Why didn't the avengers assemble in Tobey and Andrew's universes?

Discussion in 'Spider-Man: No Way Home' started by pr0xyt0xin, Jan 4, 2022.

  1. pr0xyt0xin Shaper Savant

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    What happened differently in universe in the MCU that led to the creation of the Avengers and Thanos' absence in Raimi and Webb trilogies? Was it a single difference? A single choice? Or many?

    Do the Infinity Stones not exist (and therefore Earth is off the radar to most of the cosmic MCU?)

    Or perhaps Odin just hid the Tesseract elsewhere? Agamotto never came in contact with the Time Stone?

    Stark never invents arc reactor tech because his dad never studied the tesseract?

    The Red Skull never rose to power? Cap didnt need to save Bucky?

    Of course I'm just musing. Any other thoughts on what happened differently in each universe?
     
  2. Detective Conan Registered

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    Real-life reason: The Avengers didn’t assemble in those universes as Sony didn’t have the rights to those characters. As a result, Tony Stark and the rest of the Avengers(in addition to other heroes) simply don’t exist in the Raimi and Webb universes.

    That being said, it would be fun to see Tobey Maguire Spider-Man interacting with Ben Affleck’s Daredevil. Though that’s obviously never happening.
     
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  3. Spider-Fan83 with great power...

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    lack of a big enough threat to require a whole team of heroes
     
  4. Chip Chipperson the big guy

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    now obviously this isn't the case, but in my own little head canon, I like to think this went down pre-MCU:

    marvel-ultimate-alliance.jpeg
     
  5. Chris B Registered

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    I think it'd be kind of cool if they found a way to retcon alternate versions of the MCU line-up into the Raimi and Webb universes despite the Avengers not being a thing in either one.

    Like say if the rumor of Tom Cruise making a cameo as an alternate Iron Man in Mulitverse of Madness is true, establish him as being the Raimiverse Tony Stark.
     
  6. pr0xyt0xin Shaper Savant

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    Just been ruminating on it... I think my official head canon:

    In the MCU, Odin must have known about Tiamut. That's why he hid the Tesseract on earth, because no one was going to come here looking for trouble. Meaning, the easiest answer for why the MCU is so drastically different is that the celestial seed was never planted on earth.

    Asgard may protect midgard from Frost Giants (leading to Norse mythology), but Odin doesn't feel comfortable leaving the Tesseract in the care of the Earthlings without celestial protection. Red Skull was probably tipped off at some point in the early 1900s about the Tesseract. Which allowed him to rise to power and fund Erskine's formula.

    So far this negates 8 movies (Thor, The Dark World, Ragnarok, The Avengers, The Incredible Hulk, Captain Marvel, and Eternals)

    No Red Skull means Hydra is never formed, SHIELD is never formed. No Shield means no Pym. If the pym particles exist, they are not public.

    Bucky was never brainwashed and he never killed Howard who probably made amends with Tony who in turn ended up with far fewer demons. He may be in weapons manufacture to some degree, or heck, maybe just worked on cars. Either way, Ultron remains a twinkle in his eye.

    This negates 9 more movies (Iron Man 1, 2 and 3, The First Avenger, Winter Soldier, Age of Ultron, Ant-Man, Ant-Man and the Wasp, and Civil War)

    Wakanda exists but remains hidden. Sokovia is never destroyed so T'chaka never leaves Wakanda to sign any accords. Kamar Taj may exist, but so much has changed, who knows if Strange crashed his Lambo or not. Perhaps the Time Stone is just a really well kept secret or also isn't on earth due to lack of celestial protection.

    Vision probably doesnt exist, but Wanda likely does in some capacity (as she is a Nexus being... the mutant gene may be dormant in Sony's Spider-verses)

    Thanos probably never comes to Earth in either Raimi's or Webb's universe. But if he does he probably has a focused assault on Kamar Taj and loses against TAO.

    This really only leaves us with Guardians of the Galaxy... it's hard to say whether Quill left the planet or not. Things may get cleared up about this in the future. I speculate that Ego was not actually a celestial. That he was either a fraud or a fool and that might have something to do with it.

    Anything beyond that (Disney+, etc) is the ripple effect. Enough of the 20th and 21st century changes that nothing happens the same way.

    But Spidey remains. Peter Parker always gets bit by that spider.
     
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  7. Drizzle Penguin Silvia

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    As much as I loved the exchange about the Avengers in NWH and Tobey and Andrew not knowing who they were, it would have been more fun if it was left alone, leaving more room for speculation as to whether or not the Avengers actually assembled within those universes.
     
  8. The Infernal Mky Mk

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    Aside from an opportunistic joke I think it was to establish that for the most part if you haven't seen it in their movies then it didn't happen.

    Perhaps some of these things have still yet to happen and could be shown if they revisit those universes?
     
  9. Spider-Fan83 with great power...

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    if you really want to break it down to a singular event that could have changed this different universe to drastically...

    I'd say that maybe in those worlds, the Super Solider experiment failed... the lab blows in his their faces killing Steve, Howard, Peggy...
    without them no, Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D which means no Fury/Hawkeye/Widow
    without Howard there is no Tony
    without a successful Super Solider, Banner has no reason to do his experiment, so no Hulk
    ...so on and so forth...

    tho, the bigger question I'd have is how or why in these other universes does a Peter Park exist who were each born roughly 5-10 years apart, look different, none of which were raise by there real parents and some how all meet a similar fate of encountering a spider that gave them powers
     
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  10. herolee10 No More Miracles

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    Since Tobey and Andrew's characters don't come from alternate timelines, it's reasonable to assume that a lot of the MCU characters and locations may not even exist in their respective universes.
     
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  11. pr0xyt0xin Shaper Savant

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    You mean alternate "times" on the timeline right? Like, because Tobey and Andrew were taken from different times than Ock and Gobby.
     
  12. Spider-Fan83 with great power...

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    ^which theoretically didn't really make since, if the spell drew people to this universe based on the moment they discovered Peter's identity, shouldn't we have gotten each Peter at the moment they became Spider-man?
     
  13. DJ Kornphlake Registered (P)

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    Strange said only a few people made it through before he shut down the spell. The rest would have been among those that were going to break through at the end.
     
  14. AndrewGilkison Registered

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    I just assumed that there are no other heroes in the Raimi and Web universes.
     

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