The List of Things That Batman 89 Got Right/Wrong

[DocLathropBrown]

I move that this thread be closed. I've had enough of the comparison threads.

 

[SHADOWBAT69]

I move that this thread be closed. I've had enough of the comparison threads.

motion seconded.

 

[The Empire Ape]

Batman is a character who's been around long enough that he is afforded multiple interpretations. And I think that's a very good thing.

It's better to have these varying concepts of the character (60s show, Burton, Schumacher, Nolan, TAS, etc.) BC that way it doesn't get boring. And also that way there's something for every kind of Batman fan.

If you're a fan of the bold, bright comic book world with colorful villains and sidekicks and gadgets you've got the Schumacher films. Or if you're a fan of the modern day Batman we're getting in the books now under the pens of Jeph Loeb or Greg Rucka we've got Nolan's films.

I'm still waiting for my movie who brings the 70s/80s-Batman to screen.

 

[GoogleMe94]

im dont really care what any batman got "right ot wrong", as long as i enjoy it. and i enjoyed this movie immensly. srsly, i could write a 2 page essay on what begins got wrong, but i know that would upset the fanboys some.

 

[Cain]

I'm still waiting for my movie who brings the 70s/80s-Batman to screen.

So am I friend, so am I. 70's to early 80's Batman FTW.

 

[CFE]

So am I friend, so am I. 70's to early 80's Batman FTW.

I'd bounce off the walls if they did a Dennis O'Neal/Neal Adams Batman film.

Maybe the new animated DC Universe film line will make that dream become a reality.

CFE

 

[Spider-Bat]

Burton got a lot more right than Nolan. that new Joker is a joke.

 

[CFE]

Burton got a lot more right than Nolan. that new Joker is a joke.

I'd have to disagree, just on the basis of what I said earlier about "varying interpretations"

While one aspect of the Joker is that of a man who'd be zany enough to fry someone with a joy buzzer, there's another aspect of him that wouldn't hesitate to run down the street spitting machine gun fire into innocent bystanders.

Nolan's Joker, from what I've seen, is just as valid as Burton's...just in a different way.

CFE

 

[DocLathropBrown]

I'm still waiting for my movie who brings the 70s/80s-Batman to screen.

I find the first Burton film to be very much in the vein of the 70s and 80s comics. Less so DKR like everybody likes to say. Being that the 70s and 80s comics are my absolute favorite era, it's obvious why B89 is my favorite Batfilm.

 

[The Empire Ape]

I find the first Burton film to be very much in the vein of the 70s and 80s comics. Less so DKR like everybody likes to say. Being that the 70s and 80s comics are my absolute favorite era, it's obvious why B89 is my favorite Batfilm.

Yeah, the DKR isn't so much present in the Burton movies - and even not in Batman Begins. And both movies have a little bit of the 70s. But I want it all t:

 

[DocLathropBrown]

Yeah, the DKR isn't so much present in the Burton movies - and even not in Batman Begins. And both movies have a little bit of the 70s. But I want it all t:

Too true!

So who would you have cast if the film was made in the seventies instead, and followed the 70s material we both love?

 

[The Empire Ape]

Too true!

So who would you have cast if the film was made in the seventies instead, and followed the 70s material we both love?

I'm not the greatest film expert, I'm sorry

 

[Gotham22]

From a fan's POV, killing off the Joker was a bad move. But really, from a general POV, it honestly didn't matter. If Jack had survived, what would have happened? Burton would have still made Returns, Schumacher would have made his two films. What difference would leaving the Joker in prison as opposed to death have mattered if he was never brought back into another film?

The only thing I can think of is that the fanboys would have been secure knowing Jack was locked up in Arkham Aslyum during the events of Batman Returns, Batman Forever, and Batman & Robin even though it wouldn't have made a lick of difference.

No. things would have been different if he didnt died.

 

[GoogleMe94]

Burton got a lot more right than Nolan. that new Joker is a joke.

i'd have to agree with this. so far, im not seein anything "right" with ledgers joker. the look is all wrong, i mean, nothin but the purple suit looks joker. dyed hair? painted on makeup? wtf is this? joker has ALWAYS been permawhite because he fell into acid. i know that they feel they MUST do something different from burtons version, but still, there are some things in this world that you simply do NOT mess with, and one of those things is Joker and the way hes portrayed. so far, i am not really that pumped about anything in TDK except maybe the batpod and the new cooler looking batsuit. even though the batsuit looks nothing like the comics, i am no comics purist so that doesnt bug me. but Joker....COME ON!! hes so easy to get right, and even i have to say that i like the comics joker by far when compared to what they seem to be doing with nolans joker, and im not even a big fan of the comics! really upsetting so far, i hope nolan makes him so cool that i can eat all my words, but i have my doubts.


and as for "killing off joker: good move or bad move", seriously, why does anyone want to see joker survive? that would be very anti-climactic and ppl would probably think he'll be in the next one too. i just like it when either the villian is locked up or killed off, because then there is no way he could return. they did it for Ras, they should do it for joker. cuz unlike Ras, joker is just an evil SOB who you WANT to see die by the end of the film. if nolan keeps him alive, um, that would suck, and be illogical.

 

[BubbaGump]

i'd have to agree with this. so far, im not seein anything "right" with ledgers joker. the look is all wrong, i mean, nothin but the purple suit looks joker. dyed hair? painted on makeup? wtf is this? joker has ALWAYS been permawhite because he fell into acid. i know that they feel they MUST do something different from burtons version, but still, there are some things in this world that you simply do NOT mess with, and one of those things is Joker and the way hes portrayed. so far, i am not really that pumped about anything in TDK except maybe the batpod and the new cooler looking batsuit. even though the batsuit looks nothing like the comics, i am no comics purist so that doesnt bug me. but Joker....COME ON!! hes so easy to get right, and even i have to say that i like the comics joker by far when compared to what they seem to be doing with nolans joker, and im not even a big fan of the comics! really upsetting so far, i hope nolan makes him so cool that i can eat all my words, but i have my doubts.


and as for "killing off joker: good move or bad move", seriously, why does anyone want to see joker survive? that wopuld e very anti-climactic and ppl would probably think he'll be in the next one too. i just like it when either the villian is locked up or killed off, because then there is no way he could return. they did it for Ras, they should do it for joker. cuz unlike Ras, joker is just an evil SOB who you WANT to see die by the end of the film. if nolan keeps him alive, um, that would suck, and be illogical.

And like a water snake waiting to pounce, the Googleme catches a glimpse of opportunity...and strikes.

 

[GoogleMe94]

^Precisley, hee hee.

 

[Swordmaster]

That's not a good thing

 

[Mr. Socko]

And like a water snake waiting to pounce, the Googleme catches a glimpse of opportunity...and strikes.

LOL!

 

[DocLathropBrown]

And like a water snake waiting to pounce, the Googleme catches a glimpse of opportunity...and strikes.

Brilliance. Poetry in motion. Or typeface. Whatever.

 

[Numez]

actually, something i didn't like was how the joker died. too generic and too many villains die by falling off a building like in TMNT 3, goldeneye, robocop, dick tracy, and probably others.

other than that i like this film a lot.

 

[spiderfan21]

Ok this has been bugging me for a looong time & don't get me wrong I still love this movie I have since I first saw it when I was 3 years old but as I've gotten older of course I noticed there are a TON of things Burton & co. got wrong with the movie but of course there were some things that were awesome. So if anyone wants to add to the list feel free, these are the main ones I know of.....

The Negatives:
1. Harvey Dent - Even though he was played by a great actor, Harvey has always been caucasian in the comics.

2. Jim Gordon - Horrible casting on they're part, in the movie he didn't really serve a purpose as Gordon should & of course he was about 200 pounds overweight to play him (sorry I had to say it)

3. Joker doesn't have a name (Jack Napier) & never will at least thats how it should be I think.

4. The murderer of Bruce Wayne's parents (obviously)

5. After the Joker Goon Chase with Batman/Vicki, the Batmobile is driving automatically without Batman & in a close up you can see a hand steering it inside the front window.

6. The scene where Batman takes Vicki to the Batcave they enter into the secret tunnel & you see Vicki look back to see the entrance door close but how could she see whats behind her?? (This is a minor one but still it bugs me)

7. During the Joker Parade scene you see Vicki try to drive away from the gas clouding the city but you can clearly see in the back her right side window is rolled down. (Another picky one)

8. Joker shooting Bruce in Vicki's apartment showing only a tin metal dish stopping the bullet, its not really wrong but I doubt a pan would stop a bullet & I thought Bruce always wore a bullet proof vest? In one scene anyway...

9. Letting Vicki into the Batcave! I mean come on, thats probably the dumbest part of the movie.

10. In the final battle scene with Batman & Joker, Batman says "You killed my parents" as Joker replies "I was young when I killed your parents" How would he know he killed his parents in the first place when he doesn't even know who Batman really is Bruce Wayne.

11. Killing off The Joker, this might be the one that really ticked me off. They should of kept him alive for future use & bring a little mystery to it...

Thats all I could think of for now, there were a few I couldn't remember like the editing they screwed up on in the Joker/Goons trashing the art pieces but I'm sure everyone knows that one by now.

The Positives:

1. The character of Alfred, great acting....all around awesome performance

2. The Joker, I'm sure several people will deny Jack was an awesome Joker but in my opinion he captured the character all around, the only thing I didn't like was he was a little overweight to play him but he made up for it.

3. Vicki Vale, Kim really was great if you ask me & her look was close to the comics if I remember correctly.

4. The Batmobile - I think everyone agrees the car rules

5. The Batcave, even though they didn't show much of it, it was just designed well from the equipment he had & the darkness of it.

6. The character of Batman - Keaton did very well in the suit although there were restrictions. His voice was pretty good, his eyes/face told the story. I didn't really love his Bruce Wayne but it was pretty good all around (Fans are still half & half I think).

Well thats about it, I'm sure there are a ton of things you guys can think of & comment on, remember these are just my opinions. I'll always love the movie no matter what, it never really gets old to me but I feel BB & The Dark Knight have & will blow this away...

10. Correct me if I'm wrong, but remember when Joker asked BRUCE at Vicki's apartment "Have you ever danced with the devil in the pale moonlight?" Well we only saw Joker ask him that, and so in the cathedral at the end, BATMAN asks The Joker that same question. Does that explain it?

 

[Numez]

typical not very well thought out opinion bashing burton's film.

 

[GregComicFan]

1. Lack of focus on Batman. The movie should be called "The Joker"

2. Batman being portrayed as being insane, like his villains.

3. Joker being the murderer of the Wayne family. This creates a neat, tidy "circular plot", where Joker creates Batman, and Batman kills the Joker, so he basically got revenge, and now he has no reason to still be Batman.

4. Comissioner Gordon is non-existent


I dont care that Two-Face was portrayed by a black actor.

 

[BubbaGump]

Brilliance. Poetry in motion. Or typeface. Whatever.

I wrote it in the tone of a National Geographic nature special.

 

[Mr. Socko]

actually, something i didn't like was how the joker died. too generic and too many villains die by falling off a building like in TMNT 3, goldeneye, robocop, dick tracy, and probably others.

other than that i like this film a lot.

Just realize that Batman was released before 3/4 of the films you named. It can't be considered generic in Batman'89 if all films after it followed suit.

10. Correct me if I'm wrong, but remember when Joker asked BRUCE at Vicki's apartment "Have you ever danced with the devil in the pale moonlight?" Well we only saw Joker ask him that, and so in the cathedral at the end, BATMAN asks The Joker that same question. Does that explain it?

But in that very scene, Joker also says "I ask that of all my prey." Which indicates he has said that to others as well. So by that rationale, in the cathedral, Joker doesn't assume he's Bruce Wayne, but anyone who he has said that too. But still, your point certainly stands. This question wouldn't even be discussed had Joker not said "I ask that of all my prey," although I have previously assumed that he was just throwing that bit in for a kick simply because he doesn't tell that to anyone else in the movie.

And while we're on the discussion, I was watching Batman'89 just yesterday. And for the first time, I thought about Joker meeting Bruce in Vicki's apartment. I always looked at it as just another scene, but does it have a much larger meaning? When Joker sees "another rooster in the hen house" and does indeed recognize that it is Bruce Wayne, what is going through Joker's head? Is he thinking "I murdered this man's parents years ago, I wonder if he recognizes me." But Joker does not bring it up or even suggest it, maybe he's killed so many people, he can't be bothered to recall them all. But conversely, "Have you ever danced with..." could have represented Joker knowing quite vividly that he killed this man's parents and know it's time to kill him.

1. Lack of focus on Batman. The movie should be called "The Joker"

2. Batman being portrayed as being insane, like his villains.

3. Joker being the murderer of the Wayne family. This creates a neat, tidy "circular plot", where Joker creates Batman, and Batman kills the Joker, so he basically got revenge, and now he has no reason to still be Batman.

4. Comissioner Gordon is non-existent


I dont care that Two-Face was portrayed by a black actor.

1. As Tim Burton has stated so many times, I mean numerously, if you don't understand why there is such a large focus on the villains then you just don't get the point. In Tim Burton's vision, Batman is a mysterious character that prefers to remain hidden. By the wonderfully weaved narrative in Batman '89, it clearly shows Tim wanted the psyche of Batman to be revealed throughout the entire 2 hour film instead of saying it up front. Batman is a mysterious character, who you don't learn about completely until the film is near over which usually concludes the viewer with "ahh, so thats why he..." The villains are the people who want to be in the limelight, they are colorful and bizarre.

2. Batman isn't insane, but he is near that brink. Any man who dresses as a bat in the night to take on the criminal underworld is most definitely out of the ordinary.

3. How can you say he "now has no reason to still be Batman"? Have you ever seen Batman Returns? It clearly illustrates that he is still Batman because evil is always lurking, and will never fully be gone from Gotham City. It is also never stated in Batman '89 that he is Batman simply because he didn't get revenge on his parent's murderer. So no, your reasoning doesn't stand no matter how you look at it.

4. This I agree with. But Gordon was not meant to have a larger role, and he didn't in the 30s and 40s of the comic books. Which is partially the era this film is based upon.

I agree, Harvey Dent being black wasn't a problem.