'Cash for Clunkers'

[Kelly]

I don't anyone is that stupid, I just think that many will not realize that they have to chill on some spending to be able to do this. When I bought my car, I MISSED THE NO CAR NOTE MONTHS....it was not fun, and for some it will hit harder than they think.

 

[Marx]

$200.00/ month is $200.00/ month you weren't paying before....along with full comprehensive insurance required on all new cars...which here in Houston could run you another $150.00 that you weren't paying before....

I think some are going to feel the pinch....and they aren't going to like it.

That's true. I'm just saying that paying $5,000 or so for a brand new car is a heck of a lot cheaper than paying 10-15,000.

 

[Majic Walrus]

Pointless? You can argue that the government's spending isn't proper - but not that it's pointless. The Cash for Clunkers rebates have an indisputable point to them: to generate car sales, boosting car dealerships and car manufactors while at the sametime cutting American depedence on foreign oil (by having more efficient cars).

If the Stimulus money is going to be spent somewhere - it might as well be in a program like this.

The Cash for Clunkers money isn't all coming from the Stimulus package that was signed. This is a seperate program.

Secondly there's no evidence that it is increasing car sales overall. Most people who plan on trading in their cars are going to do it eventually anyway. All it does is boost car sales over a short term, the long term I think will look abotu the same.

Also, I think it's entirely ******ed to destory perfectly good cars. Turning their engines into big metal bricks doesn't seem very economic does it? I heard it described best like this:

If there were a brand new lightbulb that lasted for decades and used lower amounts of energy would you break all of the lightbulbs in your house and go out to buy the new ones or would you wait until your lightbulbs broke and THEN buy new ones.

Many people cannot afford to buy a new car right now but they might be able to afford a used car. Dealerships could be making money hand over fist selling used cars at highly discounted prices giving cars to people for cheap and making money off of their used product. Are they? No.

I realize that the point is to increase manufacturing but what's the point in creating manufacturing for struggling companies instead of creating profit?

 

[Heretic]

Then don't research it on that site......kind of a duh. Go to your dealership and talk to them about it.

Geeeez, pretty easy to figure out.

Let me get this straight...you fully admit and agree that the government is using the official cash for clunkers website to spy on and violate the constitutional rights of the citizens of this country, yet because some people may know about this insanely wrong and totalitarian tactic and avoid the website you just toss it aside as if its nothing???

Thats like saying that the Holocaust was okay because Jews could have moved. The argument holds no water whatsoever...except for those who WANT the government to get rid of the constitution and force the citizens into a police state.

 

[Kelly]

That has got to be one of the dumbest analogies I have ever seen on this forum...

But you go for it...

 

[Kelly]

That has got to be one of the dumbest analogies I have ever seen on this forum...

But you go for it...

 

[Franklin Richards]

Why would the administration use a fishing tactic to get info when they can just warrantless wiretap and break into emails?


You know... Like Bush did.

 

[Kelly]

If you are calling your Saudi cousin, they may.....

 

[dnno1]

Um...what is ridiculous about it? The website itself says that your computer becomes property of the government and they have the right to search your private files.

It isnt about keeping your nose clean, its about the government violating our constitutional rights.

But...as usual...excuses are made for the erosion of the constitution...because the government would never do us wrong.

You will have to show me what website that is that says your computer becomes property of the governent. The only thing it read was this:

The communications and data stored or transiting this system may be, for any lawful Government purpose, monitored, recorded, and subject to audit or investigation. By using this system, you understand and consent to such terms.

If sombody went to a government website to comit a crime/scam you don't think they shouldn't act to prosecute the perpetrator? . That would mean they would have to record the information as evidence for future prosecution. Note that they say "lawful" as well so it is assumed that they would be working within the law. Furthermore, most comercial entities do that as well. It also basically warns you that that is what they are doing, so you could either continue on or don't. Like I said before, just keep your nose clean and there is no worries.

 

[Kelly]

That's true. I'm just saying that paying $5,000 or so for a brand new car is a heck of a lot cheaper than paying 10-15,000.

LMAO? $5,000 for a new car instead of 10-15,000, what are you buying a golf cart?

The lowest I've seen thus far is around 10,000 for a little Toyota Corolla....seats 4 comfortable....not gonna work....

BUT, HEY.....I have a Ford Escape that gets good gas mileage....so I'm not personally going to worry too much about all of this, EXCEPT THAT my $78,000 self looks to be paying more taxes in the years to come to pay for this....

 

[Marx]

LMAO? $5,000 for a new car instead of 10-15,000, what are you buying a golf cart?

The lowest I've seen thus far is around 10,000 for a little Toyota Corolla....seats 4 comfortable....not gonna work....

BUT, HEY.....I have a Ford Escape that gets good gas mileage....so I'm not personally going to worry too much about all of this, EXCEPT THAT my $78,000 self looks to be paying more taxes in the years to come to pay for this....

A local dealer (the one I told everyone about earlier - you know the guy that looked like someone killed his dog in the commercial standing in front of an american flag) has said that he dealership will match the government program and give you upwards of $9,000 off a brand new car. They have been running commericals like crazy. You can get a car like the Corolla or Cobalt for $4995. He has other cars for $7995. (After those rebates.)

 

[Heretic]

You will have to show me what website that is that says your computer becomes property of the governent. The only thing it read was this:



If sombody went to a government website to comit a crime/scam you don't think they shouldn't act to prosecute the perpetrator? . That would mean they would have to record the information as evidence for future prosecution. Note that they say "lawful" as well so it is assumed that they would be working within the law. Furthermore, most comercial entities do that as well. It also basically warns you that that is what they are doing, so you could either continue on or don't. Like I said before, just keep your nose clean and there is no worries.

I love that you intentionally removed the part of the quote where it states that the government owns your computer.

You intentionally edited the quote to protect the fact that the government is spying on its people and setting fire to the constitution...so at least we know that you stand against freedom and for government owning its citizens property.

 

[Heretic]

Why would the administration use a fishing tactic to get info when they can just warrantless wiretap and break into emails?


You know... Like Bush did.

What does this have to do with anything???

OH YEAH...you cant get your head out of the left/right paradigm...you think that one party is good and the other is bad.

I dont think that way. Bush trampled on our freedoms, and now Obama is picking up where he left off.

 

[Heretic]

That has got to be one of the dumbest analogies I have ever seen on this forum...

But you go for it...

What I did was show how outrageous his concept is...

The government is stealing our liberties, but its okay because we should know better.

Waaaay too many people accepting the fact that the government is our slave masters and that we are merely their property to do with as they will.

 

[dnno1]

I love that you intentionally removed the part of the quote where it states that the government owns your computer.

You intentionally edited the quote to protect the fact that the government is spying on its people and setting fire to the constitution...so at least we know that you stand against freedom and for government owning its citizens property.

That quote was straight from the US Department of Transportation's website (just clik on the link I provided in my post). I edited out nothing. Furthermore you haven't showed me where you got that statement about the government owning your computer. I have a feeling you just got that form Glen Beck, who basically mislead the public into thinking that by going to the CARS website (http://www.cars.gov) you automatically forefeit your computer. He said as much in this video:

[YT]mqfuZ7hiap0[/YT]

First of all, the website that he has on his laptop is for dealers who are registered with the CARS system. Secondly, his computer never did go to the page that produced the disclaimer that he displayed on his show, so there is no real credibility to what he is saying. He just wanted his listeners not to go to the consumer site (www.cars.gov) to be properly informed about the program. I have a feeling that he streched the truth a little bit and did a little wordsmithing. I am sure that it is actually the CARS database that is property of the federal government and not your computer. Don't be foolish and listen to people like that. Go find out for yourself and get your facts straight before you post.

 

[Majic Walrus]

Actually that's a pretty standard EULA. It's nothing that makes the website "Evil", it just makes it safe.

Spoiler

For instance Google Chrome: "7.3 Google reserves the right (but shall have no obligation) to pre-screen, review, flag, filter, modify, refuse or remove any or all Content from any Service."

"11.1 You retain copyright and any other rights you already hold in Content which you submit, post or display on or through, the Services. By submitting, posting or displaying the content you give Google a perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, royalty-free, and non-exclusive licence to reproduce, adapt, modify, translate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display and distribute any Content which you submit, post or display on or through, the Services. This licence is for the sole purpose of enabling Google to display, distribute and promote the Services and may be revoked for certain Services as defined in the Additional Terms of those Services."

For another instance WoW: Consent to Monitor."
WHEN RUNNING, THE GAME MAY MONITOR YOUR COMPUTER'S RANDOM ACCESS MEMORY (RAM) FOR UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAMS RUNNING CONCURRENTLY WITH THE GAME. AN "UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM" AS USED HEREIN SHALL BE DEFINED AS ANY THIRD PARTY SOFTWARE PROHIBITED BY SECTION 2. IN THE EVENT THAT THE GAME DETECTS AN UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM, THE GAME MAY (a) COMMUNICATE INFORMATION BACK TO BLIZZARD, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION YOUR ACCOUNT NAME, DETAILS ABOUT THE UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM DETECTED, AND THE TIME AND DATE; AND/OR (b) EXERCISE ANY OR ALL OF ITS RIGHTS UNDER THIS AGREEMENT, WITH OR WITHOUT PRIOR NOTICE TO THE USER."

All of these is of course neither here nor there. Beck, unsurprisingly, misquoted the website. The actual disclaimers are applicable to ALL DoT websites, not just the cars website.

Beck is so full of **** I'm surprised he can talk without spraying the room in diarrhea.

 

[Malice]

My thoughts right now on this program:

TO ME, this program far beats any other stimulus program than anything else that has been done by the administration. This program, regardless of what is advertised, is being done on the surface for "green purposes" but under the hood, they are doing it more to make the books of car companies they now own, look better.

In the end, I think Congress was frankly just surprised it took off like it did. No big deal. I think the Stimulus package should have been more programs like this....meaning its ALL set up and delivered in 2-3 years from the signing of the bill.

 

[dnno1]

... Beck is so full of **** I'm surprised he can talk without spraying the room in diarrhea.

I'm convinced it happens during the commercial breaks.

 

[BlackLantern]

I'm convinced it happens during the commercial breaks.

there's a valve on the back of his neck...they just run a hose to it

 

[dnno1]

I love that you intentionally removed the part of the quote where it states that the government owns your computer.

You intentionally edited the quote to protect the fact that the government is spying on its people and setting fire to the constitution...so at least we know that you stand against freedom and for government owning its citizens property.

To follow up on this, your rediculous claim had been debunked on Snopes.com. Like I said before, next time do you research first before you start spouting off nonsense.

 

[chaseter]

A local dealer (the one I told everyone about earlier - you know the guy that looked like someone killed his dog in the commercial standing in front of an american flag) has said that he dealership will match the government program and give you upwards of $9,000 off a brand new car. They have been running commericals like crazy. You can get a car like the Corolla or Cobalt for $4995. He has other cars for $7995. (After those rebates.)

Yeah we have commercials here for the Hyundai Acent for only $8888. Add in tax, title, etc...and you get near 10 grand but that is still a good deal. I remember when all cars were around 20 grand and all the good vehicles were 30 grand or more.

 

[chaseter]

To follow up on this, your rediculous claim had been debunked on Snopes.com. Like I said before, next time do you research first before you start spouting off nonsense.

Snopes, the most trusted name in news!

Frankly, it could have been that they were trying to take more control over us or they were just that stupid to write something like that. Either way, its not a good indicator for us. This is coming from the White House that wants us to forward them joke e-mails about healthcare It isn't surprising that they would possibly want access to your computer. They also changed the wording of that so either they did **** up or they were surprised that they got caught.

These are the same people that are writing health care reform bills If they can't even get a user agreement right, what makes you think we are going to be better off when the over thousand page health care bill rolls out? They already screwed up the Stimulus Bill and so our future looks grim.

 

[BlackLantern]

To follow up on this, your rediculous claim had been debunked on Snopes.com. Like I said before, next time do you research first before you start spouting off nonsense.

Ive always operated on the assumption that the government is always watching/listening...probably always have been since Nixon was in office

 

[Malice]

One thing that bothers me....is the destruction of cars...that currently work.
You know there is just something fundamentally wrong to me with the killing of a car that actually runs.

just feels wrong, whether it really is or not....

 

[Kelly]

A local dealer (the one I told everyone about earlier - you know the guy that looked like someone killed his dog in the commercial standing in front of an american flag) has said that he dealership will match the government program and give you upwards of $9,000 off a brand new car. They have been running commericals like crazy. You can get a car like the Corolla or Cobalt for $4995. He has other cars for $7995. (After those rebates.)

I'd like to know what those cars have on them.....lol, I just don't trust these dealerships....they are getting rid of inventory like crazy, and this time of year it is inventory at the end of the conveyor belt.....BUT, hey a new car, is a new car.....I would definitely look at some of those cars for my teenager, if I had a teenager.....for me, its loaded or nothing.

Also, what I'm hearing is that it us up to $4,500.....not everyone automatically gets the $4,500......not sure how that works, but that is a screw up point for some....