David Goyer hired to write Man of Steel

[raybia]

Brilliant guy, but his writing is about as exciting as watching paint dry. Superman is based in pulp mythology, Hebrew legend, and Siegel and Shusters personal lives. Realistically depicted sci-fi does not work for it.

I find it funny how Superman has come to be presented as a "Christ" figure considering his creators were Jewish.

 

[Kurosawa]

I find it funny how Superman has come to be presented as a "Christ" figure considering his creators were Jewish.

That's because Donner moved Smallville from being a Northeastern type farm town to Kansas, so the "midwestern values" (whatever the hell they are) got shoehorned into Superman. Another modern addition that doesn't fit.

The correct religious analogies should be Superman to Moses and the Golem, and Jor-El as a failed Noah.

 

[SpiderByte]

Wait, Smallville was in New England? Even reading about it I always thought it was in, or at least near, Kansas.

 

[Kurosawa]

Wait, Smallville was in New England? Even reading about it I always thought it was in, or at least near, Kansas.

New England or the Northeast in general, within driving distance of Metropolis at least.

 

[SpiderByte]

Huh. Weird.
I always assumed it was Kansas. I live in New England, so it didn't really make me think of New England.

 

[SuperDaniel]

Kansas Smallville makes MUCH MORE SENSE, IMO.

 

[Motown Marvel]

Brilliant guy, but his writing is about as exciting as watching paint dry. Superman is based in pulp mythology, Hebrew legend, and Siegel and Shusters personal lives. Realistically depicted sci-fi does not work for it.

superman has endured as a character because he has grown beyond the original intentions of siegel and shuster. i mean, if you want to strip down the reasons for seigel and shuster's reasoning behind superman's creation, then it was nothing more than sarcasm and bitterness resulting from being sexually deprived. what does it take to get a chick? well apparently you'd have to have stunning good looks, muscles--hell, probably even need super powers!

but the character superman has grown and evolved and developed over the decades. and sci-fi is a necessity of the character, he is rooted in sci-fi. and it should be presented believably in his stories in regards to the universe these stories exists in.

 

[Kurosawa]

Kansas Smallville makes MUCH MORE SENSE, IMO.

Why? What's the difference? do you really think two Jewish guys from Cleveland would pick Kansas of all places for their character to grow up? It was a stupid idea when Donner did it and it sucks that the people after him followed with it..it's part of how Superman went from being an intelligent, confident hero to a Jethro Bodine half-******ed hick hayseed Colossus looking Big Blue Boy Scout. It's even insulting to Kansas considering what the implication is-that anyone from a Kansas farm is some kind of duh-huh moron.

 

[Kurosawa]

superman has endured as a character because he has grown beyond the original intentions of siegel and shuster. i mean, if you want to strip down the reasons for seigel and shuster's reasoning behind superman's creation, then it was nothing more than sarcasm and bitterness resulting from being sexually deprived. what does it take to get a chick? well apparently you'd have to have stunning good looks, muscles--hell, probably even need super powers!

but the character superman has grown and evolved and developed over the decades. and sci-fi is a necessity of the character, he is rooted in sci-fi. and it should be presented believably in his stories in regards to the universe these stories exists in.

Batman DESTROYS Superman in popularity and relevance because DC smartly kept him reasonably close to the Kane and Finger original. Straying too far from the creators intentions is how you get crap like Terminator Salvation or the 60's camp Batman TV show, or the Halle Berry Catwoman movie. If 1938-1986 Superman sucks so bad that the core elements of it need to be changed for it to get over, then all they are selling is the name.

 

[raybia]

Batman DESTROYS Superman in popularity and relevance because DC smartly kept him reasonably close to the Kane and Finger original. Straying too far from the creators intentions is how you get crap like Terminator Salvation or the 60's camp Batman TV show, or the Halle Berry Catwoman movie. If 1938-1986 Superman sucks so bad that the core elements of it need to be changed for it to get over, then all they are selling is the name.

I always looked at Byrne's Superman as getting back closer to his creators original. Do you agree or disagree and tell me why.

 

[SuperDaniel]

Why? What's the difference? do you really think two Jewish guys from Cleveland would pick Kansas of all places for their character to grow up? It was a stupid idea when Donner did it and it sucks that the people after him followed with it..it's part of how Superman went from being an intelligent, confident hero to a Jethro Bodine half-******ed hick hayseed Colossus looking Big Blue Boy Scout. It's even insulting to Kansas considering what the implication is-that anyone from a Kansas farm is some kind of duh-huh moron.

It makes much more sense because a ship falling in the middle of nowhere, in the center of the United States, at night, in a terrible snowstorm, as shown in the Byrne origins, is a much more suitable and realistic cover instead of a ship falling in broad daylight in a small town close to one of the most advanced and biggest cities in the world.

Get over this Siegel & Shuster crap!

 

[raybia]

It makes much more sense because a ship falling in the middle of nowhere, in the center of the United States, at night, in a terrible snowstorm, as shown in the Byrne origins, is a much more suitable and realistic cover instead of a ship falling in broad daylight in a small town close to one of the most advanced and biggest cities in the world.

Get over this Siegel & Shuster crap!

There is logic to the first portion of your statement but for you to tell him to get over S&S crap is...crap. Have some respect for the creators. They built the foundation for one of the greatest modern mythologies and that foundation has to be kept in place for there to be any success of the Superman character regardless of the medium.

 

[SpiderByte]

It makes much more sense because a ship falling in the middle of nowhere, in the center of the United States, at night, in a terrible snowstorm, as shown in the Byrne origins, is a much more suitable and realistic cover instead of a ship falling in broad daylight in a small town close to one of the most advanced and biggest cities in the world.

Get over this Siegel & Shuster crap!

Oh...god...

HIT THE DECKS! HERE COMES THE THREAD WAR!

 

[SuperDaniel]

I do have respect but i also see that that version is CLEARLY DATED. I just have a problem with him because he keeps on going and going that the original ideas and everything about the golden age was the only and true version of Superman...

 

[raybia]

I do have respect but i also see that that version is CLEARLY DATED. I just have a problem with him because he keeps on going and going that the original ideas and everything about the golden age was the only and true version of Superman...

Certainly that version is outdated but the foundation or the original concepts should always remain with the character.

 

[8Diagrams(WU)]

Superman is simply a character engraved in popular culture and pop culture is dictated by the current society so naturally superman will go through many incarnations. The golden age stuff was part of the times, but clearly we live in a different society today and well it becomes so dated that it loses its attractiveness. Comic books certainly would not have gotten to where they are today if they were telling the same story with identical elements over and over, if that was the case they wouldnt exist today.

The problem I see right now is that superman is one of the only characters that is a bit stuck in terms of how he is presented. He needs a fresh modernization. Get rid of the underwear for starters.

Supermans origin story of course owes Moses a big IOU but the image of hope that gives himself to be our saviour fits the image of jesus a bit better imo. I guess thats another example of the character evolving into smething else besides the original conception of the character by the creators like motown was saying.

 

[raybia]

Superman is simply a character engraved in popular culture and pop culture is dictated by the current society so naturally superman will go through many incarnations. The golden age stuff was part of the times, but clearly we live in a different society today and well it becomes so dated that it loses its attractiveness. Comic books certainly would not have gotten to where they are today if they were telling the same story with identical elements over and over, if that was the case they wouldnt exist today.

The problem I see right now is that superman is one of the only characters that is a bit stuck in terms of how he is presented. He needs a fresh modernization. Get rid of the underwear for starters.

Supermans origin story of course owes Moses a big IOU but the image of hope that gives himself to be our saviour fits the image of jesus a bit better imo. I guess thats another example of the character evolving into smething else besides the original conception of the character by the creators like motown was saying.

So Superman is a litmus test for our society. Well now I understand why he still wears his shorts on the outside of his clothes.

We're not waiting for him to lose the trunks, he's waiting for us.

 

[8Diagrams(WU)]

So Superman is a litmus test for our society. Well now I understand why he still wears his shorts on the outside of his clothes.

We're not waiting for him to lose the trunks, he's waiting for us.

No need for sarcasm. Comic book heroes have grown with society. Its pretty crystal clear.

 

[bgshw44]

i think some of you need to realize that superman is not real and is a comic book character. its like saying you need to redraw mickey mouse because a real mouse has smaller ears in proportion to his body or something stupid. keep the underwear etc.. because thats the character. if you dont like it go find another one

 

[raybia]

No need for sarcasm. Comic book heroes have grown with society. Its pretty crystal clear.

Seriously, I'm not being sarcastic toward your remarks which I agree with. I'm presenting an indictment against society with "society wearing their shorts on the outside" as a metaphor for its mindless and hedonistic lifestyle.

 

[bgshw44]

i think some of you need to realize that superman is not real and is a comic book character. its like saying you need to redraw mickey mouse because a real mouse has smaller ears in proportion to his body or something stupid. keep the underwear etc.. because thats the character. if you dont like it go find another one

 

[Crook]

1) That's a terrible analogy

2) Undies are the character? Really?

 

[SpiderByte]

i think some of you need to realize that superman is not real and is a comic book character. its like saying you need to redraw mickey mouse because a real mouse has smaller ears in proportion to his body or something stupid. keep the underwear etc.. because thats the character. if you dont like it go find another one

That reminds me incredibly of this:

 

[Kurosawa]

I always looked at Byrne's Superman as getting back closer to his creators original. Do you agree or disagree and tell me why.

Only similarity is the lack of a Superboy career. Byrne's version had a totally different Clark, Superman, Luthor and had no social conscience at all, he was just a typical superhero. The lie that Byrne spread was that he was taking him back to the basics, when in fact he was creating a completely new take mostly based on Marvel characters.

It makes much more sense because a ship falling in the middle of nowhere, in the center of the United States, at night, in a terrible snowstorm, as shown in the Byrne origins, is a much more suitable and realistic cover instead of a ship falling in broad daylight in a small town close to one of the most advanced and biggest cities in the world.

Get over this Siegel & Shuster crap!

The most realistic scenario by that mode of thinking would be Red Son.

 

[SuperDaniel]

Wtf? What do u mean red son?

Anyways, its just a good explanation of why Superman`s ship wouldn`t be seen by other people.

Anyways, Smallville in Kansas is the best, IMO.