The Amazing Spider-Man 2 Critic bias towards this franchise?

[Spider-Fan]

Critics review the movie before them. If they don't like it, they don't like it. They are not biased against this series. They are biased against what they don't like about the movie, which may or may not be a problem that was apparent in the 1st film also.

I always hate when fanboys question the validity of EVERY critic if the RT score doesn't mesh with their opinion. You don't have to hate this movie, but critics don't have to love it either. Yes, SOME critics don't like superheroes or have a bias against blockbuster films. But, there is no mass conspiracy amongst critics directed toward this movie.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Critics review the movie before them. If they don't like it, they don't like it. They are not biased against this series. They are biased against what they don't like about the movie, which may or may not be a problem that was apparent in the 1st film also.

I always hate when fanboys question the validity of EVERY critic if the RT score doesn't mesh with their opinion. You don't have to hate this movie, but critics don't have to love it either. Yes, SOME critics don't like superheroes or have a bias against blockbuster films. But, there is no mass conspiracy amongst critics directed toward this movie.

Saying what I have been trying to say the entire time. The fanboy heartache every single time, really?

 

[Spider-Fan]

Saying what I have been trying to say the entire time. The fanboy heartache every single time, really?

Exactly. I disagreed with several reviewers on their analysis on Cap 1, but the fact Cap 2 (reviewed by the same pool of people) scored way higher shows a lack of bias against the genre. Critics judge the movie before them. Just like we, the movie going public and comic book fans, do. The only difference is, they don't have a horse in the race and they get paid.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Exactly. I disagreed with several reviewers on their analysis on Cap 1, but the fact Cap 2 (reviewed by the same pool of people) scored way higher shows a lack of bias against the genre. Critics judge the movie before them. Just like we, the movie going public and comic book fans, do. The only difference is, they don't have a horse in the race and they get paid.

Completely agree. Just because I don't agree with some critics, doesn't mean they are attempting to tie all comic book films to the train tracks. I simply disagree.

But it seemingly can't be help. As you said we all have a horse in these races, so every new release seems to bring a new conspiracy theory. Heck the Avengers and TDK both got into the 90s, and we still saw them.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Completely agree. Just because I don't agree with some critics, doesn't mean they are attempting to tie all comic book films to the train tracks. I simply disagree.

But it seemingly can't be help. As you said we all have a horse in these races, so every new release seems to bring a new conspiracy theory. Heck the Avengers and TDK both got into the 90s, and we still saw them.

LOL!!! You're always going to have the East German judge, though. I remember when Toy Story 3 had a 100%, then along comes Armond White who gives it the 1st rotten and people exploded. You'll always have the "no fun" or "wasn't hugged enough as a child" critics, but there isn't a mass conspiracy.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

LOL!!! You're always going to have the East German judge, though. I remember when Toy Story 3 had a 100%, then along comes Armond White who gives it the 1st rotten and people exploded. You'll always have the "no fun" or "wasn't hugged enough as a child" critics, but there isn't a mass conspiracy.

That is the legendary troll job. That it was Armond White made it the thing of folklore. There are always those that troll to troll, even amongst critics. But that applies to everything, not just our beloved comic book heroes.

 

[Frodo]

No. I don't think there's a critic bias against this franchise either. That said, I think there's a fan bias towards going ape**** if a critic disagree's with them on a film ala Rotten Tomatoes and TDKR fiasco.

 

[TeeKay]

Why do you all care what the critics say anyways. I loved TASM2 and it has its share of flaws but this thread is just ridiculous to say the least. Just because you don't agree with the critics that doesn't mean their opinion in any less valid than yours. Most of the critics made very reasonable and valid criticism against the film but that does mean I should bash them and call them out for hating the franchise? Who's opinion matters here, yous or theirs? Darth and Spidey-Fan made very good points here which I agree with.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Why do you all care what the critics say anyways. I loved TASM2 and it has its share of flaws but this thread is just ridiculous to say the least. Just because you don't agree with the critics that doesn't mean their opinion in any less valid than yours. Most of the critics made very reasonable and valid criticism against the film but that does mean I should bash them and call them out for hating the franchise? Who's opinion matters here, yous or theirs? Darth and Spidey-Fan made very good points here which I agree with.

If more were as confident in their opinions or feelings on a film as you TeeKay or Spider-Fan and I SEE SPIDEY, I don't think we'd see as much backlash against critics. But alas, the search for fanboy validation will go on imo. It is a cycle here. After TASM2 will come DoFP and then GotG, so on and so forth.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Why do you all care what the critics say anyways. I loved TASM2 and it has its share of flaws but this thread is just ridiculous to say the least. Just because you don't agree with the critics that doesn't mean their opinion in any less valid than yours. Most of the critics made very reasonable and valid criticism against the film but that does mean I should bash them and call them out for hating the franchise? Who's opinion matters here, yous or theirs? Darth and Spidey-Fan made very good points here which I agree with.

Exactly! Critics are just paid for their opinions. That doesn't mean your opinion is any less valid, whether it be enjoying something critics hated or vice versa.

If more were as confident in their opinions or feelings on a film as you TeeKay or Spider-Fan and I SEE SPIDEY, I don't think we'd see as much backlash against critics. But alas, the search for fanboy validation will go on imo. It is a cycle here. After TASM2 will come DoFP and then GotG, so on and so forth.

Agreed. I care about t he critics score only if I am mildly interested in something (like on the fence about whether to watch or pass) or if I am paying attention to the lead up buzz to a movie I care about because stuff like that can effect BO returns. Outside of that, I judge the movie when I see it and I think of myself as my own film critic, LOL!

 

[BlackFox]

 

[jmc]

Well i'm biased in the way I love Spider-Man and superhero movies. Heck even SM3 is an enjoyable film with plenty of funny moments.

In fact, TASM2 suffers the same problem as SM3 in that the main villains don't even properly appear till a final battle right at the end.

What reviewers aren't taking into consideration though is the fact that villains for example Goblin only make brief appearances here, but they will 100% be in follow ups. Venom in SM3 was killed off completely, but people need to see this film with an open mind regarding a FRANCHISE.

For example, the "Untold Story" from the first film was never going to be covered in the first. It was going to be covered in the FRANCHISE. That's the sort of mindset people need since it happens all the time where villains appear at the end of comic books and then play a bigger focus in the following issue.

The problem is you can't expect people to treat movies like a TV series. Movies are a short form of storytelling, you can't expect people to pay money, tell an incomplete narrative to them and then expect them to judge the context of the present film with future films in mind. It doesn't work that way with the medium. People expect a 3 act structure with a beginning, middle and an end in film. TV can stretch a story over several episodes due to the weekly nature of the medium. It's easy to build up to something in that format because the last episode is still fresh in people's minds. You can't expect the same thing for films 2-3 years apart so people can only judge based on what's presented to them. Film really is analogous to the short story, TV is the full novel.

 

[GremlinZilla89]

I don't think there is some wide spread bias, but I do think individual bias does exist against it.

Nobody can deny many critics (professional or otherwise) are simply against this reboot franchise for the fact they dislike the concept. I'm sorry, that crap just isn't fair to bring into a review.

A reviewer has to be fair and if they are going to write up a few paragraphs whining about how they hate the concept of a reboot instead of legitimately appraising the film FOR BEINGS IT'S OWN THING than yes, I'm gonna cry "bias."

They can rip apart the film all they want as long as they don't piss and moan about how they loved the first two Raimi films and how Hollywood is such a greedy, money hungry machine. Ya, we all know this, that doesn't mean some good can't come out of it. Watch the damn movie and keep your politics out of it.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

lolno there is no bias

maybe

maybe


they just aren't very good

 

[TheLastAvenger]

Critics review the movie before them. If they don't like it, they don't like it. They are not biased against this series. They are biased against what they don't like about the movie, which may or may not be a problem that was apparent in the 1st film also.

I always hate when fanboys question the validity of EVERY critic if the RT score doesn't mesh with their opinion. You don't have to hate this movie, but critics don't have to love it either. Yes, SOME critics don't like superheroes or have a bias against blockbuster films. But, there is no mass conspiracy amongst critics directed toward this movie.

It stems from the overimportance we have all put on Rotten Tomatoes. Something about those percentages gets everyone in a tizzy. Sometimes for valid reasons, as critics scores can affect box office which in turn can affect the chances for a sequel. In this case, not so much, as Sony already has the future of this franchise set in stone.

So what is it? I don't know. A bit of insecurity, perhaps. God knows fans of certain franchises like to flaunt a high tomatometer percentage, while others get way too defensive about low ones. It's become some sort of bizarre currency in a war between fanbases, and has proven so effective that even those of us on the sidelines have started to believe in its importance.

 

[jmc]

The thing to remember also is that bias usually only shows through on an individual level. If there's a theme running across the reviews saying something in particular isn't right it's kinda absurd to assume all those people who agree there's an issue are biased against the film. To say otherwise is heading toward tin-foil hat territory. Reviewers of course like certain films more than others like any of us, but their overall job is to present as objective a review as possible, they don't gang up on a movie. Sometime the film isn't quite as good as you'd like it to be, it's as simple as that. There's actually more onus on you the fan to remain more objective than the critic because you are the one who is emotionally attached to the material.

 

[spiderman2]

yeah I understand if there is a theme but a lot of the reviews sound like they are being very nick picking or not really giving legit reason for there reviews at all of them but a good amount.

 

[jmc]

What's a satisfactory complaint though? I can assure you as someone who has seen the film there are legitimate complaints about the film to be made.

 

[spiderman2]

while I havnt seen the movie yet but it is just the way a lot of the reviews are saying things. I may hate the movie and then maybe I really understand things more. I don't think that is going to happened though I think I will love the movie. But it sounds like a lot of reviews are just saying things about how it is a reboot and not really going into deatail about how or why villains are not devepoled while or why the story is a mess or something like some of the reviews are saying.

 

[The Endless]

You think you will love the movie. Because you're a Spidey fan and you'll love anything with his name on it.

And we are talking about bias?

 

[DarthSkywalker]

That is the crux of the argument. Fanboys see anti-bias because they themselves have pro-bias.

 

[spiderman2]

I think I will love the movie because form the previews this movie looks great and it is very rare that I fell dissapoted by a movie and even spider man 3 I think is not even close to has bad has people made it out to be. But I am wored because the reviews have not been has good has I was expeciting them to be and because even though I still liked spider man 3 I was dissapoted with it so I don't want to have a second spider man movie dissapote me.

 

[JayTee]

Yes, there is a bias. It goes with the snarky cynical behind-the-scenes nature of being a 21st century critic. You have to be above everything you're taking in. ASM was a "cynical cash grab" as if Spider-Man 4 wasn't. ASM "was only made to keep the rights" as if Raimi's first Spider-Man wasn't. ASM was "a retread of the original" as if Raimi invented Spider-Man. It's an adaptation of a pre-existing source. Would The 90's Romeo and Juliet be considered not worth your time because it hits key story elements? "ASM is not as good as MCU's efforts or Nolan's Batman." Yeah, you mean the 4 or 5 out of 12 that were critical darlings.

In fact, I'm starting to get a vibe from so-called fans of comic book heroes that their "best movies ever" lists are eerily close to what critics consider the best. As if they look up to critics instead of their hearts to justify why they love this stuff. Amazing Spider-Man 2 was a really awesome Spider-Man movie, but most will keep Dark Knight and Spider-Man 2 on their "best ever!" lists because some cynic who gets paid to spew snark and often outright insult this genre deem them to be works of art. Never mind that Spider-Man isn't funny in SM2 or that The Joker is a guy in face paint and not the fully realized "Arkham City" one we all want to see. The fanboys want to look cooler than the stuff they like so they follow critical trends and buzzwords to be little critic Sidekick pseudo-intellectuals.

So yes, there is a bias. If I were them? I'd probably have a bias too. This is another expensive superhero movie in a SEA of them.

But you people are the fans. You do not have to sink to that level. Remember what it is to love Spider-Man and watch him in a well made movie. Your little reviews and nitpicks and casual agreements with mainstream critical consensus won't be read by many people and you're cheating yourself out of a fun experience.

ASM2 may be an 8/10 movie, 6/10 for the worst of the cynics, but to me? 9/10 (point off for dumb Goblin outfit and Doctor not-Ashley Kafka!). I'm a Spider-Man fan. I didn't drop out of film school to be a snarky brat (I actually graduated and work in entertainment to be honest!), I just plain love Spidey.

Tacos are delicious.

 

[jmc]

That is the crux of the argument. Fanboys see anti-bias because they themselves have pro-bias.

That's exactly right. I inadvertently fell into that trap a bit myself with MoS when the reviews started coming out, I genuinely thought the first batch of negative reviews were too busy comparing the film to the original Superman and not reviewing the movie itself, I was letting my fondness for DC comics influence my thinking. When I brushed off my own DC bias and remembered who the director was I realized that the only reason they were bringing up the original Superman was because the film obviously wasn't delivering a good experience in the first place. It's perfectly fine to love a particular character or set of characters, but it's also important not to let your emotions get in the way when someone says something you don't want to hear. The truth is they may well be right.

 

[spiderman2]

while there is alrease going to be some bias has you enjoy some things more then other things. Spider man is my favorite super hero batman a close second. If there was a batman and spider man movie that was evenly good I would like the spider man movie more has it would intertain me more. But I still fell like a lot of the reviews are not really bring up legit problems with the movie. Also there are some movies that I don't under stand the hype about has it is my opinua. I don't under stand why people thought iron man was so good. A lot of people think it is a top 3 CBM ever and I just don't see it and want to laugh has I don't think it is even top 10. Avatar is other movie I thought it was just ok and yet it made mad money and got great reviews.