Characters And Copyright Laws

[Memphis Slim]

Maybe some of you can help me out on this....

I recall reading how DC comics sued Fawcett back in the 40's because Captain Marvel was too close to being like Superman.

But today we have characters at Marvel that are so much like DC characters, the only difference is in name.

Hyperion is just like Superman. More similar than Capt. Marvel ever was. hIS ORIGIN IS SO CLOSE TO Superman.....

Nighthawk is Batman except for the skin color and being more blood thirsty. Origin the same...almost.

How can you have a Captain Marvel at DC and Marvel comics without a legal problem??


Can you name some more characters that are copy cats??

 

[Darthphere]

Closing....

 

[Memphis Slim]

sigh........

 

[supermarvelman]

Well Marvel legally got the rights to use the name Captain Marvel, since DC put Billy on the shelves, by the time DC decided that Billy wasnt a threat to Superman's popularity anymore, Marvel had already got the rights to use the name. That is why DC's Captain Marvel has been called Shazam eversince. Also Marvels Captain Marvel and DC's Captain Marvel are nothing alike, so legally DC would not beable to sue. If I had an independent comicbook company I could legally use names such as Colossus as long as the character isnt a direct knock off of Marvel's Colossus. For example I could name a character Colossus and his powers could be more similar to Giant-Man's powers, instead of metal transformation and that would not break copyright laws.

 

[Darthphere]

I already answered all of this.

 

[Artistsean]

Copycats of Superman (Actually just Superman types):
Icon (DC/Milestone, I think)
Supreme (Image, I think)
Apollo (Wildstorm)
Gladiator (Marvel)
Sentry (Marvel)
Mighty Man (not sure, old time comic)
Mr. Majestic (Image, I think)
Samaritan (Astro City comic)
Captain Marvel (Marvel)
There was also this Skrull character that Marvel used in a Spider-Man story,
his story: an orphan from outerspace, cared for by a human couple, goes to the city to become a big time super hero. He can fly, is super strong, and has super visions, but then he discovers he is actually a Skrull. (can't think of his name but he is from Marvel)

and there is probably way more, almost all super heroes are inspired by Superman in some way.

Freakazoid was directly inspired by, and stories for the show were used from the comics of, Madman

 

[supermarvelman]

I already answered all of this.

Where?

 

[supermarvelman]

Icon (DC/Milestone, I think)
Supreme (Image, I think)
Apollo (Wildstorm)
Gladiator (Marvel)
Sentry (Marvel)
Mighty Man (not sure, old time comic)
Mr. Majestic (Image, I think)
Samaritan (Astro City comic)

and there is probably way more, almost all super heroes are inspired by Superman in some way.

Mr. Majestic is Wildstorm, also most of the heroes above are inspired by Superman, but most of them are very different, except for the powers. But Superman is THE superhero, but he is very generic really, so it's almost a given that basically every comic company will have a "Superman" just like most comic company's will have a "Flash" or an "Aquaman".

I agree, even me being a Marvel Zombie, I can agree that almost all heroes are inspired by Superman, most superheroes wouldn't exist if he was never created, like how in Infinite Crisis they said that Superman was basically the center of all creation of the DC Universe/Multiverse, but I think that even apply's to Marvel and every other comic book company.

 

[Artistsean]

Before Superman there were no "Super Hero" comics. But there were adventure comics. So Superman was sort of inspired by those comics, but Superman started the whole superhero trend.

But like you were saying, most of the characters are different enough. They are just Superman types.
Like now someone might make a Spider-Man type or a Hulk type.

Comics have been doing that for years, thats sort of what Captain Marvel did when he was created at Fawcett.
Superman was so successful that everyone created their "Superman" types. Fawcett had Captain Marvel, but instead of being a hero/normal man Captain Marvel was a Hero/kid.

DC thought Fawcett's character was too close and sued them. They were tied up in legal battles to the point that they went out of buisness, at least I think thats what happened. Thats why Fawcett lost and why DC won and got Captain Marvel.

But couldn't DC try this today? I mean all the characters I listed are different but are obvius Superman types. Couldn't DC sue these guys?

 

[Darthphere]

Not according to the Supreme Court.

 

[Artistsean]

Whats different now?

 

[Darthphere]

Its a different age and era. People understand homages and satire now. As long as theyre not calling the character Superman or Super-Man or something like that, its all good.

 

[supermarvelman]

There was also this Skrull character that Marvel used in a Spider-Man story,
his story: an orphan from outerspace, cared for by a human couple, goes to the city to become a big time super hero. He can fly, is super strong, and has super visions, but then he discovers he is actually a Skrull. (can't think of his name but he is from Marvel)

and there is probably way more, almost all super heroes are inspired by Superman in some way.

His Name is Ethan Edwards aka Moral Man, Virtue, The Tiller. I'd like Marvel to use him again one day, he was pretty cool. He is probably the closest to a Superman knock-off that exists in Marvel, evenmore than Gladiator and Sentry. His origin is basically the same, his upbringing is nearly the same, and his powers are almost identical, he did showcase some powers that Superman has never shown before, he was able to project energy blasts from his hands. He also was a writer for the the Daily Bugle, and he wears glasses as a disguise.

 

[wobbly]

With Hyperion, who, with the Squadron Supreme has been around for ages now, both Marvel and DC were in on that as the Squadron Supreme first appeared in an old Avengers issue at the same time a team very similar to the Avengers appeared in the Justice League of America: Basically, the writers were having a little fun so no harm no foul.

Had DC known Marvel would get no small amount of mileage out of the Squadron Supreme they might not have been so amicable about it at the time, as Marvel themselves did later threaten to sue the owners of Miracleman whose original name was Marvelman (I have met Dez Skinn, editor at Trident when the book was produced, who told me how he had to go and manually change every word balloon with 'Marvelman' to 'Miracleman' because of that) and with that case the only issue was the use of the word 'Marvel'.

These days though I think unless the infringement is very cut and dry most companies realise the only real winners in such cases are the law firms that represent them.

 

[Memphis Slim]

Well Marvel legally got the rights to use the name Captain Marvel, since DC put Billy on the shelves, by the time DC decided that Billy wasnt a threat to Superman's popularity anymore, Marvel had already got the rights to use the name. That is why DC's Captain Marvel has been called Shazam eversince. Also Marvels Captain Marvel and DC's Captain Marvel are nothing alike, so legally DC would not beable to sue. If I had an independent comicbook company I could legally use names such as Colossus as long as the character isnt a direct knock off of Marvel's Colossus. For example I could name a character Colossus and his powers could be more similar to Giant-Man's powers, instead of metal transformation and that would not break copyright laws.

Hmmmm......I didn't know that about the Capt. Marvel name. Thanks.

 

[supermarvelman]

Before Superman there were no "Super Hero" comics. But there were adventure comics. So Superman was sort of inspired by those comics, but Superman started the whole superhero trend.

But like you were saying, most of the characters are different enough. They are just Superman types.
Like now someone might make a Spider-Man type or a Hulk type.

Comics have been doing that for years, thats sort of what Captain Marvel did when he was created at Fawcett.
Superman was so successful that everyone created their "Superman" types. Fawcett had Captain Marvel, but instead of being a hero/normal man Captain Marvel was a Hero/kid.

DC thought Fawcett's character was too close and sued them. They were tied up in legal battles to the point that they went out of buisness, at least I think thats what happened. Thats why Fawcett lost and why DC won and got Captain Marvel.

But couldn't DC try this today? I mean all the characters I listed are different but are obvius Superman types. Couldn't DC sue these guys?

I think there are big enough differences in all the characters named that DC would not win. If DC had tried to sue for Captain Marvel(Billy Batson) in todays society, they would not win.

 

[Fading]

You have to look past powers, though I do agree with Hyperion, but like said above he's more of a homage or satire (as his entire team is somewhat of a JL deal).

Anymore anytime someone has the swiss army knife power set (Super strength, speed, invulnerability, flight, energy projection) ppl think it's a Superman rip off. Take Sentry tho, he has similar powers (and instead of frost breath or eye beams it's energy projection from his hands and telepathy I believe), but past his powers he's vastly different from Supes. Sentry was born on Earth and his powers aren't natural which is the opposite of Superman. Superman has a weakness of an inanimate object in Kryptonite, Sentry has a weakness in himself. Superman's biggest foe is Luthor, Sentry's biggest foe is his other half.

Most of these guys are only similar in powers to Superman, or status as their Earth's most powerful hero. They differ however (with a small group of pure ripoffs) in costumes, names, background stories, villains and so on.

So it's not enough to claim Copyright infringement, (like said above) if Hyperion was named Super-Man and crashlanded on Earth from another planet and worked at a newspaper then they might have a good case.

 

[supermarvelman]

Totally agree.

 

[Silicon Surfer]

There have even been cases where they have written each others characters in. For example crowd scenes in Spider Man where you can see Clark Kent. Or Spider Man lurking in a dark corner at a major DC event.

 

[Artistsean]

I think there are big enough differences in all the characters named that DC would not win. If DC had tried to sue for Captain Marvel(Billy Batson) in todays society, they would not win.

I think DC was able to get away with that in the beginning because it was such a new idea. They probably thought they could hold the market on super heroes or something like that. Sue for a character that is similar top yours to show everyone not to mess with you, I don't know.

I just thought that along with the characters being different that the name had to be different too. If you can or can't I just need to know.

You have to look past powers, though I do agree with Hyperion, but like said above he's more of a homage or satire (as his entire team is somewhat of a JL deal).

Anymore anytime someone has the swiss army knife power set (Super strength, speed, invulnerability, flight, energy projection) ppl think it's a Superman rip off. Take Sentry tho, he has similar powers (and instead of frost breath or eye beams it's energy projection from his hands and telepathy I believe), but past his powers he's vastly different from Supes. Sentry was born on Earth and his powers aren't natural which is the opposite of Superman. Superman has a weakness of an inanimate object in Kryptonite, Sentry has a weakness in himself. Superman's biggest foe is Luthor, Sentry's biggest foe is his other half.

Most of these guys are only similar in powers to Superman, or status as their Earth's most powerful hero. They differ however (with a small group of pure ripoffs) in costumes, names, background stories, villains and so on.

So it's not enough to claim Copyright infringement, (like said above) if Hyperion was named Super-Man and crashlanded on Earth from another planet and worked at a newspaper then they might have a good case.

But you also have to look at the way a character is presented.
With Sentry he was presented as Marvel's answer to Superman in a Marvel/Wizard magazine April Fools joke.

Similar Hyperion and the whole Squadrin were presented as Marvel's JLA.

Or in the new book Invincible Omni-Man is a clearly meant to be a Superman type.

Or Apollo and the Midnighter, there powers are different from Superman and Batman right? But they are clearly meant to be homages (thats a word right?) of Superman and Batman like the others here.
But still there are some characters out there who have the Swiss Army Knife powers who aren't meant to be a Superman type. They just have many powers that might include some Superman has.

So its not just the difference in the powers or origin, those might be very different but the intent might be the same.

Mallibue Comics had a character called Prime, remember him? He was a 15 year old boy who could transform into a Superman type, he was sort of that comic companies answer to Captain Marvel, and sort of Superman.
But Mallibue was bought out by Marvel, who felt many of their characters were being copied by that company. (examples inlcude: Freaks= X-Men, Ultra Force= Avengers or JLA, Prototype= Iron man)
They didn't sue them, but they did buy them out.

But now Marvel owns Prime,
If Marvel tried to use Prime now, as Marvel's answer to DC's Captain Marvel, do you think they would be sued?
If so would Marvel or DC win in that?

 

[Joker]

seeing as Hyperion and Nighthawk are parodies/satire on Superman and Batman, from a book that was a parody/satire of the JLA, I think that I just have one thing to say...the maker of this thread is a god damn idiot, and this should be closed

 

[Artistsean]

Copyright laws and trademark laws are INCREDIBLY important in the comic book world.
What constitues a parody versus outright copying? Is it in the story, in the character design, in the name, or in th title of the comic? I supppose if I were to create a character who origin was similar, I am still not sure.

It still seems like a company would try to protect their characters name somehow, do any of the comic companies do that? Or are they not legally allowed to?

Also does anyone know of a great website where I can find simple and easily understandable copyright and trademark laws posted specifically for this sort of thing?

 

[wobbly]

Hmmn...I think something being a parody or satire doesn't excuse it from copyright laws: it it makes someone money, it's surely still subject to copyright infringement? (maybe even more if its mocking the source?)

I'm thinking of all the movie spoofs here too, like the recent 'Epic movie' for example. Now that has obvious lifts from X-men, Narnia, Harry Potter, Willy Wonka, POTC, etc...did the producers of that get permissions from all those sources for the many spoofs they have in that?

 

[Darthphere]

Hmmn...I think something being a parody or satire doesn't excuse it from copyright laws: it it makes someone money, it's surely still subject to copyright infringement? (maybe even more if its mocking the source?)

I'm thinking of all the movie spoofs here too, like the recent 'Epic movie' for example. Now that has obvious lifts from X-men, Narnia, Harry Potter, Willy Wonka, POTC, etc...did the producers of that get permissions from all those sources for the many spoofs they have in that?

Probably not, but again, its parody, they're protected. Notice how they spelled Narnia as Gnarnia in the movie.

 

[Artistsean]

But at a certain point isn't it infringment, I mean once it gets a little too close? Is there ever a point where someone can sue over copying or is it always legally protected if they say its a parody?