David Goyer hired to write Man of Steel

[8Diagrams(WU)]

I also found a nice wiki of supes abilities pre and post crisis to further the discussion along

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powers_and_abilities_of_Superman

 

[SuperMike335!!]

post crisis supes is a homewrecker?!?!?!

hardly heroic.

And I wanna read about heroes

No. No. No. Its NOT what it looks like!

See, Mister Miracle like to watch.

This may be hard to you know "understand", but sometimes married life gets boring.

Sooo, sometimes grown ups will do strange things to, "spice things up".

 

[Kurosawa]

Kurosawa, Superman wasnt just arrogant Pre-Crisis! He was a super *****ebag, more than Batman ever could be.
Really now, is this how you'd like your Superman? Does it make sense when you consider his humble origin and his modest life as Clark Kent? Oh wait, i forgot, Clark Kent is just him acting, Superman is the real person.

The reason i love Superman is because he is DC's Jesus. He is the person everyone looks up to, even freaking Batman.

Umm...Superman in that scene essentially IS the Pre-Crisis Superman. All-Star Superman is VERY close to the Pre-Crisis Earth-One Superman.

Nice post. Kurosawa is either too old (cant teach an old dog new tricks) or a Siegel family member.

That scene has nothing to do with Superman or in how they changed him. I just don't get the point.

^ Well, not Jesus since i don`t like religious connotations exaggerated(AKA Superman Returns) but he is pretty much a noble, humble and caring kind of guy. **** the cocky! I want my Superman to be confident and THAT is totally different of being arrogant!

You`re guys still wasting time on him? I`ve actually mentioned that he had to be a member of the Siegel Family.

LOL actually I'm not. I'm a WASPy guy from the south. If we were arguing over Cap or WW or any other character I would have the same stance. I believe strongly in respecting the intentions and fairly compensating the original creators of comics characters. It's just my opinion that they took Superman too far from who he was before, and that they didn't do that with WW or Batman. They changed WW a LOT more than they did Supes, but I felt it was closer to the spirit of the WMM/Peter original. Not that Post-Crisis Supes is a terrible guy, just that he has a lot less depth and pathos to me, and I didn't like how they handled Clark as much. Later creators like Jurgens, Stern, etc did a lot better job with that take on Superman than Byrne did and it got really good after awhile. Plus that character is gone now, just like the Earth-One Supes is...the current Superman is much more of a mix of all the characters traits, hopefully the movie will do that too.

 

[Mr. Earle]

I personally could care less about the original creators. They didnt write books, they wrote comic book characters whose stories are ongoing and hopefully will be ongoing in the distant future. Thus they have to change and evolve for the audience of each era to connect with them. I dont know how things were before WW2, but i cant connect with Pre Crisis Clark Kent or even understand the reason for him.

Nobody said to take Sophocles' Oedipus Tyrannus and adapt it to 2010. But if Oedipus' story continued until today, well it would have to, otherwise nobody would care. Hell, they even did that with Captain America. At first he was the super soldier of WWII and then they froze him and brought him to our day so that he can still be around. Is it true to the core? No. He was fighting Nazis and now he is in the Avengers and he is fighting aliens. Cap is now a living WW2 relic (in a good way) fighting alongside todays heroes, a far cry from what he was.

 

[The Batman]

The thing that bothers me is that post crisis fans in this thread are literally basing their interpretation of pre crisis superman on covers designed to shock you with out of character moments so that you'll buy them. They conviently forget that even post crisis superman has moments like that. Hence the reason why I posted Superman making out with Big Barda.

The truth is that in that comic, Superman and Big Barda were being mind controlled. I actually have an idea of what happened in the comic.

Do any of you have any proof of how pre crisis supes acts beside covers you only know about because you fond them on a joke site??


I mean, you guys are supposed to be fans of a character, yet show an obvious ignorance towards over half his existence.

 

[GL's Light]

One should always have respect for the original creators - after all, we wouldn't have these great characters without them. But when you're talking about characters whose exploits continue for decades, with a lot of different writers and artists contributing to the mix, it's natural that there's going to be an ongoing process where the characters are developed, tweaked, and updated. After all, Siegel and Shuster themselves honed and tweaked Superman following his early appearances.

Writers other than the original creators often come up with great additions to longstanding characters. In some cases they even take the character in a new direction that surpasses the original and becomes definitive (such as happened with Daredevil).

 

[Kurosawa]

I personally could care less about the original creators. They didnt write books, they wrote comic book characters whose stories are ongoing and hopefully will be ongoing in the distant future. Thus they have to change and evolve for the audience of each era to connect with them. I dont know how things were before WW2, but i cant connect with Pre Crisis Clark Kent or even understand the reason for him.

Nobody said to take Sophocles' Oedipus Tyrannus and adapt it to 2010. But if Oedipus' story continued until today, well it would have to, otherwise nobody would care. Hell, they even did that with Captain America. At first he was the super soldier of WWII and then they froze him and brought him to our day so that he can still be around. Is it true to the core? No. He was fighting Nazis and now he is in the Avengers and he is fighting aliens. Cap is now a living WW2 relic (in a good way) fighting alongside todays heroes, a far cry from what he was.

So just because it's a different medium and it's continued by other creators, the originators don't deserve respect and you INTENTIONALLY allow yourself to be ignorant towards their work? Amazing. I find comic readers who are ashamed of what they read...interesting.

The thing that bothers me is that post crisis fans in this thread are literally basing their interpretation of pre crisis superman on covers designed to shock you with out of character moments so that you'll buy them. They conviently forget that even post crisis superman has moments like that. Hence the reason why I posted Superman making out with Big Barda.

The truth is that in that comic, Superman and Big Barda were being mind controlled. I actually have an idea of what happened in the comic.

Do any of you have any proof of how pre crisis supes acts beside covers you only know about because you fond them on a joke site??


I mean, you guys are supposed to be fans of a character, yet show an obvious ignorance towards over half his existence.

They don't care to learn, because if they did they would either have to 1) Dismiss it outright as stupid or 2) Reevaluate their viewpoints which means they might have to admit that they could be (gasp) wrong.

 

[craigdbfan]

One should always have respect for the original creators - after all, we wouldn't have these great characters without them. But when you're talking about characters whose exploits continue for decades, with a lot of different writers and artists contributing to the mix, it's natural that there's going to be an ongoing process where the characters are developed, tweaked, and updated. After all, Siegel and Shuster themselves honed and tweaked Superman following his early appearances.

Writers other than the original creators often come up with great additions to longstanding characters. In some cases they even take the character in a new direction that surpasses the original and becomes definitive (such as happened with Daredevil).

Well said.

 

[Lighthouse]

Are we still on this pre-post crisis crap? Really? Isn't it obvious that both had their benefits?

 

[Octoberist]

Yawn-fest

 

[Mr. Earle]

So just because it's a different medium and it's continued by other creators, the originators don't deserve respect and you INTENTIONALLY allow yourself to be ignorant towards their work? Amazing. I find comic readers who are ashamed of what they read...interesting.

You re so eager to take every discussion to this obsession of yours with respecting the original writers that its not even funny. Seriously Kurosawa, are you Siegel himself? Or if he is dead, are you his ghost? Jesus.

Nobody disrespected him. We acknowledge his contribution but we re all telling you that he wrote Superman before WW2 and thus Superman has to evolve through time. Even you admit that businessman Lex is better than goofy scientist. "YOU DONT RESPECT TEH SIEGELS YOU WILL BURN IN HELL".

Sometimes even the ****ty bat forums seem better than this. At least there you can discuss the character without some guy screaming "you dont respect Bob Kane and Bill Finger" at every post that doesnt agree with some version of the character that existed BEFORE MY ****ING PARENTS WERE EVEN BORN.

 

[X Knight]

seriously....reading this stuff is making my head hurt.

somehow this thread's gotten waaaayyyyy off topic......lol.

and you know what that mean.........no news.......

 

[Mr. Earle]

I'd like to see some heart warming scenes that we've come to expect from Superman. Like saving that girl in the pic i posted in the previous page, or these:

 

[Crook]

I'm rather averse to such corny depictions that have plagued the character for decades. There are more efficient ways in displaying his kind soul.

 

[8Diagrams(WU)]

Im not 100% convinced in that particular portrayal of superman as the guy that gets the cat off the tree kind of thing.

 

[Mr. Earle]

I'm rather averse to such corny depictions that have plagued the character for decades. There are more efficient ways in displaying his kind soul.

"Plagued"? Oh come on. This is why people love him. I want to see him beat the crap out of Brainiac/Mongul/Darkseid, but i want to see some moments like these as well.

 

[souvlaki]

I'd like to see some heart warming scenes that we've come to expect from Superman. Like saving that girl in the pic i posted in the previous page, or these:

If examples from All Star Superman are what you are using to prove how inferior pre-Crisis Superman is to post-Crisis than you obviously don't know anything about pre-Crisis Superman. I am a huge fan of Byrne's take on Superman but some of you guys are being ridiculous. I'm starting to get the impression that half of you don't even know anything about pre-Crisis Superman.

 

[Crook]

"Plagued"? Oh come on. This is why people love him. I want to see him beat the crap out of Brainiac/Mongul/Darkseid, but i want to see some moments like these as well.

Oh come on? What time period do you live in? Superman is irrelevant in every sense of the word. That's in large fact due to his corny status in people's eyes. That's saying a lot considering he has the best package of superpowers that one could ask for.

 

[Changeling]

I hate this Pre vs Post war

 

[Lighthouse]

I hate this Pre vs Post war

I agree. It's more suited to the Superman comic boards.

 

[Mr. Earle]

If examples from All Star Superman are what you are using to prove how inferior pre-Crisis Superman is to post-Crisis than you obviously don't know anything about pre-Crisis Superman. I am a huge fan of Byrne's take on Superman but some of you guys are being ridiculous. I'm starting to get the impression that half of you don't even know anything about pre-Crisis Superman.

I didnt use this page in the Pre-Post war. I just said i'd like to see some heart warming scenes like these.

As for the Pre-Post Crisis war, i'll say again:
Each has its good and bad points. I personally like Post, but i dont like how Byrne made Clark a jock. My favourite Clark/Superman is the one seen in STAS and L&C and you cant say that he was a jock or too dynamic. Its actually the Clark/Superman we currently see in the comics since writers have toned down Byrne's original concepts. I think its perfect as it has evolved in our days.

Anyway, from what i hear Johns is trying to balance Superman in his Secret Origins, but others say that its basically another tribute to the Donnerverse.

Oh come on? What time period do you live in? Superman is irrelevant in every sense of the word. That's in large fact due to his corny status in people's eyes. That's saying a lot considering he has the best package of superpowers that one could ask for.

So what you re saying is that nobody loves Superman and that he is irrelevant. WHAT?

 

[Crook]

So what you re saying is that nobody loves Superman and that he is irrelevant. WHAT?

No, I never said 'nobody'. I implied 'most' shared that sentiment. And it's true. Superman hasn't been on the mainstream "cool" list of superheroes in a long, long, long time.

He's been relevant to the Superman comic book fans, and that's a pretty damn small margin.

 

[SpiderByte]

Waitwaitwait.

When the hell did Superman stop being popular by the GA? I've seen, like 12 kids wearing \S/ shirts, and they sure as hell aren't fanboys.

 

[Mr. Earle]

No, I never said 'nobody'. I implied 'most' shared that sentiment. And it's true. Superman hasn't been on the mainstream "cool" list of superheroes in a long, long, long time.

He's been relevant to the Superman comic book fans, and that's a pretty damn small margin.

So? Relevence to the general audience comes from movies and he hasnt had a good one for years. Batman, Ironman and Spiderman are mainstream because of their movies.

Last time Superman was mainstream was actually with Lois & Clark. And i remember how everyone was excited when S:Returns was being shot. Everyone was excited about getting a new Superman movie after all this time. Kids like pokemon and... whatever these days, but Superman is still somewhere in there.

So anyway, what does this have to do with Supes being a nice guy? Isnt that his hole shtick?

 

[Crook]

Waitwaitwait.

When the hell did Superman stop being popular by the GA? I've seen, like 12 kids wearing \S/ shirts, and they sure as hell aren't fanboys.

When did wearing a shirt of a popular logo become a sign of fandom?