Comics Which version of Hobgoblin did you prefer....

[DACrowe]

Roderick Kingsley or Ned Leeds?

Since Roger Stern wrote it and I preferred it being a powerful businessman than a chump reporter, I always liked the retconn that Kingsley was Hobby. It also gave some closure to Betty Brant and made her a truly strong character for a change....like ever.

But I recently for the first time in a really long time examined the old Hobgoblin and Kingpin storylines in the '80s Spidey comics. First off these were classics, and for the most part they were written by Tom DeFalco and Peter David. Stern may have set the blueprint but they carried it out. And when I got to the climax where it was Ned Leeds and Peter blamed himself and Kingpin revealed it to Spidey to get him to attack a rival named the Foreigner and what it did to Betty, etc. The whole tragedy of the thing and Hobby hating Spidey so much because of all the horror he brought to his wife Betty, and a more logical reason for Hobby to target Flash other than him saying on TV "He could get his ass kicked by Spidey," etc. were all mroe riveting.

And the end with the first showdown with Macendale now as Hobby (a poor one at that) and Peter's rage over the whole thing....I just felt it was dramatically more satisfying than making him a poor man's Norman Osborn.

I dunno which I prefer, but I made a poll. Do you prefer the original version with Ned Leeds as theoriginal Hobby or the retconned Kingsley by the creator, then?

 

[Cyclops]

Kingsley for sure.

 

[Citizen_Kaine]

Kingsley's motivations made sense, especially now that he's a full time character in Spider-girl. However Kingsley is a retcon, and a big one at that, as Neddy boy was Hobgoblin for ten years before Hobgoblin Lives occured. Ned was dead when he was revealed as the Hobgoblin, not a great start to a succesful villian. Add to the fact that he was an extremely obvious red herring throughout the Defalco/Frenz tenure of ASM. Hating Spidey because your wife had nightmares about him? Nah, I don't buy it. Especially since the Goblin was shown to not give a **** about anyone throughout his existence, even killing the man who showed him the locations of Norman Osborn's hideouts. If Ned knew Peter and Spidey were one and the same it would be much more plausiable, especially since Peter at one point slept with Betty during her marriage to Ned. Had Leeds been the mastermind behind the Clone Saga, much of this clunky revelation would have been cleaned up. Granted Roderick Kingsley is a great character in his own right, but thats simply because he's written with the Hobgoblin persona permenantly. The Kinglsey of my Generation was a snivilling coward of a fashion designer, not some criminal genius who used his twin brother(really quality deux exmachina there ) to cover his ass when he acted as the Goblin.

 

[Tokyo Vigilante #1]

Rodderick Kingsley

Leeds seemed too "convenient."

 

[Secret_Riddle]

kingsley.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

kingleys defenitley.

 

[Vile]

Kingsley.

Ned's death just didnt make sense, as was addressed in Hobgoblin Lives.

The guy can go toe to toe with Spidey, tear off sections of buildings but gets his ass handed to him by what? 4-5 guys with pistols?

Thank God for the retcon.

 

[TwoMinutesHate]

I liked Leeds better. Leeds to the max!

 

[Silver Sable]

Roderick

 

[DACrowe]

Well personally I thought Ned's death if he was the Hobgoblin was beautiful. Here is a guy who seemed almost invincible but as they said "YOu're an ameteur who wuld've been dead long ago if Spider-Man had the guts to finish you," and he just gets his ass beat. And him crying for Spider-Man's help was the ultimate irony.

I agree Ned seemed too....convient in trying to make it someone personal again (the whole friction that led Lee and Ditko to break up was who was the GG. Ditko wanted it to be a stranger to Spidey because someone he knew was a little too much of a coincidence, particularly a "friend's" father. Albeit no one complains about Norman Osborn being GG). I suppose it is the same trap that Raimi may be falling into by making Sandman Ben's killer.

Also though, I want to point out though that while Roderick Kingsley is a better Hobby unmasked now, the whole story in ASM #289 with Macendale, Kingpin, the Foreigner and HObby's death was MUCH better and much better written/handeled than Hobgoblin Lives! Hobgoblin Lives was the most obvious retconn I think we've ever seen.

I prefer Kingsley but since both have only really had one story unmasked, Leeds' was better. Sure there is Goblin's gate but that story was Kingsley looking like a chump and getting his ass handed to him by Norman Osborn before running away with his tails between his legs.

Out of couriosity....who would like to see Kingsley and Hobby return in regular continuity though?

 

[Dangerous]

DA- Where the hell are Hobgoblin II (Arnold Lefty Donovan) & Hoggoblin IV (Jason Phillip Macendale) ?!

If ya gonna do a which 'Hobby is best poll?' (which is done every year) at least include the second best Hobgoblin- Macendale.

No I don't wanna see Kingsley return, that's one of the things that make him so great- he retired.

 

[drmick]

For a truly comprehensive poll shouldn't we have other options?

What about the Demogoblin/ real Goblin Hobgoblin?

EDIT: I've just realised the title thread differs slightly from the poll question, sorry.

 

[Vile]

Well personally I thought Ned's death if he was the Hobgoblin was beautiful. Here is a guy who seemed almost invincible but as they said "YOu're an ameteur who wuld've been dead long ago if Spider-Man had the guts to finish you," and he just gets his ass beat. And him crying for Spider-Man's help was the ultimate irony.

Thats what I mean though - The Hobgoblin during his debut and Gang War was hardly ameteurish, especially considering the schemes he was pulling the entire time.

Then you have Ned's death which just seemed very...un-Hobgoblin like. Granted, *at the time* no one questioned that ol' Neddy was and always will be the Hobgoblin but even then it just seemed...wrong. At the time, I chalked it up to crappy writing and a rushed way to usher in ol' Jack O'Lantern's transformation into a more rough and tumble Hobgoblin.

Macendale's debut, though very cool really only lasted that issue. After that, he basically became a joke and had a revolving door on his jail cell.

Hobgoblin Lives, while hardly a masterpeice of writing (brother stand-in? wha?) was, I think, very much needed as it cleaned up any loose ends...not to mention, bought back the Hobgoblin which I always felt was a worthy successor to Norman and, in most ways superior. Macendale needed to go, as he was only crapping all over the name.

I wouldnt mind seeing Kingsley return, but as Dangerous said...I wouldnt mind if he did not. Nothing wrong with a supervillain who, in the first place, frames someone and quits because he's bored - then just retires to live the good life on an island somewhere.

 

[DACrowe]

Oh I hated Macendale too. I just liked how in the story he paid an assassin to kill the original Hobby and just scoffed it off as it was such an ironic and unheroic death for Hobby. No going out in the blaze of glory like GG did, but getting killed like a ***** and the guy who paid for it runing his name...it seemed fitting.

Anyway, I did not include the other Hobgoblins because this poll is not which is your favorite HObgoblin but which version of the original Hobgoblin did you prefer, Ned or Rodderick? If I was making a poll about favorite Hobby then I just wouldn't have included Ned as it was retconned that Ned was not Hobgoblin.

Sorry, though.

 

[jaydawg]

To me, not only is Kingsley the only worthwhile Hobgoblin, he's only man worthy of carrying on Norman's legacy.

 

[Kraven]

I voted Kingsley.

 

[Venomfan]

so GG beat up Hobgoblin? was that a good story or a bad story?

 

[Vile]

It was a decent story, mostly because of the ending. As to the fight...well, it was more of a draw than anything else.

In the end though, Norman believes he's wiped out Roderick finanicially but Kingsley reveals that he has other accounts filled to the brim with money so he basically retires to a resort island somewhere.

 

[DACrowe]

Indeed he does. But the storyline has Roderick on Norman's leash the whole three issues and constantly afraid Norman is going to try and kill him. And then while he is trying to unmask Spidey Norman reveals he already has done it and in the meantime of Roderick's stalling Norman had wiped Roderick's business accounts (the legal ones) out and took it all from him. They then fight and it begins with Norman ontop but it ends in a draw.

I always think Norman is the ultimate Goblin, but I did wish that final confrontation wasn't written with Hobby playing budding "lackey" for lack of a better word the whole arc. I wish Hobby had been a little more powerful in their working together and untrustworthy....kind of like how he dealt with the Rose in Amazing way back though.

 

[SpideyInATree]

Honestly, I was always kind of partial to the Jason Macendale version of Hobgoblin, especially him and all the high tech weaponry. Minus all that Demogoblin stuff it wasn't too bad.

But Kingsley is the true Hobgoblin, I just wish Macendale weren't dead.

 

[Spec Spider-Man]

Leeds for me

 

[Hobgoblin]

badass mastermind Kingsley =
expendable pawn Leeds =

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Kingsley.

God, i wish he'd come back to the 616 Spidey books, and just kick EVERYONE'S ass.

 

[Grim Goblin]

Kingsley all the way!

I just prefer Kingsley's motivation better. Here you have a ruthless man that's so scrawny he couldn't handle any direct confrontations, who finally get a chance to gain raw physical power, and a cool gimmick to boot. And at first he even does exactly what 99.9% people would really do in his case...just enjoy the power trip. It seems much more plausible than, say, an all around good guy reporter becoming a costumed criminal AND murderer simply because his wife had nightmares.

the rushed retconned twin notwithstanding, Kingsley is definitely the better choice.

 

[SpideyInATree]

Kingsley.

God, i wish he'd come back to the 616 Spidey books, and just kick EVERYONE'S ass.

Even Spidey's posterior?