Cops kill Groom.

jks said:
*sigh*

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/26/nyregion/26cops.html?em&ex=1164690000&en=3224a01c2af0d48e&ei=5087



So not only did he slam into the vehicle [which at that point could have just been an accident] but then he backs up, which at that point makes it a hit and run, almost hits someone [undercover cop or civilin, doesn't matter] which makes it attempted vehicular manslaughter and THEN procedes to ram the minivan AGAIN. At that point the officers justfully believed after a repeat ramming that they were being attacked and dfended themselves. Case closed.

Or to look at it another way,he's driving under the influence. has an accident, driving into a van. decides to park up and leave his details, but a combination of booze n shock, and he hits the throttle too hard , and clips someone in the road, on his way to colliding with the shop. puts his foot down in a total panic, having seen the person he clips produce a gun (in the wingmirror). collides with the van again.

then gets hsot at 50 times.

case NOT closed.
 
logansoldcigar said:
Or to look at it another way,he's driving under the influence. has an accident, driving into a van. decides to park up and leave his details, but a combination of booze n shock, and he hits the throttle too hard , and clips someone in the road, on his way to colliding with the shop. puts his foot down in a total panic, having seen the person he clips produce a gun (in the wingmirror). collides with the van again.

then gets hsot at 50 times.

case NOT closed.

http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10638653&postcount=53
 
why, a link to my own post. how terribly kind.
But seeing as i typed it, i dont need to read it.

Edit: and now you've linked it to the post i quoted.

your point is?
 
This is sad...but, I hate that Al Sharpton is involved. The man is a walking, talking parody.
 
comicgirl said:
This is sad...but, I hate that Al Sharpton is involved. The man is a walking, talking parody.
We haven't learned yet not to go to Al when we have problems. He just takes away any validity.
 
terry78 said:
We haven't learned yet not to go to Al when we have problems. He just takes away any validity.
He sucks the validity out of everything he touches. And, why is he still walking around with the Don King perm? Ugh!
 
logansoldcigar said:
Or to look at it another way,he's driving under the influence. has an accident, driving into a van. decides to park up and leave his details, but a combination of booze n shock, and he hits the throttle too hard , and clips someone in the road, on his way to colliding with the shop. puts his foot down in a total panic, having seen the person he clips produce a gun (in the wingmirror). collides with the van again.

then gets hsot at 50 times.

case NOT closed.

Again, it seems like an unfortunate set of events on both sides. The cops were undercover (high stress situation), see one of their own get hit by a car. Five open fire. That is an average of ten bullets a piece. Extreme? Yes. But an unfortunate accident. It is certainly not comprable to the beating of Rodney King.
 
comicgirl said:
This is sad...but, I hate that Al Sharpton is involved. The man is a walking, talking parody.

Agreed, and it really doesn't seem to be a race thing either. It seems to be a case where both sides (the groom and the cops) made mistakes in high stress situations. Its not like Rodney King where he was beat because he was black, and thats what Sharpton is trying to turn it into.
 
I don't think a lot of people understand how stressful situations not even including undercover but general police work is.

And cops aren't mind readers, they don't know if they do or do not have weapons on them. If you are apprehending a suspect and he won't get his hands out of his pocket, or is resisting. You don't give them the benefit of the doubt that they are probably not holding some sort of weapon. You sometimes have to put them down hard because you want to be able to go home. In the end, these cops are only human.
 
^True enough, but they knew what the job was going to be like when they took it. Being a cop is probably the most disturbing job you'll ever have, and if you don't have the emotional strength or sense of judgment to deal, you're gonna **** up. Cops have to be, for lack of a better term, better than the rest of us.
 
terry78 said:
^True enough, but they knew what the job was going to be like when they took it. Being a cop is probably the most disturbing job you'll ever have, and if you don't have the emotional strength or sense of judgment to deal.....

Shooting isn't "not having emotional strength or sense of judgment". It was about them responding to a situation in the only way they could. The men were fleeing, the men clipped an officer and then repeatidly rammed a police van. Drunk or not, if I kill someone while drunk, its not an excuse. The groom bears just as much responsibility and if they just got out of the car, he would be on his honeymoon right now.

I personally think they made the right call. They saw an officer get clipped by a car by a fleeing suspect well in an undercover situation and they opened fire. They did it to protect themselves and their fellow officers. It was a tragic mistake. Granted, they may have shot too much, but anyone who hasn't been in the same situation has no right to judge them. They were undercover cops and one of them got hit by a car for godsakes.

Furthermore, I'd like to emphasize again...lets not turn this into a race thing, because its not. I really do wonder, if it were just a middle class white guy who got shot if this would be getting the same kind of feed back?
 
Matt said:
Shooting isn't "not having emotional strength or sense of judgment".

I personally think they made the right call. They saw an officer get clipped by a car by a fleeing suspect well in an undercover situation and they opened fire. They did it to protect themselves and their fellow officers. It was a tragic mistake. Granted, they may have shot too much, but anyone who hasn't been in the same situation has no right to judge them. They were undercover cops and one of them got hit by a car for godsakes.

Furthermore, I'd like to emphasize again...lets not turn this into a race thing, because its not. I really do wonder, if it were just a middle class white guy who got shot if this would be getting the same kind of feed back?

If they were fleeing, then there was no reason to keep firing at them. Police are allowed to fire on a suspect only when they are in danger.

Seeing as how the officer hit by the car was not injured and was even able to fire at the car, I don't think the car was going that fast. It very well could have been the poor driving of a drunk driver.
 
Outsiderzedge said:
If they were fleeing, then there was no reason to keep firing at them. Police are allowed to fire on a suspect only when they are in danger.

Seeing as how the officer hit by the car was not injured and was even able to fire at the car, I don't think the car was going that fast. It very well could have been the poor driving of a drunk driver.

He hit an officer with a car, going ten miles per hour behind 2 tons of metal is enough to seriously injure someone. Hell, going 5 miles an hour is enough to seriously injure someone.

However, I concede to the greatness that is Outsiderzedge who never makes any mistakes, I'm sure if you were in an undercover situation and just saw one of your teammates get hit by a car, you would've remained perfectly calm and said "Oh well, we'll get them next time".
 
Matt said:
He hit an officer with a car, going ten miles per hour behind 2 tons of metal is enough to seriously injure someone. Hell, going 5 miles an hour is enough to seriously injure someone.

However, I concede to the greatness that is Outsiderzedge who never makes any mistakes, I'm sure if you were in an undercover situation and just saw one of your teammates get hit by a car, you would've remained perfectly calm and said "Oh well, we'll get them next time".

:o.
 
I remember it being said that one office shot 31 times (the most of them all)
Clap your hands together and count to 31. It surprised me a great deal.
 
This was a terrible accident, the cops probably shot too much but hindsight is 20/20, I have no clue why this is turning into a race issue, I feel bad for white cops (I'm black) ,if it was asian or black cops who did this, it wouldnt be nearly as big, but since they're white race has to come in, I guess its the Sharpton effect...
 
whether its racist or not ..ITS WRONG! its murder!


50 shots with only a pause to RELOAD!???:wow:


it was some form of hate and negligence ..either way spells murder
 
DarthRekal said:
whether its racist or not ..ITS WRONG! its murder!


50 shots with only a pause to RELOAD!???:wow:


it was some form of hate and negligence ..either way spells murder

Or it is a case of a drunk suspect ran over a cop in his friggin car so 5 officers opened fire.
 
Matt said:
Or it is a case of a drunk suspect ran over a cop in his friggin car so 5 officers opened fire.

50rounds???? did they wana make sure they were all dead????


yeah okay lets not make sure they're debilitated(sp) but let me reload my clip and keep wailing:whatever:
 
Wouldn't it make more sense to blow their tires out?
 
terry78 said:
Wouldn't it make more sense to blow their tires out?

no that would just anger them more who knows the damage they would do they must be hopped up on pcp..:ninja:
 
DarthRekal said:
50rounds???? did they wana make sure they were all dead????


yeah okay lets not make sure they're debilitated(sp) but let me reload my clip and keep wailing:whatever:

50 rounds among 5 men. Its not that bad when you look at it that way.
 
terry78 said:
Wouldn't it make more sense to blow their tires out?

Yes, it would. However, they were undercover cops which is about as high stress as it gets and then suddenly one of their teammates is ran over. If you were in the same exact situation, I really doubt you'd of thought to blow out tires.

And just for the record, wouldn't it have made more sense for the groom to you know, just stop and get out of the car instead of trying to run from the police?
 
I don't think they tried to run when the shooting started. Going by the reports and the picture earlier, the car was already crashed into the police van when the cops started firing. Basicly these guys weren't moving and the cops fired anyway.

After going over it today, how a mistake was made does make sense. The officer that was run over fired at the back of the car. A window shatters and the remaining officers, after having the car nearly hit them, assumed they were under attack and returned fire...But not everything is clear yet so who knows who fired when.
 

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