Comics Superman Renounces U.S Citizenship in Action Comics #900

[Lead Cenobite]

Why is it anti-American? He's treating the world equally, he's not giving up his US citizenship to be a citizen of Canada or England or something. You'd think not singling out the US as the best damn country in the world is some kindof attack against it.

 

[Motown Marvel]

His out of character intentions to renounce his U.S. Citizenship is an anti-American act. A blatantly unpatriotic act.

did you even read the story? the renouncing of his citizenship doesnt come from his lack of faith or appreciation of america, or any anti-american resentment. rather, his actions on an international scale are constantly mistaken by other countries as the actions of american policy and government. that does more harm to america than good, and that is not what he intends. and so he feels the best way for that to be avoided is to publicly renounce his citizenship.

yes, thats stupid and its a dumb story and pretty out of character. but the rationale isnt illegitimate and its certainly not anti-american, since he's blatantly making a sacrifice for the best of america.

 

[theMan-Bat]

Why is it anti-American? He's treating the world equally, he's not giving up his US citizenship to be a citizen of Canada or England or something. You'd think not singling out the US as the best damn country in the world is some kindof attack against it.

Renouncing his U.S. Citizenship is completely contradictory to being a Citizen of the world. America is a part of the world. That's not treating the world equally. Superman was awarded Citizenship of every country in the United Nations, that means Superman has Citizenship in Canada, England, etc., and isn't renouncing Citizenship to them. There is nothing wrong with him being patriotic for his home country. Taking pride in the positive accomplishments and principles of his home country. Patriotism and Jingoism are not the same things at all. Superman isn't chauvinistically patriotic and doesn't vilify, hate and refuse to help other countries.

did you even read the story? the renouncing of his citizenship doesnt come from his lack of faith or appreciation of america, or any anti-american resentment. rather, his actions on an international scale are constantly mistaken by other countries as the actions of american policy and government. that does more harm to america than good, and that is not what he intends. and so he feels the best way for that to be avoided is to publicly renounce his citizenship.

yes, thats stupid and its a dumb story and pretty out of character. but the rationale isnt illegitimate and its certainly not anti-american, since he's blatantly making a sacrifice for the best of america.

Yes, I've read it. Renouncing his U.S. Citizenship isn't protecting America, isn't the best for America. As long as he is a member of the Justice League of America and his comrades are all Americans, no sudden renunciation of his U.S. Citizenship would convince the Iranian regime that the Big Blue Boy Scout doesn't represent America. To renounce his U.S. Citizenship is an anti-American act. An unpatriotic act. It looks like we are going to have to agree to disagree here. We do agree that it's a dumb story and out of character for Superman.

 

[Czar Colossus]

Plus this is one of those times in history where we need him the most and what does Goyer have him do? Abandon us at one of our lowest points in the eyes of the rest of the world.


Thanks Superman.

Yeah; when we've got someone in the White House who goes around the world apologizing for America...... we don't need Supes renouncing citizenship...we need him running for president!t:

 

[Red Mask]

What's wrong with Superman being a global hero? The guy can run from New York to Tokyo going east in a few hours if he took his time, why limit him to one country?

Also, those patriotic Superman covers are incredibly hokey, especially the one with the eagle.

There is nothing wrong, for example, with Superman flying to France to save a French family from a burning building. (He did that in Superman Returns.) But as an action comic, with a grown trend towards huge battles, I wonder what the writers are trying to accomplish when those battles are set in foreign countries. And where was Superman during Iran's last election, when the protestors were being oppressed? They capitalize on what started in Tunisia but they address it in Iran. How typical of them. It's like that time when Superman went to help an earthquake hit Chile. But in the real world, around that time, it was the country of Peru. Maybe it was coincidence but that felt exploitive to me.

 

[Shivsguy616]

I never really understood why he was aligned with America in the first place (except for his being created and written by Americans for an American audience). It seems to make sense that he would declare himself not aligned with any particular regieme, lest his actions threaten the lives of innocent people merely by association.

 

[Motown Marvel]

Yes, I've read it. Renouncing his U.S. Citizenship isn't protecting America, isn't the best for America. As long as he is a member of the Justice League of America and his comrades are all Americans, no sudden renunciation of his U.S. Citizenship would convince the Iranian regime that the Big Blue Boy Scout doesn't represent America. To renounce his U.S. Citizenship is an anti-American act. An unpatriotic act. It looks like we are going to have to agree to disagree here. We do agree that it's a dumb story and out of character for Superman.

im just saying, in order for it to be considered anti-american it would require for his actions to be born out of some sort of resentment for america.

but yes, however you see it, its a dumb and unnecessary story.

 

[theMan-Bat]

I never really understood why he was aligned with America in the first place (except for his being created and written by Americans for an American audience). It seems to make sense that he would declare himself not aligned with any particular regieme, lest his actions threaten the lives of innocent people merely by association.

Superman's patriotic loyal alignment to America is curiosity of his upbringing, how he was raised. Superman was raised in America's rural heartland by two Americans (he was even born in America in The Man Of Steel). He was raised assimilated into America's Kansas farm culture as a baby. He grew up in a very loving household raised by two Americas that were parents to him in every way. Pa Kent’s advice directed the man. That is where he draws his outlook, his mentality. "The American Way," "the American Dream." The principles of "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness", "liberty and justice for all." The principles that America was founded on with the U.S. Constitutional rights. Superman believes in those principles. He's not jaded, pessimistic, full of angst. He's about hope, optimism. He's identity is formed by his folksy American parents' values, thus, patriotism is important to him. Refusing to be aligned with the U.S. for fear of offending someone, somewhere, somehow, is cowardly and out if character for Superman.

im just saying, in order for it to be considered anti-american it would require for his actions to be born out of some sort of resentment for america.

Goyer writes Superman as being opposed to U.S. policy.

but yes, however you see it, its a dumb and unnecessary story.

Agreed!

 

[theMan-Bat]

DC now says, "The story itself was simply a look at what could be and not what is.
This short story is just that, it will not be followed up upon. Superman will remain as American as Apple pie."

http://www.capetowncommunity.com/2011/05/superman-still-stands-for-truth-justice.html

 

[Alex_Spider]

Good. Superman should stand for the whole world, not just America.

 

[theMan-Bat]

Superman already stands for and helps the whole world, while also being a U.S. Citizen.

 

[Motown Marvel]

Goyer writes Superman as being opposed to U.S. policy.

what policy was he against? (not being argumentative...i just dont remember anything specific from the story about that). either way, theres nothing anti-american about being against certain policies if you don't believe they are whats best for the country.

DC now says, "The story itself was simply a look at what could be and not what is.
This short story is just that, it will not be followed up upon. Superman will remain as American as Apple pie."

http://www.capetowncommunity.com/2011/05/superman-still-stands-for-truth-justice.html

i think i called that somewhere, ha. so its not surprising and probably for the best. though, clearly DC is just back peddling because of the negative reaction. i wonder how this might affect the movie if it was indeed indicative of their approach?

 

[theMan-Bat]

what policy was he against? (not being argumentative...i just dont remember anything specific from the story about that). either way, theres nothing anti-american about being against certain policies if you don't believe they are whats best for the country.

Goyer writes Superman as being opposed to the U.S. policy to not get involved and take sides between the protesters and the Iranian regime. The U.S. President's national security adviser is incensed that Superman appeared in Tehran to support the protesters demonstrating against the Iranian regime. Goyer than has Superman decide to renounce his U.S. Citizenship. I see renouncing his U.S. Citizenship is an out of character anti-American act. An unpatriotic act. We are repeating ourselves and we are going to have to just agree to disagree here.

i think i called that somewhere, ha. so its not surprising and probably for the best. though, clearly DC is just back peddling because of the negative reaction. i wonder how this might affect the movie if it was indeed indicative of their approach?

The reaction to this story should tell Warner Brothers to take a careful look at Goyer's Superman movie script and have it doctored. They likely wont allow Goyer to have Superman renouncing his U.S. Citizenship in the film script, but I'm certain there is plenty of ridiculous angst in Goyer's Superman script. Goyer explained in his introduction to Geoff Johns' Superman Secret Origin that Geoff Johns' Superman Secret Origin is a big influence on his script.
"In which young Clark is told the truth about his heritage. He races out into the night, sobbing, stumbling through the cornfields. Eventually, his foster father, Jonathan, finds him. 'I don’t want to be someone else,' says Clark. 'I don’t want to be different. I want to be Clark Kent. I want to be your son.'"

David Goyer says, "Right there in that moment, Geoff contextualized Superman in a way that I’m not sure has ever really been done before. I had an ‘aha’ experience when I read that. For the first time I was able to grasp how lonely Clark must have been when he was growing up. And what a sacrifice Clark must continually make by being Superman. As I write this, I am midway through my first draft of a new Superman screenplay. It’s a task that has stymied many talented filmmakers in the years since Donner’s film. And for all I know, it will end up stymieing me as well. But I’ve got one advantage that the screenwriters who came before me didn’t have– and that’s access to all the wonderful Superman stories written by Geoff Johns– first and foremost being the Secret Origin issues."
http://blastr.com/2010/12/did-david-goyer-give-away.php
David Goyer's Superman script also seems similar to Mark Waid's Superman Birthright, which follows a young Clark Kent as a globetrotting freelance reporter who hasn’t yet become a superhero. Goyer's script reportedly has Clark Kent reluctantly grappling with whether or not he should become Superman.
http://gammasquad.uproxx.com/2010/1...evealed-written-faster-than-a-speeding-bullet
I certainly don't want an angst ridden, whiny "poor me" Clark Kent being reluctant to become Superman. One of the things that audiences disliked about Singer's Superman Returns, along with the lack of action, was the angst ridden, moping, sad emo Superman.
John Byrne was asked, is Superman the toughest superhero to write? John Byrne replied, "He shouldn't be. Superman is just a decent guy who does the right thing for the right reasons. He cares about his adopted planet, and the people on it. To the best of his ability, he tries to right the world's wrongs, but he understands that humanity must proceed along its own path, and the best he (or any single person) can do is try to keep us falling off that path.
Those who have trouble writing Superman are the people who do not believe such simple honesty and decency exist. They cannot find it in themselves, so they doubt it can be in others. They look for Superman's 'feet of clay', or they crank the basic model up to cliché levels."
http://www.byrnerobotics.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12986
"What does it say about the people that write these stories that characters
cannot simply do the right thing for the right reason?"
http://www.byrnerobotics.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=30966&PN=1&TPN=5

 

[Shivsguy616]

Superman's patriotic loyal alignment to America is curiosity of his upbringing, how he was raised. Superman was raised in America's rural heartland by two Americans (he was even born in America in The Man Of Steel). He was raised assimilated into America's Kansas farm culture as a baby. He grew up in a very loving household raised by two Americas that were parents to him in every way. Pa Kent’s advice directed the man. That is where he draws his outlook, his mentality. "The American Way," "the American Dream." The principles of "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness", "liberty and justice for all." The principles that America was founded on with the U.S. Constitutional rights. Superman believes in those principles. He's not jaded, pessimistic, full of angst. He's about hope, optimism. He's identity is formed by his folksy American parents' values, thus, patriotism is important to him.

I guess that makes sense. I just never imagined that Superman would have such a naive outlook. I sort of assumed he'd be more open minded as an adult, realising that those values and rights and "dreams" and "ways" exist throughout the world in many countries. Then again, I'm not well aquainted with his personality in the comic books.

 

[Timstuff]

Superman still represents American writers imposing their will on the world. I have never supported the idea of a geopolitically active Superman, because whether or not he is an American, the idea that he enforces his will upon the earth's population makes for some very shaky ethical ground whether he does it as a citizen of America or a citizen of Krypton. This strikes me as more of a stunt than anything else, and I can't help but wonder if this is DC's way of trolling all the people who whined about Superman not being played by an American in Man of Steel.

If you want a geopolitically active character who intervenes in armed conflicts while remaining impartial, that is Wonder Woman's domain (even if a lot of DC's writers seem to forget it). Superman's job is to protect and inspire earth, not to enforce his own ideals on it. If you get that part right, then his US citizenship should not be a problem.

 

[Motown Marvel]

Superman still represents American writers imposing their will on the world. I have never supported the idea of a geopolitically active Superman, because whether or not he is an American, the idea that he enforces his will upon the earth's population makes for some very shaky ethical ground whether he does it as a citizen of America or a citizen of Krypton. This strikes me as more of a stunt than anything else, and I can't help but wonder if this is DC's way of trolling all the people who whined about Superman not being played by an American in Man of Steel.

If you want a geopolitically active character who intervenes in armed conflicts while remaining impartial, that is Wonder Woman's domain (even if a lot of DC's writers seem to forget it). Superman's job is to protect and inspire earth, not to enforce his own ideals on it. If you get that part right, then his US citizenship should not be a problem.

whut?

 

[theMan-Bat]

I guess that makes sense. I just never imagined that Superman would have such a naive outlook. I sort of assumed he'd be more open minded as an adult, realising that those values and rights and "dreams" and "ways" exist throughout the world in many countries. Then again, I'm not well aquainted with his personality in the comic books.

He was raised to be patriotically proud of the positive accomplishments and principles of the country he was brought up in and chooses to continue to live in as an adult. Sure there are other countries that have many of the same rights, etc., that America has and of course America is not flawless, Superman knows that, thus Superman is a crime-fighter fighting a never-ending battle.

 

[Timstuff]

whut?

The idea that Superman renouncing his citizenship makes it politically correct for him to become more active in world politics is flawed, because Superman is still being written by American writers who want him to represent their ideals. Whatever Superman does is going to be a reflection of what an American writer considers to be the ideal, and whether or not Superman has ties to the American government (which he doesn't anyway, since he's a fictional character that is privately owned) doesn't really matter because ultimately his actions are controlled by the will of American writers. As long as American writers are controlling the character, no-one can truly deny that his actions on the page represent the will of the American people to some degree, which is why I would prefer not to see Superman involved with global politics in the first place, since either he's imposing the will of the US government on the rest of the world, or he is imposing his own will on it, and since he is not born of earth that in a way poses him as a conquerer from another world.

At best, Superman renouncing his citizenship is symbolically flat, unless the goal is to say "stop b****ing that Henry Cavill is British." DC is probably kicking themselves over the timing of this development, while Marvel gets to laugh it up since they've got the Captain America movie coming out in July.

 

[Motown Marvel]

not all of superman's writers are american, nor has there been any overt stuffing of american agenda in his comics. and in this one particular story that was slightly political, he made it obvious that his intentions are not to be taken as the will of the american government.

and frankly, i dont think i've seen many people complaining about henry cavill not being american.

 

[theMan-Bat]

Co-creator of Superman, Joe Shuster, was Canadian, John Byrne is British born and moved to Canada when he was 8 years old, Alan Moore is British, Grant Morrison is Scottish.

I didn't have a problem with Henry Cavill not being American. I just wanted Colin Firth for Superman.

 

[Superman 1265]

not all of superman's writers are american, nor has there been any overt stuffing of american agenda in his comics. and in this one particular story that was slightly political, he made it obvious that his intentions are not to be taken as the will of the american government.

and frankly, i dont think i've seen many people complaining about henry cavill not being american.

Really? People on the internet were *****ing about it non-stop the first several weeks.

 

[Motown Marvel]

i never saw many people complaining about it. and i was definitely here for it.

 

[Redwolf]

You know you can fight evil in the world and still stand for the "American Way."

The "American Way" is "Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness." How is that offensive to other nations? Oh wait the other nations who may be offended are..guess who? Communist nations, nations run by radicals religious nuts and dictators, that's who. So to those of you who say he should fight for all nations, he already does this! He doesn't limit himself to fighting evil inside American borders! He just stands for what America stands for and again how is the "American Way" a bad thing to stand for?

Superman and patriotism are like peas and carrots, it's been a part of him for decades now.

 

[Shivsguy616]

Don't take this the wrong way, I'm merely stating that I find this amusing, but it is rather ironic that a country which aimed for "Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness" now has the death penalty and the world's highest incarceration rate! Again, not poking fun, I'm sure similar could be said of the Einigheit in "Einigheit und Recht und Freiheit" and the fraternité in "Liberté, égalité, fraternité".

 

[theMan-Bat]

"Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness" for all the peaceful law-abiding citizens of the country, not for all the criminals.