Heroes series ripping off X-Men 3

[La_She-Beast]

Ok, then. Sorry if I somehow misinterpretate you. (I received a different message with the title "ripping off")

Well, you know my opinion, lol. I thought Heroes are an epic series to comics. Hiro (hero), the main character is a complete nerd who salutes with 3 fingers- a busdriver is Stan Lee, the weapon salesman is Mr. Claremont, an FBI agent called Quesada, Maicah's comics, Kirby Plaza... etc.

"Days of Future Past" episodes were a fangasm too.

But how those ideas were developed imo are excellent. Every puzzle piece fits perfectly.

 

[X-Maniac]

Ok, then. Sorry if I somehow misinterpretate you. (I received a different message with the title "ripping off")

Well, you know my opinion, lol. I thought Heroes are an epic series to comics. Hiro (hero), the main character is a complete nerd who salutes with 3 fingers- a busdriver is Stan Lee, the weapon salesman is Mr. Claremont, an FBI agent called Quesada, Maicah's comics, Kirby Plaza... etc.

"Days of Future Past" episodes were a fangasm too.

But how those ideas were developed imo are excellent. Every puzzle piece fits perfectly.

Right, so now we're back to civil discussion.

I also enjoy Hiro, and also Mohinder and Peter. The 'days of future past' nod was pretty good, but also a little too derivative of X-Men for me.

 

[Neptune]

You guys are talking about the "5 years gone" episode right? That was the best episode of the season if you ask me. I like Sylar, he's so deliciously evil. He kinda reminds me of Apocalypse with his survival of the fittest theory and his believing that people need to be worthy of having these abilities.

 

[javphonic]

How does he see how their powers work? And how does he duplicate them? The mutations work differently in all the people featured. So he can copy powers by staring at your brain? Doesn't sound logical to me.

When Sylar first meets Chandra Suresh six months prior to the series' starting point, he describes having intuitive aptitude, the ability of knowing how things work by looking at them. This ability to see and manipulate patterns within complex systems made him an expert at restoring time pieces. He was able to discern any problems, with any given watch, almost instantly. Upon meeting Brian Davis and learning of his telekinetic abilities, Sylar promised to "fix" what Davis perceived as a problem and killed him, taking his telekinetic powers for himself.

I guess the key to how their powers is apparent to him, when he looks at the brain, maybe that's a part of his mutation-being able to discern what sections of the brain allows these "heroes" to have their abilities, and how to mimic it within his own brain,

which could be similiar to Charlie-Hiro's redheaded girlfriend, or DL's cousin; copycats

 

[Hammerofthegods]

ee

Ok, then. Sorry if I somehow misinterpretate you. (I received a different message with the title "ripping off")

Well, you know my opinion, lol. I thought Heroes are an epic series to comics. Hiro (hero), the main character is a complete nerd who salutes with 3 fingers- a busdriver is Stan Lee, the weapon salesman is Mr. Claremont, an FBI agent called Quesada, Maicah's comics, Kirby Plaza... etc.

"Days of Future Past" episodes were a fangasm too.

But how those ideas were developed imo are excellent. Every puzzle piece fits perfectly.

Completely agree.

 

[Marginal Man]

As a musician, it's often easy to end up having a riff or a song sound strikingly similar to other songs/riffs. This isn't on purpose. As an artist inspired by other artists, my head stores all of my creativity in the same place it stores all of my loves and interests.

It's possible that as superhero show, the writers unintentionally had similar ideas to X-Men (like the truck flipping sequence). I don't believe for a second after watching the abomination that was X3, any one thought, "Hey let's re film that sequence for OUR movie!" That scene is not that great to begin with. I think anyone shooting an action film or show is inspired by other action films/tv shows that aren't mutant themed. I mean seriously, is X3 the only movie you've seen?

Also, any intentional similarities to Watchmen, X-Men, or JLA are fine by me as I don't think it is possible to ever get any of these stories captured exactly how it was when I first read the classic issues so why not pay homage to them? That way there's no insistance on accuracy and a new generation can enjoy the benifets of a classic story line they may not be able to get behind otherwise because the reason why these stories are often so great is that they relate to the times they are written in and are meant to parrallel current events.

Furthermore, comics/superheroes are just recycled myths and greek heroes re-invented for our times to be relevant to our lives today. I don't think the story of Superman takes anything away from Hercules at all, they are both great in their own right. I agree that movie ideas today have certainly dwindled into a nastalgia fest but I also think that is the problem with fans as well. I mean movies are going to be different than their comic counterparts whether or not your nastalgic feelings are hurt or not. I mean if I went to this great bbq my dad held in our backyard in 1988, am i going to go back to that house and re create the same benches and tables, de-age all of my dad's friends and make them talk about George Bush sr. choking on a some chicken in Japan, bring my dead dog back to life so he can bark at my neighbors, and make sure that we're all wearing the same clothes? NO! But if I did want that bb-q I would just find the receipe and make sure it tastes just as good as it can be.

I got off topic but seriously I really feel like you guys are nitpicking here. Heroes, despite it's glaring plot holes, character flaws, inconsistent acting, terrible season 1 finale, and akward season 2 pacing is a pretty damn good show. Stop acting like X Men 3 didn't make you want to gauge out your eyes and watch a show that at least can make up for it's mistakes in the next episode.

 

[X-Maniac]

As a musician, it's often easy to end up having a riff or a song sound strikingly similar to other songs/riffs. This isn't on purpose. As an artist inspired by other artists, my head stores all of my creativity in the same place it stores all of my loves and interests.

It's possible that as superhero show, the writers unintentionally had similar ideas to X-Men (like the truck flipping sequence). I don't believe for a second after watching the abomination that was X3, any one thought, "Hey let's re film that sequence for OUR movie!" That scene is not that great to begin with. I think anyone shooting an action film or show is inspired by other action films/tv shows that aren't mutant themed. I mean seriously, is X3 the only movie you've seen?

Also, any intentional similarities to Watchmen, X-Men, or JLA are fine by me as I don't think it is possible to ever get any of these stories captured exactly how it was when I first read the classic issues so why not pay homage to them? That way there's no insistance on accuracy and a new generation can enjoy the benifets of a classic story line they may not be able to get behind otherwise because the reason why these stories are often so great is that they relate to the times they are written in and are meant to parrallel current events.

Furthermore, comics/superheroes are just recycled myths and greek heroes re-invented for our times to be relevant to our lives today. I don't think the story of Superman takes anything away from Hercules at all, they are both great in their own right. I agree that movie ideas today have certainly dwindled into a nastalgia fest but I also think that is the problem with fans as well. I mean movies are going to be different than their comic counterparts whether or not your nastalgic feelings are hurt or not. I mean if I went to this great bbq my dad held in our backyard in 1988, am i going to go back to that house and re create the same benches and tables, de-age all of my dad's friends and make them talk about George Bush sr. choking on a some chicken in Japan, bring my dead dog back to life so he can bark at my neighbors, and make sure that we're all wearing the same clothes? NO! But if I did want that bb-q I would just find the receipe and make sure it tastes just as good as it can be.

I got off topic but seriously I really feel like you guys are nitpicking here. Heroes, despite it's glaring plot holes, character flaws, inconsistent acting, terrible season 1 finale, and akward season 2 pacing is a pretty damn good show. Stop acting like X Men 3 didn't make you want to gauge out your eyes and watch a show that at least can make up for it's mistakes in the next episode.

But X3 didn't want to make me GOUGE out my eyes.

I still think it's better to see original sequences, rather than things that were seen very recently in a movie with a similar topic (mutants). Regardless of whether it was intentional copying, they should have thought 'Let's do something that hasn't been seen in a related movie.'

As someone who once had my work ripped off by someone else, I feel very strongly about the subject of ideas and originality and your pretentious twaddle about time travelling barbecues alters nothing, certainly not my opinion.

 

[Marginal Man]

As I stated, my pretentious twaddle about BBQ was off topic but I still feel like it was relevant to the topic of "the movie wasnt like the comic"

Come on man flipping over trucks with superheroes and mutants incarcerated inside was boring and sucked in X3 too, but to cry thief on heroes for that is just ******ed. SERIOUSLY. The idea just isn't creative to begin with it happens all of the time in comics and action movies. for you to pine on that is just mind boggling.

Anyway, how have you been ripped off? I'd like to hear your story.

 

[X-Maniac]

As I stated, my pretentious twaddle about BBQ was off topic but I still feel like it was relevant to the topic of "the movie wasnt like the comic"

Come on man flipping over trucks with superheroes and mutants incarcerated inside was boring and sucked in X3 too, but to cry thief on heroes for that is just ******ed. SERIOUSLY. The idea just isn't creative to begin with it happens all of the time in comics and action movies. for you to pine on that is just mind boggling.

Anyway, how have you been ripped off? I'd like to hear your story.

But I didn't think flipping over trucks in X3 was 'boring' or that it 'sucked'. I really liked the sequence in X3 where Magneto stopped the prison truck. I wouldn't say it happens 'all the time' either. How many movies have featured people with super-powers flipping trucks (or moving entire bridges, for that matter)? Someone else mentioned Night Watch, which is one earlier example of something similar. But that's all that comes to mind.

I was surprised, and somewhat disappointed, to see a similar sequence (and some other X-Men-tinged sequences) in Heroes and I still feel the same way now. It's no use preaching your opinion at me as though yours is better, that's not how opinions work.

Originality is important. I realise there isn't that much of it around, given Hollywood's current output of remaking everything (a trap into which even Bryan Singer fell with SR), but that shouldn't stop people like me hoping for imaginative, innovative, creative thought that stimulates my mind and shows intelligent thought at work. Or should i accept any old crap thrown at me? I think not. Far better to make people strive harder to do something fresher.

And... about that instance of my work being ripped off, I don't really want to talk about that on here to complete strangers!

 

[Marginal Man]

And... about that instance of my work being ripped off, I don't really want to talk about that on here to complete strangers!

...Because you are full of ****.

 

[X-Maniac]

...Because you are full of ****.

Nope, not the case. Here's a bit more info for you, though you don't really deserve it with that nasty attitude. It was an opening sequence in a manuscript, sent to a publisher, which appeared (slightly altered but not much) in a published novel. Happy now? Got what you needed? How did that happen, you ask! Well, manuscripts are often sent out to 'readers' - who may be other novelists - to see what they think. One of these people ripped off my work. So there you are, you rude and ignorant ********!

Now, if you could just TRY to be pleasant and less of a piece of ****. Here's hoping!

 

[Marginal Man]

wow it was really easy to break you!

 

[X-Maniac]

wow it was really easy to break you!

So that was your intention?

It reflects more on you than me. Marginal you are indeed.

 

[Marginal Man]

well played, sir

 

[X-Maniac]

Well, steering this back on track, what X-Men ideas do people want to see, or NOT want to see, in Heroes?

Do people want to see deliberate use of X-Men ideas?

Would people want to see a magnetic character? A weather-controlling character? Someone who transforms into metal? etc etc.

What direction do we want to see Heroes go in? How can it sustain itself? Will we need to see new characters, and what should happen to the existing characters? They can't keep adding new ones without removing existing ones.

 

[BMM]

Heroes shouldn't use the Legacy Virus, aka "the Plague" in the Animated Series... whoops, too late. Actually, it could be very different. I guess it's too early to tell, but that's what I was immediately reminded of regarding the current storyline.

 

[La_She-Beast]

Well, steering this back on track, what X-Men ideas do people want to see, or NOT want to see, in Heroes?

Do people want to see deliberate use of X-Men ideas?

Would people want to see a magnetic character? A weather-controlling character? Someone who transforms into metal? etc etc.

What direction do we want to see Heroes go in? How can it sustain itself? Will we need to see new characters, and what should happen to the existing characters? They can't keep adding new ones without removing existing ones.

Surprise, surprise, I'd love to see a "beast" in Heroes. Seriously. Even if it's blue and furry. (hmmm the better)

 

[conan69]

Maniac,
You should have known better. Its the simplest thing inthe world to do the "poor mans copyright" with is to mail a copy of your work to yourself and dont open it. We were told to do this at Kuberts. The postmark on the envelope is the proof of the date the work was created.

Or you could have published it on a blog. Again a date would show ownership.Something to show it was a work of your design and protect yourself. NEVER send anything to any sort of publisher without representation and protection.

Now while there are no laws that state this type of copyright works, its at least presents you with something.. instead of just throwing your hands up saying well I lost that round.

Copyrighting is only $45 and the paperwork is easy to get online.


Theres a great story out there about how a indie filmmaker told his idea for a Gindhouse movie to Taratino and then months later QT announced he was doing such a movie. This guy states clearly some of his ideas were explicitly ripped off.

But QT has made a career out of ripping off others peopels work(often blatantly).


As for Heroes, I tried,but found it to be unwatchable (then again, Im a snob who doesnt watch any network television).

 

[Fenryr]

I know the main argument about "ripping people off" has mostly died down, but I have to interject this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Propp

When it comes down to it, there are no truly original characters, and there are no truly original stories. The best you can manage is to subvert a cliche, and even some of those subversions are becoming their own cliches.

About the truck-flipping scene, it was probably one of the best in an otherwise mediocre X3. I don't even remember it happening in Heroes, but scenes involving superpowers and big vehicles are not really uncommon. Hellboy and Fantastic Four both feature similar or related stunts.

 

[X-Maniac]

Maniac,
You should have known better. Its the simplest thing inthe world to do the "poor mans copyright" with is to mail a copy of your work to yourself and dont open it. We were told to do this at Kuberts. The postmark on the envelope is the proof of the date the work was created.

Or you could have published it on a blog. Again a date would show ownership.Something to show it was a work of your design and protect yourself. NEVER send anything to any sort of publisher without representation and protection.

Now while there are no laws that state this type of copyright works, its at least presents you with something.. instead of just throwing your hands up saying well I lost that round.

Copyrighting is only $45 and the paperwork is easy to get online.


Theres a great story out there about how a indie filmmaker told his idea for a Gindhouse movie to Taratino and then months later QT announced he was doing such a movie. This guy states clearly some of his ideas were explicitly ripped off.

But QT has made a career out of ripping off others peopels work(often blatantly).


As for Heroes, I tried,but found it to be unwatchable (then again, Im a snob who doesnt watch any network television).

Hello! Thanks for your comments, though I am well aware of the copyright situation. I didn't say the problem hadn't been pursued. I was merely explaining what had happened and how annoying it was that people feel they can do things like that.

 

[conan69]

"When it comes down to it, there are no truly original characters, and there are no truly original stories. The best you can manage is to subvert a cliche, and even some of those subversions are becoming their own cliches."


There are plenty of great original ideas out there in storytelling land.
Not everything out there is a cliche or a twist on "another idea". I do agree its rare,especially in this day and age, when ideas seem so sparse.

But they are out there, you just have to look for them. For ever 500 recycled films that are garbage, you get a Memento.


Good luck Maniac. Any time a creator can get one over on a souless company, Im all for it.

 

[Mike059jig]

yes the show does but it rip-offs the entire x-men myth not just X3...although I don't watch I heard Stan Lee made a guess appearance in a episode, so it can't be that bad....and the show is sufferings from the sophomore slump.....

 

[X-Maniac]

So.... despite borrowing heavily from X-Men, despite being praised on here for its character-driven style.... Heroes has hit a slump in its second series. Ratings have slumped by 15 per cent and creator Tim Kring has made a public apology, blaming the show's dismal pacing and weak romances and poor narrative structure.