Discussion: The Second Amendment IV

[Bill]

No, but I don't see how that prevents me from answering your question. I am pretty sure I previously did. If a little girl can field strip an assault rifle, it proves to me that you don't need military experience to know about that subject matter. What is your point?

Experience in the military will enable you to understand the meaning and purpose of the inspection being performed on the rifle, as well as the safety of the procedures employed to clear the rifle. Those procedures are performed by qualified personnel, and the rifle is as safely cleared as it would be if it were field stripped.

The general rules are that you should never look down the barrel of a gun, but the reality is that you have to look at it to properly check it. Most gun owners are not equipped to take the barrel off the receiver, so field stripping is as far as the rifle will be taken down for cleaning.

The point is that in the context of the picture, and knowing the procedures involved, safety is assured and further debate is a waste of time. Even after educating you on the rifle and procedures taken to clear and inspect it, we're still getting arguments where there should be none.

 

[dnno1]

Experience in the military will enable you to understand the meaning and purpose of the inspection being performed on the rifle, as well as the safety of the procedures employed to clear the rifle. Those procedures are performed by qualified personnel, and the rifle is as safely cleared as it would be if it were field stripped.

The general rules are that you should never look down the barrel of a gun, but the reality is that you have to look at it to properly check it. Most gun owners are not equipped to take the barrel off the receiver, so field stripping is as far as the rifle will be taken down for cleaning.

The point is that in the context of the picture, and knowing the procedures involved, safety is assured and further debate is a waste of time. Even after educating you on the rifle and procedures taken to clear and inspect it, we're still getting arguments where there should be none.

Military experience is nice, and if you server, then thank you for doing so, but it is not necessary to learn or know about firearms. I may not be that well versed on your terminology or your slang for the weaponry or its use, but I did go to college and I can read drawings. Heck, the instruction manuals for a lot of these weapons we are talking about are online, so don't give me that BS line about only people who fired a weapon or served in the military are uniquely qualified to post on this thread. From the looks of the evidence I have presented, it seems like you guys don't get your facts right either.

 

[Hotwire]

No, but I don't see how that prevents me from answering your question. I am pretty sure I previously did. If a little girl can field strip an assault rifle, it proves to me that you don't need military experience to know about that subject matter. What is your point?

So, since you've never taken part in a military drill ceremony, shut up about it. You don't know what your talking about. I DO! I was a soldier and was in several of these ceremonies. I know what I'm talking about.

And, since you've never personally handled these weapons, shut up about them. You don't know what you're talking about. We do! We've handled them and understand how they actually work.

If you're going to keep posting like a know-it-all, I'm going to report you for trolling.

 

[Bill]

I'm not too sure about that. You can visually see the back end of the barrel even with the receiver attached.

I'm not talking about the chamber itself. I am talking about looking through the chamber to see down the length of the barrel. In other words, you cannot pick up the barrel and receiver assembly, and look from the back end of the receiver and see through to the muzzle of the barrel. What do you think is being looked at when looking down the barrel? You have to have a line of sight down the interior of the barrel to check for cleanliness and obstructions.

There are a host of terms about which you have simply no clue what is meant by inspecting the barrel, and why you can, and cannot, on certain rifles.

 

[KalMart]

i dunno if anyone has posted this yet, but:

Since 1968, more people have died by firearm (homicide, suicide, accident) than all the wars combined in American history.

What about cigarettes?

 

[Bill]

Military experience is nice, and if you server, then thank you for doing so, but it is not necessary to learn or know about firearms. I may not be that well versed on your terminology or your slang for the weaponry or its use, but I did go to college and I can read drawings. Heck, the instruction manuals for a lot of these weapons we are talking about are online, so don't give me that BS line about only people who fired a weapon or served in the military are uniquely qualified to post on this thread. From the looks of the evidence I have presented, it seems like you guys don't get your facts right either.

Yes, I did serve, and as a combat soldier. And you're welcome.

You have yet to demonstrate you know what we're talking about. You keep posting random pictures that do not relate to what is being discussed. It seems to me a pretty simple concept that Truman is looking down the barrel to see the inside of it. That is what is done in such an inspection. You don't need to be in the military to know that, but you have yet to do enough research into the subject to know that or why you cannot inspect from the breech for an M1 Garand short of removing the barrel from the receiver.

I am trying to explain this to you without resorting to pictures. The picture you posted shows you a rather large piece of metal that would obstruct your view. Do you not see that, or do you not understand what is meant by looking down the barrel from the breech?

 

[wiegeabo]

Guys, with someone so willfully ignorant and stubborn either report them for trolling, put them on ignore, or both.

At this point, there's nothing more you can say because you've shut down every counterargument multiple times.

 

[dnno1]

Yes, I did serve, and as a combat soldier. And you're welcome.

You have yet to demonstrate you know what we're talking about. You keep posting random pictures that do not relate to what is being discussed. It seems to me a pretty simple concept that Truman is looking down the barrel to see the inside of it. That is what is done in such an inspection. You don't need to be in the military to know that, but you have yet to do enough research into the subject to know that or why you cannot inspect from the breech for an M1 Garand short of removing the barrel from the receiver.

I am trying to explain this to you without resorting to pictures. The picture you posted shows you a rather large piece of metal that would obstruct your view. Do you not see that, or do you not understand what is meant by looking down the barrel from the breech?

Those are pictures of the M1 Garand receiver, not just random pictures. They prove that you can see the back of the barrel as opposed to what you say that it can't be done. A picture is a lot more credible than just someones word supposedly backed up by the claim that they served in the military. You have any pictures showing that you can't see the barrel? After looking at the evidence, I doubt it.

 

[dnno1]

I'm not talking about the chamber itself. I am talking about looking through the chamber to see down the length of the barrel. In other words, you cannot pick up the barrel and receiver assembly, and look from the back end of the receiver and see through to the muzzle of the barrel. What do you think is being looked at when looking down the barrel? You have to have a line of sight down the interior of the barrel to check for cleanliness and obstructions.

There are a host of terms about which you have simply no clue what is meant by inspecting the barrel, and why you can, and cannot, on certain rifles.

Yeah, click the hyperlink in that post.

 

[Webfoot Hero]

So if a little child can learn how to do it I could certainly do it as well without serving in the military right? That pretty much nullifies your argument if there was any there.

No it doesn't. I said hands-on experience with handling a rifle/gun will always trump someone who's only read about it (you). Just because you can read schematics and look at photos doesn't mean you actually know what you're doing. It's like saying you can do surgery just by reading textbooks and watching videos, but when it comes down to using your own hands, it won't be quite as easy as you think.

With this, I'm blocking you since you've added nothing to this argument and got everyone sidetracked with you inane, know-it-all attitude about something you are clearly not knowledgeable in. I suggest everyone else do as well and maybe he'll get the hint.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

It's clear we agree on this, it's time to disarm the police. Their shootings are included. It is within the the government and voter's abilities.

Is it not glorious comrade

I mean I know there is a flippancy about disarming the police, but I will say they have gotten to that point in the UK for most of them and it seems to work out fairly well. Obviously that's not something that could be done in the United States now, but I'm not entirely sure I'd be fully against it.

 

[Paradoxium]

Way I see it, if you lump shootings civilians and police together, you are against it for both.

But I would throw money to support a police disarm in Washington.

 

[dnno1]

No it doesn't. I said hands-on experience with handling a rifle/gun will always trump someone who's only read about it (you). Just because you can read schematics and look at photos doesn't mean you actually know what you're doing. It's like saying you can do surgery just by reading textbooks and watching videos, but when it comes down to using your own hands, it won't be quite as easy as you think.

With this, I'm blocking you since you've added nothing to this argument and got everyone sidetracked with you inane, know-it-all attitude about something you are clearly not knowledgeable in. I suggest everyone else do as well and maybe he'll get the hint.

I and I am saying that you don't need hands on experience to tell that the safest way to inspect the barrel of a gun is when it's disassembled (i.e. when it's technically no longer a gun). Furthermore, I do know what I am doing since that's part of my job. Can't you tell?

 

[Destructus86]

There's far too many ways to get guns via illegal means...far too many armed gangs...disarming the police would be idiotic. (in this country)

 

[Kable24]

There's far too many ways to get guns via illegal means...far too many armed gangs...disarming the police would be idiotic. (in this country)

There is a saying. "When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns."

But of course people who put up gun free zone signs will be ok.

 

[Hotwire]

I and I am saying that you don't need hands on experience to tell that the safest way to inspect the barrel of a gun is when it's disassembled (i.e. when it's technically no longer a gun). Furthermore, I do know what I am doing since that's part of my job. Can't you tell?

And what is your job?

 

[Kable24]

And what is your job?

I'm convinced dnno1 is Dianne Feinstein or Carolyn McCarthy

 

[Paradoxium]

There's far too many ways to get guns via illegal means...far too many armed gangs...disarming the police would be idiotic. (in this country)

Why else quote statistics that includes gun death from police.

 

[Bill]

Those are pictures of the M1 Garand receiver, not just random pictures. They prove that you can see the back of the barrel as opposed to what you say that it can't be done. A picture is a lot more credible than just someones word supposedly backed up by the claim that they served in the military. You have any pictures showing that you can't see the barrel? After looking at the evidence, I doubt it.

You're still not getting it. You have not posted a picture of a field stripped barrel and receiver that has a view from the breech down the barrel. I did not ever state at any time that you couldn't see the chamber. I said you did not have a direct line of sight down the barrel from the breech due to the receiver. That's the reason why you look down the muzzle.

This is what you want to see:

You're looking into the entire length of the barrel to check for obstructions and cleanliness.

This is what you see when you don't remove the barrel from the receiver:

As you can see, the receiver blocks a direct line of sight into the barrel so that you cannot see to the muzzle.


This is about as close as you can get until the receiver blocks your view:

You want to see down the entire length of the inside of the barrel. You can't do that from the breech end without removing the barrel from the receiver.

I can't explain it any more clearer than that. You either don't understand what is being said, or you don't want to admit you're wrong. If it isn't clear now, I'm done. We've went out of our way to explain this to you, and you just can't, or don't want to, get it.

I'd say that of anyone making claims here, your lack of understanding of simple terms and poor research abilities would lead me to believe you've never seen the inside of a college classroom. Either that, or you need to get a refund on your education. You got gypped.

 

[KalMart]

I and I am saying that you don't need hands on experience to tell that the safest way to inspect the barrel of a gun is when it's disassembled (i.e. when it's technically no longer a gun). Furthermore, I do know what I am doing since that's part of my job. Can't you tell?

What is it then?

 

[Grievous]

If you disarm the police you are basically giving gangs and crime groups a free pass. Why fear the police? We got guns and they don't would be the outcome of disarming them. This idea should not even been remotely considered. Cops hitting people in the crossfire is sad, but you can't disarm them and let the bad guys take over.

 

[dnno1]

What is it then?

Whatever you want to call it (a pipe, an upper receiver group, a part, an assembly...), but not a firearm.

 

[KalMart]

Whatever you want to call it (a pipe, an upper receiver group, a part, an assembly...), but not a firearm.

If you take a apart a motorcycle....what are those parts for then, 'technically'?

 

[terry78]

You're still not getting it. You have not posted a picture of a field stripped barrel and receiver that has a view from the breech down the barrel. I did not ever state at any time that you couldn't see the chamber. I said you did not have a direct line of sight down the barrel from the breech due to the receiver. That's the reason why you look down the muzzle.

This is what you want to see:

You're looking into the entire length of the barrel to check for obstructions and cleanliness.

This is what you see when you don't remove the barrel from the receiver:

As you can see, the receiver blocks a direct line of sight into the barrel so that you cannot see to the muzzle.


This is about as close as you can get until the receiver blocks your view:

You want to see down the entire length of the inside of the barrel. You can't do that from the breech end without removing the barrel from the receiver.

I can't explain it any more clearer than that. You either don't understand what is being said, or you don't want to admit you're wrong. If it isn't clear now, I'm done. We've went out of our way to explain this to you, and you just can't, or don't want to, get it.

I'd say that of anyone making claims here, your lack of understanding of simple terms and poor research abilities would lead me to believe you've never seen the inside of a college classroom. Either that, or you need to get a refund on your education. You got gypped.

It's sad that first person shooter games are the first things that came to my mind when I saw these pictures and not the information you were providing.

 

[Bill]

It's sad that first person shooter games are the first things that came to my mind when I saw these pictures and not the information you were providing.

Honestly, that's where most young people get their first experiences with firearms. Most of today's games enable kids to learn everything about these firearms including their capabilities and operation. Some of them provide accurate examples of tactics as well.