The Batman General News & Discussion Thread - Part 2

[Iceman]

If it’s true that Nolan suggested using his universe as part of Man of Steel’s, then I have no idea why they rebooted Batman. That would have been so much better received if JGL, Hathaway and Bale returned.

Bale in BVS and JL should have happened.

I think the chances of success for everything would have been higher with the audience respect for the TDK trilogy and that much more hype than for a Batman not seen before. Either way I would have loved to have seen Hathaway and JGL in a future film where there could be more focus on them. JGL's role especially seems a bit throwaway with no follow up.

 

[dhandler01]

If it’s true that Nolan suggested using his universe as part of Man of Steel’s, then I have no idea why they rebooted Batman. That would have been so much better received if JGL, Hathaway and Bale returned.

Bale in BVS and JL should have happened.

Except Bale was never going to do it. He only wanted to make films with Nolan.

And I don't buy for a second Nolan suggested that anyways.

 

[Boom]

Bale made it pretty clear his interest in playing Batman starts and ends with Nolan's direct involvement.

 

[Iceman]

Miller doesn’t deserve my respect. I’ll call Ezra a lamb if it suits me.

Eh, I loath Ezra and as a queer person consider them to be a massive public embarrassment but not using their pronouns is a bit like using racial slurs about a person of colour who does something bad. It's just unnecessary. Not exactly the forum for this, and not trying to get on your case, its just worth considering.

@shauner111 Ezra doesn't deserve your respect but as @SwordOfMorning said, it's like using racist insults against a minority who has committed a crime - you also simultaneously disrespect the others of that minority who didn't do anything wrong (and I don't think that is your intention).

 

[shauner111]

Not my intention no, and I do not agree with you on that comparison. Apples and oranges. Referring to Ezra as dirtbag or lamb is not the same as using an incredibly disgusting and hateful racial slur that indeed affects an entire race.

We’ll just have to agree to disagree.

 

[Iceman]

Not my intention no, and I do not agree with you on that comparison. Apples and oranges. Referring to Ezra as dirtbag or lamb is not the same as using an incredibly disgusting and hateful racial slur that indeed affects an entire race.

We’ll just have to agree to disagree.

Oh you can call them a dirtbag or a lamb. This is just in reference to intentionally using wrong pronouns, which I see was actually originally in reference to a different post than yours. Only the intentional usage of wrong pronouns is against the rules here.

 

[flickchick85]

Everyone is expected to use correct pronouns here or face banning. Period. I don’t care who it’s in reference to or if you respect them. Transphobia is not acceptable here in any context.

 

[shauner111]

i 100 percent support the trans community so yeah, my bad for making it sound like I was targeting more than just Ezra and their bad behaviour. My apologies.

Back to the Keats and the Benjamins. I don’t see Keaton wanting to deal with WB’s DC universe again after this. It would have to take one hell of a pitch from Muschietti or Burton.

Ben told everyone in 2017 that he needed rehab that’s why he was done. He came back to help Zack and to have a farewell with the Flash. After that production (as someone who is a lot happier now) he stated how he’s done with blockbusters. As far as we know he only returned to reshoot one scene with Momoa because it would no longer make sense with Keaton. I seriously doubt Zaslav wants to keep making movies with a Ben Affleck Batman after what he said about starting over for real. I also heard that he didn’t like the Batgirl movie when he saw it and he’s not a fan of the Snyderverse and wants it buried.

I’m pretty confident that he’s done and so is Michael unless they pitch him an incredible idea. That Nightwing movie with Keaton probably won’t happen. Maybe they can still do that Harley/Ivy movie with Pfeiffer’s Catwoman but I’m assuming that’ll never happen either now that all the little references from Batgirl died with that movie.

Pattinson seems to be the one and only until they decide to use him for their shared universe or decide to reboot again down the road with a new Batman. I actually like this a lot and feel like Keaton’s return being a one and done would be quite fitting.

 

[Iceman]

i 100 percent support the trans community so yeah, my bad for making it sound like I was targeting more than just Ezra and their bad behaviour. My apologies.

Back to the Keats and the Benjamins. I don’t see Keaton wanting to deal with WB’s DC universe again after this. It would have to take one hell of a pitch from Muschietti or Burton.

Ben told everyone in 2017 that he needed rehab that’s why he was done. He came back to help Zack and to have a farewell with the Flash. After that production (as someone who is a lot happier now) he stated how he’s done with blockbusters. As far as we know he only returned to reshoot one scene with Momoa because it would no longer make sense with Keaton. I seriously doubt Zaslav wants to keep making movies with a Ben Affleck Batman after what he said about starting over for real. I also heard that he didn’t like the Batgirl movie when he saw it and he’s not a fan of the Snyderverse and wants it buried.

I’m pretty confident that he’s done and so is Michael unless they pitch him an incredible idea. That Nightwing movie with Keaton probably won’t happen. Maybe they can still do that Harley/Ivy movie with Pfeiffer’s Catwoman but I’m assuming that’ll never happen either now that all the little references from Batgirl died with that movie.

Pattinson seems to be the one and only until they decide to use him for their shared universe or decide to reboot again down the road with a new Batman. I actually like this a lot and feel like Keaton’s return being a one and done would be quite fitting.

Thanks for that.

Keaton must be slightly horrified at what he’s landed himself in after waiting all these decades to make a return. Really hope the return is worthy of his legacy. I also doubt Ben wants a return to all the pressures of taking this role further.

I’m not sure how much the new regime want to focus on the multiverse going forward. If they had wanted to then all these elements would have been more likely but maybe Zaslav is now going for more of a reboot.

I have no idea if Pattinson is up for taking part in a wider universe but I would love that even if it can only happen when Reeves has finished telling his story. Catwoman and Penguin can come too for the ride.

 

[Jermobooka]

Y’know, the fact that we’re even talking about Micheal Keaton returning to the role of Batman in the first place feels kinda crazy. A few years ago that idea would’ve been shot down immediately.

Will it be as hyped as Tobey/Andrew returning as their respective Peter Parker’s? Definitely not. But it’s still another wild fan “never-gonna-happen-ever” dream come true (even if it’s happening in a film mired with a whole bunch of external and internal problems).

 

[universeman]

On the topic of Keaton, and if he would even want to return after the mess with WB/DC. He did say yes to Morbius.

Plus I actually think the main reason why they had Keaton returned is so they could use Batman in DCEU without forcing Reeves to put his Batman in the DCEU, and with Keaton he wouldn't step on Pattison's toes.

 

[BatLobster]

As far as the idea of TDK Trilogy being used for the DCEU, I think @The Lazarus Pit could be referring to this:

"It was not 100 percent off the table," Snyder told the Happy Sad Confused(opens in new tab) podcast. "We did talk about it a little bit. The whole thing is that, I think that it's difficult, and it would have been interesting because that would have meant, just doing the math, that the Batman – maybe that's why we didn't do it, that if we had done that the Batman in this movie would have been probably... It would've been Joseph [Gordon-Levitt]. Which could've been cool.

Also I think [Nolan] kind of, and I don't blame him, I like that his thing doesn't get muddied by these other… It's a tight box and I'm glad I didn't f*** with it because it's a pretty nice trilogy and I enjoy it," Snyder continued.

My read: I think Snyder was probably interested in crossing those worlds and brought it up, and maybe Nolan did the courtesy of entertaining the pitch, but really had no intention of letting that happen.

 

[Iceman]

Don’t blame Nolan at all for wanting his trilogy to be self-contained but I wonder how big that would have been seeing that Batman and world cross over. When you use a Batman that’s seen that much success and been fully developed over 3 films, you don’t need to put any time into explaining anything about them in the crossover film, and also the audience already takes their participation as guaranteed quality on the Batman side rather than wait and see. Would have been an amazing platform to build from.

The same could potentially apply here with the Reeves-verse and Pattinson, but again the same could apply in terms of having to keep it self-contained. I’m crossing my fingers that there’s a chance this time we see it with Reeves’ blessing, even if that is only possible after a trilogy or so and Reeves has achieved what he wanted with his films.

But anyway just getting a fully developed Reeves-verse hopefully with supporting shows going ahead will be great either way.

 

[dhandler01]

As far as the idea of TDK Trilogy being used for the DCEU, I think @The Lazarus Pit could be referring to this:



My read: I think Snyder was probably interested in crossing those worlds and brought it up, and maybe Nolan did the courtesy of entertaining the pitch, but really had no intention of letting that happen.

That is a whole lot of word salad to say "yeah it was brought up once and went nowhere".

I dont think anyone would have wanted to see JGL as Batman anyways. It was a cool ending, the full circle moment, but it has zero value beyond that moment. There was no real connection there.

 

[dhandler01]

Don’t blame Nolan at all for wanting his trilogy to be self-contained but I wonder how big that would have been seeing that Batman and world cross over. When you use a Batman that’s seen that much success and been fully developed over 3 films, you don’t need to put any time into explaining anything about them in the crossover film, and also the audience already takes their participation as guaranteed quality on the Batman side rather than wait and see. Would have been an amazing platform to build from.

The same could potentially apply here with the Reeves-verse and Pattinson, but again the same could apply in terms of having to keep it self-contained. I’m crossing my fingers that there’s a chance this time we see it with Reeves’ blessing, even if that is only possible after a trilogy or so and Reeves has achieved what he wanted with his films.

But anyway just getting a fully developed Reeves-verse hopefully with supporting shows going ahead will be great either way.

Bale wasn't who they were talking about though Snyder said it would have been JGL in the quote. We had like half a film development for that hothead and that is being generous.

 

[Eddie Dean]

Snyder said he considered casting Bale in Batman v Superman, but not as Batman. I don’t think he was serious about it, but more as a statement of how his movie is a totally different continuity.

On the other hand, I remember a story about Bale turning down a huge sum of money to be in BvS from pretty respected outlets. I’m sure the idea was at least entertained at some point.

 

[BatLobster]

That is a whole lot of word salad to say "yeah it was brought up once and went nowhere".

I dont think anyone would have wanted to see JGL as Batman anyways. It was a cool ending, the full circle moment, but it has zero value beyond that moment. There was no real connection there.

Yeah, I agree, there would've been no point to that. You can't have the first Batman and Superman meetup on film and have it not be Bruce. That's kinda dead in the water. And the alternative of bringing Bale's Batman out of retirement so close to TDKR would've completely negated the trilogy's ending, no matter how you try to spin it. Nolan and Bale were right to resist-- not to mention that universe is not even remotely anything like Snyder's vision for Batman, as we clearly saw.

I do think hardcore fans underestimate how many casual fans actually were interested in a fourth movie with Blake as a version of Nightwing or something though, I remember a lot of people were asking about that or misinterpreted the ending and thought that was happening. But a Batman vs. Superman movie was no place for that. I think it was more of a desire to just see more stories in that universe vs. any sort of strong attachment to the character, to be fair. Plus, JGL's career was pretty hot at that time. I'm glad it was all left alone though. For the best.

I always took the ending of TDKR as not only Bruce passing the torch, but also in a meta sense, Nolan and co. passing the torch to the next creative stewards of the character. It's a reflection of how the legend of Batman endures in real life as well as in-universe for that Gotham.

 

[Eddie Dean]

I would love a comic about Robin John Blake Batman, but no interest in a movie of it.

 

[dhandler01]

Yeah, I agree, there would've been no point to that. You can't have the first Batman and Superman meetup on film and have it not be Bruce. That's kinda dead in the water. And the alternative of bringing Bale's Batman out of retirement so close to TDKR would've completely negated the trilogy's ending, no matter how you try to spin it. Nolan and Bale were right to resist-- not to mention that universe is not even remotely anything like Snyder's vision for Batman, as we clearly saw.

I do think hardcore fans underestimate how many casual fans actually were interested in a fourth movie with Blake as a version of Nightwing or something though, I remember a lot of people were asking about that or misinterpreted the ending and thought that was happening. But a Batman vs. Superman movie was no place for that. I think it was more of a desire to just see more stories in that universe vs. any sort of strong attachment to the character, to be fair. Plus, JGL's career was pretty hot at that time. I'm glad it was all left alone though. For the best.

I always took the ending of TDKR as not only Bruce passing the torch, but also in a meta sense, Nolan and co. passing the torch to the next creative stewards of the character. It's a reflection of how the legend of Batman endures in real life as well as in-universe for that Gotham.

Oh I wanted that film...I like JGL and thought that could have been a great twist. But the Nolanverse needed to be self contained otherwise certain elements stop making sense.

 

[I Am The Knight]

So I'm just reading that report that says that WB is considering scrapping The Flash entirely if the situation with Miller gets worse. Even though Grandpa Keaton may not care that much these days imagine returning to your signature role after 30 years and all of your 3 different appearances getting scrapped, 2 of them actual movies I hope he got paid well.

 

[BatLobster]

I mean...how much worse can it get? Murder?

This is such a disaster. Something in our timeline is really pushing back hard against the possibility of seeing Michael Keaton as Batman again.

 

[Gothamsknight]

It's crazy honestly. And Keaton had gotten sort of screwed over after Batman Returns in the 90s with Burton essentially being kicked off of making a 3rd Batman film. It just sucks all around. Most importantly though is that Ezra is a POS and I don't think their work should be celebrated.

I do really want to see what Keatons done with the character all of these years later though. WB could go the HBO Max route.

 

[Jermobooka]

Even after all that Miller has done, I still want to see The Flash. I don’t even care if it’s unceremoniously dropped on HBO Max, I just want to see the return of Keatonbat and the Burtonverse. Hell, it’d be cool just to see a live action Flashpoint.

I don’t know about the rest of ‘ya, but I’d be pretty damn bummed if it went the way of the Batgirl and disappeared off the face of the earth.

 

[BatLobster]

Most importantly though is that Ezra is a POS and I don't think their work should be celebrated.

To be fair though, should the actions actions of one person be weighed against all the hard work of the cast and crew? If we're just looking at the situation ethically, removed from any business considerations I think that's a fair point to bring up. Granted, I know he's the star, but still.

Let's be honest though...Tom Cruise has done a great job cleaning up his image and staying out of the news while winning our hearts over with his insane dedication to this movies...but he's still a leading member of horrible abusive, brainwashing cult. We all turn a blind eye and enjoy the crap out of the M:I movies and Top Gun Maverick. Just saying!

I think we can all walk and chew gum at the same time and separate the art from the artist. I hope we get to see the movie...one way or another. I guess my feelings on this are less conflicted because I've never cared for Ezra's Flash anyway. The appeal of this movie was always 100% on Keaton's Batman for me. This is a situation where someone's mental health is in freefall and I think Ezra is in serious need of help. I'm not a fan of them, but something is obviously very wrong when an individual who seemingly has it all proceeds to do everything they can to piss it all away.

 

[Gothamsknight]

To be fair though, should the actions actions of one person be weighed against all the hard work of the cast and crew? If we're just looking at the situation ethically, removed from any business considerations I think that's a fair point to bring up. Granted, I know he's the star, but still.

Let's be honest though...Tom Cruise has done a great job cleaning up his image and staying out of the news while winning our hearts over with his insane dedication to this movies...but he's still a leading member of horrible abusive, brainwashing cult. We all turn a blind eye and enjoy the crap out of the M:I movies and Top Gun Maverick. Just saying!

I think we can all walk and chew gum at the same time and separate the art from the artist. I hope we get to see the movie...one way or another. I guess my feelings on this are less conflicted because I've never cared for Ezra's Flash anyway. The appeal of this movie was always 100% on Keaton's Batman for me. This is a situation where someone's mental health is in freefall and I think Ezra is in serious need of help. I'm not a fan of them, but something is obviously very wrong when an individual who seemingly has it all proceeds to do everything they can to piss it all away.

I'm in total agreement honestly. I don't think it's fair to Keaton, Calle, it anybody else and I do still want to see the film. It's also testing well too. It's just a weird situation all around.