The Year 2012 (Merged)

[A&W]

There is no scientific basis for the assumption that a reversal in the earth's magnetic field will create tsunamis. Not one little bit.

It depends. Scientists claim it will happen gradually and that we are in the middle of this change right now, which is why the earth's magnetic north pole's movement has been accelerating so much for the last several decades.

In that case nothing to worry about. yeah it will cause a lot of extinctions as species are unable to evolve fast enough to keep up with the changing weather patterns, but nothing like the doomsday scenarios predicted for 2012. Nothing the technologically advanced human race couldn't survive.

But if the conspiracy theorists are right and it happens in days or hours, then yes we are talking giant tsunamis. don't believe me?

Fill a cake pan with water, stick it in a wagon. start pulling the wagon gradually moving faster and then bam suddenly either stop or switch directions. What's going to happen to the water? You will see a big wave of water come splashing out of the pan.

 

[A&W]

if the tectonic plates have a sudden drastic change in movement than our oceans will be like the water in that pan. They will go flying everywhere.

 

[Carcharodon]

Your example is the result of Newton's first law of motion. It has nothing to do with shifts in magnetic fields. The earth isn't expected to stop spinning.

Try again.

 

[Paroxysm]

this is the only conspiracy theory or doomsday theory I have ever given the time of day. this is the only time I've ever felt afraid of looking crazy to others while expressing my beliefs or concerns as well.

i suggest you seek some kind of psychiatric help, you could be suffering from the beginning stages of Kenophobia.

 

[A&W]

Your example is the result of Newton's first law of motion. It has nothing to do with shifts in magnetic fields. The earth isn't expected to stop spinning.

Try again.

I didn't say the earth was going to stop spinning. I said that if continental drift's current patterns were disrupted or altered suddenly, the oceans would spill over the continents temporarily. I don't think anybody really disputes that.

The only thing that is really disputed is whether or not this pole shift is going to be instant or gradual. When I use the word "only" I say that because not many people are putting any empasis on the 2012 nuclear war or the return of Jesus, the mayan god, or some alien invasion.

There would be no way for the Mayans to predict that.

 

[Carcharodon]

I didn't say the earth was going to stop spinning. I said that if continental drift's current patterns were disrupted or altered suddenly, the oceans would spill over the continents temporarily. I don't think anybody really disputes that.

Yet you've provided no explanation of HOW the current patterns will be disrupted or altered. Continental drift occurs at a rate equivalent to the growth rate of your fingernails, hardly enough in terms of momentum to displace the volumes of water you're talking about.

When you say, "I don't think anybody really disputes that," bear in mind that you're talking to a scientist. A scientist who "disputes that."

Do you even know what causes tsunamis? Do you have even the foggiest idea of the nature of the relationship between the earth's magnetic field and plate tectonics? Do you know WHY the plates move?

Explain how a polar shift would disrupt tectonic activity with even remotely enough significance to cause global flooding. That's what I'm waiting for.

(I don't even know why I'm bothering with this. I must be really, really bored. )

 

[A&W]

sorry I should have explained better. the magnetic fields are what would cause the pole ****. the pole shift (keep in mind that first law of motion) is what would cause the tsunamis.

 

[Carcharodon]

That makes no sense.

 

[Paroxysm]

sorry I should have explained better. the magnetic fields are what would cause the pole ****. the pole shift (keep in mind that first law of motion) is what would cause the tsunamis.

 

[Carcharodon]

I think he believes that the world is going to invert itself. Like, literally flip over.

 

[A&W]

Yet you've provided no explanation of HOW the current patterns will be disrupted or altered. Continental drift occurs at a rate equivalent to the growth rate of your fingernails, hardly enough in terms of momentum to displace the volumes of water you're talking about.

When you say, "I don't think anybody really disputes that," bear in mind that you're talking to a scientist. A scientist who "disputes that."

hey buddy, chill out a little. keep it friendly. I am trying to form an opinion and hoping that others who have researched it will respond with information key to certain points. I admitted that a lot of this was over my head, especially with the magnetism.

When you say, "I don't think anybody really disputes that," bear in mind that you're talking to a scientist. A scientist who "disputes that."

Wrong. You are disputing the end of the world. I said that if there was a sudden disruption to continental drift it would cause huge tsunamis. No scientist is disputing that part. None.

Do you even know what causes tsunamis? Do you have even the foggiest idea of the nature of the relationship between the earth's magnetic field and plate tectonics?

I'm guessing earthquakes for starters. Why ask me in such a sarcastic tone of voice?

Explain how a polar shift would disrupt tectonic activity with even remotely enough significance to cause global flooding. That's what I'm waiting for.

I will read up on pole reversals more to look at it's effect on that. That is why I'm having this conversation. To form an opinion. having other mentions things like that gives me something new to think about. I don't claim to be a scientist. It's just that first I heard about this theory, and then bam coincedence, after coincedence, after coincedence seems to support it, and then the fact that nobody has offered a plausible explanation as to how the Mayans knew what they knew about the existence of galaxies, black holes, and even the location of the black hole at the center of the galaxy. How could they have possibly known?

Can I ask what kind of scientist you are or what you do for a living?

I also like to add that it is possible that many scientist have been purposely kept in the dark. When it comes to astronomy and anything related to outer space, everything they think about relies on data gotten somewhere else. If this was being covered up, surely much of the data given to many scientists has been falsified.

Certain physics laws and data might have been kept hidden to keep people from finding out.

 

[C. Lee]

,or some alien invasion.

There would be no way for the Mayans to predict that.

Why not? Maybe some aliens told them they thought humans tasted good and would come back with thier friends on 2012 for a big shindig.

 

[Carcharodon]

Wrong. You are disputing the end of the world. I said that if there was a sudden disruption to continental drift it would cause huge tsunamis. No scientist is disputing that part. None.

I'm disputing the idea that the pole-shift will disrupt continental drift.

Can I ask what kind of scientist you are or what you do for a living?

Marine biologist.

I also like to add that it is possible that many scientist have been purposely kept in the dark. When it comes to astronomy and anything related to outer space, everything they think about relies on data gotten somewhere else. If this was being covered up, surely much of the data given to many scientists has been falsified.

This is basic earth-science. It's not complicated.

Certain physics laws and data might have been kept hidden to keep people from finding out.

I'm done.

 

[Paroxysm]

hahaha

 

[A&W]

hey guys I don't claim to be an expert on this or an expert on the 2012 theory. I've only been researching it for two days. so asking me questions about physics and what about this or that is kind of pointless. I don't have all the answers to this. I'm trying to find them out.

by all means though I encourage you to give me reasons and make points to doubt certain things. you might think of something I hadn't and give me something else to research or another angle to look at it from.

On some points made I'm offering rebuttal points so that they can be countered, if I don't feel satisfied by the point made.

A lot of this stuff is hard to understand, and you don't know who to believe. My reasons for being concerned are the large number of coincedences, and most of all the Mayans scientific understanding of the universe combined with the Ark story from so many religions. The only feasible way I can think of them being able to know what they know is if this happened before and humans survived it, thus the ark story. Obviously it wasn't wood, and it wasn't just two of every species. some species are a sexual.

but stories change over time.

 

[A&W]

Why not? Maybe some aliens told them they thought humans tasted good and would come back with thier friends on 2012 for a big shindig.

well yeah I guess so, but it would be a big coincedence for aliens to pick the same year that the alignment occurs.

 

[Carcharodon]

Look, I'm telling you in no uncertain terms that there is no way that the pole-shift will alter or disrupt plate tectonic activity with enough significance to cause global flooding. Period.

Pole shifts occur very frequently in terms of geologic time. They're not unique events, nor have they been linked with mass-extinction events by any stretch of the imagination.

By the way, you don't really believe that the earth flips over during a pole-shift, do you?

 

[C. Lee]

well yeah I guess so, but it would be a big coincedence for aliens to pick the same year that the alignment occurs.

So, you are saying that alien beings who would have the technology and knowhow to traverse the universe and visit other planets....wouldn't be able to figure out that there would be a planetary alignment in our area at a certain time in the future....and want to use it as a backdrop for thier great feast?

 

[A&W]

I'm disputing the idea that the pole-shift will disrupt continental drift.

Okay. You originally worded it so that it sounded like you disputing the fact that a disruption to continental drift would cause tsunamis.

Marine biologist.

that's pretty cool

This is basic earth-science. It's not complicated.

does your background give you a detailed history of the geographical history of the earth? I'm asking because for all I know marine biologists might not be that educated with earth's history, so much as they would be educated on the biology of marine animals. But because of biologists tending to know a lot about evolution, you might have to have had class after class after class of studying the earth's history. So I don't know.

If not than you shouldn't be bringing the fact that you are a scientist into the argument. It would be like a registered nurse claiming authority on global warming.

I'm done.

There is no reason to act all superior. At minimum I'm sure can understand how the coincedences would be enough to make a person look into this. The peak in solar activity, at the same time as the alignment that was predicted by people who shouldn't have been able to predict it, combined with the fact that almost every culture and religion has a story about the earth being completely flooded for a few weeks, and a large vessel containing survivors repopulated the earth.

It's a lot of coincedences. As a scientist I'm sure you realize that many discoveries are made by exploring possiblities. Not every possiblity is true, and in order to find the ones that are true, you have to look at every possiblity. You have to have an open mind. You gotta brainstorm and then take options into consideration.

Eddison made 10,000 attempts to make a light bulb before he was successful. He had to explore that many options for how to build one, before he found the right one.

Same goes for evolution, biology, astronomy, and so on. So I ask you to not talk sarcastically or try to act superior by using smileys and telling me your done.

 

[A&W]

So, you are saying that alien beings who would have the technology and knowhow to traverse the universe and visit other planets....wouldn't be able to figure out that there would be a planetary alignment in our area at a certain time in the future....and want to use it as a backdrop for thier great feast?

well it's possible, but I figure if they wanted to destroy us, they wouldn't have waited 5,000 years to do it.

 

[C. Lee]

well it's possible, but I figure if they wanted to destroy us, they wouldn't have waited 5,000 years to do it.

You forget they are aliens....5,000 years could be like a week in thier life.

 

[A&W]

Look, I'm telling you in no uncertain terms that there is no way that the pole-shift will alter or disrupt plate tectonic activity with enough significance to cause global flooding. Period.

Pole shifts occur very frequently in terms of geologic time. They're not unique events, nor have they been linked with mass-extinction events by any stretch of the imagination.

By the way, you don't really believe that the earth flips over during a pole-shift, do you?

from what I have been reading from sources independant of doomsday forseers is that normally during magnetic pole shifts no. but many of the 2012 theorists are saying yes. a new equator and everything. Alaska used to be at the equator.


History channel documentary
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Lhs7VR52Bg&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LbMUFamZV0

my concern is that if the earth has a magnetic field and the galaxy and the sun each have one as well, is it possible that they could interact somehow that cause the earth to move, wobble suddenly or anything. like the way magnets repel and attract each other.

I'm not saying they can or will because I have no idea.

 

[Carcharodon]

does your background give you a detailed history of the geographical history of the earth? I'm asking because for all I know marine biologists might not be that educated with earth's history, so much as they would be educated on the biology of marine animals. But because of biologists tending to know a lot about evolution, you might have to have had class after class after class of studying the earth's history. So I don't know.

If not than you shouldn't be bringing the fact that you are a scientist into the argument. It would be like a registered nurse claiming authority on global warming.

Plate tectonics is something I had to learn time and time again. I don't pretend to be an expert, but I do claim enough knowledge to know that what you're talking about is scientifically illogical.

Earth/physical science was a heavy portion of my curriculum.

There is no reason to act all superior. At minimum I'm sure can understand how the coincedences would be enough to make a person look into this. The peak in solar activity, at the same time as the alignment that was predicted by people who shouldn't have been able to predict it, combined with the fact that almost every culture and religion has a story about the earth being completely flooded for a few weeks, and a large vessel containing survivors repopulated the earth.

It's a lot of coincedences. As a scientist I'm sure you realize that many discoveries are made by exploring possiblities. Not every possiblity is true, and in order to find the ones that are true, you have to look at every possiblity. You have to have an open mind. You gotta brainstorm and then take options into consideration.

Eddison made 10,000 attempts to make a light bulb before he was successful. He had to explore that many options for how to build one, before he found the right one.

Same goes for evolution, biology, astronomy, and so on. So I ask you to not talk sarcastically or try to act superior by using smileys and telling me your done.

You rebutted scientific opinion with a conspiracy theory. The sarcastic smiley was warranted.

 

[Paroxysm]

from what I have been reading from sources independant of doomsday forseers is that normally during magnetic pole shifts no. but many of the 2012 theorists are saying yes. a new equator and everything. Alaska used to be at the equator.


History channel documentary
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Lhs7VR52Bg&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LbMUFamZV0

my concern is that if the earth has a magnetic field and the galaxy and the sun each have one as well, is it possible that they could interact somehow that cause the earth to move, wobble suddenly or anything. like the way magnets repel and attract each other.

I'm not saying they can or will because I have no idea.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_phenomenon

A far more apocalyptic view of the year 2012 has also spread in various media. This view has been promulgated by History Channel which, beginning in 2006, aired "Decoding the Past: Mayan Doomsday Prophecy", based loosely on John Major Jenkins' theories but with a tone he characterized as "45 minutes of unabashed doomsday hype and the worst kind of inane sensationalism". It was co-written by a science fiction author.[58] This show proved popular and was followed by many sequels: 2012, End of Days (2006), The Last Days on Earth (2008), Seven Signs of the Apocalypse, and Nostradamus 2012 (2008).[59] Discovery Channel also aired 2012 Apocalypse in 2009, suggesting that massive solar storms, flipping of the magnetic poles, earthquakes, super volcanoes, and more may occur in 2012.[60

 

[A&W]

what do you guys think about this? I'm asking because it's wikepedia and again I'm no expert.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Magnetic_Pole#Geomagnetic_reversal

it does appear that a geo magnetic reversal of the poles does have this effect.

remember the geomagnetic poles are not the same as the magnetic poles.