The Atheism Thread - Part 6

[Snow Queen]

Here's another inspiring verse about God's love..

"The people of Samaria must bear the consequences of their guilt because they rebelled against their God. They will be killed by an invading army, their little ones dashed to death against the ground, their pregnant women ripped open by swords."
-Hosea 13:16 NLT

And this one's just plain nuts..

"Happy those who seize your children and smash them against a rock."
-Psalms 137:9 NAB

Or the children's story about the genocide of the human race aside from one family and two of every animal. Thou shall not kill...but it's okay if I do it.

 

[KevanG]

Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.

I always preferred that version. it sounds better.

 

[The End]

This is going to sound weird, but here goes.

I am a Christian. I believe in God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, all of that. But this is the weird part. I HATE God.

Seriously, have you looked at the Bible?

The story of Noah is always presented to us as something uplifting. God saves Noah, the animals, and leaves a rainbow as a symbol that he would never again flood the earth. Aww.

Nevermind the fact that God KILLED EVERYBODY ELSE ON EARTH.

And there's this..

Meanwhile, the LORD instructed one of the group of prophets to say to another man, "Strike me!" But the man refused to strike the prophet. Then the prophet told him, "Because you have not obeyed the voice of the LORD, a lion will kill you as soon as you leave me." And sure enough, when he had gone, a lion attacked and killed him.
-1 Kings 20:35-36 NLT

And this..

But if this charge is true (that she wasn't a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father's house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst.
-Deuteronomy 22:20-21 NAB

And this..

They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men. All five of the Midianite kings – Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur, and Reba – died in the battle. They also killed Balaam son of Beor with the sword. Then the Israelite army captured the Midianite women and children and seized their cattle and flocks and all their wealth as plunder. They burned all the towns and villages where the Midianites had lived. After they had gathered the plunder and captives, both people and animals, they brought them all to Moses and Eleazar the priest, and to the whole community of Israel, which was camped on the plains of Moab beside the Jordan River, across from Jericho.

Moses, Eleazar the priest, and all the leaders of the people went to meet them outside the camp. But Moses was furious with all the military commanders who had returned from the battle. "Why have you let all the women live?" he demanded. "These are the very ones who followed Balaam's advice and caused the people of Israel to rebel against the LORD at Mount Peor. They are the ones who caused the plague to strike the LORD's people. Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves.
-Numbers 31:7-18 NLT

Umm, holy effing crap. If anyone did that today, they would rightfully be called terrorists and probably executed. Yet these are God's chosen people, following the command of God.

Didn't God say "Thou shalt not kill?" What hypocrisy.

Then there's the whole hell thing. If God truly loved us, why would he send his people or his children, to such a place. If you had a child that caused trouble and disobeyed you, would you throw him into a furnace? Didn't think so.

I believe in God, and that all of the stuff spoken of in Revelation will go down one day, and I guess it's the fear of that that keeps me believing in him, but I just had to post this and get it out of my system. Hopefully God will forgive me, even though I think he is a psychotic mass-murderer.

I wish there was an even higher power than God himself, who would punish HIM for all the evil acts he has done.

Hey, thanks for sharing this. There's many people that go through a similar process. I know I had my fears of hell when I was having serious doubts. And for me, one of the things that had me doubting was the sorts of passages you've shared, the image I had in my mind of an all loving god was not able to stand up against that.

Here's another one.

2 Kings 2:23 And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.

2:24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the LORD. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.


Think of it this way - God's kind of like a North Korean dictator, isn't he?

Hitchens described god that way.

[YT]f40TRJl5vvI[/YT]

"I don't in myself have any desire to live under a permanent unalterable dictatorship".

The good news is that there's no good reason to believe its true. There's no evidence. It becomes obvious that the bible was written this way to control people. You look at the posts of Harvest in the Jesus thread, and ya think, now there's a guy firmly under the control of a 2000 year old book.

I've been watching the new series of Cosmos with Neil deGrass Tyson, and the way that science can allow people to ask questions, and give us tools that work for examining reality, its so much more illuminating and satisfying than anything from any religion. The most recent episode is aptly titled, 'When Knowledge Conquered Fear'. You can't blame ancient people for thinking comets are omens from god. But when people later understand gravity and mathematics, we work out that the comets that pass the Earth are actually caught in the gravity of the sun and pass us by like clockwork. Nothing to be afraid of there.

The episodes are actually online. It's an informative, beautiful series that for me frankly makes god seem like such a petty concept. http://www.cosmosontv.com/watch/203380803583

You may find, when you have doubts about god, that when you really sit back and think about the arguments for god that the arguments are full of bad logic, special pleading, circular reasoning, and no evidence. Fear is no reason to believe. "Believe or x will happen" is an empty threat, and today it holds no power over me. I'm no more afraid of god's punishment than I am of ending up on santa's naughty list. It's literally THAT absurd to me. (And when you think about it, isn't god just santa for the grown ups?)

This animation sums up the absurdity brilliantly.

[YT]HaJgLBoB_Pw[/YT]

The bottom line, the beginning and the end of the discussion when it comes to good reasons for believing if god exists, is the burden of proof.

[YT]KayBys8gaJY[/YT]

If you have any questions or want to discuss anything, feel free.

 

[Hotwire]

From the Jesus Thread...

I'm curious. I'm not trying to start a fight here, just get some answers. I'm wondering why so many Christians get hung up and vocal about banning same-sex marriages while at the same time, being so silent about banning divorce? Both are labeled as sins in the Bible. Divorce, even by Jesus, saying that those who divorce and remarry are committing adultery which, parts of the Bible say is punishable by death. Now, I know the story where Jesus called on the people without sin to cast the first stone but, you see what I'm getting at. The divorce rate in the US right around 50%! This is something that is truly destroying the sanctity of the institution. Especially when the only forgivable reason Jesus mentioned for divorce, infidelity, is #5 on the list of reasons for divorce! So, bottom line, why the uproar over gay couples getting married and not over straight couples getting divorced?

 

[KevanG]

Because divorce is socially accepted now where it wasn't back then and people these days have grown up with divorce being commonplace, where them 'icky' gay folks are still new and exciting and (pardon the pun) forbidden fruit so it's okay to look down on them and scream bloody murder about it being bad and a sin.

 

[Feenix]

I agree with Kevan. I think the majority of it comes from the "ick" factor that a lot of Christians associate homosexuality with.

That or they're closet homosexuals with a lot of hatred for themselves.

 

[Lily Adler]

This blasphemous decorum is utmost dissatisfying to my sophisticated conscious.

But for real, I agree that I don't see why some of these overtly vocal Christians are outraged over gay marriage when divorce is clearly making a mockery of the institution of marriage not the bonding of two people who are in love and happen to be of the same gender.

 

[KevanG]

The thing is that unless you know someone is gay you can't tell that they are unless they decide to either cross dress, which not all gay folks do, or go totally overboard on the flamboyant side. So until someone is told that a person is gay then they have no reason to hate them except for other things.

Like that news article a few weeks back where two women were part of a church congregation for decades until it came out that they were a couple, up until then the pastor had no problems and said they were a wonderful addition and always happy to have them around, then when it came out he kicked them out of the church.

 

[Lily Adler]

 

[redhawk23]

Jesus's harsh stance against divorce was actually one of the first obstacles Christianity had to over come when seeking to expand. Paul, in his Letter to the Corinthians had to backtrack and town down a lot of Jesus's message on the matter, adding exceptions and such.

 

[Hotwire]

Now, are any of you who responded, Christians?

 

[redhawk23]

I come from a Christian family and have had to study theology as a student at a Jesuit university.

 

[Hotwire]

I come from a Christian family and have had to study theology as a student at a Jesuit university.

So, they basically just change the rules as they see fit.

 

[regwec]

I bet all the Christians who deplore homosexuality still watch plenty of lesbian porn.

 

[Feenix]

I bet all the Christians who deplore homosexuality still watch plenty of lesbian porn.

They need an outlet for some of that sexual frustration.

After all, kissing is a sin. Sins are bad. Don't ever sin.

 

[The End]

As long as you ask for forgiveness afterwards its all good.

 

[E-Man]

Is anyone here planning on seeing Noah since Aronofsky said that it's the least Biblical movie ever because he's an atheist. I'm not going to see it, but I will need ammo to troll some holier than though people I know on Facebook. If someone sees it then let me know if it makes people cry in the theaters due to there being no god.

 

[regwec]

I was thinking about seeing it. I like a lot of the Hebrew mythology, and just wish it could be freed from the weirdos who still profess to believe it is factual.

 

[E-Man]

Some of the Hebrew myths are okay, but there's too much unnecessary convolution. Kinda like the whole Jesus thing. It doesn't make sense that an omnipotent being would impregnate someone with himself intentionally to have himself murdered when he already displayed the ability to change things in the blink of an eye during the Tower of Babel. Instead of a cool story like Hercules you get a mess with Jesus. Samson is kick ass though. I'd watch a Samson movie in a heartbeat.

 

[regwec]

I liked the Jesus movie that did with Jeff Bridges and that rug.

 

[Breogan]

FGM is terrible and I honestly don't understand why it's so widely practiced.

Probably another way of controlling women. Since it inhibits their sexual pleasure. Sex for a woman becomes just a means / object of satisfying the man and/or for breeding, ie a vessel.

 

[MrsKent26]

From the Jesus Thread...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hotwire
I'm curious. I'm not trying to start a fight here, just get some answers. I'm wondering why so many Christians get hung up and vocal about banning same-sex marriages while at the same time, being so silent about banning divorce? Both are labeled as sins in the Bible. Divorce, even by Jesus, saying that those who divorce and remarry are committing adultery which, parts of the Bible say is punishable by death. Now, I know the story where Jesus called on the people without sin to cast the first stone but, you see what I'm getting at. The divorce rate in the US right around 50%! This is something that is truly destroying the sanctity of the institution. Especially when the only forgivable reason Jesus mentioned for divorce, infidelity, is #5 on the list of reasons for divorce! So, bottom line, why the uproar over gay couples getting married and not over straight couples getting divorced?

Inconsistencies like this don't surprise me. Religion is imprecise and malleable. People can bend it to exclude whomever/whatever they want. All it takes is a certain person's "take" to infiltrate a few other minds that are open to it/desire the same exclusions for whatever reason.

 

[Destructus86]

Hey, thanks for sharing this. There's many people that go through a similar process. I know I had my fears of hell when I was having serious doubts. And for me, one of the things that had me doubting was the sorts of passages you've shared, the image I had in my mind of an all loving god was not able to stand up against that.

Here's another one.

2 Kings 2:23 And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.

2:24 And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the LORD. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.


Think of it this way - God's kind of like a North Korean dictator, isn't he?

Hitchens described god that way.

[YT]f40TRJl5vvI[/YT]

"I don't in myself have any desire to live under a permanent unalterable dictatorship".

The good news is that there's no good reason to believe its true. There's no evidence. It becomes obvious that the bible was written this way to control people. You look at the posts of Harvest in the Jesus thread, and ya think, now there's a guy firmly under the control of a 2000 year old book.

I've been watching the new series of Cosmos with Neil deGrass Tyson, and the way that science can allow people to ask questions, and give us tools that work for examining reality, its so much more illuminating and satisfying than anything from any religion. The most recent episode is aptly titled, 'When Knowledge Conquered Fear'. You can't blame ancient people for thinking comets are omens from god. But when people later understand gravity and mathematics, we work out that the comets that pass the Earth are actually caught in the gravity of the sun and pass us by like clockwork. Nothing to be afraid of there.

The episodes are actually online. It's an informative, beautiful series that for me frankly makes god seem like such a petty concept. http://www.cosmosontv.com/watch/203380803583

You may find, when you have doubts about god, that when you really sit back and think about the arguments for god that the arguments are full of bad logic, special pleading, circular reasoning, and no evidence. Fear is no reason to believe. "Believe or x will happen" is an empty threat, and today it holds no power over me. I'm no more afraid of god's punishment than I am of ending up on santa's naughty list. It's literally THAT absurd to me. (And when you think about it, isn't god just santa for the grown ups?)

This animation sums up the absurdity brilliantly.

[YT]HaJgLBoB_Pw[/YT]

The bottom line, the beginning and the end of the discussion when it comes to good reasons for believing if god exists, is the burden of proof.

[YT]KayBys8gaJY[/YT]

If you have any questions or want to discuss anything, feel free.

We can't view history from modern day perspective. People thought completely different in ancient times.

As for fear. True Christianity has nothing to do with "Believe in God or you will burn in hell" fear tactics. And while there are plenty of Christians in today's society that do push that belief it was not something that Christians believed for many centuries. The core message of Christianity has always been that God created man with free will. We fell away and became broken people in a constant struggle of moving closer to God and then falling into exile again over and over. And then sending His Son to save people, to help us become better than we are and close to where He wants us to be.

This guy says it best

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vggzqXzEvZ0

 

[regwec]

The core message of Christianity has always been that God created man with free will.

That doesn't work with predestination or justification by faith, does it?

 

[Doctor Evo]

You guys seriously got the JCAaW thread closed? You couldn't just leave them alone?

Yes, what many of them were saying was disgusting, offensive and intellectually bankrupt. But was it really our place to go in there and derail the **** out of the thread? Seriously, guys, come on. I think what happened constitutes a major breach of message-board etiquette (and this comes from someone who has little regard for such nonsense).