X3 Forum Debate #8: Realism and the X-Men

[BMM]

Since their inception in the early 1960s, the X-Men have served as a social commentary about the intolerance and persecution faced by those who are deemed different by society… but along with such weighty social issues, the X-Men also serve as a means of escapist sci-fi fantasy. In order to stay true to the spirit of the X-Men, the creative teams behind these movies opted for a more grounded/realistic approach… but does it work?

Specifically, what works and what doesn’t? How much realism is too much? Or is there too little? After The Last Stand, what are your suggestions for the future?

 

[Mdizzle]

I loved the Bobby Drake "coming out" storyline in X2...so well done. I think X2 had the right combination of fantasy and realism, because the events in the movie weren't too far out but reasonable for a comicbook movie. No real godmodding or deus ex machina stuff. I mean...Jean died, ok. Makes sense. Pyro's scene wasn't too far out either, but spectacular enough to have proved a point. Sometimes during comicbook movies you might find yourself screaming at the screen, "Just fry/insert power here on him!" But sometimes subtlety and restraint work better in movies. The Bobby coming out storyline in X2 worked because it explained why he was so hesitant to use his powers...even though he had the potential to seriously get back at and defend himself against alot of oppressors. Pyro's storyline just showed the possibilities of doing the opposite. I thought it was a good balance of fantasy/exhibiting power and a realistic enough plot.

For the future...I think basing movies on realistic themes are a good idea, stuff that is reasonable enough to make sense and be believable, yet still have that far-out comicbook quality involving extraordinary powers...seeing how ppl with powers can respond within these types of settings. There have to be some sort of boundaries otherwise the movie becomes too unbelievable...ok why doesn't everyone just kill each other then?

I didn't really comment on X3...X2 just really stood out to me instead.

 

[javphonic]

I think the realism and fantasy was well balanced in the first too films, especially the 2nd, but I felt the 3rd made it too real for comic lovers: (ex- Jean has been a schitzo and that's the reason for her Phoenix side, no phoenix raptor or the fact that her powers were toned down, just stuff like that)

Maybe it could have been a little more adventurous, yet maintain it's realism as Singer did in X2 expecially for the film dealing with the all powerful cosmic entity Phoenix

 

[The Original Bamfer]

I am a massive fan of the realism in these films. Social commentary is an immense factor of the X-Men, in any incarnation, and I believe that the films' "grounded reality" makes not only the characters more real, but the social isses as well. It was this reality that brought the major social themes to the forefront of the films, where they needed to be. People could ultimately relate to them because of this.

On the other hand... As long as the fantastical elements are attributed only to mutant abilities - no matter how fantastic/unreal they are - these elements should work within the films.

 

[Arkady Rossovich]

An original fact is that when Stan Lee and Jack Kirby created the X-Men,they took a real life theme and put it into the comics.Rasicism,Claremont used this extremly well.I think the realism aspect,has been lost though...

 

[Mdizzle]

Which is why X1 and especially X2 worked out better imo. The real-life social issues were better represented in these movies. Bobby's reception at home could have been interpreted on any number of different levels.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

I think that due to the themes of what X-Men is all about, these movies NEEDED to be grounded.

The reason why I love X-Men so much, as both comics and movies, is because they are a balance between fun (mutants with amazing abilities, battlings fantastic villians with extreme plans for global domination, or what have you) and heart, character, and emotion (struggling for acceptance, fighting against oppression, and the family element these characters have among each other)

Because of that, X-Men becomes more than just some typical comic book about a superhero fighting super powered villians who become super criminals. I don't think that characters like Spiderman, Hulk, Fantastic 4, Ghost Rider, etc... have even a fraction of the heart and depth that X-Men has, and that's why I like X-Men so much over those other characters.

And that is why I love the way the X-Men movies were made, because they actually focus on what makes X-Men different from other comics, while maintaining the fun and entertainment of being a comic book.

To me, I don't mind that there is no Phoenix raptor, I don't mind the black costumes, and I don't mind the toned down powers, because to me, X-Men isn't about power displays and bright costumes. It's about a group of outcasts who risk themselves for social equality. I don't care that there was no M'Krann crystal, or distant galaxies, or anything else like that, because the Phoenix struggle isn't about all that, it's about one woman's descent into darkness, and what her loved ones would do to save her. And yes, while I wish things were handled differently, the Phoenix Saga in the movie maintained enough of it's essence for me to be able to kind of accept (i.e. Jean Grey still wants to die because of what she has done to her loved ones, which, even if not as blatant as it should have been, puts her love with Cyclops to the forefront of her plight)

In the end, the way the X-Men movies were handled, in terms of the balance between realism and fantasy, was handled pretty much perfectly. As X-Men: The Last Stand showed us, I believe you can throw in a bit more fantasy, and still maintain the realistic setting, and maybe Singer's films could have used a BIT more comic book goodness, but in the end, I'm still glad that the movies took the route that they took.

 

[X-Maniac]

I want to be able to identify with the characters and their world and their struggles, and to believe in the possibility (however distant)... therefore some sense of realism is vital. All three movies contained a sense of realism in bringing some very unreal things to the screen - characters like Nightcrawler, Beast, Angel, Mystique are so bizarre and unconventional that they could so easily look hammy and spoofy. They didn't, and were realised beautifully.

I had friends round to watch the movies - they burst out laughing when Storm rose from the elevator shaft at the end of X1 because they said it seemed 'too unreal'... Singer had grounded things so much that to them the notion of flying seemed wrong. Interesting that Storm doesn't fly at all in the acclaimed X2 (although my friends laughed again when Storm was in Cerebro creating an icy windstorm and staring like she was constipated). But no one laughed when Storm flew in X3. The movies have to create a world in which the character's powers and abilities are possible. Bryan created a world in X1 in which some things seemed a little out of reach to some people (flight). If we'd seen a brief shot of Storm landing on the snow in front of the ambushed truck near the start, this small and simple trick would have established a rule of flight being something that was possible and actual. Interesting that Magneto mocks the X-Men after saving their plummeting jet 'When will these people learn how to fly?!' Wel, duh, but Storm already can. Again, the rule of flight wasn't established. Storm's icy windstorm to stop Cerebro was a bit silly, it needed to be a much fiercer storm, not a bit of swirling air.

Some people on here have criticised and mocked X3 for showing Magneto's henchmen in full costume in broad daylight at Jean's house. To them it seemed silly. Bryan Singer filmed the characters mostly shown in shadow or darkness, as his technique for creating mood and believability. Brett was more brazen with showing the characters in their full glory (although he wasn't so brazen with that darned Phoenix raptor).

I still think some elements of the movies work and some don't. The leather costumes seem fine, though Storm's cape is wrong as it is far too flimsy to be an aid for flight (it should be the winged shape from the comics) and she should wear heels for stature (she had heels on in X1).

Mystique worked very well, as did Nightcrawler, and also Beast, Angel and Juggernaut. Colossus seems somewhat more real in X2. Toad and Sabretooth were less succesful for me, but fine for the low-budget first movie.

The mansion, the jet, Cerebro, the Weapon X augmentation room at the dam, almost all the other infrastructure, were all exceptionally well done. The Danger Room looked/sounded great when the holograms stopped, but didn't like the Sentinel head at all.

I would think most of the comicbook elements are possible in some way in the movies, though some are more desirable than others and some things may have to be altered. For instance, Sinister is like something from Rocky Horror and Havok's headgear is a bit OTT, so those things might have to go to make a movie look cool and believable. Much as a FF sequel with the Inhumans might have to miss out Lockjaw who, as i said elsewhere, is essentially a giant bulldog with a TV aerial on his head.