Another Person Shot While Looking for Help

[Nathan]

So good people are allowed to do mistakes, even when it leads to someone's death. But someone who was looking for help, late at night, was too stupid to live.

 

[charl_huntress]

Y'all are just offended that I find this girl's choice to be a poor one...lol. I'm sorry, but I do. I am not, however, saying she deserved to die because of it. I'm saying it was a poor choice. Why is that so offensive to some?

As for the story about the girl not calling the cops, that's why I was telling it. It was more of wondering why someone wouldn't call the cops in an instant when they should. It's not relatable to this story in any way except to say that she didn't call the cops and she should have.

 

[DJ_KiDDvIcIOUs]

Don't want this update at the bottom of the page so people miss it:

The 19-year-old Detroit woman who was shot and killed Nov. 2 by a Dearborn Heights homeowner was shot in the face, according to an autopsy report issued Monday in a case that continues to have more questions than answers.

The report from the Wayne County Medical Examiner’s Office does not specify the distance from which the fatal shot was fired, but it provided additional details about Renisha McBride’s death.

“There was an entrance shotgun wound to the face, with no evidence of close range discharge of a firearm noted on the skin surrounding this wound,” reads the report by Assistant Medical Examiner Kilak Kesha, who ruled McBride’s death a homicide.

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/...lose-range?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

 

[Hotwire]

Again, I don't think that person shot them in cold blood. It sounds far more plausible it was accidental. Meaning they didn't mean to shoot her and it was a situation that went terribly wrong.

Now as for them not calling the police...that was absolutely wrong. They should have called the police. However, as I was explaining this story to a friend of mine she reminded me of an incident I had forgotten about. A friend of ours at the time hit someone with her car. It was an accident. It was in the daytime. She may have been going a little fast, but she wasn't drunk or anything like that. The person just darted in the road and she hit them. Now this girl is not some GTA wanna-be. She's a nice person and normally a law-abiding citizen, but in this instant she freaked out and took off. She didn't call the cops. She didn't even call for help. She just left. Her entire life was destroyed by this incident, but when asked why she fled and didn't call the cops. Her response...."I don't know. I was just scared."

My point with this is she was a good person who did a bad thing...it happens.

That's called fleeing the scene and falls under the "cover it up" category of how you deal with something that makes you feel guilty. She didn't want to get caught and so, she ran. She attempted to create distance between herself and the victim. This murderer didn't flee. He simply went back inside and left her on his front porch. He made no attempt, unlike your friend, to distance himself from the incident. As I sad, when people do things they regret, they either confess, or cover them up. If they don't feel any guilt, they make excuses. Don't believe me, watch some true crime shows.

 

[Tropico]

Arnold Reed, a prominent Farmington Hills attorney, on Monday said the case could present a “serious uphill battle” for the homeowner.

“It’s unjustified to open your door and shoot someone in the face because they rang your doorbell or knocked on your door,” Reed said. He added that part of the legal test of Michigan’s self-defense law, likened to Florida’s Stand Your Ground law, is whether the would-be intruder is in your home.

I know you won't change your mind, Charl Huntress, and that's fine but realize that you're calling those of us who don't agree as delusional and not living in the real world. I doubt that even the words of an attorney will sway you that it's you who lives in a different world than us.

 

[charl_huntress]

That's called fleeing the scene and falls under the "cover it up" category of how you deal with something that makes you feel guilty. She didn't want to get caught and so, she ran. She attempted to create distance between herself and the victim. This murderer didn't flee. He simply went back inside and left her on his front porch. He made no attempt, unlike your friend, to distance himself from the incident. As I sad, when people do things they regret, they either confess, or cover them up. If they don't feel any guilt, they make excuses. Don't believe me, watch some true crime shows.

OMG...she didn't deliberately hit them. It was an accident. She fled and left because she was scared. I don't know why, but she took off. Yet, it was an accident. People saw it. Had she stayed she likely wouldn't have been charged. The cops told her this! My point was she just freaked out, but it wasn't that she was some inhumane monster. She just wasn't thinking clearly because she was scared.

If they DA thinks they should charge him then they should, but it will be interesting to see how this plays out. I'd also like to hear about the toxicology report.

 

[Hotwire]

OMG...she didn't deliberately hit them. It was an accident. She fled and left because she was scared. I don't know why, but she took off. Yet, it was an accident. People saw it. Had she stayed she likely wouldn't have been charged. The cops told her this! My point was she just freaked out, but it wasn't that she was some inhumane monster. She just wasn't thinking clearly because she was scared.

Didn't say she did it on purpose. I said she felt guilty about it and in a panic, chose the "cover it up/make it go away" option. She did make a mistake in the heat of the moment. My point was, she actually cared about what had happened and therefor reacted they way people who care react. They either confess to clear their conscience or try to hide it so they don't get punished. People who don't care, don't do either of those things and instead, make excuses for and try to justify their actions.

 

[charl_huntress]

Assuming for a second the that the homeowner is not the monster you are all making it out to be. Does the fact he thought someone was breaking into his home not give you pause to think of how he felt?

 

[Hal_Jordan]

Assuming for a second the that the homeowner is not the monster you are all making it out to be. Does the fact he thought someone was breaking into his home not give you pause to think of how he felt?

You keep neglecting the major question. Why did he have so little regard for her that he didn't even bother to call an ambulance after he shot her(if it truly was an accident) or call the police at the very least.

Thats the huge part of this situation that keeps flying right over your head. But at this point, you are deliberately ignoring the obvious.

 

[Hal_Jordan]

OMG...she didn't deliberately hit them. It was an accident. She fled and left because she was scared. I don't know why, but she took off. Yet, it was an accident. People saw it. Had she stayed she likely wouldn't have been charged. The cops told her this! My point was she just freaked out, but it wasn't that she was some inhumane monster. She just wasn't thinking clearly because she was scared.

Fleeing the scene is fleeing the scene regardless of intent. What about this are you not understanding? And why do you have such empathy for this person's actions you can't understand, but none for the woman who "made a bad decision" leading to her getting shot in the face?

Why is that?

 

[Hal_Jordan]

Assuming for a second the that the homeowner is not the monster you are all making it out to be. Does the fact he thought someone was breaking into his home not give you pause to think of how he felt?

Of course he has the right to be cautious/and or scared. That does not give him the right to shoot someone in the face who is knocking on his door no matter what time of day or night, accident or not.

He has to be responsible for his actions, fear induced or not.

 

[Hotwire]

Assuming for a second the that the homeowner is not the monster you are all making it out to be. Does the fact he thought someone was breaking into his home not give you pause to think of how he felt?

Okay, so he felt someone was breaking into his home. Let's assume that position.

There are knocks on the door at 2:30 AM. I'll give him some benefit of the doubt for a minute here and say, he goes to a window to see who it is. See's a young woman, if he can see anything at all. He then goes for his shotgun and decides he's going to handle this potential home invader by himself. He goes to the door. Now, since she was shot in the face, I'd have to assume he gave no warning that he had a gun and would shoot. I mean, no matter how bad off I am, someone threatens me with a shotgun, I'm leaving as best I can. They'll just have to shoot me in the back. So, with no warning given, he opens the door. Something I'm sure LOADS of people scared someone is breaking into their house would do. He's no face to face with his would be attacker. It's a young woman asking for help and probably putting her hands up to show she's not trying to attack him. Pretty common thing when an innocent person has a gun pointed at them. You want to make sure you're not perceived as a threat. So, at this point, since I'm assuming he's the scared homeowner with a shotgun on an unarmed young woman, there's some sort of conversation. He's probably telling her to f*** off and she's probably begging him to lower the gun and help her. Gun goes off and she's dead. Now, the potential home invader has been dealt with so, since he's so freaked out by the whole thing, he just closes the door and goes back to bed? Or does he stay up all night trying to figure out the best way to deal with the dead body on his front porch? At some point, he decides that calling the cops to try and explain the situation is just completely out of the question! As is doing anything about that body on his porch. So, he just decided to pretend the whole never happened and, should the cops come knocking and asking questions, it was an accident.

Now, just how plausible does that sound? See, the mentality doesn't fit. If you do something on accident, something you don't want to go to prison for, you either hide it, or confess and try to explain what happened. He did neither. He left her to ROT on his front porch! That's what is called depraved indifference.
http://definitions.uslegal.com/d/depraved-indifference/

If this had been a case of someone walking into an ethnic neighborhood and shouting racial slurs who ended up getting shot, I'd agree that they made a poor choice that cost them their life. But, this isn't a case of someone who stupidly went looking for trouble. This was a woman looking for help and getting shot in the face instead.

 

[charl_huntress]

Goodness....You've added all this to a scenario where very little is known.

How about this scenario. It's just as plausible.

There are knocks on the door at 2:30 AM.... The owner is sleep and is woken by the knocks which he thinks is someone breaking into his house. He was sleep so the noise woke him. He then goes to investigate with a shot gun (because he thinks someone is breaking in at that time) and comes upon an "intruder" (we know now it was an innocent woman looking for help, but I don't think he knew this) who he can't see clearly, and startled fires upon them. I am adding the startled part because that is what most people would be. No ill will or malice intended here. I believe it's possible he didn't even mean to shoot her. I'm speculating of course, but I think that could also be a possibility. He could have pulled the trigger by just flinching uncertainly and if he was frightened then that is a big possibility.

As for him not calling the cops. He should have done that, but again...assuming he's not a monster with a depraved indifference for human life maybe he freaked out. I mentioned the girl I knew because I have seen a situation where for whatever reason someone didn't call the cops when they clearly should have. Not the same situation, but I bring it up to say it's also possible something like that happened.

 

[Hotwire]

Goodness....You've added all this to a scenario where very little is known.

How about this scenario. It's just as plausible.

There are knocks on the door at 2:30 AM.... The owner is sleep and is woken by the knocks which he thinks is someone breaking into his house. He was sleep so the noise woke him. He then goes to investigate with a shot gun (because he thinks someone is breaking in at that time) and comes upon an "intruder" (we know now it was an innocent woman looking for help, but I don't think he knew this) who he can't see clearly, opens the door, and startled fires upon them. I am adding the startled part because that is what most people would be. No ill will or malice intended here. I believe it's possible he didn't even mean to shoot her. I'm speculating of course, but I think that could also be a possibility. He could have pulled the trigger by just flinching uncertainly and if he was frightened then that is a big possibility.

Added a detail you left out.

As for him not calling the cops. He should have done that, but again...assuming he's not a monster with a depraved indifference for human life maybe he freaked out. I mentioned the girl I knew because I have seen a situation where for whatever reason someone didn't call the cops when they clearly should have. Not the same situation, but I bring it up to say it's also possible something like that happened.

You friend still made an attempt to cover up what she had done by fleeing the scene.

 

[Ant-manic]

Goodness....You've added all this to a scenario where very little is known.

How about this scenario. It's just as plausible.

There are knocks on the door at 2:30 AM.... The owner is sleep and is woken by the knocks which he thinks is someone breaking into his house. He was sleep so the noise woke him. He then goes to investigate with a shot gun (because he thinks someone is breaking in at that time) and comes upon an "intruder" (we know now it was an innocent woman looking for help, but I don't think he knew this) who he can't see clearly, and startled fires upon them. I am adding the startled part because that is what most people would be. No ill will or malice intended here. I believe it's possible he didn't even mean to shoot her. I'm speculating of course, but I think that could also be a possibility. He could have pulled the trigger by just flinching uncertainly and if he was frightened then that is a big possibility.

she wasn't shot through the door. the door was opened. she didn't meet the definition of "intruder."

 

[charl_huntress]

So he opened the door? I get that right there you think he should have called the cops but maybe....just maybe he was going outside to investigate and opened the door and got startled. It's not clear they had a conversation where she asked for help. She was there looking for help.

You friend still made an attempt to cover up what she had done by fleeing the scene.

I'm not sure what you mean by cover it up. She didn't try to cover anything. She didn't go get her car fixed, or book a flight to Mexico. She just went home and stayed there. The cops came to her house to arrest her. I think she was in shock if you ask me. I think the fact she hit someone just freaked her out. The sad thing is it was ruled an accident, but she got hit with all kind of charges for fleeing the scene.

she wasn't shot through the door. the door was opened. she didn't meet the definition of "intruder."

He thought someone was breaking in so in his mind he's looking for someone attempting to "intrude".

 

[Teelie]

I think this has all been one long troll. No one can seriously defend this guy's actions.

 

[Hotwire]

I'm not sure what you mean by cover it up. She didn't try to cover anything. She didn't go get her car fixed, or book a flight to Mexico. She just went home and stayed there. The cops came to her house to arrest her. I think she was in shock if you ask me. I think the fact she hit someone just freaked her out. The sad thing is it was ruled an accident, but she got hit with all kind of charges for fleeing the scene.

Fleeing the scene separates her from the incident. It's a common action that's usually done in hopes that the problem won't follow you. If it doesn't, you're in the clear. If it does, than you have to deal with it. Also, for the record, she deserved every single charge thrown at her!

Again, this guy didn't try to run or hide what happened. He left her on his porch like some kind of warning to anyone else who may come knocking.

You know what, though. I'm done with you and this discussion. You want her to take the blame for this whole thing and you want to treat him like some innocent that just accidentally shot someone. Like it's no big deal. Heaven forbid he be held accountable for killing some stupid teenager who was dumb enough to knock on his door. You're view on this whole thing is just really, really sad. You have my pity.

I think this has all been one long troll. No one can seriously defend this guy's actions.

I thought this at first but, I've never seen Charl troll before.

 

[charl_huntress]

You pity me???? lmao...please go screw yourself then.

 

[Teelie]

I thought this at first but, I've never seen Charl troll before.

Me either but this has gone to such lengths to defend a person who has done nothing defensible I'm not sure what else to think. I can't see why she would victim blame or defend a man who so callously shoots an unarmed, hysterical woman for nothing more than knocking on the door at 2 in the morning.

 

[charl_huntress]

I am not trolling. I don't troll. I don't know what a troll would do. I just simply believe that this was probably not cold blooded murder. But I am done with this...once people start calling people trolls then it's over. Yet that is eventually what starts to happen when someone doesn't agree here.

 

[Teelie]

You have defended him to the point of absurdity. Past a point of reason and some of your justifications have been completely implausible.

Maybe you genuinely believe someone can kill another person and not even care but remain innocent. Or you are in such denial over this you can't see the reality that yes, he really did murder her in cold blood.

Glad it's over though. There's no way this was going to end with anyone agreeing the other side might be right.

 

[E-Man]

So he opened the door? I get that right there you think he should have called the cops but maybe....just maybe he was going outside to investigate and opened the door and got startled. It's not clear they had a conversation where she asked for help. She was there looking for help.



I'm not sure what you mean by cover it up. She didn't try to cover anything. She didn't go get her car fixed, or book a flight to Mexico. She just went home and stayed there. The cops came to her house to arrest her. I think she was in shock if you ask me. I think the fact she hit someone just freaked her out. The sad thing is it was ruled an accident, but she got hit with all kind of charges for fleeing the scene.


He thought someone was breaking in so in his mind he's looking for someone attempting to "intrude".

It's still not that hard to ask a person what they want through the door. All he has to tell her is to go away, and if for some reason she won't that's when he could have called the cops. There's no need to open the door at all, and being scared still doesn't justify the negligence of the consequences of a gun going off without pulling the trigger. Since that is a possibility he should have known that, and he shouldn't have pointed the gun unless it was distinctly demonstrated that his life was threatened.

We still wouldn't even be here though if he didn't open the door to begin with. Who in the hell opens the door when they think someone might be breaking in to their place? If that's the case I'd call the cops while waiting in a safe place with my shotgun. Once you open the door you are giving that person an easier chance to get in the house.

 

[charl_huntress]

UGHHH.... you keep pulling me back in. Again, he thought someone was breaking into his house!!! Who in the HELL stops to ask someone they think is a potential intruder a question???? All we know truthfully at this point is she was there looking for help, and he thought she was an intruder. WE don't know if she asked for help and they had an actual conversation about it. He was asleep and heard a noise which he thought was someone breaking in!!! He was under the impression it was an intruder and that someone was breaking in at that moment. I cannot fathom how anyone...ANYONE...cannot see that as a scary situation.

People seem to think I am defending him shooting her in cold blood and that is not the case. I am defending his right to be scared, but for some reason you superheroes on SHH seem to think it was no big deal and he shouldn't have been afraid...AT ALL. I don't know why you would think that. Maybe you don't own a home, maybe you live with your parents in the basement, but surely I can tell that none of you have has ever had to face anything like this. Yet, you all have some infantile beliefs about what someone in that situation should and would do!! It makes no sense to me.

 

[Teelie]

Who breaks into your house by knocking on the door? Unarmed and alone? That's some stretch of imagination to say he must have thought she was breaking in. And then he failed to even report an attempted break in or that he shot a would-be intruder in the face?

I can't see how you can believe that but you won't acknowledge just how cold blooded that all is so there is no point in repeating this again. I think others have been through it at least a dozen times and you still defend it.