Why can't Jor-El be seen on screen?

[Kane]

I dont see how they could make this work in a plausible way. An actor that looks like TW with unique Stamps voice...

The fact that they said they wanted to cast Stamp to actually play Jor-El onscreen for season 6 makes me think theyre planning to ignore TW as Jor-El in Relic... The newspaper article would be the only problem...plothole? We'll see.

 

[AgentPat]

...AG has actually revealed in recent interviews what they are "planning," or what he wants, to do with the "actual casting" of Jor-El, if all the ducks are in line. Search for it, it's all out in the public domain.

Now if that will actually happen, remains another matter...
(as a lot of you know, many recipes have changed along the way..)

But it sure makes sense based on previous casting choices...

Yeah, it does. I hope they can find a window in his sked in order to make it work. That appears to be the only monkey wrench in the plan at the moment.



BTW, I'm I the only one LOL at the "age" anachronism as being an issue?

 

[Lunar_Wolf]

They could cast a younger Jor-el and dubb his voice with Stramp's. Might work.

 

[AgentPat]

They could cast a younger Jor-el and dub his voice with Stamp's. Might work.

Sure. They could, and it would, but they don't need to. Besides, having Stamp appear on screen as Jor-El is much nicer than dubbing the voice onto some random guest actor. Stamp is also not opposed to it, so it really is just a matter of scheduling - just like it was with Reeve.

 

[Cmill216]

I like the mystique created by not showing his face, but I believe that he needs to be seen in one of the last episodes of the show. I too would love to see Stamp as Jor-El. It would be a nice touch.

 

[Kane]

Honestly though, how would they explain the rapid aging from Tom Welling as 'Jor-El' in the 60s to Stamp as 'Jor-El' in the 80s. Thats only 20 some years. Even by human standards, that kind of aging makes no sense...

 

[Supershizzle]

radiation given off by a dying Krypton?

 

[Kane]

Or maybe theres some quantum descrepancy between the planets... like time moves at a faster rate in Krypton's galaxy compared to the Sol System.

 

[JackMercy]

Look, Kane, no one had a problem with an ageing Brando playing Reeve's father.

And if you really look at it, the newspaper shot of "young Jor-El" could kind of easily be a younger Terry Stamp as well...

And would that really be a hard thing to swallow considering how many other things the show has asked us to accept as "plausible" over the past five years?


Follow the yellow brick road...

 

[Kane]

Look, Kane, no one had a problem with an ageing Brando playing Reeve's father.

Follow the yellow brick road...

Dude you're missing the point. They showed a young Jor-el in the 1960s from Relic played by Tom Welling. Then its the 1980s and Jor-El has aged so much (if played by Stamp)?

It just contradicts, especially considering Kryptonian aging.

With the movie, there was no previous portrayal of Brando's Jorel prior to Brando....so Jor-El could be any age and it wouldnt matter.

 

[AgentPat]

Umm... We're staring down a $200M Superman feature film, starring a TWENTY THREE year-old Lois Lane (whose the mother of a child IN the film) playing opposite a TWENTY SIX year old Superman (whose been "missing" for five or six years), and people are complaining about a guest appearance by Terence Stamp as Jor-El (whose "image" could have been recorded at any time during his life on Krypton) on SV - a freakin' TV show??!

Jeezes H. Keerist people!

 

[The Sage]

I have a new enemy, and his name is JackMercy!!

 

[Serene]

I have to say, I do see Kane's point. While I won't have a problem accepting Stamp as Jor-El (in fact, I think it would be pretty cool casting if they pull it off), my vision of Jor-El (at the time of his death) would be of a much younger looking man. Take the Relic Jor-El (1961) who looked anywhere from 18 - 25-ish, and add 17 or so years until Krypton blew and you have a man who is mid-30's to mid-40's. That's going to take some goood make-up for Stamp (who is 65) fit in the SV established timeline for Jor-El.

But that's just the stickler perspective. And we all know it doesn't pay to be a stickler when you are a sci-fi/fantasy fan. Matching up the "voice" of Jor-El would be a casting coup, and would override any chronological inconsistencies.

And not for anything, but I still think it's creepy to use Marlon Brando footage in the new movie. Meh.. something else they never consulted me about.

 

[AgentPat]

Honestly, there's only one point that I think is relevant. Krypton blew up thousands of years ago. Given our knowledge of time, there's no WAY Jor-El could have been on Earth in 1961. The whole thing doesn't make sense, which is what Jack was trying to convey about SV. So, having an aged Stamp play Jor-El makes as much sense as having him on Earth as a young adult 45 years ago.

But, if you're one of those math junkies that just has to have a balance in every equation, Terence Stamp - the actor - was 22 years old in 1961.

I hate math. And Einsteinium physics is not my forte either.

 

[Kane]

Umm... We're staring down a $200M Superman feature film, starring a TWENTY THREE year-old Lois Lane (whose the mother of a child IN the film) playing opposite a TWENTY SIX year old Superman (whose been "missing" for five or six years), and people are complaining about a guest appearance by Terence Stamp as Jor-El (whose "image" could have been recorded at any time during his life on Krypton) on SV - a freakin' TV show??!

Jeezes H. Keerist people!

Kate confirmed shes playing the Lois character older than her age. Lois is in her late 20s (meaning Jason was born while she was 23/24 or later, depending on his age). Superman also late 20s, 30 tops.

Superman has been missing since 2000 (according to the DP newspaper) which means he started his Superman career in the late 90s. The Zod incident probably happened around 1999, along with his first relationship with Lois. The 4 part comic series is supposed to explain the revised origins anyways and it may even be touched on during the film.

It actually all fits here.

Jor-El's rapid aging doesnt, even by human standards. I dont think Tom Welling will look like what Terrence Stamp looks like now in 20 years...

 

[Kane]

Honestly, there's only one point that I think is relevant. Krypton blew up thousands of years ago. Given our knowledge of time, there's no WAY Jor-El could have been on Earth in 1961. The whole thing doesn't make sense, which is what Jack was trying to convey about SV. So, having an aged Stamp play Jor-El makes as much sense as having him on Earth as a young adult 45 years ago.

Krypton blew up 1000s of years ago? I recall Hackman's Lex saying Krypton blew up in the 1940s in Superman I, in that underground library scene.

In the comics, Kara Zor-El definately wasnt in stasis for 1000 years, more like 30.

 

[Kane]

And not for anything, but I still think it's creepy to use Marlon Brando footage in the new movie. Meh.. something else they never consulted me about.

I think its a pretty unique idea. Im curious to see how its handled. Besides I like the fact that despite Brando being dead, he appears here. Its kinda reminiscent of the Jor-El character in a twisted ironic way...

 

[Serene]

Honestly, there's only one point that I think is relevant. Krypton blew up thousands of years ago.

Now I'm confused. How long exactly was baby Clark floating through space before he reached Earth?

Okay.. this throws a whole new wrench into things.

I know! Since Jor-El *was* here in 1961.. then in SV mythology, Krypton didn't blow up thousands of years ago. Jor-El had time to go back to Krypton, fall in love with Lara, have a child.. then Krypton goes boom and Clark lands on Earth sometime 1987-ish.

Maybe?

 

[Kane]

Clark was about 3 when he landed... hmmm

I think the BEST explaination the SV writers could use if they wana use Stamp is that time moves much faster in Krypton's star system compared to Earth.

Meaning, compared to Relic, the Jor-El we would see played by Stamp would be 80-100 years older or more.

It amazes me Jor-El was still fertile enough for Clark to be born...must be the Kryptonian DNA. It'd be funny if Lara was half his age.

 

[JackMercy]

Kane, you just answered your own question with your earlier reference to casting ingredients in the "feature" pie.

Tell Christopher Lee he can't play a Darth at 82.

Tell Connery he can't play Bond in his mid-50s.

Wait a minute... doesn't some guy called TW actually play someone much younger than his actual age?

Only by about ten years.

It's called acting.
And it's been a Hollywood consistency for many many years.

Look, all I can say is that the pizza chefs are not really interested in specific Kryptonian timelines or scientific inconsistencies. If they really were, they would have just done a show about Stephen Hawking.

Bottom line is, the chefs plan on making a pizza with certain kinds of ingredients, in a certain way. And the advantages to making this pie a certain way far outweigh the disadvantages. So...

You can either

A) eat the pizza and accept it for what it is

Or

B) go hungry that night...or month...or season...

 

[Kane]

Gosh... stop talking like that.

I proved earlier that the casting for SR wasnt a relevant comparison to the issue here. This is simply an inconsistancy. I mean I suppose I could ignore such an oversight and assume Relic has been retconned....

but still I offered a solution to how the writers can easily explain it.

 

[AgentPat]

Now I'm confused. How long exactly was baby Clark floating through space before he reached Earth?

Ya got me, but it could have been quite a long time. If folks *really* need technobabble to explain this, I'll give it a shot. But lets first remember that this is SV. It's not the Donner film, and it's not the comics - even if it's vaguely based on those things. (Damn, I love that word!)

Aight, in an effort to keep it simple, here's two dialog excerpts from Rosetta and Arrival:

From Rosetta:

Clark: Is that where Krypton is?

Swann: No, that's where Krypton was. I followed the signal's path billions of miles out into space. I was hoping to discover its origin but instead, I found nothing.​

Fiction: Krypton is "billions of miles" away.

Fact: Light travels through the vacuum of space at 186,282 miles per second. In one year, light will travel 5,880,534,262,081 miles.

From Arrival:

Clark: I wasn't born anywhere near Smallville. In fact, I wasn't born anywhere near this galaxy.​

Fact: It is approximately 75,000 light years to the farthest edge of our galaxy.

Conclusion: Krypton must be at *least* 75,000 light years away, which means it took at least 75,000 years for the signal to reach us, which means it blew up at least 75,000 years ago.


I still hate math.

Look, all I can say is that the pizza chefs are not really interested in specific Kryptonian timelines or scientific inconsistencies. If they really were, they would have just done a show about Stephen Hawking.

Bottom line is, the chefs plan on making a pizza with certain kinds of ingredients, in a certain way. And the advantages to making this pie a certain way far outweigh the disadvantages. So...

You can either

A) eat the pizza and accept it for what it is

Or

B) go hungry that night...or month...or season...

Thank you!!! Some things are wicked easy if you just suspend disbelief. If a major motion picture director can get away with it, so can a "blasphemous" TV show, right Jack?


I'm procrastinating my workout. Be back later.

 

[Kane]

Conclusion: Krypton must be at *least* 75,000 light years away, which means it took at least 75,000 years for the signal to reach us, which means it blew up at least 75,000 years ago.

The hell? Didnt Clark's rocket ship travel at lightspeed? If lightspeed only took him about 3 years to get from Krypton to Earth (from a baby to a toddler)....wouldnt that mean Krypton blew up 3 years prior to his arrival?

 

[Serene]

You can either

A) eat the pizza and accept it for what it is

Or

B) go hungry that night...or month...or season...

Or maybe we can talk about the pizza first just because it's.. fun?

I don't have a problem with them casting Stamp. I thought I made that clear.

But technically, Jor-El's appearance on Earth in 1961, *does* throw a wrench into the theory of Krypton being destroyed a zillion years ago. Kane and I are just volleying the possible ways around that.

I guess we could bend time.. which as sci-fi fans I believe we're allowed to do.

 

[AgentPat]

But technically, Jor-El's appearance on Earth in 1961, *does* throw a wrench into the theory of Krypton being destroyed a zillion years ago.

Well, yes and no. See below...

Kane and I are just volleying the possible ways around that.

I've had him on ignore for quite some time. Got tired of the BS. I'd rather argue with Milkman and Pickle - at least they're fun.

I guess we could bend time.. which as sci-fi fans I believe we're allowed to do.

There's a "portal" in the cave. Wormhole, maybe? Any Trekers in the house? It's fantasy; anything's possible if you need it to be.

Okay, I *really* need to fly (pun intended.) TTYL