Transformers The Reviews Thread

[The Kid]

wow. you missed the point completely.

It didn't matter if FF2 was far better than FF1.

It still did worse than FF1 at the box office because FF1 was shallow.

TF2 could do worse because TF1 is shallow.

But you guys don't really care if the franchise has legs, right? Just as long as you get 2 hours of explosions with Tyrese in the mix your happy, even if it means the franchise will suffer an early demise.

Not every movie's a masterpiece.

 

[blind_fury]

Not every movie's a masterpiece.

Not asking for a masterpiece, just a movie that attempts to be more than just an empty spectacle with loud explosions.

One that resonates with movie goers so it doesn't hurt the franchise later due to lost interest.

 

[The Kid]

You sure seem like all you want is fu-gunshot-ing gone with the wind.

 

[blind_fury]

You sure seem like all you want is friggin gone with the wind.

No. I want more than an empty spectacle that loses it's novelty days after the franchise is born.

 

[Marvin]

What about the comics? You think they were more shallow than a boy trying to get laid while Megatron looks for magical glasses?
yea comics are a good source(tell that to singer) thing is, they're not the 80's show...and as it's been stated before, "Bay" has already strayed from the "original material"
with that line of thinking "he" may as well have looked at Beast wars and Beast machines for rich material while he was at it

Even the most adamant Bay apologist can't be that stubborn.
u don't have to be an adamant bay apologist to argue with faulty logic


no, the dark horizons review confirms what we feared the most.


"It's a tough task adapting an 80's children's show into a workable film, yet a real chance to invent a rich and compelling mythology is never even attempted - rather cheap tricks and only a semblance of story to try and link the action sequences together."

One could just as easily assume that instead of referring to the flimsy 80's material...or that he's specifically referring to a few of the well written comic books!
One could infact assume that he's insinuating that the producers should have in fact strayed away from the complaisant and dated(by todays standard) ideas from the 80's and just went 21st century sci-fi with it

how many other reviews have said it's the corny lines and homages to fans and original "stuff" that hurts the movie most...

"Whereas truly great Summer films get more rewarding on subsequent glances, this packs all its power on the initial viewing and that viewing will please most everyone from fanboys to casual cinemagoers. It's not a movie that you need to see again however, and whilst it'll probably be one of the better films of the season - it ultimately doesn't have the weight let alone staying power to sit fondly in retrospect."

that's 100% subjective opinion and u know it!
how many ppl have already clamoured at a repeat viewing....
(as "deep" as batman begins "was" i can't bear to watch it twice (same goes for SR)


Most people loved the first POTC. Based on the above review "[Transformer] ultimately doesn't have the weight let alone staying power to sit fondly in retrospect."

that films sequels have just as much "weight" if not more...why are they being ill recieved by audiences?(hint: pirates 3 has way too much for a summer audience not willing to commit themselves to continuity heavy LOTR stuff...save that for the winter season)

But you don't care if the franchise suffers an early death because the first one was a big giant spectacle without anything else. Do you?

don't presume to know what i care about

 

[Marvin]

yeah we covered this already. I stated:

"I simply pointed out the part of the review that worried me. I'm not here just to be a Bay cheerleader. I'm a skeptic who demands more from a TF movie than explosions and flashy effects. Of course I'm going to analyze what the movie is lacking and how it can be improved upon."

i do understand this tho

with Superman returns
i demanded more than a vison-less hack without the ability to go beyond regurgitating the source material(if u can call donners that) but rather elevate it with an imaginative take on the this the visual medium that is film

 

[Disclaimer]

Why is it a crime to ask for something solid from a story?

It doesn't have to be 'Citizen Kane' and nobody's saying that. Those of us disappointed in the lack of story simply wanted something to relate to, to make us want to come back and see where it goes...

This film really, honestly, seriously does NOT attempt that.

No seeds are sewn regarding the Decepticon thirst for energy. It's implied that Cybertron has no chance of more life, rendering the idea of a battle over it completely moot. We're given no reason to buy into the war except that it's over the Allspark, so that leaves very little to care about by film's end.

I have no doubt that a solid story can be created for a sequel but all good franchises - in the end of film one - leave you asking questions. This one only leaves you wondering which ones will appear next time... but you don't walk out with big questions relating to a looming war or the future of our planet.

It's just a really limp story and - honestly - it comes across as careless, because adding some depth really wouldn't have taken much effort at all.

I envy those who are content with big explosions and awesome action sequences but no one can possibly say that asking for more isn't a GOOD thing. Why aim for the lowest common denominator, when that little added effort could have made this a real sci-fi classic that appeals to all?

 

[blind_fury]

yea comics are a good source(tell that to singer) thing is, they're not the 80's show...and as it's been stated before, "Bay" has already strayed from the "original material"
with that line of thinking "he" may as well have looked at Beast wars and Beast machines for rich material while he was at it

If you want to do a Beast Wars movie, do a movie called Beast Wars.

You want to do a movie using/exploiting the popularity of G1 characters use the G1 comics which have better stories than kid trying to get laid while Megatron looks for magical glasses.

u don't have to be an adamant bay apologist to argue with faulty logic

What faulty logic? The G1 comics had better ideas/concepts than "boy tries to get laid while Megatron looks for magical glasses, hilarity ensues". That's not faulty logic, it's common knowledge.

One could just as easily assume that instead of referring to the flimsy 80's material...or that he's specifically referring to a few of the well written comic books!

except it's clear he isn't talking about a well written comic book, he's talking about a poorly written movie:

"yet a real chance to invent a rich and compelling mythology is never even attempted - rather cheap tricks and only a semblance of story to try and link the action sequences together."

how many other reviews have said it's the corny lines and homages to fans and original "stuff" that hurts the movie most...

They mostly pointed out those homages were forced and poorly executed that's why they didn't fit with the movie.

that's 100% subjective opinion and u know it!
how many ppl have already clamoured at a repeat viewing....
(as "deep" as batman begins "was" i can't bear to watch it twice (same goes for SR)

Yes all reviews are subjective that doesn't mean their constructive criticism lack merit or value.

don't presume to know what i care about

I didn't presume anything, I asked you an open ended question. Why avoid it?

Don't care if the franchise suffers an early death because the first one was a big giant spectacle without much else?

 

[Mr. Socko]

I'll reserve my final judgment till I've seen this movie.

 

[nosebleed.]

Why is it a crime to ask for something solid from a story?

It doesn't have to be 'Citizen Kane' and nobody's saying that. Those of us disappointed in the lack of story simply wanted something to relate to, to make us want to come back and see where it goes...

This film really, honestly, seriously does NOT attempt that.

No seeds are sewn regarding the Decepticon thirst for energy. It's implied that Cybertron has no chance of more life, rendering the idea of a battle over it completely moot. We're given no reason to buy into the war except that it's over the Allspark, so that leaves very little to care about by film's end.

I have no doubt that a solid story can be created for a sequel but all good franchises - in the end of film one - leave you asking questions. This one only leaves you wondering which ones will appear next time... but you don't walk out with big questions relating to a looming war or the future of our planet.

It's just a really limp story and - honestly - it comes across as careless, because adding some depth really wouldn't have taken much effort at all.

I envy those who are content with big explosions and awesome action sequences but no one can possibly say that asking for more isn't a GOOD thing. Why aim for the lowest common denominator, when that little added effort could have made this a real sci-fi classic that appeals to all?

THANK YOU!! We've been stating this for the longest time. I'm glad someone gets it

 

[Marvin]

Why is it a crime to ask for something solid from a story?

It doesn't have to be 'Citizen Kane' and nobody's saying that. Those of us disappointed in the lack of story simply wanted something to relate to, to make us want to come back and see where it goes...
hard to argue when ur like the only person who as "seen" the movie

This film really, honestly, seriously does NOT attempt that.
I'd love to take ur opinion at face value...i really would

No seeds are sewn regarding the Decepticon thirst for energy. It's implied that Cybertron has no chance of more life, rendering the idea of a battle over it completely moot. We're given no reason to buy into the war except that it's over the Allspark, so that leaves very little to care about by film's end.
I'd say this story was based around the events on earth and didn't need any further diffusion with the many concepts of outter space/cybertron/vectorsigma/dinobots/and a continuity(ask alot of the new audience) spacial war that really has no need to be explored just yet

I have no doubt that a solid story can be created for a sequel but all good franchises - in the end of film one - leave you asking questions. This one only leaves you wondering which ones will appear next time... but you don't walk out with big questions relating to a looming war or the future of our planet.
Weather u ask that question on tuesday(about the space war) or not won't effect how successful the next film will be(ie: when all that other exposition really beings for those of u who are wondering what's next duh)

It's just a really limp story and - honestly - it comes across as careless, because adding some depth really wouldn't have taken much effort at all.
sure it would...adding that would have taken away from sam(the human element)...and weather u like it or not the human element is the protagonist in this story...

I envy those who are content with big explosions and awesome action sequences but no one can possibly say that asking for more isn't a GOOD thing. Why aim for the lowest common denominator, when that little added effort could have made this a real sci-fi classic that appeals to all?

I envy them too

and yes we've seen plenty of straight up sci fi that appeals to all in this day and age
(by appeals i ALSO mean is successful)
ahem
serenity
startrek films
starwars films
etc

like it or not little johnny and suzy who watch the laguna beach on monday night are gonna get a way bigger kick outta Shia's teen angst than vector sigma jargon...
the majority of the country that voted bush is gonna cheer deep down in their hearts for a multi cultural group in army clothes working together and taking down a threat or two
the jocks that thought only geeks went to see LOTR on a wed in full costume are no doubt gonna love muscle cars, and sun kissed girls
I can go on all night

my point

don't talk about appealing to everyone one ur just thinking of one group...
urself

 

[The Kid]

No. I want more than an empty spectacle that loses it's novelty days after the franchise is born.

Aren't they preping a 300 sequel sometime soon?

I thought that movie was michael bay on crack, but it's doing fine.

stop worrying you girly man.

 

[Figs]

Aren't they preping a 300 sequel sometime soon?

I thought that movie was michael bay on crack, but it's doing fine.

stop worrying you girly man.

LOL, Jesus! Wesyeed, you just love starting **** storms don't ya.

 

[blind_fury]

I
I can go on all night

my point

don't talk about appealing to everyone one ur just thinking of one group...
urself

Yes most people enjoy explosions and flashy effects but they also want memorable stories and characters that resonate beyond a superficial level.

If a movie has both style and substance it helps the franchise in the long run. Otherwise people lose interest after the novelty of the style wears off.

 

[YÅ«gi's BM]

Those 'magical glasses' are, you know, the map to a powerful and dangerous item that could tip the balance in the war, right?

 

[blind_fury]

Aren't they preping a 300 sequel sometime soon?

I thought that movie was michael bay on crack, but it's doing fine.

Don't count your chicks before they hatched.

stop worrying you girly man.

You're teh girly man...girly man.

omg pwnage!!!1!

 

[ShadowBoxing]

If you want to do a Beast Wars movie, do a movie called Beast Wars.

You want to do a movie using/exploiting the popularity of G1 characters use the G1 comics which have better stories than kid trying to get laid while Megatron looks for magical glasses.

Megatron/Galvatron did tend to look for magical things, especially in the cartoon. Aztec crystals, Atlantis, the Decepticon Matrix, Ruby Crystals, the Pearl of Bahuddin, The Matrix, Vector Sigma, of and the list goes on and on and on. And in the story he isn't looking for "magical glasses", he inscribed a code on the glasses once he was activated accidentally, and since he is in stasis his Decepticons must find them to find the Allspark. This actually comes straight out of Beast Wars when Megatron (the Decepticon leader, not the Predacon leader) inscribed a map on the Satillite orbiting earth with a message for future Decepticons.

And Beast Wars IS Transformers, whether you want to separate them or not, and it's a LOT more influential than G1 was...which essentially now is rewritten off the basis of what Beast Wars laid down. Beast Wars not only is Transformers, it's the most successful and popular incarnation to date...especially among the fanbase. Drawing from that, as far as any fan is concerned, is not only fine, it's necessary. Almost as necessary as minicons have become in toylines.

What faulty logic? The G1 comics had better ideas/concepts than "boy tries to get laid while Megatron looks for magical glasses, hilarity ensues". That's not faulty logic, it's common knowledge.

That was more or less the first story. Megatron came down to Earth, Buster was trying to get laid at a drive in theatre. A war erupts in the parking lot and he and his "girlfriend" end up in the back seat of Bumblebee. Bob Budinsky had some great stories later on, but unfortunately all the stuff he and Simon Furman did that was really good was unadaptable as it requires some backing first.

except it's clear he isn't talking about a well written comic book, he's talking about a poorly written movie:

"yet a real chance to invent a rich and compelling mythology is never even attempted - rather cheap tricks and only a semblance of story to try and link the action sequences together."

You couldn't develop much of a mythology in the first film if you wanted to. I haven't seen his movie yet, but one of the smart things Singer did was utillize a very simple and straight forward story for X1. Sure it wasn't great, and in some cases it was just stringing action sequences together...but it was a good setup for the sequel. And the comic adaptation reads well and is satisfying from that angle.

They mostly pointed out those homages were forced and poorly executed that's why they didn't fit with the movie.

Again, cannot comment, haven't seen the film.

Yes all reviews are subjective that doesn't mean their constructive criticism lack merit or value.

But thus far we've seen overwhelmingly positive reviews. You're laching onto a few bad or poor reviews. I would have to say thus far the people giving it bad reviews seem to be the exception not the rule.

I didn't presume anything, I asked you an open ended question. Why avoid it?

Don't care if the franchise suffers an early death because the first one was a big giant spectacle without much else?

I highly doubt this. The film will make a TON of money irregardless, and like FF2 it will get a sequel. The thing is most people want to see big giant robots smash eachother and couldn't care less about LOTR mythology. Frankly, I myself would rather the film not delve to much into Unicron or the Matrix and perhaps try to leave the mythology building to the tie-in comics and novels. It's really hard to build a mythology off of a movie franchise, especially one with as much baggage as Transformers.

 

[blind_fury]

Those 'magical glasses' are, you know, the map to a powerful and dangerous item that could tip the balance in the war, right?

of course I know that. I clearly stated they were "magic" glasses!

 

[Mr. Socko]

What magic glasses?

 

[Marvin]

If you want to do a Beast Wars movie, do a movie called Beast Wars.

You want to do a movie using/exploiting the popularity of G1 characters use the G1 comics which have better stories than kid trying to get laid while Megatron looks for magical glasses.

movies tend to have a wider audience that comics and thus a story about a boy doing what boys do and being motivated by what boys are motivated is a smater move on the producers part than Comic book story asking alot of it's general audience (Even Raimi knows this)
Magical Glasses?

What faulty logic? The G1 comics had better ideas/concepts than "boy tries to get laid while Megatron looks for magical glasses, hilarity ensues". That's not faulty logic, it's common knowledge.
The G1 comics also had nothing for non fans...(i don't mean that literally but i also kinda do...the coming of age story present is the anchor that sells this movie to the general audience...trust me my 30 year old aunt could car less about robots and star "wars"



except it's clear he isn't talking about a well written comic book, he's talking about a poorly written movie:

He said the chance to be creative and original was missed...that could either mean;
'Bay should have given the world a straight of G1 regurdge...(because that would be new/imaginative/creative...to our cinematic would)

or

'Bay should have not told that weak however simpified G1 regurdge and imagined something new for todays star wars inflated audience

"yet a real chance to invent a rich and compelling mythology is never even attempted - rather cheap tricks and only a semblance of story to try and link the action sequences together."


They mostly pointed out those homages were forced and poorly executed that's why they didn't fit with the movie.

they also pointed out that the homages were made in the first place...
who knows what would have happend if they just created something fresh and new


Yes all reviews are subjective that doesn't mean their constructive criticism lack merit or value.
him saying that it's not a movie u need to or would enjoy seeing more than once?
sorry but ppl find replay value in all sorts of things (I can watch blade 4 times a day)
SR and BB have no replay value for lots of ppl how does he figure that

that statement is just way too "subjective imposing" on out opinion for me to stand sorry


I didn't presume anything, I asked you an open ended question. Why avoid it?

Don't care if the franchise suffers an early death because the first one was a big giant spectacle without much else?

sorry, the way u posed the question the first time had so much subtle inplication that i didn't even notice the question mark...

I do care...i also think one should keep spectacle in mind
I honestly am not excited about the Superman Returns sequel(i really don't like that movie lol) due to many things.....including lack of spectacle

I think Raimi got it right the first time
a good mix of both

but in the extreme case
I'd say if u can impress the audience with a spectacle the first time...
the second time around...that won't be enough...and that's when the story get's heavy

 

[Tempest19]

But thus far we've seen overwhelmingly positive reviews. You're laching onto a few bad or poor reviews. I would have to say thus far the people giving it bad reviews seem to be the exception not the rule.

Exactly.

I am seeing ALOT of t: reviews and not so many, if any at all reviews.

I myself would rather the film not delve to much into Unicron or the Matrix and perhaps try to leave the mythology building to the tie-in comics and novels.

That would be cool, don't know if I can keep up though. I'd try an inbetween to see if I can follow it. I did love the OFFICIAL books in between the 'AOTC' and 'ROTS'. Really gave me a larger connection to the characters, their world and their relationship. Very great books, imo, that bridge the gap perfectly.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

What magic glasses?

They aren't magic. When Megatron was found in the ice by this explorer (Spike's great grandfather), he activated a laser from his eye (I think) and inscribed a map to the Allspark (for his Decepticons to find) on the glasses. Hardly magic.

 

[Figs]

What magic glasses?

The ones the decepticons wear to read their lines since their lines are so small. t:
I'll be here all night folks..... . That was horrible lol.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

The ones the decepticons wear to read their lines since their lines are so small. t:
I'll be here all night folks..... . That was horrible lol.

Starscream: Excuse me, Mister Bay, all my lines just say "BLARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!"
Bay: Just stick to the script.

 

[Disclaimer]

Perhaps I read it wrong... but, Marvin, were you questioning whether I've "seen" the movie?

Because I have. And I don't consider myself in some kind of special league for the honour.

Firstly, the film hit cinemas TODAY in Australia... and advance screenings (of which I saw one Monday) have been going on for weeks. I went to free MySpace one.

Geez...

Oh, and as for my apparent need to only refer to a single group (myself), you're a fool. Appealing to all includes myself, does it not? I never said the film shouldn't appeal to those you listed - I'm saying it should also appeal to those of us (and, believe me, I'm not alone) who value quality from a story.

I can't believe I even wasted the finger energy responding to you when you're clearly missing the point.