. In the book he clearly regresses. Here you're not sure if he did or not (nor is Chuck) and further perhaps that is where he was the whole movie. At least subconsciously, it is possible.

 

[DACrowe]

Well that is the beauty of the ending.

Spoiler

I personally think in the movie that he was sane and did not want to live with the guilt of what he had done or experienced so he pretended to be Teddy so they would cut his head open.

On the other hand, if he was pretending to be Teddy perhaps he was forcing himself to be Teddy and this is how his insanity starts. He wants to believe he is Teddy Daniels out to kill Andrew Laetus so badly, that perhaps he really is sane, but just won't go along with it for fear. Could you take it further? In the back of his mind did he know he was Andrew all along?

It is so wonderfully twisted with that one added line. In the book he clearly regresses. Here you're not sure if he did or not (nor is Chuck) and further perhaps that is where he was the whole movie. At least subconsciously, it is possible.

 

[Doctor Jones]

So your position is that [BLACKOUT]he really was sane, there was a conspiracy theory, and they managed to fool him? If so, how does that explain him remembering EXACTLY what happened that fateful spring day, down to why he killed her and the date of the incident? None of this info was given to him. There's more that contradicts your theory, but this is a pretty big one.[/BLACKOUT]

Spoiler

He's accepted what he did, but even though he's now sane he cannot bear to live with himself. Teddy can't force his psyche to create the delusions, so he opts to fake the insanity so the doctors can rid him of his misery. He refuses to "live as a monster".

[BLACKOUT]But he does believe it. It's not wanting to deal with it anymore that makes him go for the lobotomy. If he didn't believe it, he certainly would not decide to have his entire mind essentially wiped. He'd still try and take the hospital down. [/BLACKOUT]

That wasn't my position at all. I was merely saying that

Spoiler

there are two sides to interpreting it. I do believe that he was sane and was faking so he could no longer deal with the trauma

Sorry if I wasn't clear on that part. But I think I get what you mean about my contradiction. But I do believe you can interpret it in both ways which leads into the theory of madness and how we percieve it.

 

[Crook]

Spoiler

It is so wonderfully twisted with that one added line. In the book he clearly regresses. Here you're not sure if he did or not (nor is Chuck) and further perhaps that is where he was the whole movie. At least subconsciously, it is possible.

Spoiler

But if he did regress, what is the context of the line (from Teddy's perspective)? Moreover, why in the world would he walk with the officers to his certain "end"? That's what I'm not getting with the other theory. It serves to eradicate the poignancy and tragedy of Andrew/Teddy's story.

 

[-Arya-]

Spoiler

I thought it was quite clear to me that he did not regress back to his delusional state. The last line would be without context if he did.

 

[cerealkiller182]

My review http://rickshq.blogspot.com/2010/02/review-shutter-island.html

Spoiler

Set during the 1950s, US Marshall Teddy Daniels and his new partner, Chuck, travel to the remote Shutter Island somewhere in Boston Harbor to investigate the disappearance of one of the patients from a hospital for the criminally insane. From the very instance Teddy sets foot on the island, the doctors running the institution seem out to get him. Little do they know that Teddy is more concerned with a rumored conspiracy and taking vengeance on an inmate who's crime caused a traumatic event in Teddy's past.

Martin Scorsese and Leonardo DiCaprio seem to have found their niche, depicting a relatable and empathetic leading man who spirals into instability. It started with The Aviator, fine tuned in The Departed, and has come to fruition in Shutter Island. This is easily one of DiCaprio's finer roles. The level of distraught and stress he carries with him throughout the series of events adds so much more tension than any other element of the story.

Like a lot of movies now a days, there seems to be a growing use of great actors in small supporting roles who leave you wanting more: Patricia Clarkson, Ted Levine, Max Von Sydow, and Elias Koteas participate admirably. It is amazing to me the Jackie Earle Haley was not getting consistent work before Little Children, or that he has been tapped only to play wackos and perverts. He does more with his one scene than any of the other actors in the movie do.

The score is underwhelming. It resembles classic thriller music, hard hitting notes and lots of bass tones. Unfortunately, it seems shoe-horned into the film. It always seems out of place and ultimately distracting. It never synced up to the plot or provide any hits or beats. The theme in Jaws was a warning and built tension as it neared its completion accentuating the scare even though you knew it was coming. This does the opposite. There is no pay off when the score ends. I also found that the score ends unexpectingly sometimes. I noticed the same thing in The Departed where the rock track list just seemed to end.

The plot ending has roots in the cliche and many suspected it from the very beginning. Yet somehow it still feels somewhat fresh. When it comes to these types of movies and these types of endings, it is usually in the details and how they fit together looking back over the film that makes or breaks how plot is received. I suspect that this film will be much better over a second viewing.

6/10 This may be one of DiCaprio's best, but it is not Scorsese's.

 

[bullets]

Spoiler

I thought it was quite clear to me that he did not regress back to his delusional state. The last line would be without context if he did.

I agree with you and Crook on all of this . It would be nice to interpret it differently (I wanted to) but I think it's clear

 

[Episode29]

My Review:

Spoiler

I’m an absolute, unapologetic sucker for films that provide the chance to be transported to original, fully-realized, tangible places, allowing me to virtually inhabit the cinematic world of the characters. Martin Scorsese’s latest, the inconsistent-but-impressive psychological thriller Shutter Island, masterfully does just that, plunging the viewer into the eerily quiet Massachusets-situated Ashecliffe Hospital, a stone fortress-like psychiatric prison housing the most appalling criminally insane deviants mankind ever accidentally birthed. Concealed behind an impenetrable wall of fog, and located atop a craggy, rocky land mass so unsightly that there might as well be trolls peeking out from within its endless jagged crevices, the facility at once utterly repulses us while nonetheless drawing us into its nefarious clutches.

Such is also the unlucky case for Teddy Daniels (Leonardo DiCaprio, in perhaps his best performance with the director) and Chuck Aule (Mark Ruffalo), two U.S. Marshalls, circa 1954, assigned to uncover the truth behind the disappearance of one of the penitentiary’s deranged inhabitants. Naturally, upon warily entering the cast iron gates of Ashecliffe – an ominous episode given, courtesy of the relentlessly throbbing, doom-drenched soundtrack, all the nerve-racking fanfare of King Kong’s unforgettable emergence from the thick, suffocating jungles of Skull Island – and surrendering their weapons, the two lawmen quickly find themselves at odds with the hospital’s exceedingly calm medical director Dr. Cawley (Ben Kingsley – masking restrained menace behind a soothing, silky voice) and his German colleague Dr. Naehring (An effortlessly intimidating Max von Sydow).

Finding their investigation hopelessly obstructed by Ashecliffe’s tough rules and regulations and its uncooperative staff and patients, Teddy begins to grow unhinged, plagued by visions of his recently murdered wife (Michelle Williams), as well as a traumatic WWII experience liberating a Nazi concentration camp. As the tormented lawman slowly loses his grip on reality, and a violent hurricane batters at the fortified walls outside, the two Marshalls slowly come to realize that sinister forces may be planning to ensure that they remain at the facility. Permanently.

Ostensibly a glorified B-movie in A-movie trappings, Scorsese has nonetheless delivered a hauntingly gorgeous visual feast. Working with his regularcinematographer Robert Richardson - A current Oscar-nominee for his efforts on Inglourious Basterds – and Editor Thelma Schoonmaker, the celebrated auteur conjures up a number of audacious moments that leave you breathless. There’s a lengthy tracking shot, unsympathetically floating down a line of Nazi soldiers being executed, that is a thrilling feat of movie-making virtuosity, along with an alarming trip to the dreaded Ward C that feels like a descent into Hell and a nightmarish sequence involving a sea of rats that manages to out-creep both Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade and Werner Herzog’s Nosferatu. Even more startling are the many spellbinding flashback and hallucination sequences which, unlike throngs of similar genre entries, actually operate on a believable plane of fevered dream logic. In particular, the team puts Michelle Williams’ ethereal, porcelain-doll loveliness to magnificent use, creating an enthralling and disquieting aura around her.

Alas, as exquisitely technically crafted as it frequently is, Shutter Island underwhelms in the story department. For the film to truly succeed it needs to completely draw us into Teddy’s psychological spiral and make us share his escalating sense of trepidation, uncertainty and anxiety. Unfortunately, Scorsese and screenwriter Laeta Kalogrodis never quite figure out how to transform Dennis Lehane’s novel into a wholly engrossing venture. Although it starts off incredibly strong, the movie’s latter half is often cluttered and plodding, featuring far too many scenes of powerhouse character actors (including Jackie Earle Haley, Patricia Clarkson, Elias Koteas and Ted Levine) providing Teddy with draggy enigmatic exposition that is more frustrating than tantalizing. At 138 minutes, the film could use some serious trimming, especially in the concluding flashback which, while thematically important and beautifully staged, would have been significantly less harmful to the already-bumpy pace if dealt with in a briefer manner.

There’s also the issue of Shutter Island’s plot twist which is, frankly, both far too predictable and utterly ludicrous. Scorsese makes the wise decision to not smack us over the head with a sudden shocking transition, instead allowing for a subtle shift free of stylistic fireworks, but that doesn’t make it any less silly. It’s the sort of twist that requires one to make a leap of Grand Canyon-sized logical proportions to accept and, if scrutinized even minutely, causes the entire house of cards to collapse.

In the hands of a lesser talent, Shutter Island would probably be a disaster. Yet in Scorsese’s masterful hands, and filtered through a fully engaged cast, it’s an agreeable night at the movies with enough extraordinary imagery and chilling atmosphere to make it still a film undeniably worth seeing. I’m not likely to forget the dreary, fearsome Ashcliffe institution, with its shuffling bands of zombified inmates and interchangeable orderlies, any time soon. I just wish I felt as strongly about the tale unfolding within its cold, pitiless, lonely halls.

3/5

 

[Dark Victory]

While I liked the film more than you, I agree on what were the worst aspects of the film. Solid review.

 

[hugekent]

So your position is that [BLACKOUT]he really was sane, there was a conspiracy theory, and they managed to fool him? If so, how does that explain him remembering EXACTLY what happened that fateful spring day, down to why he killed her and the date of the incident? None of this info was given to him. There's more that contradicts your theory, but this is a pretty big one.[/BLACKOUT]

Spoiler

He's accepted what he did, but even though he's now sane he cannot bear to live with himself. Teddy can't force his psyche to create the delusions, so he opts to fake the insanity so the doctors can rid him of his misery. He refuses to "live as a monster".

[BLACKOUT]But he does believe it. It's not wanting to deal with it anymore that makes him go for the lobotomy. If he didn't believe it, he certainly would not decide to have his entire mind essentially wiped. He'd still try and take the hospital down. [/BLACKOUT]

This

Spoiler

I too cannot see how the "sane" scenario is possible. Even right from the start when the guards are acting all weird towards Teddy you can see that there's a big game of sorts going on. The conversation with Jackie Earl Haley pretty much confirms it.

 

[jmc]

Just came back from seeing this. Overall it's not one of Scorcese's best, good in parts, a tad predictable, DiCaprio was fine, Ruffalo also good, kinda got a bit of a Hitchcock vibe from it. Just felt like though something in the story was missing, like one element was left out from making it a better movie. I may view this differently when I see it on DVD again but upon first viewing I'd give it a fairly solid 7. I actually believe if this was a lesser director at the helm of this project the critics wouldn't be as hard on the movie, but it's Scorcese so expectations are generally higher.

 

[SuperJediHero]

As far as I'm concerned, I don't think the majority of people who hated this film(primarily the ones that make up the general audience) actually got the final ending. Too many people like to turn off their brains now days.

So, What they got wrong? What they DIDN'T got?

They didn't get

Spoiler

it was ALL in his head?

?

 

[Doctor Jones]

Some people were actually confused by it. I know...

 

[Crook]

So, What they got wrong? What they DIDN'T got?

They didn't get

Spoiler

it was ALL in his head?

?

If that's how they perceive the film, then yes, they didn't get s**t. [blackout]Everything around him was very much real. It's just that the hospital played along with the game to support his delusions.[/blackout].

 

[Hurm...]

I just finished the book. I love how there are so many different ways to interpret the film, that it literally drives you insane. Can't wait to check out the movie now.