The Format War

[KALEL114]

http://www.hdtvuk.tv/2007/07/universal_feeli.html

Wow. This is great news. If Universal switches; game,set,match.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

I am not joking or trying to be an ass but isn't Universal's backing of HD dvd basically going through the five stages of death? Denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and finally acceptance?

 

[KALEL114]

Looks like it.^

For those looking for a BluRay player deal, run over to Walmart.

http://www.n4g.com/ClickOut.aspx?ObjID=52309

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

The new deals just piss me off to be honest. I paid over $600 for a PS3 just 2 months ago and got zero extras. Now people are getting the price cut PS3 with 5 free blu-rays.

 

[KALEL114]

The new deals just piss me off to be honest. I paid over $600 for a PS3 just 2 months ago and got zero extras. Now people are getting the price cut PS3 with 5 free blu-rays.

That's life in the technology age we live in. What's expensive now will not be for long. Remember when the first DVD player came out? Now they are practically giving them away. I'm in the same boat. I paid 530.00 from Ebay. Hey, at least we have one.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

That's life in the technology age we live in. What's expensive now will not be for long. Remember when the first DVD player came out? Now they are practically giving them away. I'm in the same boat. I paid 530.00 from Ebay. Hey, at least we have one.

I know over time things like this happen but I missed it by such a small gap and it pisses me off. Oh well not much I can do about. Also can't forgot the seperate HDMI cable I had to ****ing buy.

 

[Fading]

The new deals just piss me off to be honest. I paid over $600 for a PS3 just 2 months ago and got zero extras. Now people are getting the price cut PS3 with 5 free blu-rays.

Just wait until a year or two down the road when PS3's are about $300 as BR diodes come down further, and better movies are offered with the 5 free deal and they pack it with even more. Heck they'll probably offer a game with it too. I'm just impatient lol, I can wait a few months for the first wave of defective consoles to cycle threw, but I'm not the type to wait a year to get a slight price cut. I'd rather be playing and enjoying it the whole time.

Edit - Just read that, that's actually 7 free movies with that lower priced BR player...damn.

 

[Downhere]

I know over time things like this happen but I missed it by such a small gap and it pisses me off. Oh well not much I can do about. Also can't forgot the seperate HDMI cable I had to ****ing buy.

I hope you didn't pay a lot for that cable.

A matter of fact, for those who may need to buy HDMI cables, buy them online at places like monoprice.com. Don't pay more than 10-20 bucks for an HDMI cable.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

I hope you didn't pay a lot for that cable.

A matter of fact, for those who may need to buy HDMI cables, buy them online at places like monoprice.com. Don't pay more than 10-20 bucks for an HDMI cable.

Nah I am not that gullible. I only paid $9 bucks with the shipping already included. It is just an irritation because the whole ****ing point of the PS3 is HD and you pay all of that money and it isn't even HD ready out of the box?

 

[Downhere]

^ Glad you didn't get ripped off when it came to the HDMI cable. And your right, the PS3 should have an HDMI cable in the box, considering the PS3 is all about HD. I mean, it would only cost Sony a buck or less if they buy in bulk.

 

[BatMatt]

I don't mind that I payed $600 just over 7 months ago, but I wouldn't mind the free Blu-Ray's even if they're not my favorite movies

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

Just wait until a year or two down the road when PS3's are about $300 as BR diodes come down further, and better movies are offered with the 5 free deal and they pack it with even more. Heck they'll probably offer a game with it too. I'm just impatient lol, I can wait a few months for the first wave of defective consoles to cycle threw, but I'm not the type to wait a year to get a slight price cut. I'd rather be playing and enjoying it the whole time.

Edit - Just read that, that's actually 7 free movies with that lower priced BR player...damn.

Yeah it isn't really the fact that I missing out on 5-7 free blu-rays but that I got ZERO extras. I know that the first buyers of the PS3 got like a free blu-ray with their system so I must have been in the jerk-off group that bought one in the time between of no extras.

 

[imdaly]

http://www.hdtvuk.tv/2007/07/universal_feeli.html

This article, which includes more quotes from Universal higher-ups, paints a very different picture about the "pressure" that Universal is supposed to be feeling: http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117968570.html?categoryid=20&cs=1

 

[DorkyFresh]

Well don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with backing a company, but refusing to buy a better product or wishing that product failure because of who's backing it is a different story.

Like me, if I had to choose I'd be a Sony guy. Up until the PS3 they've kept me very happy with the PS1 and 2, and come out with some amazing and sometimes quirky games other consoles wouldn't release. Even now their trying hard to make up for past mistakes by cramming even more in with firmware and free games like home. If however HD-DVD were far and clearly superior to BR in everyway, I wouldn't buy BR or back it just because Sony backs it.

It's when I go to places like Best Buy and hear the employees say things like (have actually heard this and corrected them), "No, Disney doesn't back Blu-Ray, their HD-DVD exclusive, and HD actually has far better picture and space", to customers not in the know that get to me. And that they would lie to customers to help sell a product just because it's competing against another product who has one backer they don't like is even worse of a reason.

Nothing against anyone who does, but I'm going off the hardware. I like BR and not because Sony backs it. I run out of space quick despite having 2 80GB harddrives, having a 50-200GB (eventually) burnable BR disk drive is great to me. The extra bonuses they'll be able to fit on the disks once they start using more of the space will be great. The companies that already back it, and buisnesses like Blockbuster and now even anime companies like Funimation. It's on equal video quality with HD-DVD, and from what I read even better sound. It's quickly lowering it's prices on hardware, and the price of the actual movies on it are often equal to HD-DVD prices and on a few actually lower. That's why I back BR.

great post! i'm not sure, exactly, about blu-ray's picture quality but i could've sworn i read somewhere that it's a tad better than hd-dvd's. anywho...i totally agree what everything you said.

 

[Downhere]

but i could've sworn i read somewhere that it's a tad better than hd-dvd's.

No, both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray have similar picture and audio quality. For each film it will depend on the source they use, usually for newer films the source for each film should be in pristine shape, and would therefore have similar picture quality on either HD-DVD or Blu-Ray.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

Yeah from everything I have read the difference in picture and sound there is hardly any difference. It just depends which movie. The only real things that HD-DVD has over Blu-Ray is Universal and way more bonus features and interactivity. But over time Blu-Ray will have both of those.

 

[Downhere]

Blu-Ray should have had everything HD-DVD has from the beginning.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

Blu-Ray should have had everything HD-DVD has from the beginning.

Well the fact is they rushed the product into the market so things will take time to come around.

 

[Downhere]

Well the fact is they rushed the product into the market so things will take time to come around.

Yes, I know, which was because they wanted to release around the same time as HD-DVD. Without HD-DVD, we would be stuck with sub par Blu-Ray releases and high prices. Either way, the technology wasn't ready and still isn't totally where it should be.

 

[Zenien]

For you first point they rushed out because Toshiba rushed out. It's a lot easier to standardize format options when you only have a small handful of companies backing it. Blu Ray has to deal with and juggle a much larger pool of the industry heavyweights.

Toshiba and Universal just wanted to hold onto their old monopoly of the market instead of joining with what the vast majority of the industry was set to support and put out there. Any company would have probably done the same in similar circumstance's, but it's not like the Blu Ray group felt they had much of a choice. Though both BRD group and the HD-DVD group have each other to thank for their plunging player prices which is why initially the format was is a good thing.

 

[Downhere]

For you first point they rushed out because Toshiba rushed out. It's a lot easier to standardize format options when you only have a small handful of companies backing it. Blu Ray has to deal with and juggle a much larger pool of the industry heavyweights.

Well, while you say Toshiba rushed out with HD-DVD, they still delivered a completed product. The only feature it didn't have at start was Dolby TrueHD, which was later added to first generation players via firmware. Now, Blu-Ray came out with a player that did not have the finalized specs for profile 1.1, which still hasn't been completed but will be later in the year. In my honest opinion, this should have been finalized for first generation players.

Also, when it comes to standardizing a format, however many companies backing it has nothing to do with how long it takes. Sony had many years to finialize their format, considering they started working on Blu-Ray at the time DVD became the next standard. Sony and Philips weren't happy that their MultiMedia Compact Disc was abandoned in favor of Toshiba's DVD format and they didn't get the royalties they thought they would get so Sony, with Panasonic, immediately started work on a HD format. Toshiba also started working on a next gen solution as well. I mean, considering the royalties they get from DVD, they weren't going to lose all those profits.

Toshiba and Universal just wanted to hold onto their old monopoly of the market instead of joining with what the vast majority of the industry was set to support and put out there. Any company would have probably done the same in similar circumstance's, but it's not like the Blu Ray group felt they had much of a choice.

Considering Toshiba was the force behind DVD, do you think they would want to give up the royalties they get from new technology? Of course they would move ahead with their own format. It was the next progression from DVD. The Blu-Ray group (specifically Sony and Panasonic) tried to use their shady tactics to block the invention of HD-DVD for their own gain. For example...


Back in 2004, the U.S. Department of Justice made preliminary inquiries into purported efforts by members of the Blu-ray group to use their voting power in the DVD Forum collectively to thwart development of the HD DVD format.

At the time, there were widespread reports that Sony, Matsu****a and Panasonic, in particular, used their positions on the DVD Forum steering committee to deny HD DVD-developer Toshiba the absolute majority it needed to pass resolutions, by abstaining from voting.

In fact, the Justice Department’s interest in the actions of the Blu-ray group likely predated the information request in 2004, largely thanks to the efforts of Warner Home Video, which at the time was a strong supporter of the HD DVD format and had complained to Justice officials about Blu-ray’s actions as early as 2002.

Warner ultimately dropped those complaints, and the department’s investigation fizzled out.

http://www.videobusiness.com/article/CA6458096.html

Now mind you, the reason Warner dropped the complaints was because the DVD Forum changed their policy on abstaining from a vote counting as a no vote. Before, Blu-Ray companies were able to block HD-DVD related votes by simply abstaining.

Though both BRD group and the HD-DVD group have each other to thank for their plunging player prices which is why initially the format was is a good thing.

I would thank HD-DVD more for prices coming down on both formats. If HD-DVD didn't exist everyone would still be paying high prices for a Blu-Ray Player. Also, the first releases on Blu-Ray weren't all that hot. HD-DVD set a standard in picture quality which got Blu-Ray to play catch up with. I remember all the hoopla over The Fifth Element. Sony blamed the Samsung Blu-Ray player for how it looked and Samsung blamed Sony for crappy encoding. Of course Sony then took back blaming Samsung and then blamed the source saying it wasn't in good condition to begin with.

 

[imdaly]

Welcome to the thread, Downhere.

 

[Fading]

To push back BR's release date would have been to push back the PS3's release date and give HD-DVD more of a foothold in the format war.

It took months for BR to catch up in sales, imagine if they gave HD-DVD almost a years headstart while they waited. It also gives more time for BR backers to look at HD-DVD without competition and decide to jump over to it. Not to count HD-DVD in a lot of areas is a modified and tweaked DVD. They can use a lot of the same manufacturing plants, and had a board to jump off of to start. BR is a new technology so it shouldn't be surprising that it has more kinks to work out. They are fixing a lot of their problems at a surprising rate tho, by this time next year we won't even remember talking about this probably.

 

[Zenien]

What used to be exclusive HD-DVD backer, HDScape now chose to support Blu-ray as well

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/sh...h-Def_Menu/776


HDScape Adds Blu-ray to its High-Def Menu
Tue Jul 17, 2007 at 03:01 PM ET
Tags: Disc Announcements, DVD International (all tags)

DVD International has announced that it will bring its entire HDScape library of scenic high-definition titles to Blu-ray disc beginning in late 2007.

Though the distributor has already released its HDScape catalog on HD DVD (an eight-strong line-up that currently includes such titles as 'Antarctica Dreaming,' 'Visions of the Sea' and 'Stargaze'), until now they had eschewed supporting Blu-ray. Now, in a press release out this morning, the company says it will add Blu-ray support by the end of 2007.


"Since its inception almost one year ago, HDScape has become the premier source for scenic high definition content that turns any HDTV into a beautiful work of art. Now is the ideal time to bring our library to the Blu-ray community, so that they can experience just how beautiful high definition artwork can be," said David Goodman, President of DVD International.

The company has not yet announced exact street dates for its upcoming Blu-ray HDScape titles, nor specs or pricing. However, DVD International has confirmed that all of its Blu-ray HDScape will be "recorded and mastered in stunning high definition video," as well as include either Dolby TrueHD or Dolby Digital 5.1 surround audio.

 

[Downhere]

Welcome to the thread, Downhere.

Thanks.

They are fixing a lot of their problems at a surprising rate tho, by this time next year we won't even remember talking about this probably.

Indeed they are, which is due to the competition. If Blu-Ray didn't have HD-DVD to contend with they would have taken their sweet little time getting things up to spec. But I am glad that by next year they should have everything squared away.