Across the Kraven-verse: How Sony Won the Superhero Cinematic Civil War Thread - Part 59

[DarthSkywalker]

I liked it better than all three Tobey McGuire films COMBINED, lol. He's a much better Spider-Man by far.

I've never agreed with you more, Squeeks.

 

[Iceman]

I’ve grown to like Homecoming quite a bit, especially in hindsight of NWH. However it feels like a downgrade from Spidey’s fantastic first appearance in Civil War where he was a total badass and going toe to toe with Avengers and then in Homecoming it felt like he was bumbling his way through the script.

Maybe could have worked better with Homecoming first - obviously some things would have had to be rejigged given Homecoming starts with acknowledgements of the CW fight.

 

[Snow Queen]

I liked it better than all three Tobey McGuire films COMBINED, lol. He's a much better Spider-Man by far.

 

[Iceman]

I liked Homecoming, but it's my least fave Holland movie. Like NWH the most, FFH 2nd most. Spider-Man 2 is still the GOAT of Spider-Man movies

Same order for me. I give HC a 7/7.5, FFH an 8, NWH a 9. SM2 & NWH are my favourites.

 

[Iceman]

If the new Avengers movies do anything close to the last ones, I’d consider that a massive, massive success because Marvel will have proven they are not beholden to particular characters or actors.

True. Not sure what's realistic yet but my target would be $1.5B+ for Kang Destiny (lower than I would have set a couple of years ago) and still over $2B for Secret Wars as that has plenty of potential to blow up with everything thrown in (even if the rest of the films before it only do enough to set a decent foundation without themselves outperforming).

 

[Nardz937]

NWH is the best of the trilogy for sure. I'd still prefer HC over FFH though. FFH is the one I truly loathe. Bottom of the barrel MCU for me.

 

[writer0327]

A big chunk sure, but there’s still a big chunk left. That’s why when MCU films aren’t received well, they do Ant Man numbers rather than Shazam numbers

I think they are the last vestiges of GA hanging on to what the MCU once was. DCEU and especially Shazam, never had that kind of cache. I have a feeling after GOTG3, the MCU will take a massive dump with the Marvels. But one never knows...

 

[Drizzle]

Only thing I dislike about MCU Spider-Man is his staple rogues apparently don't exist in his universe.

I think that's something they'll retcon down the line. They can only go so far without revisiting Goblin or Ock again. Dafoe is great but he's not the end-all be-all Norman Osborn. It's like saying nobody else should've played Joker after Nicholson.

They also planted the seed for Venom in the MCU, or at the very least the symbiote with that post-credits scene but I still think they missed an opportunity by not having Hardy's Venom show up at the end battle in NWH just for ****s and giggles.

 

[kguillou]

No Way Home is one of those rare movies that is not only really good, it makes its predecessors better in hindsight. Homecoming and FFH work so much better knowing that theyre building up to what NWH does to the character.

Hell, NWH makes the Garfield movies better in hindsight too.

 

[Sithborg]

[chuckling at the idea of Tony Revolori getting the symbiote]

 

[Iceman]

I think they are the last vestiges of GA hanging on to what the MCU once was. DCEU and especially Shazam, never had that kind of cache. I have a feeling after GOTG3, the MCU will take a massive dump with the Marvels. But one never knows...

What kind of box office level would you define as a massive dump for Marvels? Some of the GA left after Endgame and I think a section of the remaining GA are in wait-and-see mode till the next event film and are considering an exit if it disappoints. I'm hoping Marvels does surprisingly well myself.

 

[Ninjablade]

I think it's the opposite. NWH works as well as it does because all the previous films, regardless of quality, lay a strong foundation of material to mine through. I don't think it enhances any of those movies at all.

 

[Sithborg]

I think the issue is they just are not growing their legs anymore. Most of the recent MCU movies have had an increase of their opening weekends. But their legs have been getting worse. The opening weekends says the enthusiasm is still there. The problem is maintaining it.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Only thing I dislike about MCU Spider-Man is his staple rogues apparently don't exist in his universe.

By the way renting all three this weekend on Prime Video for a moviethon.

I am okay with it cause Spider-Man has sooooo many villains we have never seen in movies you still can use, and who knows how many movies down the line a dude Iike Electro or Sandman was going to be done again. This way, we got Holland to face some of his heavier hitters, and we can still use ones like Scorpion or Kingpin or Mr Negative or Hobgoblin or.... still

 

[Iceman]

No Way Home is one of those rare movies that is not only really good, it makes its predecessors better in hindsight. Homecoming and FFH work so much better knowing that theyre building up to what NWH does to the character.

Hell, NWH makes the Garfield movies better in hindsight too.

Agreed - it makes the whole Spidey film history feel more worthwhile than it already did for me. A great payoff to 2 decades of Spidey films that we never knew we would get or even could conceive off as a possibility until recently.

 

[Drizzle]

I think Homecoming and FFH work fine as is even without NWH but I do really like Peter's arc through those three movies, not to mention peripherally in Civil War, IW and Endgame.

 

[TeeKay]

I liked Homecoming, but it's my least fave Holland movie. Like NWH the most, FFH 2nd most. Spider-Man 2 is still the GOAT of Spider-Man movies

It is the greatest superhero movie imo.

 

[Iceman]

I think it's the opposite. NWH works as well as it does because all the previous films, regardless of quality, lay a strong foundation of material to mine through. I don't think it enhances any of those movies at all.

Both ways are true for me. I thought TASM 2 for eg apart from a couple of good scenes was terrible, but I can look on it a bit more fondly now. Even Electro who was absolute horse**** has some value now.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

I think that's something they'll retcon down the line. They can only go so far without revisiting Goblin or Ock again. Dafoe is great but he's not the end-all be-all Norman Osborn. It's like saying nobody else should've played Joker after Nicholson.

They also planted the seed for Venom in the MCU, or at the very least the symbiote with that post-credits scene but I still think they missed an opportunity by not having Hardy's Venom show up at the end battle in NWH just for ****s and giggles.

Another reason why this multiverse stuff is going to be hokey after a while. It’s like Holland already met one variant of Gobby, so clearly he will automatically know a 616 Norman Osborn is bad news which means he’ll have no reason to befriend a 616 Harry.

But we’ll see I guess.

 

[squeekness]

Because it's true?

It doesn't mean there is anything wrong with others hating it, lol. I just thought Holland was a vast improvement over McGuire.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

It is the greatest superhero movie imo.

Yeah.

Spider-Man 2, Batman Returns and TMNT 1990 are my personal trio of god tier CBMs.

 

[Iceman]

I am okay with it cause Spider-Man has sooooo many villains we have never seen in movies you still can use, and who knows how many movies down the line a dude Iike Electro or Sandman was going to be done again. This way, we got Holland to face some of his heavier hitters, and we can still use ones like Scorpion or Kingpin or Mr Negative or Hobgoblin or.... still

Not using a rogue's gallery properly is a common issue in films which have often come in trilogies and need to have say the top 2 villains repeated. There isn't usually enough room to get around to more than a few villains over 3 films when they can't all be new.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Another reason why this multiverse stuff is going to be hokey after a while. It’s like Holland already met one variant of Gobby, so clearly he will automatically know a 616 Norman Osborn is bad news which means he’ll have no reason to befriend a 616 Harry.

But we’ll see I guess.

I dont think we're getting a new MCU Norman in the main MCU, honestly. I think that's part of why they used Dafoe here. I think we will see Kingpin occupy the evil rich guy role for the street level heroes, including Spider-Man

 

[Iceman]

Because it's true?

It doesn't mean there is anything wrong with others hating it, lol. I just thought Holland was a vast improvement over McGuire.

I think a lot of people (including me) like Maguire's Peter Parker and Garfield's Spider-Man while Holland is equally good at both roles.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

I dont think we're getting a new MCU Norman in the main MCU, honestly. I think that's part of why they used Dafoe here. I think we will see Kingpin occupy the evil rich guy role for the street level heroes, including Spider-Man

Give me Kingpin, a Spider Slayer or two, Tombstone and Black Cat and I’ll be ready for Spidey 4.