David Goyer's Script Discussion

[FlameHead]

SHH!: Are you still working on the Ghost Rider movie too?
Goyer: I might be getting an executive producer credit, but I'm really not involved. Once they decided that they didn't want it to be R-rated, Norrington and I basically left. I think there are some remnants of my script in there, but I haven't even read Mark Steven Johnson's new script. I totally wish him luck, but I'm really not involved.

SHH!: So I guess we won't be seeing a Midnight Sons movie anytime soon?
Goyer: No, there won't be a crossover. It's really hard when the film rights to the different characters go out to different studios.

SHH!: That seems to be the big problem with Marvel's movies, because at least at Warner Brothers, you could eventually expect to see some sort of crossover between their characters.
Goyer: But it's also why, by the same token, Marvel is more competitive. I think that's why they've initially had more success in marketing their properties for film, because they can go out to the town, whereas DC is really hindered in that way.

So, he may get a producer credit, which is pretty neat. I wish he were able to give a little more input or suggestions anyway. It would be nice to get some of his R-rated ideas in there...hehe.

It sucks that he says "no" on the Midnight Son's crossover idea though. I would think that woudl be a very valuable enterprise to develop...

 

[PaleRider]

no R rating?? oh man I'm getting nervous. 1. Mark Steve Johnson now this. I'm getting ify.

 

[FlameHead]

It's been a no R-rating for a while now. If you're really nervous, I suggest checking out the Q&A thread posted by MSJ. It puts your mind at ease a little... and he does discuss the R-rating thing.

 

[BIGGUN]

no R rating?? oh man I'm getting nervous. 1. Mark Steve Johnson now this. I'm getting ify.

having an R rating does not equal a good movie. in recent years ive been amazed w/ the quality of some PG 13 horror films (the Grudge, Ring, ect) and was suprised how much they got away w/ on screen. from the sound of things MSJ plans to do the same thing. personally ive always liked suggested horror rather than in your face horror. both have their place of course but to me it takes more skill from a director to suggest something horrible in a film rather than showing it full on. i really dont need to see Blackheart tear someone's limbs off in full color. you could simply hear the man's wild screams and the sound of muscle and bone tearing. leave the rest to the audience....they dont need to see everything. i can understand your worry about MSJ...to me MSJ still needs more experience however alot of my worries were put to rest when i read his responses to our questions. at least we know this is going in the right direction.
as far as Goyer is concerned i remember reading he was getting exec. prod. a long time ago....cool that he confirms it now. this is an excellent sign that they want some of his ideas in the film. i didnt like his take on GR....very little resemblence to the comic and average characters. But his ideas on GR's powers were awesome! cant wait to see some of those

 

[TheVileOne]

You guys remember why Goyer left the project right? He said the studio was turning this movie into a "family film."

 

[BIGGUN]

You guys remember why Goyer left the project right? He said the studio was turning this movie into a "family film."

yes but you have to remember the time when this was announced. this was shortly after 9/11 and movie studios were looking to make movies less violent and geared more towards happy crap. however later films (may have started w/ Fellowship of the Ring) that were rated PG13 started showing darker themes and became more violent.
do you really think that GR would be made into a kiddie fest after the success of such violent films like the Lord of the Rings, The Grudge, or The Ring? i dont think so. Hollywood sees that there is big money in bloodless but scary, dark and violent horror films...more so probably than in bloody R-rated horror films. to make GR into a kiddie/family film would outright betray the source material and Marvel is known for staying very close to the heart and soul of the original books.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Part of me wishes Goyer were writing the script b/c i think he's the best comic book adapter in the biz but i read his intial script draft and it didnt blow me away.The whole R rated thing is moot it's not and thats that....Just remember these days you can get away with a lot more in a pg-13 than used to especially where characters that are very far removed from reality are concerned.

 

[The Flash]

I'm not at all worried about the the fact that it's PG-13. I've seen lots and lots of violent movies with a lot of blood and death in them that have a PG-13 rating, and those were very violent. It would've been great if GR did have an R rating because of a lot of violence, but now it doesn't bother me as much that it doesn't. So I'm cool.

 

[FlameHead]

The pg-13/r rating issue has been a major one for a while now. The way I look at it that we're very lucky to be getting any movie on this character at all. We need to trust thier decision in rating and wait to see how it looks.

I'm just happy it's being made. Thay could make him a teletubbie Ghost Rider and I wouldn't care... that much...

 

[TheVileOne]

Its not the PG-13 that bothers me guys. What bothers me is that the studio going to cut this up and try to turn into a family, superhero film and make it more "Spider-man" like they did the theatrical cut with Daredevil. The last movie Mark Steven Johnson directed.

Take King Arthur for instance, the movie was medicore and did very poorly. The movie was supposed to be a hard-R rated WINTER picture. Instead Disney butchered it into a PG-13 movie and tried to make it into a family-friendly SUMMER picture. Basically they thought they could turn KING ARTHUR into another Pirates and that plan failed miserably.

 

[Hunter Rider]

I know where your coming from vile but DD was at fox and GR is at sony/columbia so msj might not encounter the same problems as he did at fox.
This is one of the things that makes me glad that cage has signed b/c he's a big hitter and i think he will help msj keep his vision for GR true to the character.
The thing with pg-13 rated films since LOTR is you can get away with more than you used to be able to.

 

[FlameHead]

Vileone, no matter what the prouction company, director, and everyone else involved do, you will not see a Spider-Man style movie. Ghost Rider isn't a hero of that sort and will not be treated the same way. If you know Ghost Rider at all then you should realize that this isnt' going to be your typical superhero movie. This movie will tell the tragic tale of Johnny Blaze... a man who sold his soul to save the life of the person he loved but ends up getting possessed by a maniacal demon. This ain't your teenage boy bitten by a spider type story. It's dark in design already and there is nothing they can do to make it a childrens flick... PG 13 or not.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

Hmmm....well I am worried about PG-13 but not in a big way like some people. I just have a bad feeling inside from past movies with the same deal. Let's take Spawn for example...very similar to Ghost Rider and IMO could have done a lot better if it had an R rating. Giving that movie a PG-13 rating was a mistake. Also take Daredevil for another example...PG-13 rating with some content cut out to make it that way. Now with the Director's Cut out I am hearing a lot more people raving about it with the new scenes and R rating. But I am not immensly worried about the rating but there is just something inside of me that says there MIGHT be a chance that it hurts it. I am praying and hoping that they don't try to turn it into a movie for all ages and stray away from the comic character.

 

[FlameHead]

I just watched the DareDevil DC and I have to admit that it was indeed much better. I don't think it was the R-rating though. The only thing that I noticed which made it an R-rating was the language but, that's all. It was the missing footage (and the rearrangment of old) that made it better... much better.

Having said that, I just read a newspaper article about David Goyer and the Blade franchise. They were talking about the success of that franchise and Goyer thinks the movies have succeeded because he refused to drop the R-rating. He could be right on that but I personally believe that the character and image of Ghost Rider is all that's needed to make this movie succeed. We'll see though..

 

[BIGGUN]

He could be right on that but I personally believe that the character and image of Ghost Rider is all that's needed to make this movie succeed. We'll see though..

also GR dispatched the bad guys in a completely different operandi. GR doesnt kill humans and although Blade killls vampires they still look very human so i can see why the ratings board might have a problem w/ that. It just wouldnt look right if every time Blade was gonna cut a vampire the camera cuts away from not showing anything get hacked off, ect. it wouldnt have been believable that a dude armed to the teeth w/ edged weapons wouldnt be causing some serious damage to lots of people.
Blade could have made it w/ a PG 13 but it wouldnt have been the cult hit it is today...i do think the gore did play into that a bit.

 

[FlameHead]

Yeah, the gore was pretty important in the Blade movies... especially considering it's all about vampires. What's a vampire movie without Blood? Blood means R.

Ghost Rider doesn't need blood... or bathtubs full of it anyway. He's only gonna beat on the blood spilling human for a while before penance staring their ass. No killing is involved in that. No R.

 

[BIGGUN]

a lil' bit mo' from goyer from an interview w/ Chud.com
not much just says he might get some credit for the ideas used in the new script:

"Q: Can you give us a rundown on your other comic projects?

Goyer: I did an early draft of Dr. Strange that’s languishing at Sony. I did a draft of Ghost Rider with Steven Norrington when Nic Cage was going to do it, and small bits of that are going to show up in the thing Mark Stephen Johnson is doing, but that’s a completely different take. I don’t know, I might get story credit on that."

 

[Hunter Rider]

I'm not at all worried about the the fact that it's PG-13. I've seen lots and lots of violent movies with a lot of blood and death in them that have a PG-13 rating, and those were very violent. It would've been great if GR did have an R rating because of a lot of violence, but now it doesn't bother me as much that it doesn't. So I'm cool.

Love the avvy

 

[The Flash]

Thanks HR! My friend The Kryptonian made it for me. I love yours too.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Thanks HR! My friend The Kryptonian made it for me. I love yours too.

thanx mine was done by cconn

 

[TheVileOne]

Flamehead, I know who the hell Ghost Rider is dude, and I know that he is nothing like Spider-man. That's not the point. Daredevil is nothing like Spider-man either, but that didn't keep the studios and producers from trying to make the movie Spider-man v. 2.0.

I'm just saying, that the studios will try to make this movie as "audience friendly" as possible and if that means dumbing or toning down the content so THEY think it can reach a wider audience they will do it. I don't see anything wrong with being cynical about this, especially knowing what we know about Ghost Rider's history.

the SPAWN movie BTW was a joke, and a cheesy piece of crap.

I know Nicholas Cage is a heavy hitter, Hunter Rider, but so was Ben Affleck when he signed up for Daredevil, and that didn't keep Johnson's vision of the movie intact. I don't see how Cage's casting will do this unless he has some sort of executive or producer power.

 

[FlameHead]

No need to get upsede dude. We're just having a conversation.

No, there's nothing wrong with being cynical but you also have to look at the other side of the coin as well; there's nothing wrong with being optomisitc. Most of us that chat here in the Ghost Rider section are huge fans of the character. We're hoping to get a great product and from what has been told to us so far, most of us believe we will get that.

No matter what the studio's try to do they can't make this any more audience friendly that what the image will allow. Ghost Rider is a demon with a flaming skull who carries out acts of vengeance. It's the character. Nothing that they do will change that and because of that, they won't be able to 'friendly' it up as much as you think they will.

As for Cage, he's been with the project from the start. He has more pull than you would think.

 

[Marcus M.]

Does anyone know if Goyer's script is online? Has anyone seen it? All I can find are reviews.

 

[BIGGUN]

i scanned a few pages for MarvelMovie's site:
http://www.digitalentropy.net/Internapse/page/gr/GRScript.html

its only a few pages though...but we both did a short review on it.

as far as i know no one has the entire script online yet

 

[HighVoltage]

So this David Goyer script for Ghost Rider was good or bad??