Rise of the Silver Surfer BOX OFFICE Discussion

[Agent 194]

I can put it another way...I think of it like a good restaurant. One that has great food, service and atmosphere...then it gets sold to some big chain. Almost immediatley the quality of the food goes down (that's almost always the case) then even the least smart or least perceptive people start to abandon that eatery. Even the people who'd eat bacon grease on a bagel if it had a fancy name and package start to figure it out after a while.

In other worlds, even the least informed about the comic book world know when something's good and when it's not. This is pretty evident in the fact that FF isn't still pulling people in.

It was 128 degrees somewhere in the country two days ago. If that isn't reason to go to a movie I don't know what is.

 

[Kelly]

Please Milk, go back to sleep. Read my post concering TF. Fat chance. HP will dismantle the robots. Enjoy it while it lasts. I did not see hide nor hair of you opening weekend ? Now you come out of the closet. Amazing. Go back to the batcave, and wait for 08. In the meantime, I will continue to enjoy. I feel so sorry for the other side. Brings tears to my eyes. What ? Carp Man tears for the other side ? Say it ain't so. It ain't so. Ever see a fish cry ?

Carp, I explained it.....there was REALLY no need for this.....

 

[Spider-Fan]

I see the FF2 vs. Transformers war is heating up.

 

[Kelly]

I see the FF2 vs. Transformers war is heating up.

No its not, because the hose will come out quickly.........and hose the children down....

 

[Tony Stark]

I don't want to see a Transformers vs. FF2 debate, but I think some are overrating Transformers. I liked it, and the first hour or so of the movie was damn near perfect. But at the point where they had the S7 guy take his shirt off to reveal his S7 undershirt in the shape of a Superman logo, the film went downhill from there.

People say FF2 was designed for children, well at least they refrained from *********ion jokes and having a robot whip it out and "pee" on someone. A robot taking a piss, the money shot brought to you by ILM and the guy who said Spider-man 3 was "silly".

 

[Tony Stark]

Been lurking around too long - Very good discussion here, and I agree with Cal for the most part concerning FF2 - it was another "just go through the motions" with this one and the money will automatically churn in. Well, audiences wised up this time around and dropped FF2 almost immediately.

DH4 had Wiseman as director and Bruce as a producer, that's why it's good.

Transformers will have LEGS, I guarantee it - it's that damn good.

Congrats to Carp for taking his signature away after FF2 dropped like a lead balloon. Nice one my friend, you certainly didn't disappoint in the hypocrisy and biased department.

Save it Milk, you lurk around here for 3 weeks when everyone around here liked the film. So since it's not going to do as well as the original you jump in with your spin?

Die Hard 4 is tanking and was no. 1 at the BO for 1 day. It probably won't make 100 million.

See above about Transformers. Although I'll admit I liked it dispite the flaws, but the groan scenes in that movie were 100 times worse than "Marco - Polo".

 

[Malus]

People say FF2 was designed for children, well at least they refrained from *********ion jokes and having a robot whip it out and "pee" on someone. A robot taking a piss, the money shot brought to you by ILM and the guy who said Spider-man 3 was "silly".

Yep.
Both VERY low points for ANY film purporting to be appropriate for my children.
The term "*********ion" didn't have to actually be said for that scene to be funny. Then again, the scene wasn't very funny to begin with.

There's no FF/Transformers war, just as there's no FF/Harry Potter war.
They each appeal somewhat to the same demographic, but that's it.
Potter will make more $ than Tranformers and Transformers will make
more $ than FF2.

And Spidey 3 & Pirates 3 have already made more money than any of them will. (My guess.)

Were any of these the "best movie made" this year?
To some, sure. To me? Hardly.

 

[Inhuman63]

These posts have been interesting and I am very surprised that FF2 has not done better in the domestic box office but things happen. I don't think it has anything to do with the quality of the movie as most that I have discussed it with have enjoyed it and these are non FF fans. There really could be a variety of reasons, a glut of must see movies opening around the same time can damage the box office. I know that I went to see Spiderman3 and FF2 but did not go to see Pirates. $10.50 a pop for a movie makes a differnce in what you will see. That is not to say that I won't purchase the DVD for Pirates when it becomes available. And even though I am going to see Transfromers this weekend, it is more due to my neice and great nephew wanting to see it then it is me. My next movie would have been Harry Potter. Basically, I don't think that the perceived failure (by some) of FF2's box office is an indication of the film but more an indication of the oversaturation of movies that are opening right behind each other and a choice must be made. FF2 may have fared better opening at another time. The real tale will be told, as far as domestically is concerned, is in the DVD sales. Personally, I think and I may be wrong, that Fox has it's own distribution in the States and in the International market so whatever FF2 makes worldwide has already solidified any justification that Fox needs for FF3.

Now with that out of the way, I do agree that the next movie should not be aimed so much at a younger demographic and should really take the FF to the next level. Of course, the Inhumans would be ideal for this and could really bring out some of the more intense characterizations that the FF is known for. Also, I personally do not believe that it would cost a lot, relatively speaking, to bring the Inhumans to life (if Lockjaw is excluded or seen very briefly). The only character that would need CGI work on themselves would be Medusa. The remaining characters can easily be worked with without major CGI thereby reducing the cost. Of course, the effects of their powers would require money but those effects should be cheaper than the 4's effects.

Basically, I believe that Tim stepped up his game big time for this one and I hope that he is building up the clout that is needed to be able to diminish the interference from the studio. I enjoyed Don Payne's script and after reading his interview, I am with the impression that there was more to the story that was written and shot that ended up on the cutting room floor again. I cannot say that I will not support FF movies because I have waited years on top of years to see them realized on the big screen and I am happy that I have finally got a chance to see them. With that said, I do think Fox made a mistake with the target audience as the FF fans tend to be older than Spiderman or X-Men fans, since those 2 franchises had the benefit of very popular cartoons that the kids are used to watching.

P.S. Caught Stan Lee being interviewed in the Directors thingy that FX has, and he mentioned that he still wants to see Dr. Doom on screen LOL.

 

[WorthyStevens]

Die Hard 4 is tanking and was no. 1 at the BO for 1 day. It probably won't make 100 million.

LFoDH is doing great. And with $66 million in a little over a week, it's a LOCK for $100 million.

 

[WorthyStevens]

Please Milk, go back to sleep. Read my post concering TF. Fat chance. HP will dismantle the robots.

Probably no worse than how Evan Almighty dropped FF2.

This bias of yours against Transformers is getting old.

 

[Hiruu]

I don't want to see a Transformers vs. FF2 debate, but I think some are overrating Transformers. I liked it, and the first hour or so of the movie was damn near perfect. But at the point where they had the S7 guy take his shirt off to reveal his S7 undershirt in the shape of a Superman logo, the film went downhill from there.

People say FF2 was designed for children, well at least they refrained from *********ion jokes and having a robot whip it out and "pee" on someone. A robot taking a piss, the money shot brought to you by ILM and the guy who said Spider-man 3 was "silly".

Yeah, but overall, it was a very nicely put together summer popcorn flick. It was 2:28 min, but didn't really lag at all, and I never felt like...damn this is too long. That's what you look for in summer movie, and had this launch last year, it would have dominated, but this year has too much competition, and I'm sorry to all those fanboys who are dreaming of massive legs...Good luck against HP. FF2 got caught in the same buzzsaw, and I'm glad to see the film holding out, and all the doomsayers lamenting the film's demise, are going to be disappointed again. FF2 will reach $130 domestic, and the international is well on track top FF, which looks to add another $175-200 to the bottomline. Will sleazy Fox ever learn...nope...they will keep gambling that they can squeeze more from less, and we can only hope production teams work as hard as they can to deliver a better product.

 

[Hunter Rider]

It's amazing how defensive ppl get over movies and try to twist and tear down "rival" films for their own ends,suddenly Carp is suckling the teet of Potter and yet he was pissed at it when it was near FF2

 

[Bishop2]

I see the FF2 vs. Transformers war is heating up.

We should really be debating the two big 4th of July films instead - Die Hard vs. Transformers.

Although I guess that fight is a little unfair to Transformers.

 

[Advanced Dark]

Oh God it's like the Batman Begins vs Fantastic Four flame wars again. Yeah I was part of that but only in relatiation. He he. LOL Who F'n cares. They're movies and nothing more. Enjoy them or don't enjoy them for Christ's sake. LOL I am a Michael Bay fan and originally wanted him to do The Hulk film (but love the choice of Leterrier), I enjoy his films. I thought for sure this one would be a total mess. He did a great job. It had flaws but it was fun. I know it made most of the Transformers fans happy. I enjoyed Fantastic Four and Die Hard as well.

 

[Bishop2]

It's inevitable that when all the people on the Transformers board are calling the movie "the best movie I've ever seen" and "the movie that shows other summer movies how it should be done," a lot of people are going to take umbrage with those kinds of statements. And I've seen a LOT of them.

 

[Spider-Fan]

No its not, because the hose will come out quickly.........and hose the children down....

You know, much like SR, it will continue to get mentioned here. Even after the 15th warning.

Although, who really cares? I enjoyed both movies (Transformers just a tad more), but there is no need for this my movie was better than yours garbage.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Have to keep going over, and over this. The FF comic is NOT, a deep, dark, serious comic. It is fun, lighthearted, corny, cheesy, pokes fun at itself comic. When are people going to get that ? This is not Batman, not Superman, not Ghost Rider, or any other serious comic you can think of. The 2 movies have stayed true to the spirit, if not the letter of the comic. It's that simple. K.I.S.S Keep It Simple Stupid. People want to make this harder than it is.

Do you actually READ the comics, man? Beause it sounds more like the cartoon you're describing to me.

"pokes fun at itself"?

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

As much as what you're all saying is true, I seriously doubt FOX has the balls to do that though. They will wipe their hands of this franchise just like the others they've hacked to death.
.

Agreed.

 

[Bishop2]

Do you actually READ the comics, man? Beause it sounds more like the cartoon you're describing to me.

"pokes fun at itself"?

I read the comics and have been doing so for years. And I agree with what he said. Unless, of course, you're reading the all-too-short-lived "Marvel Knights 4," or later, just "4." It was a decent book that went a far more serious route. And of course, the main book has gotten sadly grim in the wake of Civil War, but let's not talk about Civil War, because it was crap and made Reed go so far out of character that it makes my head explode. Let's talk about Mark Waid - now there's a guy who totally GOT the FF. His run is the best in the last 10 or so years easy, and keeps things mostly very light and ALWAYS humorous.

 

[Milkman95]

Save it Milk, you lurk around here for 3 weeks when everyone around here liked the film. So since it's not going to do as well as the original you jump in with your spin?

Die Hard 4 is tanking and was no. 1 at the BO for 1 day. It probably won't make 100 million.

See above about Transformers. Although I'll admit I liked it dispite the flaws, but the groan scenes in that movie were 100 times worse than "Marco - Polo".

Save what? My opinion? DH4 should do well overall, meaning worldwide. We'll see what happens, should be interesting.

That's all it is, an opinion, and I did say FF2 was an improvement over the original, it just wasn't a big enough one is all. I do agree Transformers had some cheesy moments, but overall, it was a spectacle to see.

 

[highguard]

1) When did Story say that Fox specifically showed him numbers that said to aim that a kid demographic?

2) The film can't be 2 and 1/2 hours because they simply didn't have the budget for that without degenerating into assloads of talking on static sets. I'm glad this movie wasn't just 2 and 1/2 hours of blather, it had ACTION and moved fast!

http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=237096&page=11

Tim Story:

Playing to a younger crowd

To find the right tone for "Silver Surfer," Story says he is tapping into why the first "Fantastic Four" was so successful. He had originally thought that movie was for comic-book crazed teenagers and 20-somethings.

"The film actually played younger than we thought. We found that 8-year-olds and 9-year-olds and even 6-year-olds were able to go watch this movie and have a ball," he says. "And because it's younger, we also found that we also got people on the other side of the 25 range because they have to take their kids."

Actually it was McMahon who let slip that they were asked to tone it down:

With that type of audience in mind, Story will again rely on the teasing banter among the superheroes that kids find so funny but will adjust his approach to McMahon's villain.

"Because of what happened with the last movie - the younger-audience skew - I've been asked to temper things just a little bit more toward a more childish audience," says McMahon, with what seems like a permanently arched eyebrow. "They wanted me to tone it down a little bit so it didn't look quite as brutal."

I need to be clear on this. I don't think the PG rating is or was a problem. I loved that it was PG. What I have a problem with is when that is the target audience and others are discarded. Does PG mean you can't get 2 and a 1/2 hours and well developed character moments with serious tones.

I think the FF includes light and Dark moments even though I think the Dark moments are in the crises they face. Batman fights megalomaniacs who want to take over cities. The FF on a good day fights villains who want to rule the world, other days they fight villains who want to destroy all life on earth (Galactus) and other days they face villains bent on wiping out all life in the Galaxy and beyond, Abraxus, Anihilus etc.

The budget was 130 million. I don't accept that you can't make a 2 & 1/2 movie with 130 million dollars. When did that become a reality.

Star Wars:ROTS was 2 hours 26 minutes and cost 113 million.

http://boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=starwars3.htm

And there was plenty of action in that movie.

Maybe George is on to something when he said everyone but one or two people are coming to him to do the special effects.

maybe Fox who may have issues with George should eat crow and pay the man some money to get a great film.

They owe us.

And don't take my constructive criticisms as an indication that I disliked FF2. I actually like both FF1 and FF2 but I took a reality check and realized that the FF can be so much more and knowing that Tim Story said he reads SHH I have taken the oppotunity in the hopes that he sees that we all love what he is trying to do to take the franchise all the way.

He said in an interview somewhere that these characters have about 4 possible movies in them and the contracts are for three with a fourth as an option.

There is still time to take this thing to the next level and I think that Tim Story is still the guy to do it. He is growing fast and i still think that he is the best one to break through and give us the a home run.

On a positive but off topic note. I just read that After Story pitched the idea to introduce the SS that Avi Arad who had wanted the Mole Man as mentioned in an interview somewhere jumped in with the people at Marvel to convince Fox to introduce SS in the FF sequel.

So Fox apparently does listen sometimes.

 

[X-Maniac]

It's true that the first movie was enjoyed more by kids - my nephews loved it, as did a work colleague's very young son - but that's because it was very much presented as that kind of movie.

Kids will still enjoy a darker movie. They are enjoying Harry Potter, which has become darker.

I'd like to see the franchise less kid-friendly. The FF are not part of the kids' market like Harry Potter and all the books and Spider-Man and all the costumes. They shouldn't make it as brooding as Batman or as sombre as Superman...but tone down the hammy humour and make it a little deeper.

Bring on the Inhumans!

 

[Advanced Dark]

Average experts consensus is 56-80 million Fri-Sun. We shall see.

 

[Agent 194]

X-Maniac,

Have to admit I agree with your post. I don't care what history or target audience research shows...I think it always backfires when you intentionally dumb it down.

When I was a kid, Monty Python was directed way over my head but I instinctively knew this was something special.

The TV show Police Squad was genius stuff. When it was later made as the Naked Gun movies it was so slap sticky and dumbed down. I didn't enjoy it as much. Dumbed down, kiddied down...whatever you want to call it....always a bad idea in my book.

 

[Carp Man]

Thursday's #'s are in. FF 2 $ 119,641,000 domestic. $ 202,141,523 WW thru 7-5. TF $ 84,903,028 domestic. $ 121,156,989 WW thru 7-5.