Changing you

[PyroChamber]

Has anyone ever been in a relationship where your girlfriend/boyfriend wanted to change something about you, whether it was how you looked, what type of things you liked, who your friends were, etc.?

 

[jaguarr]

Sure have. They aren't around anymore.

jag

 

[Lackey]

Has anyone ever been in a relationship where your girlfriend/boyfriend wanted to change something about you, whether it was how you looked, what type of things you liked, who your friends were, etc.?

sometimes...sometimes, I don't see a problem with this provided it's not extreme in most cases. I mean, shouldn't you be with someone who makes you want to be a better person?

 

[twylight]

sometimes...sometimes, I don't see a problem with this provided it's not extreme in most cases. I mean, shouldn't you be with someone who makes you want to be a better person?

There's a difference between them trying to change you, and you changing yourself for them.

 

[jaguarr]

sometimes...sometimes, I don't see a problem with this provided it's not extreme in most cases. I mean, shouldn't you be with someone who makes you want to be a better person?

The key part of that is that YOU are the one who wants to improve, which suggests you have some active input into what that means, as opposed to someone just trying to mold you to who and what they want you to be instead of just accepting you for who you are.

jag

 

[twylight]

I said it better with fewer words.

 

[BRUTAL]

There's a difference between them trying to change you, and you changing yourself for them.

In a good relatioship you should have to change yourself darlin'

 

[Lackey]

There's a difference between them trying to change you, and you changing yourself for them.

unless you don't know what to change if someone doesn't tell you



it's like when you have something stuck in your teeth...you need someone to tell you.

 

[twylight]

In a good relatioship you should have to change yourself darlin'

..I know..I have had one before...

unless you don't know what to change if someone doesn't tell you



it's like when you have something stuck in your teeth...you need someone to tell you.

Lackey..darling there's a difference.

If I said "I want you to cut your hair, because you make me look like I'm dating a loser" as opposed to "You look nice with your hair cut like this" which one are you going to be more willing to listen to?

First one is their own selfish reasons, second one is them giving suggestions out of love.

 

[BRUTAL]

If I said "I want you to cut your hair, because you make me look like I'm dating a loser" as opposed to "You look nice with your hair cut like this" which one are you going to be more willing to listen to?

First one is their own selfish reasons, second one is them giving suggestions out of love.

Why not just leave his hair preferences alone?

 

[Lackey]

Lackey..darling there's a difference.

If I said "I want you to cut your hair, because you make me look like I'm dating a loser" as opposed to "You look nice with your hair cut like this" which one are you going to be more willing to listen to?

First one is their own selfish reasons, second one is them giving suggestions out of love.

No, they're both the same, the second one is just buttered up. Both are trying to make him get a better hairstyle to please her.

 

[twylight]

Why not just leave his hair preferences alone?

I mean, shouldn't you be with someone who makes you want to be a better person?

If he wanted to be a better person for me he'd cut his hair.

 

[BRUTAL]

Well I shave my head so I can't relate to any hair-related semi-hatred

 

[Lackey]

If he wanted to be a better person for me he'd cut his hair.

see. we're basically agreeing here.

 

[twylight]

No, they're both the same, the second one is just buttered up. Both are trying to make him get a better hairstyle to please her.

. . . .


I give up..it wasn't about the hair it was about the whole premise...

There is selfish gain and there is love gain.

The change Pyro, I'm assuming, was addressing was the kind that came from selfish ambition. Picking out a guy, and then changing the way he is over silly things, the types of movies he likes, how he cleans the house...this isn't changing him for the better, it's changing him to what she wants him to be.

 

[BRUTAL]

There is selfish gain and there is love gain.

The change Pyro, I'm assuming, was addressing was the kind that came from selfish ambition. Picking out a guy, and then changing the way he is over silly things, the types of movies he likes, how he cleans the house...this isn't changing him for the better, it's changing him to what she wants him to be.

Ugh. Why do people keep throwing this word around?

I sort of half agree with you. There are changes that are based in selfishness however if a relationship is worth anything to begin with then the necessary changes are not instigated, they just happen. If you have to initiate changes in order to make the relationship work then it's more than likely not going to work in the long run anyway.

 

[PyroChamber]

. . . .


I give up..it wasn't about the hair it was about the whole premise...

There is selfish gain and there is love gain.

The change Pyro, I'm assuming, was addressing was the kind that came from selfish ambition. Picking out a guy, and then changing the way he is over silly things, the types of movies he likes, how he cleans the house...this isn't changing him for the better, it's changing him to what she wants him to be.

That's what I was talking about.

 

[twylight]

Ugh. Why do people keep throwing this word around?

I sort of half agree with you. There are changes that are based in selfishness however if a relationship is worth anything to begin with then the necessary changes are not instigated, they just happen. If you have to initiate changes in order to make the relationship work then it's more than likely not going to work in the long run anyway.

I don't use the word 'love' in respect to relationships loosely.
It's a dangerous and powerful thing.

Has anyone ever been in a relationship where your girlfriend/boyfriend wanted to change something about you, whether it was how you looked, what type of things you liked, who your friends were, etc.?

With the exclusion of the friends, since sometimes friends are a bad influence none of those things 'need' changing in respect to what the 'core' of the person is, nor their character.

"Types of things you liked" is open for debate, sexual things, food things, etc..etc..these can be 'compromised' but not 'changed' since these won't necessarily make the person 'better' in anyway. *well..maybe sexually..but *

 

[BRUTAL]

I don't use the word 'love' in respect to relationships loosely.
It's a dangerous and powerful thing.

That's just it though, it's not. That word means next to nothing nowadys because it's use peppers eveything from TV shows to Advertisements. No one actually knows how to express themselves anymore with using the good old default "Love". It's sad to think that the only way you can tell someone how you feel is to use a word you can even define.

 

[Angry Sentinel]

I think you guys have outlined a very fine distinction. Now, how does one know when you've crossed the line? If you think a person would be a better person for keeping themselves better groomed and they disagree... then you've crossed the line. Doesn't matter if you are right(or your opinion is more popular and accepted) or not, all that matters is that you are now trying to FORCE something on someone that NEEDS to choose this for themselves.

In other words, all real 'changing you' NEEDS to WANT to be done by YOU, regardless of where the initial suggestion comes from.

 

[Lackey]

. . . .


I give up..it wasn't about the hair it was about the whole premise...

There is selfish gain and there is love gain.

The change Pyro, I'm assuming, was addressing was the kind that came from selfish ambition. Picking out a guy, and then changing the way he is over silly things, the types of movies he likes, how he cleans the house...this isn't changing him for the better, it's changing him to what she wants him to be.

some push for change is done out of both selfishness and love


Say you meet a guy and he's really funny and has a great personality and you guys just really hit it off and have a lot to talk about and of course you're physically attracted to him... and all that has helped you to look passed that stupid emo haircut he's sporting, and he's not emo, he just has that haircut for some reason and he's had it for the past 3 years.
You might mention that he'd look nicer with a different haircut one of these days, if you two stay together for any length of time.
It's done out of selfishness because you personally don't like that haircut and would prefer something different and fits your personal taste. And it's done out of love because you know how nice he looks underneath that mop and you want that to show through.
The same reason a mom would tell her son to cut her hair, which would be completely out of love without selfishness.

 

[BRUTAL]

Say you meet a guy and he's really funny and has a great personality and you guys just really hit it off and have a lot to talk about and of course you're physically attracted to him... and all that has helped you to look passed that stupid emo haircut he's sporting, and he's not emo, he just has that haircut for some reason and he's had it for the past 3 years.
You might mention that he'd look nicer with a different haircut one of these days, if you two stay together for any length of time.
It's done out of selfishness because you personally don't like that haircut and would prefer something different and fits your personal taste. And it's done out of love because you know how nice he looks underneath that mop and you want that to show through.
The same reason a mom would tell her son to cut her hair, which would be completely out of love without selfishness.

I sense much experience talking here

 

[Lackey]

I had an emo haircut

 

[BRUTAL]

It's ok buddy, we all make bad decisions sometimes, you'll get through this ...

 

[twylight]

some push for change is done out of both selfishness and love


Say you meet a guy and he's really funny and has a great personality and you guys just really hit it off and have a lot to talk about and of course you're physically attracted to him... and all that has helped you to look passed that stupid emo haircut he's sporting, and he's not emo, he just has that haircut for some reason and he's had it for the past 3 years.
You might mention that he'd look nicer with a different haircut one of these days, if you two stay together for any length of time.
It's done out of selfishness because you personally don't like that haircut and would prefer something different and fits your personal taste. And it's done out of love because you know how nice he looks underneath that mop and you want that to show through.
The same reason a mom would tell her son to cut her hair, which would be completely out of love without selfishness.

I don't even know how to react to that since I've never had that issue.
Most of the guys I know, are well aware of what they need to change about themselves. I only support them in the change. If I don't agree I tell them how I feel, but I don't force them to change, or even want them to change if they don't want to.

I agree with you and understand what you're saying but PyroChamber has already made the distinction, if you push the change without them wanting to change, they youi are doing it for selfish reasons, because they have already told you that they don't want to change.

Once it goes past them accepting your suggestions and wanting to change, then it becomes purely selfish. If you truly loved the person you'd stand by their decision, after they made it.