Batman: Arkham Knight

[Drz]

A Bruce Wayne clone would of been a horrible choice to be the Arkham Knight. Jason Todd was the only choice if they weren't going a grown up Damien Wayne.

Damian Wayne is pretty much a Bruce Wayne clone. I really wanted Arkham Knight to be Damian Wayne (the childish tantrums would have made alot more sense) and Amanda Waller/Project Batman Beyond to be involved.

Now the game just ends with [BLACKOUT]a Fear toxin superpowered hobo Batman with no proper conclusion to anything.[/BLACKOUT]

 

[Snow Queen]

The Arkham Knight himself might be the worst element of the series for me.

 

[The Joker]

This, I mean wow. I love the Arkham games. And I like Knight but in the series for me it's weak and game of the year? Joker what are these guys smoking please tell me? We've had 3 votes for game of the year here hahaha

Maybe they're still drunk after New Year's Eve?

Trying to remember emotional scenes in Arkham games:
2) Arkham City. Same. Maybe Talia's death, maybe Harley expecting a child.

Talia's death was totally spoiled by Batman carrying Joker's body out instead of hers. He carries her murderer and his worst enemy out and tenderly lays him on the hood of a Cop car, but Talia, someone he supposedly loves gets left to rot in the theater. Bad writing all around and no emotional resonance to it.

As for Harley expecting a child, if you mean finding a pregnancy stick on the floor in Joker's lair, which the average player could easily miss if they didn't ZOOM in on it, had no emotion to it at all. It was more like a funny easter egg.

Bruce and Alfred's argument late in the game got to me. I'm so used to seeing their relationship as casual and detached in these games, then they get all emotional and aggressive. It was really nice to see.

That, and Batman finding Alfred near dead in the Batcave after Bane's attack, and saving his life. Also Alfred's emotional pep talk to him afterwards when Bruce is suffering a crisis of faith in his ability to protect Gotham.

See that's what Origins does so well. Character investment and development. Alfred wasn't some Johnny come lately character in the game. He and Bruce's relationship was developed throughout the game, just like it was with Gordon, Barbara, Joker etc. They didn't just give gamers a flashback or two to some character we'd never seen before in the games and expect them to care when they reveal his presence like with AK/Jason.

 

[Rodrigo90]

Nothing emotional in Arkham Origins? Not even when our favourite butler was nearing the pearly gates of Heaven?

 

[OutOfBoose]

Well, maybe it was just me, but Harley's lullaby was kinda creepy and emotional in grand scheme of things, given that the Joker is dead. I remember we didn't know at that point (before the DLC) if she's really pregnant or not.

I totally forgot about Alfred in Origins. I don't know. I guess I didn't care.

 

[Rodrigo90]

How could you not care about Alfred?! IT'S ALFRED!!!

 

[OutOfBoose]

I know, I know. Maybe I was frustrated by something else, that got me distracted...

 

[The Joker]

The Arkham Knight himself might be the worst element of the series for me.

He's a contender for worst written character. Jason Todd thinks Batman abandoned him and replaced him. So his response is to team up with Scarecrow and try and kill the whole city. Makes no sense. And we're supposed to feel sympathy for this guy and care he was Robin once? There was no real emotion to his story.

Compared to comic book Jason who was naturally pissed Batman didn't avenge his death by killing Joker. Even then his response wasn't to try and kill millions of innocents. He took the stance he thought Batman should have. Take down criminals, and do it by killing if necessary. And of course seek revenge on the Joker.

AK totally missed the mark on Jason/Red Hood.

 

[Wise]

He's a contender for worst written character. Jason Todd thinks Batman abandoned him and replaced him. So his response is to team up with Scarecrow and try and kill the whole city. Makes no sense. And we're supposed to feel sympathy for this guy and care he was Robin once? There was no real emotion to his story.

Compared to comic book Jason who was naturally pissed Batman didn't avenge his death by killing Joker. Even then his response wasn't to try and kill millions of innocents. He took the stance he thought Batman should have. Take down criminals, and do it by killing if necessary. And of course seek revenge on the Joker.

AK totally missed the mark on Jason/Red Hood.

Agree completely.

Comics Red Hood/Jason Todd was unhinged and homicidal in the sense that he would kill criminals and mob bosses on a quest to prove to Batman that his mission is pointless without the conviction to kill.

Arkham Knight Red Hood/Jason Todd was a genocidal psychopath, a spurned bratty child with daddy issues and temper tantrums. A lackey for Scarecrow.

 

[Nardz937]

Nothing emotional in Arkham Origins? Not even when our favourite butler was nearing the pearly gates of Heaven?

The scene fell flat because you knew he wasn't going to die, since he was in the other games that took place afterwards. There was no drama or suspense in it for me. Didn't care.

 

[Slade W]

The time this games DLC and the like takes to download is more tedious and boring than the constant tank battles.

 

[OutOfBoose]

The scene fell flat because you knew he wasn't going to die, since he was in the other games that took place afterwards. There was no drama or suspense in it for me. Didn't care.

Yep, something like this.

 

[The Joker]

Agree completely.

Comics Red Hood/Jason Todd was unhinged and homicidal in the sense that he would kill criminals and mob bosses on a quest to prove to Batman that his mission is pointless without the conviction to kill.

Arkham Knight Red Hood/Jason Todd was a genocidal psychopath, a spurned bratty child with daddy issues and temper tantrums. A lackey for Scarecrow.

Exactly.

Though when it comes to reducing villains to lackeys, it still was not as bad as what they did to Hugo Strange in AC. At least Arkham Knight appeared a few times throughout the game. Strange was practically a cameo. Protocol 10 like a side mission.

Yep, something like this.

That's bizarre reasoning. How can you feel emotion for something like seeing Bruce's parents die, when we all know already they're dead, and they are not even characters we know or care about one fifth as much as Alfred.

Alfred's near death experience is not about knowing Alfred will live, it's the fact that he nearly died at all, and as a result of Bruce and his mission as Batman. Bane targeted him because he figured out who Batman was. Bruce blamed himself, and felt he couldn't defend his own home let alone Gotham. That has more raw emotional power than just about anything Rocksteady did.

I don't know I find your views on emotional scenes very strange. You think nonentity things like Harley's pregnancy that never was, nor even made significant in any way, as emotional, but Alfred nearly dying doesn't stir anything from you.

To each his own, but I don't get it at all.

 

[Wise]

Arkham Knight Batman logic.

1. Batman won't kill his villains. But he has no problem whatsoever with putting Azrael in a cell full of them. Azrael, a man who is trained to be almost as formidable as Batman and has sworn to stop crime in Gotham... BY KILLING THE CRIMINALS.

2. It's easier to track down 243 Riddler trophies than it is to go to Home Depot and track down a plasma cutter that can cut through a floor...

3. Batman absolutely will not kill under any circumstances... unless the unconscious body of a henchman is lying on the ground. If so then they are fair game to be flattened by his tank.

 

[godisawesome]

I think the biggest story problem with AK's identity as Jason Todd was the entire militia concept, his leadership of it, and the apparent partnership he had with Scarecrow.

The way I see it, a cleaner version would have gone something like one of these:

1. Scarecrow employs the militia and Arkham Knight, but separately. They're not his men until the mission, and he's definitely not quite all in with Scarecrow's plan. He spends the game trying to use the militia to kill Batman, but also planning to kill Scarecrow, and the other villains as well. He also wants the resources to seek out Robin and Nightwing for fistfights. When he gets defeated, the militia barely reacts because Scarecrow's still their overall commander, and we see that Red Hood took down some militia men before rescuing Bruce. And maybe he ends up pointing his gun at the still somewhat restrained Bruce before walking away.

2. Arkham Knight does control the militia and partners with Scarecrow, but they're a smaller, separate, and more elite force while most mooks are rogue affiliates. This accomplishes the dual purpose of giving the regular villains a higher profile throughout the game, and allows for Arkham Knight to be a mastermind himself. I'd have him reveal that he used Scarecrow's plan to ensure the only people left in Githma were the "bad guys" and those who "failed him." He'd be nastier and meaner than regular Jason, but he'd also be insistent on making sure Scarecrow doesn't get to use the East Coast sized chemical attack.

 

[OutOfBoose]

That's bizarre reasoning. How can you feel emotion for something like seeing Bruce's parents die, when we all know already they're dead, and they are not even characters we know or care about one fifth as much as Alfred.

Not bizarre. Recalling death of Bruce's parents is grieving, similar to when you visit graves of your dead relatives. Seeing Alfred suffering - entirely different thing. It's not really I didn't feel for Batman and the old man, it's just it was JUST as predictable as Jason Todd's reveal. Not nearly as exciting as Harley's supposed pregnancy (again, it wasn't clear before the DLC if she's for real or not, I'd like to stress that out) or death of Joker. Seeing Ivy's sacrifice and then that little flower. Seeing Nora confront Victor was also really interesting and you feel for the guys.

Alfred's near death experience is not about knowing Alfred will live, it's the fact that he nearly died at all, and as a result of Bruce and his mission as Batman. Bane targeted him because he figured out who Batman was. Bruce blamed himself, and felt he couldn't defend his own home let alone Gotham. That has more raw emotional power than just about anything Rocksteady did.

For you, maybe. First of all, I don't consider ANY of Arkham games substantially dramatic. Even the most emotional moments of these games have nothing on proper drama in, say, Batman Returns or Dark Knight.

To each his own, but I don't get it at all.

Just as I don't get blandness of Arkham Origins, that gets so much praise from some people.

 

[Broseph44]

Pretty much describes all of Origins in a nut-shell.

Where are you getting your drugs from? Arkham Knight game of the year and origins you think was horrible. Tell me your drug source I want the good stuff.

 

[Paradox1]

The way I see it Origins is the sibling that barely made it through college while the other Arkham games went on to achieve PhDs. In most families making through college is a big deal just not in this one.

 

[Broseph44]

The way I see it Origins is the sibling that barely made it through college while the other Arkham games went on to achieve PhDs. In most families making through college is a big deal just not in this one.

Knight desperately wanted the PhD but failed miserably at attaining it.

 

[jonathancrane]

The way I see it Origins is the sibling that barely made it through college while the other Arkham games went on to achieve PhDs. In most families making through college is a big deal just not in this one.

City was the equivalent of a sibling completing a year of a Master's program, switching to another one, and then adding an unrelated certificate.

 

[The Joker]

Not bizarre. Recalling death of Bruce's parents is grieving, similar to when you visit graves of your dead relatives. Seeing Alfred suffering - entirely different thing.

It's not a different thing. Emotional pain for a loved one is emotional pain for a loved one. Only one is based on characters we barely know other than they are Bruce's parents, and the other is a character we all know and love.

That's why Alfred's has more emotional power to it. We care about the old man and his relationship with Bruce.

It's not really I didn't feel for Batman and the old man, it's just it was JUST as predictable as Jason Todd's reveal.

Not even remotely. Jason's reveal was obvious long before it even happened. From the moment they started making a big deal out of a dead character who had no relevance what so ever to the previous games. They might as well have spelled out in glowing letters across the screen Jason was AK.

Alfred being attacked and the Batcave being trashed, nobody saw that coming. Yes, we knew Alfred would survive, but that wasn't the point of the scene's drama, it was the emotional power of the scene of seeing him nearly die, and Bruce blaming himself, was as good as it gets.

Not nearly as exciting as Harley's supposed pregnancy (again, it wasn't clear before the DLC if she's for real or not, I'd like to stress that out) or death of Joker. Seeing Ivy's sacrifice and then that little flower. Seeing Nora confront Victor was also really interesting and you feel for the guys.

There was nothing emotional about Harley's pregnancy. I've yet to see anyone say they felt any emotion to finding that easter egg pregnancy stick. I'm sorry but that is making something out of nothing. It shouldn't even be considered an emotional scene.

Those Ivy and Freeze scenes had some good emotion to them, but when it comes to Bruce and his loved ones, nothing tops that.

For you, maybe. First of all, I don't consider ANY of Arkham games substantially dramatic.

Given that the bulk of them are made by Rocksteady, it's easy to see why you'd feel that way. Had they all been like Origins, they would be on a whole other level in that regard.

Just as I don't get blandness of Arkham Origins, that gets so much praise from some people.

Because there is no blandness. There is real emotion, real character development and character relationships. Most of it is writing worthy of a Batman movie the way it develops many of it's characters and executes emotion. The Joker/Harley therapy scene alone in Origins gets more inside the Joker's head than all three of Rocksteady's games did.

Whereas you are praising the likes of a phony pregnancy stick on the floor. It's bizarre and confusing.

 

[The Joker]

Knight desperately wanted the PhD but failed miserably at attaining it.

Asylum - Degree
City - Masters
Origins - PhD
Knight - Diploma

 

[Broseph44]

Asylum - Degree
City - Masters
Origins - PhD
Knight - Diploma

truth haha

 

[Broseph44]

It's not a different thing. Emotional pain for a loved one is emotional pain for a loved one. Only one is based on characters we barely know other than they are Bruce's parents, and the other is a character we all know and love.

That's why Alfred's has more emotional power to it. We care about the old man and his relationship with Bruce.



Not even remotely. Jason's reveal was obvious long before it even happened. From the moment they started making a big deal out of a dead character who had no relevance what so ever to the previous games. They might as well have spelled out in glowing letters across the screen Jason was AK.

Alfred being attacked and the Batcave being trashed, nobody saw that coming. Yes, we knew Alfred would survive, but that wasn't the point of the scene's drama, it was the emotional power of the scene of seeing him nearly die, and Bruce blaming himself, was as good as it gets.



There was nothing exciting or emotional about Harley's pregnancy. I've yet to see anyone say they felt any emotion to finding that easter egg pregnancy stick. I'm sorry but that is making something out of nothing. It shouldn't even be considered an emotional scene.

Those Ivy and Freeze scenes had some good emotion to them, but when it comes to Bruce and his loved ones, nothing tops that.



Given that the bulk of them are made by Rocksteady, it's easy to see why you'd feel that way. Had they all been like Origins, they would be on a whole other level in that regard.



Because there is no blandness. There is real emotion, real character development and character relationships. Most of it is writing worthy of a Batman movie the way it develops many of it's characters and executes emotion. The Joker/Harley therapy scene alone in Origins gets more inside the Joker's head than all three of Rocksteady's games did.

Whereas you are praising the likes of a phony pregnancy stick on the floor. It's bizarre and confusing.

I love you

 

[TX85]

Agreed with Joker 100%