Rise of the Silver Surfer DR. DOOM/Julian McMahon Discussion

[Onlooker]

Firstly, Julian did read comics as a child and watched Fantastic Four cartoons. Secondly, the fact that he kids around in interviews (which he does on all his projects) does not mean that he doesn't take them seriously. He's just as irreverent about Nip/Tuck as he is about Fantastic Four, so looking down on comics as "kids stuff" just doesn't come into it.

Frankly, I like it when people people don't take themselves too seriously.

Come to think of it, he had a session at a Comics Con during the first film and had the hardcore fans eating out of his hand. And he was joking around then too!

 

[Tony Stark]

Julian didn't write the movie. The part was not written to be like the Doom from the comics, so you can't blame Julian when it doesn't come off like that.

I think Julian did a good job considering the materials he was given.

Quite honestly I like how he was defeated in the movies more than the comic ending of that story. Honestly Doom chasing after some remote controlled bird until he flew into Galactus' barrier?

 

[NUFFSAID2004]

An accent isn't essential. He didn't have an accent in the 90's cartoon. He didn't have one in the Corman version.

His voice simply had POWER AND EDGE to it. McMahon's voice doesn't have that at all in these movies. And Doom does not CRACK WISE. Doom is not Spider-man. Yet why like the first movie is he constantly making little jokes? Doom as a character has always been above that. When people do that in his presence, it ticks him off.

Just as comparison. When Ian McKellan plays Magneto, his voice has that power and edge. When I saw the first X-men movie, the time I really got it, was when without even seeing McKellan's face he said, "Are you snooping around up here, Charles? Whatever are you looking for?" It gave me chills. It felt like, this sounded like a person who has seen some **** and he's going to deliver it. It sounded exactly like Magneto, and more than that it felt like something Magneto should say.

Now before X-men came out, people complained that McKellan was too old for Magneto, doesn't look like him and stuff like that. But think about this. The man's a holocaust survivor, and more than likely a world traveler and well educated. So he should be an older guy with experience. He shouldn't be a young and very spry looking guy. Though despite his age, McKellan made Magneto look like a man of stature, poise, and superiority. That's exactly what Magneto should have.

When McMahon is in the conference room in his casual clothes, he doesn't have any of that. It felt wrong that he was even there meeting them like that in such clothes.

First off, I really have enjoyed reading your posts. You show a great sense of insight towards Doctor Doom. Unfortunately, Tim Story apparently does not. One of the biggest problems on Story's/ the excecs' part is not knowing the character. They constantly refer to Doom as being simply evil, but there is so much more complexity to consider. Doom also has a certain nobility and code of honor. (*even if sometimes a tad bit warped*) These people really, really, really need to research the soarce material somewhat more. Here are three Doom stories right off the top of my head..
1) "Doctor Strange/ Doctor Doom: Triumph And Torment" (*graphic novel*)
2) Fantastic Four #258 (*John Byrne classic*)
3) Emperor Doom (*graphic novel/ 1987*)
These are just a few instances that really examine Doom's multi-dimensional character. Or if you prefer something a little more modern, then try reading the brilliant "Books Of Doom" by Ed Brubaker & Pablo Raimondi. However, the harm has already been done to Doom. Not once, but twice, thanks to Tim Story & company. Oh well, if they can start over fresh with The Hulk, then perhaps Doctor Doom might someday finally get his chance to shine upon the silver screen.....We hope..

 

[Mercurius]

First off, I really have enjoyed reading your posts. You show a great sense of insight towards Doctor Doom. Unfortunately, Tim Story apparently does not. One of the biggest problems on Story's/ the excecs' part is not knowing the character. They constantly refer to Doom as being simply evil, but there is so much more complexity to consider. Doom also has a certain nobility and code of honor. (*even if sometimes a tad bit warped*) These people really, really, really need to research the soarce material somewhat more. Here are three Doom stories right off the top of my head..
1) "Doctor Strange/ Doctor Doom: Triumph And Torment" (*graphic novel*)
2) Fantastic Four #258 (*John Byrne classic*)
3) Emperor Doom (*graphic novel/ 1987*)
These are just a few instances that really examine Doom's multi-dimensional character. Or if you prefer something a little more modern, then try reading the brilliant "Books Of Doom" by Ed Brubaker & Pablo Raimondi. However, the harm has already been done to Doom. Not once, but twice, thanks to Tim Story & company. Oh well, if they can start over fresh with The Hulk, then perhaps Doctor Doom might someday finally get his chance to shine upon the silver screen.....We hope..

Nuffsaid, indeed.

 

[thegameq]

Fox simply did not want comicbook Doom for these movies. Comicbook Doom is to heavy for the light fare Fox and Story wanted. To bad, comicbook Doom would have been incredible on the big screen....come to think of it he probably would have outshined the FF themselves. When the villain is better written and performed than the heroes...well, see Frank Langella in He-man.

 

[Brian Braddock]

Fox simply did not want comicbook Doom for these movies. Comicbook Doom is to heavy for the light fare Fox and Story wanted. To bad, comicbook Doom would have been incredible on the big screen....come to think of it he probably would have outshined the FF themselves. When the villain is better written and performed than the heroes...well, see Frank Langella in He-man.

I agree with what you said, and it made me cry inside.


Damn you Fox; damn you and your suit-wearing, teenager-pleasing, number-crunching ilk to hell!

 

[Bishop2]

Doom is becoming more and more like classic Doom over time. I'm hoping if they make a third one, we'll see him take over Latveria and then we'll really be in solid territory.

 

[Brian Braddock]

Would love to see that but I have my doubts.

 

[Iron Maiden]

I agree, they made some major corrections to that effect, putting him back into Latveria which should have been something they did from the very first film. To me the one thing they did wrong is not to go far enough. We Doom fans also have to remember though... this is a movie about the Fantastic Four and in neither version did Victor/Doom get a lot of screen time or much depth to the character. I noticed that after reading both novelizations that he does not get very many lines nor any real insights into his background. Julian has always been the 5th billed actor.... he's not one of the lead characters so his importance to the story is not on the same level as the others, unfortunately.

Once again, I find that all these shortcomings are the fault of the screenwriters and their reluctance to translate the character properly to the screen. At least they have admitted their failure with the business mogul aspect by completely ignoring any reference to it in the sequel.

 

[Kelly]

I agree, they made some major corrections to that effect, putting him back into Latveria which should have been something they did from the very first film. To me the one thing they did wrong is not to go far enough. We Doom fans also have to remember though... this is a movie about the Fantastic Four and in neither version did Victor/Doom get a lot of screen time or much depth to the character. I noticed that after reading both novelizations that he does not get very many lines nor any real insights into his background. Julian has always been the 5th billed actor.... he's not one of the lead characters so his importance to the story is not on the same level as the others, unfortunately.

Once again, I find that all these shortcomings are the fault of the screenwriters and their reluctance to translate the character properly to the screen. At least they have admitted their failure with the business mogul aspect by completely ignoring any reference to it in the sequel.

Frost said he was wrong?????? all I've read and heard are excuses as to why he went that direction....

 

[Iron Maiden]

No, he didn't say so in so many words but that what I'm saying is that there is no reference to his being a business mogul in the movie(which is really Payne and Story sort of "fixing" it ) means that they have thankfully dropped that aspect of the narrative. Victor is brought in to collaborate with Reed because of his knowledge. I wish they would have left the line in from the novel where Victor says he knew before Reed what mathematical formula could be applied to predict where the next crater would occur.

I found it ironic that though he (or at least I think it is Frost talking at this point on the DVD) admits that Doom's origin is worth a movie in itself he pretty much disregarded it in his screenplay, aside from the oblique references to Latveria. Even Julian's lines about growing up poor in Latveria were deleted from the first movie.

 

[Kelly]

No, he didn't say so in so many words but that what I'm saying is that there is no reference to his being a business mogul in the movie(which is really Payne and Story sort of "fixing" it ) means that they have thankfully dropped that aspect of the narrative. Victor is brought in to collaborate with Reed because of his knowledge. I wish they would have left the line in from the novel where Victor says he knew before Reed what mathematical formula could be applied to predict where the next crater would occur.

I found it ironic that though he (or at least I think it is Frost talking at this point on the DVD) admits that Doom's origin is worth a movie in itself he pretty much disregarded it in his screenplay, aside from the oblique references to Latveria. Even Julian's lines about growing up poor in Latveria were deleted from the first movie.

You can definitely thank Payne for that....

 

[CrimeMaster!]

After seeing the 2nd film,all Tim Storys talk about "Doom being full Doom" was hot air.
Except throwing a bone to the fans with the Latveria castle scene nothing else was different,it picked up right from the first films depiction of Doom.Though I will say the armor was better this time,a step up from hobo Doom.

Tim Storys Doom in my opinion just comes across as a poor mans Green Goblin,except Julians no Willem Dafoe.

 

[Onlooker]

Tim Storys Doom in my opinion just comes across as a poor mans Green Goblin,except Julians no Willem Dafoe.

For which I give thanks.

 

[thegameq]

I agree with what you said, and it made me cry inside.


Damn you Fox; damn you and your suit-wearing, teenager-pleasing, number-crunching ilk to hell!

I know the feeling. Part of me cried when I saw how poorly the Phoenix Saga was treated on film.

 

[CrimeMaster!]

For which I give thanks.

Yeah I give thanks that except for the costume,Dafoe performance of the Goblin/Osborn was spot on from the Lee,Ditko and Romita Sr comics IMO.

Can you say the same about Julian's Doom?

 

[Obi-Ron]

Hugo Weaving's "V" was the Doom we should have gotten.

 

[Onlooker]

Yeah I give thanks that except for the costume,Dafoe performance of the Goblin/Osborn was spot on from the Lee,Ditko and Romita Sr comics IMO.quote]
My preference is for something a little less cartoonish. Sorry.

 

[thegameq]

Hugo Weaving's "V" was the Doom we should have gotten.

Dear Lord, what a Doom Weaving would have made!

Is it me or does it sometimes seem like the fans have a better grip on these characters than the people who should know. A European style Doom is a no-brainer. Latveria.......

 

[see-m]

Julian is a brillant actor and a very good candidate for a arch-villain..I dont see any problem with him playing doom..maybe its the comic version that needs to be revamped and modernized..

 

[see-m]

...but if youre really looking for another option, a good choice would be Richard Roxburgh who played dracula in van helsing or the villain ''M'' in the league of extraordinary gentlemen

 

[highguard]

I think Movie Doom is being moved towards the full Doom. this is obvious in FF2.

Now it is [Edit] obvious that Doom was back by the surfer as a way to sievelessly explain his return, I still say that they can use Doom as a bit player in the third. I think that what they can do here now is have Doom in latveria with his robot army and "loyal" subjects for a final push to destroy the Fantastic Four along with his use of the [Edit] Puppet Master to pit the Fantastic four against each other.

Then we can get our Doomsday Movie just after the silver surfer small budget film.

Then in F44 we can get the conclusion of the Galactus story, cause what we got in F42 was not it.

 

[Venomfan]

i always wanted Willem Dafoe for Doom, Sean Bean would have been great as well. i think McMahon is a good actor, but hes being poorly directed. anyway i think looks wise his face is perfect for Doom, it just that they won't let him change his voice.

 

[Spider-Fan]

...but if youre really looking for another option, a good choice would be Richard Roxburgh who played dracula in van helsing or the villain ''M'' in the league of extraordinary gentlemen

That Dracula performance in Van Helsing was the worst acting I had ever seen in a big movie, ever, and that is saying something. He sucked in LXG also (as did both of these crap movies, for that matter).

So, in other words, HELL NO!!!

 

[CrimeMaster!]

My preference is for something a little less cartoonish. Sorry.

Yeah and I guess Julian McMahon's Doctor Doom performance wasn't "cartoony" right.

My preference is for good comic book films that show respect to the characters.Sorryt: